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Valve announces SteamOS
- Thread starter PartTimeWarrior
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hardcastlemccormick
Banned
I'm not sure I can get behind the suggestions that having to create xz archives of a custom configuration is more work than mirroring Ubuntu's servers aside from what Valve wants to change, and writing a substantial portion of Steam into the core configuration files of Linux is a trivial task compared to the woe-some, horrible effort of installing GTK (which Steam already requires, mind you) and Openbox. I still don't see any benefit to taking the hard road here. For the record, apt-get was an example, they could use any package manager. Please don't be pedantic.
Modern consoles are already basically creating virtual keyboards anyway, it's not like that stuff is hard to come by. I wonder what the controller will look like.
Posts asking what a 'living room machine' is, as far as the eye can see.
Will keep an eye on this for HTPC purposes if not for games. Curious as to how open the OS is; being able to build a portable MAME box that boots straight into the Big Picture interface would be tremendous.
Will keep an eye on this for HTPC purposes if not for games. Curious as to how open the OS is; being able to build a portable MAME box that boots straight into the Big Picture interface would be tremendous.
hooijdonk17
Member
I've been hearing that since the days Slackware distros hit the market on 50+ floppies.. I really doubt AAA game devs will throw a parade over another Linux distro..
Best case, maybe Linux will end up getting console ports and a new developer base rising from enthusiastic demo coders a-la Amiga days..
Yeah, I guess the best possible scenario for SteamOS is becoming a new Amiga..
hardcastlemccormick
Banned
Linux is not the same as it was when Slackware hit the market. Neither is the game dev scene. The PC marketplace is swamped with smaller indie titles getting ported to Mac and Linux. Valve is playing the long-term support game here. People have multiple uses for a PC in their houses now, and SteamOS offers flexibility in that regard. With those uses can come growth.
Funny thing is Steam OS doesn't need to succeed. Valve isn't making money off the OS, they're making money off the game sales. Steam is available on every platform and another stronger outlet can only help them. If Linux support grows from this then developers will start thinking about going to it, they just need an extra push from one of the greatest game developers in the business and that's what Steam OS provides.
Oh, I thought Linux was far behind Windows in terms of graphics performance and efficiency. Why has IBM been pouring resources into Linux kernel development?
Valve has balls.
Thing is they need proper support for their OS by most of game companies. Also they need key features ASAP like
No one will use Steam OS for one game and most of people won't consider it as second OS.
In summary they need to fundamentally change Linux scene. Without that change, their OS will be as popular for games as any other linux variant. Meaning it will die for common gamer and will be desalinated for obscurity.
What i am most excited about is their changes specially made for games. Windows is known from high API that doesn't really make your GPU fly.
So if they will release Steam OS i will install it. To show my support. But they need to change Linux scene itself which is something either impossible or very very very very hard.
Also they need to almost all developers and make them use OpenGL instead of DirectX which will be hard thing to do.
Thing is they need proper support for their OS by most of game companies. Also they need key features ASAP like
No one will use Steam OS for one game and most of people won't consider it as second OS.
In summary they need to fundamentally change Linux scene. Without that change, their OS will be as popular for games as any other linux variant. Meaning it will die for common gamer and will be desalinated for obscurity.
What i am most excited about is their changes specially made for games. Windows is known from high API that doesn't really make your GPU fly.
So if they will release Steam OS i will install it. To show my support. But they need to change Linux scene itself which is something either impossible or very very very very hard.
Also they need to almost all developers and make them use OpenGL instead of DirectX which will be hard thing to do.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
I could see this being like the Android of living room PCs. We're gonna see a lot more in that product category, methinks.
toddhunter
Member
For the server side where Linux currently shines.
KojiKnight
Member
Graphics performance is due to still kind of awful drivers (though they are getting better).
IBM pours tons of money into *Unix because IBM doesn't like relying on microsoft for anything... They don't have the best of histories together. Honestly, even if they were on great terms with Microsoft it's a good strategy for any business not to put all of their eggs in one basket.
Wut.
Compiling and installing software is no issue for a company like Valve.
Xilium
Member
I think this will ultimately be about as relevant as the Ouya, the target audience for this is just too small (HTPC gamers that, for whatever reason, aren't content with their current setup).
Also, maybe I'm missing something but aren't they basically in the process of creating the "walled garden" that Gabe was giving MS so much shit for with Win8? This would actually put them closer to that reality than MS since the Win8 store doesn't sell many of the types of games you would see on Steam/Origin/ect. and Steam itself is a form of DRM.
Also, maybe I'm missing something but aren't they basically in the process of creating the "walled garden" that Gabe was giving MS so much shit for with Win8? This would actually put them closer to that reality than MS since the Win8 store doesn't sell many of the types of games you would see on Steam/Origin/ect. and Steam itself is a form of DRM.
I've been assuming the OS is open and anyone can make a store front or distribute software for it independently of steam.
If not, then yeah, it would be rather contradictory
But I think it's open in terms of not being locked to steam distributed content.ashecitism
Member
Legendary_Red
Banned
Just as Windows dominates the personal computer market, Linux dominates the enterprise server market.
Legendary_Red
Banned
I hope they build it from scratch then. Unity, Gnome, KDE, etc. are all horrible interfaces out of the box, in my experiences. Only XCFE was any good.
Makes me wonder just how much money they can afford to pump into Steam OS development.
Xilium
Member
I've been assuming the OS is open and anyone can make a store front or distribute software for it independently of steam.
If not, then yeah, it would be rather contradictory
Yeah, I'm not expecting them to make it so that Steam is the only download service available but it'll certainly be pre-installed and placed in a prominent position to let you know it's there. I never expected Win8 to become a walled garden either but Gabe acted as though MS was in the pre-planning stages of going the Apple route because they introduced their own digital distribution service to their OS. Now Valve is working in the opposite direction and creating an OS (and likely hardware) to go with their digital distribution service.
IDK, just all seems ironic to me.
Put Photoshop and 3d Software on it and am ditching Windows for good. If Steam OS has desktop gui included that is.
edit: flat design trend plz. Ok Valve?
Good = low-cost streaming solutions
Better = akin to Valve's system -- a box with dedicated components "that’s quiet and focuses on high performance and appropriate form factors"
Best = whatever folks want to put together
angular graphics
Banned
Gabe said he is in talks with Adobe to turn Photoshop into a F2P "game". I assume he has started pitching to them (presumably among others) to start porting their apps to Linux as well.
http://uk.ign.com/articles/2013/02/07/gabe-newell-discusses-how-to-reinvent-gaming
http://allthingsd.com/20120725/valv...-games-wearable-computers-windows-8-and-more/
ColdBlooder
Banned
Sorry for not reading all 57 pages, and this might have been brought up already but i think SteamOS won't just be an existing distribution with a Valve paintjob.
SteamOS will most likely be its own distribution, running a kernel compliled specifically for SteamOS and running a "blank" xorg with no window manager eating up resources. It will just be Xorg + Steam big picture mode running on it. Why would you bloat the OS with gnome and/or KDE.
But i think they will give you the option to have a window manager installed, if you want to run one.
SteamOS will most likely be its own distribution, running a kernel compliled specifically for SteamOS and running a "blank" xorg with no window manager eating up resources. It will just be Xorg + Steam big picture mode running on it. Why would you bloat the OS with gnome and/or KDE.
But i think they will give you the option to have a window manager installed, if you want to run one.
maniac-kun
Member
With all the questions this announcement produces i think Valve should have released a video explaining everything and showcasing the OS.
ashecitism
Member
I was expecting a vid like they did with BPM. Maybe once the 3rd announcement goes live, they'll do a longer summary video including all 3.
lensoftruth
Member
It's mostly explained on the website, plus there's a further 3 announcements.
maniac-kun
Member
57 pages of confused people says they didnt explain it right.
I am expecting something like this as well. It wont be a windows replacement but it will circumvent Microsoft's grip on pc gaming by providing a fast lean OS that works well with your main rig, receiving streamed content or as a high end dedicated gaming/entertainment OS.
Microsoft owns the office, Valve wants to own the living room, and for valve, a lean gaming OS is the perfect means to achieve that.
ZehDon
Member
Normally, I'd agree with you. But we're not dealing with some run-of-the-mill company with a small pool of financial resources trying to create a standard. We're dealing with Valve, the guys who created, marketed and established the world's standard digital distribution platform, and who ran it so well it's transforming the industry (see Xbox One's disastrous reveal as Microsoft tried to copy Valve). We're also dealing with a company who, essentially, takes a 30% cut of the entire PC games market.
Valve have the resources, the established good will, the drive and sheer talent necessary to make SteamOS an accepted standard. And their track record makes me fairly confident that Steam's success wasn't a fluke; they know how to win over customers. And wherever the customers go, the content providers will follow.
This is a honest industry wide megaton. Microsoft destroyed their good will with Windows 8, Xbox One and the NSA; Valve are stepping in and making a move to establish a better gaming standard in the wake.
I find Valve's stance with windows 8 hypocritical as they have essentially created their own gardenwall store with steam. We will have to see what their other announcements are.
We have also not heard what developers are supporting this, or been given a list of supported games with their announcement.
We have also not heard what developers are supporting this, or been given a list of supported games with their announcement.
One interesting impact this could have is in countries where consoles and games are insanely overpriced, like Argentina where the PS4 is $1200. Considering this is a PC running Linux that could be assembled and mass produced within those countries by local retailers, it could get around all those taxes and tariffs to allow a modern console experience to people who otherwise couldn't afford it. In developing countries this could be a big a deal.
It all depends on what Valves hardware vision is like, making this the android of the console world could have a far reaching impact.
It all depends on what Valves hardware vision is like, making this the android of the console world could have a far reaching impact.
Very interesting. I haven't read much about this, and my previous questions were just based on my impression of the OS scene.
This makes me wonder, though, are there any other OS's in the works anywhere?
Indeed.
As another poster mentioned above, they also take a 30% cut of the entire PC game market -- which seems like a lot to me. And the fact that Steam is unnecessarily restrictive -- the games are uniquely connected to Steam, forcing you to have Steam to play them. Some developers included a Non-steam .exe with their Steam games, like X3 I think (Can play the game without Steam.) - but that should be the basic standard.
However, at least it seems like it's possible to move your Steamapps folder (All your games.) around - for example, cut and paste the Steamapps folder onto another harddisc, or somewhere else, uninstall Steam, then install steam and put the Steamapps folder right back into it. Not sure if it's possible to move it to another computer entirely.
Do you know what Steam is?
iceatcs
Junior Member
I believe most stock exchange using own OS. Saw some never seen when I was in tour.
lensoftruth
Member
Fixed
AdmiralPain
Banned
I think I can answer that. The Steambox will release in 2014, so it has the potential to be cheaper thatn nextgen consoles, as powerful or more powerful and with a greater degree of performance compared to a normal PC due to Linux and fixed spec. Add a couple of exclusives on top of that and you've got yourself a seriously tempting platform.
You will download the steamOS file and put into a lite USB memory and label it with a sticker (SteamOS)
You can put that USB memory in your main PC, your laptop, your HTPC or your Steambox for your selected brand.
If you start your machine using that SteamOS you can run Steam Big Picture. SBP has game store, app store, music store and TV/series store. SBP has chat service, call service, etc. And internet nav app. You can use all of them without keyboard/mouse, using daisy with your pad. But you can connect your keyb/mouse too. Or use the new Valve controller (SteamPAD?).
If you are using that SteamOS in a low-spec machine, you can run your games in your main pc and stream those games to SteamOS with low latency.
If you are using SteamOS in a powerful machine you can run your linux games natively.
If you are using SteamOS in a powerful machine and you want to run natively windows based games, you have three options:
-wait for a linux version of that game (uncertain)
-use a wrapper to run the game in linux (not optimal performance)
-install windows in your SteamOs machine and use dual boot (select your SO at launch)
If Valve can move devs to linux or windows/linux, those games that need a wrapper will be older every year so the performance will be less important.
What are your questions?
It's not as hypocritical as you think. They have plans to open up the store, but even if they don't and it stays the same, developers can sell steam keys directly or through other stores without paying Valve a cut.
charlequin
Banned
Excellent analysis. I think you're pretty much spot-on in terms of Valve's strategy and goals here.
This is fairy dust. We're talking OEM HTPC hardware that looks like other OEM HTPC hardware, i.e. pricey but shy of wildly expensive, small and not tremendously powerful.
There will be zero exclusives to SteamOS or Steambox. The purpose of all of this is to get more people using Steam, the actual platform that makes money. There's no reason to actively promote these side projects that way when their whole purpose is just to expand Steam's reach to more places.
Not to mention even Steamworks games aren't required to be tethered to the client -- Scribblenauts Unlimited and Super Meat Boy are two such examples, meaning they're actually DRM-free (though obviously you lose the Steamworks features if you run them outside of the client).
As for a list of games/developers that will support SteamOS, see here.
Adam Sessler has a rambling video up, but he makes a really solid point. HL3 HAS to be the third announcement. There is absolutely no way around it, they need something that will sell the package.
I think as much as the game is important. Source 2 is vitally important as the first major Linux based game engine solution.
I think as much as the game is important. Source 2 is vitally important as the first major Linux based game engine solution.
If valve makes something like hl3 exclusive to steamos it would burn a lot of the good will they have accumulated. If it's not exclusive then it doesn't help sell the package. I would have no need to install their os as long as PC games keep supporting windows.
Sentenza
Member
That's mostly because people can't read.
This thread proves it, with the same questions asked dozens of times regardless of how many time they have been answered already.
But if valve makes HL3 a steam exclusive (steam platform, not SteamOS), a lot of non-pcgamers will look to steambox as a "consolish thing" possibility. And that's the real and main point for SteamOS.
Then he is wrong.
This isn't about establishing a hardware platform , it's about expanding the reach of Steam.
The already massive PC catalogue sells the package.
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