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[borghe]

I don't like the idea of an algorithm determining how to apply HDR to SDR HD content. While it might look better to you, it more than likely undermines the intent of the director and DP. I would rather watch films the way the director intended them to look.

for ghostbusters? yeah I mostly agree. I sort of feel it falls just a step or two below colorization. Yeah it makes something look more "modern"... but I agree on every single one of your points.

but others are saying CE3K looks amazing.. I'll probably grab that from apple soon and see what it's like.

 

[Stiler]

so I have a denon avr-s920w, which supports atmos, but I have no idea how to do an atmos set up. I currently have a 5.1 system going. It looks like the atmos speakers would connect to what is labeled as "surround [L/R]". What are some decent entry level speakers for atmos?

I see that some are ceiling mounted and others are like little pods that fire at the ceiling?

I'm guessing that the ps4/PC I have connected wouldn't really use them at all, since it's different than a "traditional" 7 speaker set up (also I dont even know if a ps4 supports 7.1)

With that receiver you can do a 5.2.2 setup max (Five normal speakers, up to two subs, and two atmos speakers).

You would connect your two atmos speakers to the rear surround connections, going by the manual:
http://manuals.denon.com/AVRS920W/NA/EN/GFNFSYgobaybmw.php

Also, and this is very important, you need to make sure that you configure the speakers in your receiver to be dolby atmos speakers for the type you get (IE upward firing modules, height speakers, or ceiling speakers).

There are three options for atmos, the easiest is the upward firing modules, which you can sit on your front speakers or rear speakers, these fire sound at the ceiling and reflect it down.

A good set of these are the Elac A4's for example which aren't that expensive (around 180/pair).

Then there's height speakers which you mount on the wall in front or behind you, the SVS prime elevations are an example of this:
https://www.svsound.com/pages/prime-elevation

Lastly there's the in-ceiling or ceiling mounted option, which is the best but also the most expensive option

Each of these process sound differently, that is why it's very important that you make sure you tell your receiver which type of atmos speaker you have connected, as an upward firing module will need to send sound differently then an in-ceiling one.

Personally I went with the Elac a4's myself and it works fine, I mean I'd LOVE to have ceiling mounted speakers for atmos but it's just a lot of work and money to get that.

If you are only using two atmos speakers I recommend making them front. In the future if you upgrade your receiver to one with more channel support you can add more atmos speakers to your system.

 

[jstevenson]

I am running HDR10 also from Apple TV.. honestly I feel it is slightly more film like.. and turning off HDR results in the same titles being a bit blown out. The best example is Nice Guys when Russel Crowe goes into the pedophile's house at the beginning.. when he leaves, the stone work to the left of the screen is totally blown out and overexposed with HDR turned off.. Turning HDR on, the scene is a little darker, but that same stone work has a ridiculous level of detail to it.

Ghostbusters though was almost the exact opposite. With HDR turned off, Zhul's gate opening was a dull white and dull purple lightning (just as I remember!!!!). With HDR turned on the gate was blinding white and the purple was deeper (lol). Not sure how I feel about it.. It definitely took some of that "old classic film" style away from ghostbusters.. but there was a definite upgrade.

One last comment.. Dawn of the Planet of the Apes would not display HDR, even though the movie page says HDR10. The tell tale way you know an HDR signal is coming through to my TV is it cranks backlight to 20 and contrast to 100 no matter what you had them set to (though I really wish it would set them back when the HDR signal is done................). Dawn of the Planet of the Apes never kicked in HDR. Super confused. Played a bunch of other HDR10 titles (Deadpool, Logan, etc) and they were fine.. So not sure what was up with that.

Uhh that's weird --- are you sure you had HDR on on the Apple TV when doing Dawn of the Planet of the Apes? Cause if HDR10 is on, EVERYTHING should be in HDR (menus, etc) - and even if Dawn wasn't an HDR10 movie it'd be converted to HDR10.

I watched Discovery on TV, and then watched episode 2 on the CBS app on the apple tv 4k afterwards - I left Dolby Vision / 24Hz on just to see and it wasn't obviously bad, but I think it was more blown out for sure.

I still think optimal way to watch stuff is absolutely natively. Apple needs to patch that in for those of us stat. Otherwise it's a super nice streaming box, and the iTunes Store streams look terrific

 

[borghe]

Uhh that's weird --- are you sure you had HDR on on the Apple TV when doing Dawn of the Planet of the Apes? Cause if HDR10 is on, EVERYTHING should be in HDR (menus, etc) - and even if Dawn wasn't an HDR10 movie it'd be converted to HDR10.

correct. and this is what I see on EVERYTHING else, HDR or Dolby mentioned on the itunes screen. it's only Dawn of the Apes that acts this way. Yeah, it is weird..

edit - oh.. regarding "even if it wasn't HDR10 it would be converted".. I mean apple tv 4K obviously just runs everything in the same mode/color space.. But when you are viewing content with the HDR metadata, my TV resets the backlight to 20 and contrast to 100 (apparently this is a samsung thing from ~2015...). that's how you can for sure tell something has HDR metadata. Dawn never does this. Same thing with netflix.. if I play something that is just Ultra 4K, it won't reset my backlight/contrast. If I play something that says Ultra 4K Vision, it will reset them.

which the above sort of basically sucks... because I essentially can't "dial in" my TV for normal content, because as soon as the damn screensaver kicks in, it resets my contrast and backlight.

 

[jstevenson]

correct. and this is what I see on EVERYTHING else, HDR or Dolby mentioned on the itunes screen. it's only Dawn of the Apes that acts this way. Yeah, it is weird..

edit - oh.. regarding "even if it wasn't HDR10 it would be converted".. I mean apple tv 4K obviously just runs everything in the same mode/color space.. But when you are viewing content with the HDR metadata, my TV resets the backlight to 20 and contrast to 100 (apparently this is a samsung thing from ~2015...). that's how you can for sure tell something has HDR metadata. Dawn never does this. Same thing with netflix.. if I play something that is just Ultra 4K, it won't reset my backlight/contrast. If I play something that says Ultra 4K Vision, it will reset them.

which the above sort of basically sucks... because I essentially can't "dial in" my TV for normal content, because as soon as the damn screensaver kicks in, it resets my contrast and backlight.

but like, if HDR10 is truly on on your menus - wouldn't just the menus themselves reset your backlight and stuff? And you'd never get "reset" again until you switched output modes because it's sitting their in HDR the whole time, any content you run, any app you run, etc

 

[borghe]

but like, if HDR10 is truly on on your menus - wouldn't just the menus themselves reset your backlight and stuff? And you'd never get "reset" again until you switched output modes because it's sitting their in HDR the whole time, any content you run, any app you run, etc

no, apple tv 4K doesn't send HDR metadata on the menus and such. it only sends HDR metadata on content (screensaver, Netflix or iTunes for now)

 

[Kaiken]

Is Samsung HDR Pro just a gimmick name and not really HDR at all? This shit has me all kinds of confused.

 

[borghe]

Is Samsung HDR Pro just a gimmick name and not really HDR at all? This shit has me all kinds of confused.

it is HDR10+. It's real, but I am not sure if content providers have adopted it yet. It is very close to Dolby Vision, but without any of the licensing fees (like HDR10). I guess Dolby is still a little better with 12-bit color and higher overall nit values.

 

[jstevenson]

Is Samsung HDR Pro just a gimmick name and not really HDR at all? This shit has me all kinds of confused.

what model TV are you talking about?

 

[Kaiken]

what model TV are you talking about?

I think I've finally found my answer. It's a MU630D, which i'm comparing to the 6300 and it only has a max of 350 nits.

 

[jstevenson]

I think I've finally found my answer. It's a MU630D, which i'm comparing to the 6300 and it only has a max of 350 nits.

yeah, it's basically fake HDR... it will accept the signal but the TV doesn't really have much juice to display a good HDR image.

 

[J_Viper]

Great to hear another positive impression on ST4K. Can't wait to check it out

Speaking of The Fifth Element, the 4k duff is currently going for $14 on Amazon

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B072873SJ3/?tag=neogaf0e-20

 

[KDash31987]

My younger brother picked up Pacific Rim for me from work for a few bucks. Looking forward to finally watching it.

 

[TAJ]

My younger brother picked up Pacific Rim for me from work for a few bucks. Looking forward to finally watching it.

That's not 3D. It's not even my second choice, UHD.
Still, enjoy the ride.

 

[borghe]

yeah, it's basically fake HDR... it will accept the signal but the TV doesn't really have much juice to display a good HDR image.

yes, same as mine. You can see the color difference, but the overall contrast it pretty muted. Sticking the nickels and dimes together for a TCL p607 maybe next month.

 

[KDash31987]

That's not 3D. It's not even my second choice, UHD.
Still, enjoy the ride.

I don't have a TV that supports either.

I also don't think any store in my area has those versions. I looked at the different versions on Best Buy, Walmart, and Target websites yesterday, and all I could find was Target having the two copies of the regular Blu-ray/DVD combo pack for $10.

I read that the 4K version doesn't bring the extra bonus features disc. Is that true?

 

[TAJ]

3D is $10 on Amazon right now. I paid the same amount at Best Buy but that was a while ago.
I don't have my own copy of the UHD to check.

 

[Zeyphersan]

yes, same as mine. You can see the color difference, but the overall contrast it pretty muted. Sticking the nickels and dimes together for a TCL p607 maybe next month.

I have a TCL P607 in the mail right now, I’m really looking forward to it. My game plan is to just manually switch Apple TV modes depending on the content I’m gonna watch, until they patch that shit in. It’s going to be crazy cumbersome and I’m going to hate doing it, but if a movie I’m gonna watch is only 1080p24, I want it sending that exact signal to my TV

 

[mechashiva]

My younger brother picked up Pacific Rim for me from work for a few bucks. Looking forward to finally watching it.

That's cool of your brother. Enjoy that big fun ridiculous movie.

 

[Westonian]

I read that the 4K version doesn't bring the extra bonus features disc. Is that true?

Sadly that is correct.

 

[jstevenson]

no, apple tv 4K doesn't send HDR metadata on the menus and such. it only sends HDR metadata on content (screensaver, Netflix or iTunes for now)

mine definitely sends Dolby Vision data on all menus (main menu, apps like CBS) etc

that's the whole point and the issue, whatever colorspace you select, the Apple TV 4K sends everything in that colorspace

 

[torontoml]

If my 4K copy of Blade Runner glitches out at the same point is the disc and not the player right? It does load after like a minute and no further problems.

 

[TAJ]

If my 4K copy of Blade Runner glitches out at the same point is the disc and not the player right? It does load after like a minute and no further problems.

Not necessarily. I've heard several stories of a disc glitching at the same spot and then working on a different player, usually from people using an Xbox One S.

 

[torontoml]

Not necessarily. I've heard several stories of a disc glitching at the same spot and then working on a different player, usually from people using an Xbox One S.

Well mine is a Panasonic UB900. I did have a problem with my Wonder Woman disc as well, so maybe there is something going on with the player. Guess I'll have to try a couple more discs and see if something happens

 

[SomewhatGroovy]

Dumb questions:

1) what is the Apple 4K TV's value proposition over , say, Vudu assuming I don't have a digital library (I DO have an extensive VUDU library though)

2) I have a pretty good ethernet connection to most of my devices. What benefits would I get watching 4K movies from 4K disc vs streaming the UHD vers of the digital movies? I'll rephrase, why wait for Spiderman Homecoming on disc vs streaming it today?

Thanks in advance

 

[borghe]

Dumb questions:

1) what is the Apple 4K TV's value proposition over , say, Vudu assuming I don't have a digital library (I DO have an extensive VUDU library though)

Vudu is a service. Apple TV 4K is a box. To watch Vudu, you need a box, of which there are a number along with Apple TV.

What you do gain with Apple TV (I think in regards to what you are asking) is that you have access to ALL providers. 99¢ rentals on Amazon (as of this coming Thursday), Google (YouTube), Vudu, iTunes, etc. Deals and such on all of those platforms. Presumably Amazon and Vudu will at some point be 4K (if Amazon doesn't launch at 4K this week). YouTube likely won't be 4K for a while... Apple doesn't offer VP9 hardware decoding, so it's up to Google or not if they want to bother with software decoding specifically for their app (unlikely as they don't provide decoding on any platform, letting the platform handle it natively)

Specific to Apple TV, I feel the TV app is REALLY good, and getting better all of the time. Essentially it's a content aggregator for all services that let Apple catalog their stuff.. which is every major provider so far except Netflix (who has a vested interest in not letting their content be aggregated). So you can search for movies, TV shows and such in the TV app and it will show you the services they're on (I am seeing Netflix results showing up recently, but it doesn't keep track of episodes you watch on netflix like the other services). There are also the news and sports aggregation features coming later this fall, with stuff like the ESPN app letting you stream four 1080p channels at once on a 4K screen.

2) I have a pretty good ethernet connection to most of my devices. What benefits would I get watching 4K movies from 4K disc vs streaming the UHD vers of the digital movies? I'll rephrase, why wait for Spiderman Homecoming on disc vs streaming it today?

Thanks in advance

basically the same answer as always.. physical discs will always be higher quality. And as internet speeds ramp up, bigger discs will always be on the horizon. Total bitrate streaming right now from most services is 15Mbps for video and audio.. This doesn't even touch the bitrate of many movies on UHD Blu-ray which come in over 50Mbps. With that being said, eventually you will hit diminishing returns for bitrate.. does a 50Mb stream look 25% better than a 40Mb stream? Of course not. But it DOES look better.

with that being said, I buy digital for most stuff.. I give up the quality for less clutter/space, and better convenience. Vudu I believe already offers Atmos, and Apple will be adding Atmos to Apple TV 4K (and presumably their movies) at some point in the near future. For me that constitutes "good enough" in this regard.

 

[TAJ]

With the current political environment it seems unwise to rely on streaming. Attacks on net neutrality could easily bring video-specific throttling and upselling like we're seeing now in the mobile space from Verizon.

 

[SomewhatGroovy]

borghe, thanks for the information. Really helpful. I have a TCL 605 and a lot of the services are available by default.

I think the one disadvantage I am seeing for the time being is that Vudu will not allow me access to UHD versions of my library without paying while it sounds like Apple TV will for movies purchased from their platform. That's a huge plus though because my library on VUDU is extensive, I am l inclined to just sit still until Vudu makes a decision around this one way or another though I ;m not holding my breath since a lot of the movies i have were redeemed codes.

 

[borghe]

borghe, thanks for the information. Really helpful. I have a TCL 605 and a lot of the services are available by default.

I think the one disadvantage I am seeing for the time being is that Vudu will not allow me access to UHD versions of my library without paying while it sounds like Apple TV will for movies purchased from their platform. That's a huge plus though because my library on VUDU is extensive, I am l inclined to just sit still until Vudu makes a decision around this one way or another though I ;m not holding my breath since a lot of the movies i have were redeemed codes.

Yes, iTunes (which just started 4K last week) is one purchase for any HD version. Out of 185 movies on the service, I had about 15ish upgrade to 4K for free. Not sure what Vudu and Amazon are going to do to match that part.

One caveat with itunes... is that the frequently "deprecate" movies for new versions (I don't know a better term...). So like I bought copies of Alien and Aliens a few years back. those versions don't exist anywhere on the store now. There ARE new versions, with slightly different features.. I Can still play/watch my old versions.. but there is a very strong chance that if they upgrade the movies to 4K, they'll upgrade the new versions.. meaning I probably won't get access to them. This is purely speculation however. Only time will tell.

 

[Setzer]

I see they're releasing the first 4 Harry Potter movies in 4k UHD next week for $39.99 each. No way am I shelling out $320 for all 8 films so I ordered the complete collection from Amazon UK which will be released November 6th for 74.99($100 USD). And yes, its region free!

 

[hikarutilmitt]

Only slightly off topic, but does anyone use a Roku Premiere+ or Ultra for streaming HDR? It seems like a fairly common issue at this point that HDCP issues happen if you're using HDR, but even non-HDR depends on a ton of otherwise unidentifiable factors ranging from the cables to AVR to TV to the position of the planets on a given hour.

I know some of you guys in here are liking the Apple 4k, but what about the nVidia Shield? I've heard it's solid but, like any other device, there are reviews saying it has networking issues and other such nonsense.

Is it just this impossible to find a device that does what we want and works consistently? I'd only ever use my TV's AndroidTV apps for everything, but we have a SlingTV sub and the app on there refuses to start half the time despite it being the better app.

 

[Westonian]

My 7 year old son has literally been counting down the days until this came out for the past month.

I'm going to hate watch this tonight. At least the steelbook art is nice.

 

[PhoncipleBone]

Transformers Last Knight is in Dolby Vision as well.

 

[Big Blue]

I don't have a TV that supports either.

I also don't think any store in my area has those versions. I looked at the different versions on Best Buy, Walmart, and Target websites yesterday, and all I could find was Target having the two copies of the regular Blu-ray/DVD combo pack for $10.

I read that the 4K version doesn't bring the extra bonus features disc. Is that true?

It's still a reference disc for 1080p. Enjoy it.

 

[KDash31987]

That's cool of your brother. Enjoy that big fun ridiculous movie.

Yeah, he's great. Hopefully we'll watch the movie sometime this week.

Sadly that is correct.

Dang.

It's still a reference disc for 1080p. Enjoy it.

So I've heard! Can't wait. Thanks!

 

[mechashiva]

One day away from being able to finally enjoy the full visual power of my tv. New Sony X800 arrives with region free mod tomorrow. Going to drop in Starship Troopers then Guardians.
Also because of the region free stuff I'll be taking advantage of the 5 for 30 (pounds) sale on arrow stuff. My buddy in England will be grabbing them and sending them back with his gf from here.

 

[BastardSamurai]

Man, Vudu is getting more competitive for new UHD purchases. WW and Spidey are about $20 each, and Lego Batman is about $14.

Meanwhile, disc versions of Lego Batman and WW are around $30 each, and Spidey at $28. I'm mostly future-proofing (don't have a 4K set or player just yet), and I know disc quality will be better than streaming, but I'm tempted into going digital for these three, and potentially most movies if the pricing stays like this...

 

[Vyer]

Man, seeing that Last Knight UHD really set off some internal conflict for me. I know watching that in 4K would be amazing and also fuckng terrible.

 

[TAJ]

I once said that I'd watch two hours of nothing but turds sliding out of elephants' asses if it was in 3D but I think Transformers 5 probably doesn't even rise to that level.

Man, Vudu is getting more competitive for new UHD purchases. WW and Spidey are about $20 each, and Lego Batman is about $14.

Meanwhile, disc versions of Lego Batman and WW are around $30 each, and Spidey at $28. I'm mostly future-proofing (don't have a 4K set or player just yet), and I know disc quality will be better than streaming, but I'm tempted into going digital for these three, and potentially most movies if the pricing stays like this...

I just bought Hidden Figures, a fairly recent movie, on UHD disc for $12.99 at Fry's.
That wasn't even a promo code deal.

 

[BastardSamurai]

I just bought Hidden Figures, a fairly recent movie, on UHD disc for $12.99 at Fry's.
That wasn't even a promo code deal.

Dang, next time I head down to South Bay, I'll hit up Fry's.

 

[TAJ]

Dang, next time I head down to South Bay, I'll hit up Fry's.

I used to live in Manhattan Beach. That store is tiny.
The deal I mentioned had a yellow sale tag, but I'd check the stickers on the cases, too. I've seen several sub-$8 titles before. Some have gone higher since.

 

[X05]

Man, Vudu is getting more competitive for new UHD purchases. WW and Spidey are about $20 each, and Lego Batman is about $14.

Meanwhile, disc versions of Lego Batman and WW are around $30 each, and Spidey at $28. I'm mostly future-proofing (don't have a 4K set or player just yet), and I know disc quality will be better than streaming, but I'm tempted into going digital for these three, and potentially most movies if the pricing stays like this...

Not sure if it's due to iTunes finally having UHD movies or what, but now Vudu has quite few UHD movies at 15-20 besides those you mentioned, like Baby Driver, Fury Road, BvS and Edge of Tomorrow among others.

And The Lego Movie is just $10.

 

[mechashiva]

Man, Vudu is getting more competitive for new UHD purchases. WW and Spidey are about $20 each, and Lego Batman is about $14.

Meanwhile, disc versions of Lego Batman and WW are around $30 each, and Spidey at $28. I'm mostly future-proofing (don't have a 4K set or player just yet), and I know disc quality will be better than streaming, but I'm tempted into going digital for these three, and potentially most movies if the pricing stays like this...

They really need to get on making all 4k disc purchase redeem in UHD.

 

[Zeyphersan]

Just installed my first true 5.1 system in anticipation of the TV arriving in a couple days. This thing is NICE

 

[robotrock]

Just installed my first true 5.1 system in anticipation of the TV arriving in a couple days. This thing is NICE

hell yeah

 

[Markitron]

My younger brother picked up Pacific Rim for me from work for a few bucks. Looking forward to finally watching it.

It's absolutely awesome in 3D, but still enjoyable no matter what way you watch it.

Just installed my first true 5.1 system in anticipation of the TV arriving in a couple days. This thing is NICE

Always a special feeling. I got mine for the release of The Phantom Menace on DVD in 2001, blew my mind. Also I actually quite like that film despite it's flaws so that helped.

 

[Scavenger]

Starship Troopers 4K UHD Blu-ray $9.51 @ Amazon.com

Not planning on upgrading to 4K anytime soon, but it's very tempting to future-proof myself.

 

[StarPlatinumTheWorld]

I have a quick question...

On my TV I have 3 HDMI ports labelled 1 2 3, on the one labelled 2 it also says ARC. My Sony soundbar which is currently plugged in with an optical cable has one HDMI port labelled 1 ARC.

How do I set it up to use ARC? I currently have all 3 HDMI ports on the TV in use, 1 = Apple TV 4K, 2 ARC = Blu-Ray player and 3 = Sky TV box.

I've very confused, is ARC even better than Optical?

 

[robotrock]

Starship Troopers 4K UHD Blu-ray $9.51 @ Amazon.com

Not planning on upgrading to 4K anytime soon, but it's very tempting to future-proof myself.

Thank you lord for this deal

 

[mechashiva]

Thank you lord for this deal

Man, I love the steelbook art but what a deal!