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[Jaymageck]

I'd say that any the playstation portables have both represented and covered the demand for the most 'console like' experience.

The Nintendo portables have both covered and represented the demand for a gaming experience specific to handhelds.

I honestly think any remaining audience that wants gaming on the move, but doesn't own a 3DS or PSVita, has no reason to buy a dedicated handheld gaming device rather than using their mobile device. And I can't see anything that would really change that.

 

[PastorOfMuppets]

This has been happening for some time now. Which always makes me cringe when people only equate mobile gaming with F2P garbage they see on TV ads.

You can play damn good ports of XCOM: Enemy Within, Civilization Revolution, King of Dragon Pass and more on mobile RIGHT NOW that all control wonderfully with touch. As well as more action-oriented titles that still use successful k/m to touch translations like FTL, Papers Please, Wolf Among Us, Banner Saga, etc. Add to that a whole host of original classics (Lara Croft GO, Horizon Chase, etc.) and you start to see that mobile gaming isn't some ghetto experience some believe it to be.

Exactly, I've seen some PC games being sold in the Android Play Store. Besides turn based games, there's also a bunch of RPGs and point and click adventures since SCUMMVM has been ported over to Android. The market for high quality mobile gaming is still yet to be tapped but everybody here who grew up with consoles is missing the boat on it.

 

[QaaQer]

There is a market for a kid friendly gaming device like the Game Boy, there always will be.

Only if it costs $50 and has free games.

 

[Tenrius]

I don't know if you notice people on downtime away from home, but mobile/tablet activities (not even just games!) have a deathgrip on the populace.

Yeah, I always end up browsing the Internet on my phone on public transportation instead of playing my 3DS/GBA SP. Always regret it afterwards. Then again, I get into this situation A LOT at home too.

 

[The Beard]

Yes, I think you're crazy.

•Everybody carries a smartphone with them at all times.

•Smartphones play games. With a huge library of free games.

•Most people don't want to carry a second device around with them.

 

[Zee-Row]

Sony is the reason the Vita wasn't successful , they just put the hardware out there and barely promoted it. The expensive memory cards didn't help either. The Vita would be more popular if they put half the effort they put in marketing their consoles.

This is why i'm hesitant on Playstation VR.

 

[Tavernacle12]

Only if it costs $50 and has free games.

Agreed. I work retail and we constantly have customers who want a cheap tablet with free games and no need for wifi. If Nintendo put out a dedicated handheld that cost $50, had Minecraft, Pokemon, and Youtube all pre-installed with a bunch of free-to-play games downloadable afterwards and marketed it as a budget solution to get kids to stop trying to play on their parent's phones, then I think the handheld market could come back. The Game Boy thrived off a younger audience, that's what a new handheld would have to target. It needs to a be a viable, cheap alternative to getting a tablet.

Oh, and I realize the device I described would obviously need wifi, but so long as they can play Minecraft and Pokemon in the car I think it'd be fine. If their kid is using their tablet for Youtube anyways they have to have wifi somewhere.

 

[hersheyfan]

I personally think the ship on dedicated handhelds has sailed, and I say that as a huge Vita guy.

Even before mobile internet was a widespread thing, I always tended to read a magazine or a book if I had a few minutes to kill... Starting up the NDS generally took too long to be worthwhile... By the time you got settled in, the wait was over and you have to close everything again. It's even worse at present, as I end up just reading GAF during short waits.

Nowadays, I generally keep a Vita or 3DS in the car in case an extended period of waiting comes up (rarely happens); I also play sometimes before going to sleep, if I'm too lazy to fire up the PS4 or the PC.

As painful as it is to admit, that's a very limited use case, and while I'm willing to pay extra for that dedicated handheld premium, I imagine a lot of other people won't.

 

[Jon Carter]

Agreed. I work retail and we constantly have customers who want a cheap tablet with free games and no need for wifi. If Nintendo put out a dedicated handheld that cost $50, had Minecraft, Pokemon, and Youtube all pre-installed with a bunch of free-to-play games downloadable afterwards and marketed it as a budget solution to get kids to stop trying to play on their parent's phones, then I think the handheld market could come back. The Game Boy thrived off a younger audience, that's what a new handheld would have to target. It needs to a be a viable, cheap alternative to getting a tablet.

Oh, and I realize the device I described would obviously need wifi, but so long as they can play Minecraft and Pokemon in the car I think it'd be fine. If their kid is using their tablet for Youtube anyways they have to have wifi somewhere.

Even in 2016, especially so for parents, if a game isn't on retail shelves, it won't sell hardware. They need retail visibility but then handheld retail games are often too expensive for parents so only the biggest ones sell.

There needs to be a way for the mainstream to know that there is an extensive library of good and cheap digital games, and then Nintendo would have to make their smaller games more affordable digitally.

It's a very complex situation, but the software isn't the problem, the hardware isn't the problem, the price of the hardware isn't that big of a problem, it's really the pricing and visibility of the non-AAA handheld games (meaning games like Mario Kart, Pokémon or Smash Bros. are fine).

 

[BreakAtmo]

What I would love to see is a successor to the Vita that is more powerful, but instead of using that power to stick SUPER KICKIN' RAD graphics on a 5" screen, Sony could instead enforce a mandate that all of the games are required to run at 60fps and in 3D. I figure they could all run at either 540p/3D/60fps or 720p/2D/60fps. Instead of trying to force the idea of 'console-style' games on a handheld, try making more actual pick-up-and-play handheld games with decent visuals, but a focus on smooth, glasses-free 60fps 3D that gives a gorgeous sense of depth while being a lot easier on the eye due to the high framerate.

Additionally, it would likely be quite easy to supplement the library of new titles with remasters of PSP, PS2 and Vita titles. I actually think the unit would be well-served having full digital PSP BC and digital+physical Vita BC, but with the option to upgrade to the actual 60fps 3D port to the new system at a discount. Like, ports of Vita games could be $20 but cut to $10 if you already own the original, and PSP ports could be $10/$5. PS2 ports would be great to see - imagine playing the GTA games, Ico/SotC, MGS2/3 (and PW!), etc. on the go in 60fps 3D.

Of course the issues with the Vita would have to be cleaned up - use microSD, fix the controls, etc. It would probably fail, but honestly, I do wonder if maybe the reason why stuff like the Vita and Shield don't do so well is because people don't care much about the 'home console in your pocket' thing. This would offer a focus on 3D and smooth, properly-controllable gameplay in pick-up-and-play titles, which mobile gaming doesn't really offer. And microSD would really help.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

I think there's still a market for a Nintendo handheld. It's not a huge market, but it's there. If NX really does play the same library between console and handheld, the portable component should be pretty successful.

I don't think there'a a market for a dedicated handheld by any other company though.

 

[Lockless]

So you're saying your want a Wii U with infinite range for the gamepad?

 

[The Beard]

What I would love to see is a successor to the Vita that is more powerful, but instead of using that power to stick SUPER KICKIN' RAD graphics on a 5" screen, Sony could instead enforce a mandate that all of the games are required to run at 60fps and in 3D. I figure they could all run at either 540p/3D/60fps or 720p/2D/60fps. Instead of trying to force the idea of 'console-style' games on a handheld, try making more actual pick-up-and-play handheld games with decent visuals, but a focus on smooth, glasses-free 60fps 3D that gives a gorgeous sense of depth while being a lot easier on the eye due to the high framerate.

Additionally, it would likely be quite easy to supplement the library of new titles with remasters of PSP, PS2 and Vita titles. I actually think the unit would be well-served having full digital PSP BC and digital+physical Vita BC, but with the option to upgrade to the actual 60fps 3D port to the new system at a discount. Like, ports of Vita games could be $20 but cut to $10 if you already own the original, and PSP ports could be $10/$5. PS2 ports would be great to see - imagine playing the GTA games, Ico/SotC, MGS2/3 (and PW!), etc. on the go in 60fps 3D.

Of course the issues with the Vita would have to be cleaned up - use microSD, fix the controls, etc. It would probably fail, but honestly, I do wonder if maybe the reason why stuff like the Vita and Shield don't do so well is because people don't care much about the 'home console in your pocket' thing. This would offer a focus on 3D and smooth, properly-controllable gameplay in pick-up-and-play titles, which mobile gaming doesn't really offer. And microSD would really help.

Maybe like 5 or 6 years ago when the popularity of 3D was at its peak. Making 3D your main selling point in 2016 would be a guaranteed failure.

 

[SalvaPot]

I just realized something that is very important and might be the main difference between the West and the East Market. I want to think someone already has thought of it, but I find it weird that I can't recall anyone who has made this argument.

I think its driving your car vs riding a bus or train to get to work/school/etc. In the West, specially in the US, its culturally expected for a citizen to own a car and drive it everywhere, to the point that there are fast lines in big cities for those who share a car and have 2 or more passengers. The public transport system works but its mostly relegated to those who can't afford cars, don't want to drive or convenience.

Meanwhile in Japan riding a train to work is still the preferred way to get to work and school.

What does this mean for handhelds? Well, if you live in the US chances are you are not going to play videogames while driving to work, you'll rather get home as fast as you can and turn on your console. Meanwhile in Japan you need something to kill time while sitting on the train, sometimes for hours, gaming on the go seems far more appealing than a home console.

I just think that for a US consumer its just more appealing to setup your TV and powerful device, put up your surround system and immerse yourself in the game and make an afternoon out of it.

Don't get me wrong, I love handheld gaming, to me is far more convenient and appealing, but I also have never been one to care about graphics or FPS or playing online that much, so been able to unpause a game and entertain myself for a few minutes then pause again is what I like.

This is also why Nintendo still remains relevant in the handheld area. They are the undisputed kings of pick-and-play entertainment, so buying a console just to play 15 minutes of SMB2 or having Pokemon waiting for you on the pocket for your bathroom break its a big plus.

 

[RedSwirl]

Exactly, I've seen some PC games being sold in the Android Play Store. Besides turn based games, there's also a bunch of RPGs and point and click adventures since SCUMMVM has been ported over to Android. The market for high quality mobile gaming is still yet to be tapped but everybody here who grew up with consoles is missing the boat on it.

There is certainly a healthy market for ports of deep, premium games from other platforms. It's just that you still virtually never see anything debut on mobile platforms with the same depth as something like KOTOR or XCOM. Maybe the Telltale games and Baldur's Gate Enhanced Edition (which itself is an elaborate remaster). Original premium mobile games are still in the heavy minority.

Even in 2016, especially so for parents, if a game isn't on retail shelves, it won't sell hardware. They need retail visibility but then handheld retail games are often too expensive for parents so only the biggest ones sell.

There needs to be a way for the mainstream to know that there is an extensive library of good and cheap digital games, and then Nintendo would have to make their smaller games more affordable digitally.

It's a very complex situation, but the software isn't the problem, the hardware isn't the problem, the price of the hardware isn't that big of a problem, it's really the pricing and visibility of the non-AAA handheld games (meaning games like Mario Kart, Pokémon or Smash Bros. are fine).

It's weird that for a non-iPhone non-Android handheld, physical media could still be an advantage -- parents probably being more comfortable buying a game card to put into their kids' device than trying to connect to wifi.

The issue about the pricing of the software is dead-on though. Discoverability on iOS is still a huge issue and a cause of the race to the bottom. I still think a reason for this is that the Apple App Store by itself is too narrow a channel to distribute the totality of all the software for a platform as popular as iOS. I think more software might benefit if there were more storefronts selling it, but that's just me. Like I said earlier, if more developers could get away with selling $30 iOS and Android games, we'd see much higher quality games. You'd likely see games of quality similar to Bravely Second or XCOM debut on mobile instead of get ported there. I don't even think the touch screen-only interface would be that much of an impediment, not if games like Dragon Quest are playable on it.

I just realized something that is very important and might be the main difference between the West and the East Market. I want to think someone already has thought of it, but I find it weird that I can't recall anyone who has made this argument.

I think its driving your car vs riding a bus or train to get to work/school/etc. In the West, specially in the US, its culturally expected for a citizen to own a car and drive it everywhere, to the point that there are fast lines in big cities for those who share a car and have 2 or more passengers. The public transport system works but its mostly relegated to those who can't afford cars, don't want to drive or convenience.

Meanwhile in Japan riding a train to work is still the preferred way to get to work and school.

What does this mean for handhelds? Well, if you live in the US chances are you are not going to play videogames while driving to work, you'll rather get home as fast as you can and turn on your console. Meanwhile in Japan you need something to kill time while sitting on the train, sometimes for hours, gaming on the go seems far more appealing than a home console.

I just think that for a US consumer its just more appealing to setup your TV and powerful device, put up your surround system and immerse yourself in the game and make an afternoon out of it.

Don't get me wrong, I love handheld gaming, to me is far more convenient and appealing, but I also have never been one to care about graphics or FPS or playing online that much, so been able to unpause a game and entertain myself for a few minutes then pause again is what I like.

This is also why Nintendo still remains relevant in the handheld area. They are the undisputed kings of pick-and-play entertainment, so buying a console just to play 15 minutes of SMB2 or having Pokemon waiting for you on the pocket for your bathroom break its a big plus.

People have been bringing this up since circa 2008 when everyone started to notice the DS and PSP taking over Japan while Japanese console games were becoming less common.

 

[SalvaPot]

There is certainly a healthy market for ports of deep, premium games from other platforms. It's just that you still virtually never see anything debut on mobile platforms with the same depth as something like KOTOR or XCOM. Maybe the Telltale games and Baldur's Gate Enhanced Edition (which itself is an elaborate remaster). Original premium mobile games are still in the heavy minority.



It's weird that for a non-iPhone non-Android handheld, physical media could still be an advantage -- parents probably being more comfortable buying a game card to put into their kids' device than trying to connect to wifi.

The issue about the pricing of the software is dead-on though. Discoverability on iOS is still a huge issue and a cause of the race to the bottom. I still think a reason for this is that the Apple App Store by itself is too narrow a channel to distribute the totality of all the software for a platform as popular as iOS. I think more software might benefit if there were more storefronts selling it, but that's just me. Like I said earlier, if more developers could get away with selling $30 iOS and Android games, we'd see much higher quality games. You'd likely see games of quality similar to Bravely Second or XCOM debut on mobile instead of get ported there. I don't even think the touch screen-only interface would be that much of an impediment, not if games like Dragon Quest are playable on it.



People have been bringing this up since circa 2008 when everyone started to notice the DS and PSP taking over Japan while Japanese console games were becoming less common.

And I don't doubt it, I just think its more important now than before. Its something so obvious I feel dumb I didn't realize it sooner.

 

[BreakAtmo]

Maybe like 5 or 6 years ago when the popularity of 3D was at its peak. Making 3D your main selling point in 2016 would be a guaranteed failure.

Ehhh, I dunno. Besides the fact that it wouldn't necessarily be the sole main selling point (not even as much as it is for the 3DS), the glasses-free nature would help, and it would be coming out of the gate with the stable camera-assisted 3D that the 3DS originally lacked, I do think it would be possible to get past the negative perception. People not really liking 3D came more from not wanting to put on glasses to watch a movie, and this idea involves neither of those things.

I do get what you mean though, that too many people might see 3D and just walk away. It's certainly possible.

 

[jax]

Why yes, I am excited for the Nintendo NX. I have faith that Nintendo is about to completely pull a Wii out of their hat. Going to be 2007 all over again, only this time with a handheld and tons of third party support.

 

[duckroll]

Is there an untapped market of buyers looking for an expensive dedicated handheld that will be capable of playing most, if not all, hot-ticket upcoming AAA games that will be available on PC or a major console?

Ha.

Haha.

Hahahaha.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.

LOL.

 

[Prototype]

Yes, I think you're crazy.

•Everybody carries a smartphone with them at all times.

•Smartphones play games. With a huge library of free games.

•Most people don't want to carry a second device around with them.

.
Edit: especially the 3rd point

 

[AppleSeason]

Outside of people who actually want handhelds (and nintendo games), pretty much the potential market for handheld gaming by now is restricted to kids whose parents don't want them addicted to smartphones / tablets at an early age. I've only known of a few kids that did want to play Mario games instead of the smartphone "free" crap. I even gave one of those my old N64. He loved it.


As much as it pains me how handheld is a dying breed, I have to accept that I am guilty of adding to its decline. When I had a 3DS I only bought one game for it and it spend most of its time in its box until I sold it two years later, and Vita is a machine I only pick for long travels or when I can't use a TV console or . Outside of those must play things that force me to pick it (Ace Attorney Dual Destinies or the Danganronpa Series), I can't see myself playing at home on a small screen with crammed controllers when I can use a TV system or the computer.
Heck, looking back at my personal story, it's more of a nostalgia filter case. My first console was a gameboy because my parents were firm believers of the "consoles damage tv's" myth and pretty much once I got an Snes followed by a computer and PSX, the gameboy was completely forgotten until the pokémon crazed happened around 1999. The only reason I'm so fond of GBA is that it was a time I had massive conmutes. Once that period was over... DS, PSP, 3DS, Vita... All of them are underused for me and only being recharged when a game I really want to play comes out (and even like that I'm hoping Danganronpa Ultra Despair Girls comes to PC or PS4)

An hybrid of handheld and tv system where I can jump more or less seamlessly from the couch to the subway and viceversa? That's what could totally win me back? Even if I had to keep manually moving the savegame, it was great for Final Fantasy Tactics on PSN or games with crossave. And that's why I want to have high hopes for NX. I like being able to take gaming on the go, but I don't like being confined to a small device once I am back at home.

 

[Jimrpg]

The handheld market is pretty much dead and been taken over by smartphones.

But I wouldn't mind seeing a $99 steam handheld. I don't think it would do that well, but itd be an interesting piece of hardware all the same. We basically have the tech (itd be something like an ipod touch), somebody just needs to add some decent nubs and buttons. Id be cool even if it didn't have and it was just totally touch screen.

There's more than enough Steam games to run on basic hardware. The handheld OS would need to sift out games or warn the user that it won't run hardware intensive games.

 

[Aaron D.]

I think its driving your car vs riding a bus or train to get to work/school/etc. In the West, specially in the US, its culturally expected for a citizen to own a car and drive it everywhere, to the point that there are fast lines in big cities for those who share a car and have 2 or more passengers. The public transport system works but its mostly relegated to those who can't afford cars, don't want to drive or convenience.

Meanwhile in Japan riding a train to work is still the preferred way to get to work and school.

What does this mean for handhelds? Well, if you live in the US chances are you are not going to play videogames while driving to work, you'll rather get home as fast as you can and turn on your console. Meanwhile in Japan you need something to kill time while sitting on the train, sometimes for hours, gaming on the go seems far more appealing than a home console.

I think you're off base here. I commute daily on the 2nd largest subway system in the country, DC Metro. And additionally the #1 largest (NY MTA) frequently every year.

The demographics of subway entertainment have simply changed. 10 years ago you saw a hodgepodge of people reading books & newspapers, playing DS & PSP, listening to iPods, etc. Now it's all mobile all the time.

The decline of handheld has nothing to do with Americans driving themselves to work. If that were the case there never would have been a market for GB, DS, 3DS in the US to begin with. Where I once used to see dedicated hardware on Metro all the time, I can count the number of 3DSs & Vitas I've seen in the past few years on less than one hand.

People's habits have simply changed over the past number of years as mobile has taken the place of more traditional free-time entertainment. Well, people are still reading on the train, listening to music, and playing games. Just like they always have. Only now they're simply doing it all off of their smartphones.

 

[Nikodemos]

You're not wrong, OP, but the fundamental problem is that such a device will simply not sell at any pricepoint above $149, and it must come with a minimum of 32 GB of internal storage (apart for the SD card) alongside its physical buttons, which is a pretty tough proposition for that sort of money.

 

[Moreche]

In my pocket I carry an iPhone that has love you to bits, ghost trick, Minecraft and it also allows me to FaceTime, message, reminders, music, movies, podcasts, Apple Pay, syncs with my watch so I can still get info from it in another room, I'm hoping you get the idea.
Any company would be nuts to release a handheld console.
Nintendo nearly had me with 3D but the resolution wasn't there, I hate their account system and the price of games is to high.

 

[AppleSeason]

In my pocket I carry an iPhone that has love you to bits, ghost trick, Minecraft and it also allows me to FaceTime, message, reminders, music, movies, podcasts, Apple Pay, syncs with my watch so I can still get info from it in another room, I'm hoping you get the idea.
Any company would be nuts to release a handheld console.
Nintendo nearly had me with 3D but the resolution wasn't there, I hate their account system and the price of games is to high.

Pretty much why I moved from 3DS to Vita. At least I encounter more frequent sales, while the price of certain games for 3DS tends to skyrocket. Like when i tried to buy Teathrirythm in a physical edition.