Guilty_AI
Member
I mean, its not like story and exploration are exemplar either.
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BG3 or Witcher 3?
- Thread starter Arsic
- Start date
Bojji
Member
That's your opinion of course. Game as a whole is among best games ever made.
Guilty_AI
Member
Thats also your opinion
. Exploration is 80% about finding random loot that's completely boring or useless because the combat sucks in the first place. I stopped getting excited about legendary swords after getting the 17th just laying around somewhere. Story has tons of low points.
Bojji
Member
It's very good in some aspects but as a whole it's not on the same level as TW3 (can't speak for BG3).
Thats also your opinion
I wasn't bored in TW3, maybe in some parts of Novigrad main story questline but it get's on track after that. I still heaven't seen a game with better (side) quests than TW3, I wanted to do all of them because I was curious how creators will surprise me this time - there is ton of amazing stuff in this game.
Loot is useless but in this game I didn't really cared about it, my main focus was on doing quests and exploring the world story/characters.
Guilty_AI
Member
I can't say you explored anything then, there's almost nothing worth of seeing off the beaten path that isn't a big marker on the map already, with the vast majority of question markers just being random loot points. It's a very ubisoft-y game in this sense.
In terms of story, the high point was the Red baron quest-line, Novigrad felt like fan-service most of the time, Skillege was a bit mid with good moments and other not-so-good ones. End game post-Ciri was just kind of bad, especially when the game reveals its hand and shows almost nothing you did before mattered and only a few decisions now will determine the actual ending, which i usually don't care much about but people sold others on this game under premises of "decisions matter" or "difficult moral choices", all of which i found the game severely lacking in.
I always find it amazing because i see people shitting on Cyberpunk due to these exact same points... then the same people go on to praise The Witcher 3. This genuinely felt like a case of rose-tinted glasses, it even taught me about general public perception and the influence of social media.
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Bojji
Member
I like Cyberpunk almost as much as TW3 and I see how this game is very similar when it comes to how story and side quests are build (despite completely different setting).
I won't counter any of your opinions because, what't the point? There are many games that people adore that I don't like at all and vice versa (like Forspoken or Alone in the Dark 2024), I can see qualities of BG3 but it's not fun to play (to me).
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Edgelord79
Gold Member
Wow I found BG3 so large due to the choices and customization available.i found Witcher 3 shorter maybe because it was easier to go through?
Imru’ al-Qays
Member
BG3's story and writing are honestly extraordinarily bad which is a big problem for an RPG
Witcher 3's combat is extraordinarily bad but that's less of a problem since you can just kick it down to easy and play for the story
Witcher 3's combat is extraordinarily bad but that's less of a problem since you can just kick it down to easy and play for the story
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gaming_again
Member
The core of games like Cyberpunk and Witcher 3 is maximum immersion in a perfectly-crafted world. People moaning about loot, combat, reactive quest structures or whatever are missing the point of those games. Which is fine, but please don't act as though you're operating on a higher tier of understanding because you find those factors lacking. Nobody is playing CDPR games for the loot.
They're more like picture books than games.
They're more like picture books than games.
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Guilty_AI
Member
"pls don't criticize my favorite game"
Musashipan
Member
Witcher by far
Perfect post
JayK47
Member
Both are great. If you like open world and action, The Witcher 3. If you like less open world and turn based, Balders Gate 3. I really like Geralt and the world of The Witcher. Balders Gate has more "choices matter", but sorta doesn't matter, unless you want to kill everyone and I guess do the bad guys bidding...
Kings Field
Member
Sorry to ask this year but I’m ready to start Witcher 3. I own it on both series X and ps5. Which console runs it the best and/or looks better?
Thanks!
Thanks!
Sentenza
Member
An, the good old "joke's on you, I was just PRETENDING to be retarded".So easy to rattle folks cages on this forumSoppy twats
Ok, Witcher 3 by an absolute country mile because it doesn’t have turn based combat.
Sentenza
Member
Being too easy even on the hardest setting is ALREADY one of the major flaws of TW3.
"Kicking it down to easy" doesn't really do the game any favor.
That aside, while its combat system is underwhelming on a good day, it's not even the game's major flaw.
swing_harder
Neo Member
I just bought the PS5 version a couple of days ago myself. I think it runs and looks great in performance mode. For a 10 year old game, she’s still a beauty. The ray tracing mode however, was choppy and unplayable for me. FYI…the Complete Edition with all the dlc is currently on sale for $14.99 in the PlayStation Store. A great deal for the amount of content you’re getting. Having a blast so far. No insight on the Xbox version.
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BigLee74
Member
Oooh, you’ve read that wrong. No jokes intended. I called you a soppy twat for getting triggered that I think turn based combat in games is absolute shit. Which it is, and always will be. Therefore, Witcher 3 soundly gets my vote (helped by the fact it is a great game in its own right).
I hope that’s ok with you. Opinions and all that.
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Sentenza
Member
I'm not "triggered". I just think you are clueless moron.
I KNOW for a fact that (good) turn-based combat is great.
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Bojji
Member
Both versions are pretty much the same, performance mode has higher resolution and almost locked 60fps.
BigLee74
Member
What a master of repartee you are!
If good turn based combat is great, is great turn based combat excellent?
Witcher 3 by a country mile.
Sentenza
Member
It may be?What a master of repartee you are!
If good turn based combat is great, is great turn based combat excellent?
The point is that turn-based combat has its own appeal even if dimwtis like you seem to think a genre can be INHERENTLY superior or inferior.
That doesn't mean that EVERY turn-based combat is automatically good, as there are a lot of stinkers out there.
In the same way not every third person combat is Sekiro/Elden Ring and one can have TONS of middling, insipid shit like ELEX, the Spiderweb stuff, etc.
And let's face it, if we are talking STRICTLY about combat, TW3 would be on the list, too.
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BigLee74
Member
I would read your reply but after being called a moron and a dimwit in two successive replies from you, Im really struggling to give a shit.
Plus I don’t understand the big words.
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Sentenza
Member
Damn, I guess I'll live with that knowledge.
Imru’ al-Qays
Member
Narratively (both main and especially side quests/DLC) and graphically (including art direction) Witcher 3 is amazing. Not sure what major flaw you're referring to.
A good combat system is improved by difficulty, but a bad combat system is not.
Sentenza
Member
Not sure why you are arguing the merits of TW3 writing with me when I said the same thing in a previous reply. But since we are on topic: the quest design in TW3 despise being framed in an excellent narrative context, on a mechanical level suffers way too much of of the "follow-the-dotted-line syndrome", where the UI itself draws most of the conclusions and makes most of the decisions for you.
Then there's the progression system which is all kinds of flawed (and the leveling system feels completely vestigial and redundant... Not a rare problem these days, I'm afraid). he game would literally be improved just by removing explicit LEVELS from the core system and having just equipment and talents drive the progression.
On top of that, there's the itemization (that ties strongly with the previous problem) with its excessively steep scaling that almost manages to kill any sense of immersion and believability in a non-linear world. Any open world where the early game items do (or defend from) damage in the single digit and then their end game replacements go up to the THOUSANDS has a poorly thought system at its core.
apocaliptic
Member
Witcher 3 in every aspect. I don't understand how some say that characters and story in bg3 is better than the Witcher 3 characters and story.
Mozzarella
Member
This is mostly a good criticism of the game, i think i can let the quest design one slide because you can interpret it as the vision of the quest creator, they probably wanted it to be as thematically and narratively coherent as possible and having immersive-sim like mechanics is probably going to break them from this way, so instead of doing it Bethesda style they probably went to this route, still you are right that it becomes too reliant on certain mechanics like Witcher senses, but despite that i would say the side quests are still one of the best and most well crafted in gaming as a side quest, ofcourse im not talking about the Monster Contracts, people love to complain about those but in reality they are just the witcher job, they are supposed to be a routine.
As for the other points i have to say well said, i agree with them, i love W3 but there are some design decisions that are clear amateur mistakes, the one you put is Leveling, i do agree, leveling isn't interesting in the game and the skill tree is lame, its like Yakuza skill tree except a bit better, you have more damage, few movesets and few alteration of signs, thats it, Not too rich or interesting, then the loot and its one of the worst issues with the game, i know its not the point but it makes exploration dull when all you are exploring for is story and lore, so many of the legendary sword that quest givers claim to reward you with are just garbage loot that will go to junk few hours later into your run, where is that legendary sword? I can say the DLCs attempted to fix that and partly succeeded but the base game was filled with this shit.
I blame Diablo 2 for this.
I think midwit critic will say Combat is LE Bad
But a smart critic will address the real issues with the game, i know the combat is flawed but i think its serviceable it definitely can be improved upon and most likely will in the next installment, but as it is and within its genre i would say its about average.
Your leveling and skill argument was applied into Cyberpunk and i think it made the game better for it.
BoxFresh123
Member
Witcher 3. I came to it really late but it's amazing.
Base game is incredible but I can't forget the first time you go to Toussaint. Awesome.
Base game is incredible but I can't forget the first time you go to Toussaint. Awesome.
DaciaJC
Gold Member
All very solid points, particularly regarding the progression/leveling system. I hated how the CDPR's artists created such a gorgeous and believable open world only for the designers to ruin your immersion with arbitrarily leveled enemies, nonsensical item stats, etc. Thankfully I found a mod (Witcher 3 Enhanced Edition) which removed all levels and normalized all player/NPC/enemy stats and the game played beautifully as a result.
Lucifers Beard
Member
Both are completely different but great games.
BG3 is the better game for me personally though. I love the stories of the characters and finding out what's going to happen next. Just finished the last fight if Act 2 and damn it's just such an impressive game that has so many branching paths and interesting characters. I also play D&D regularly, so that helps with being a huge fan of the tabletop game.
I have also spent over 100 hours across two playthrougus of Witcher 3 though and loved it.
You can't go wrong with either game in all honesty
BG3 is the better game for me personally though. I love the stories of the characters and finding out what's going to happen next. Just finished the last fight if Act 2 and damn it's just such an impressive game that has so many branching paths and interesting characters. I also play D&D regularly, so that helps with being a huge fan of the tabletop game.
I have also spent over 100 hours across two playthrougus of Witcher 3 though and loved it.
You can't go wrong with either game in all honesty
darrylgorn
Member
Gran Turismo
Majima Everywhere System
Member
BG3 I couldn’t put down. It was an amazing immersion into DND.
I would say Witcher 1 was better than both for me.
Witcher 3 just never hooked me, through 80 hours. Who knows.
I would say Witcher 1 was better than both for me.
Witcher 3 just never hooked me, through 80 hours. Who knows.
EDMIX
Member
Same, 100% ^^^^
I love BG3, not only GOTY, GOTG, this is a staple RPG we will be talking about for generations to come.
I also love Witcher 1 much more and its like, the more the series continued, the more nerfed it became, the less it was an RPG and by the 3rd game, its like all of that is an afterthought. I know many feel like the whole meditating thing isn't a big deal, but to me, being limited on where you could do that added that challenge in the first game.
By the 3rd its like, yea sure...do that when ever, bombs? Oh that is free too lol Its like its just an action game at this point. Calling it an RPG is like calling AC Origins or AC Odyssey or Valhalla an RPG (those are not bad games either btw) I simply would never put them in the conversation of being the best RPGs of all time, let alone RPGs at all lol
Never liked the Story in Witcher 3 as it just felt like a dumbass runaround, be like "omg, you JUST missed her bro" and by the 4th time this happens, i'm done, i'm unintersted in anything they have going on and just want to hunt monsters, hear the story of the town that wants me to kill the monster annnnnnnd thats it. To me, that was the meat and potatoes of the first game.
Go to town, find clues, kill monster, citizens pay you annnnnnd on to the next town.
Thats it.
Its ok that is simply what it is, as the story regarding all the other characters is as boring as watching paint dry.
Dr. Wilkinson
Member
Well said. I am rediscovering the game now in next-gen mode on my Series X and goddamn. I put 50 hours into it back in 2015 on Xbox one when it had just come out and I had barely scratched the surface. Playing now by turning off the main quests and starting at lvl 30 where the first DLC expansion starts, and all of the entire game’s side quests and Hunts are available. What an amazing game. I’ve got like 200+ hours of ahead of me, and I’ve never touched Blood & Wine.
killatopak
Member
I think BG3. W3 would have been perfect if the battle system was better. I 100% my first playthrough but I don’t think I ever wanted to do an NG+ because the combat bored me. I was just spinning like beyblade with random poisons buffs and shit.
Kokoloko85
Member
I dont really count talking as gameplay tbh
This. It holds it back a pretty significant amount and made me sad
Bojji
Member
You can say that it was talking/watching cutscenes. Half of persona games is talking so it's part of the gameplay, you can skip it obviously in this game but story is integral part of the game so if you don't care about - this title is not for you.
CashPrizes
Member
Definitely Witcher 3 when modded with expansions.
Out of the box on release day head to head, I might give it to BG3. I really did not experience any major bugs in my first playthrough.
Too bad BG3 won't be getting any expansions. Once Mod tools are released, it may rise up and overcome.
I still think the writing on some of the sidequests in Witcher 3 is some of the best ever on the medium. Also I would give Witcher 3 the win on music and art design which are pretty big deals.
Out of the box on release day head to head, I might give it to BG3. I really did not experience any major bugs in my first playthrough.
Too bad BG3 won't be getting any expansions. Once Mod tools are released, it may rise up and overcome.
I still think the writing on some of the sidequests in Witcher 3 is some of the best ever on the medium. Also I would give Witcher 3 the win on music and art design which are pretty big deals.
GigaBowser
The bear of bad news
TheStam
Member
I really agree with the point made earlier in the thread that BF3 lacks a bit of heart in comparison, I believe it mostly comes down to the quality of writing for me as a story nerd. BG3 is undoubtedly a great game and accomplishment, but it doesn't have the same personality. Even if Larian is a great dev studio who seem like good people, they have this whimsical corny approach to writing which even if it's toned down in BG3 it is still very noticeable. Not to mention the relationship parts which I found awful. I don't want a fucking bearman trying to fuck my male character after just meeting him, but fair enough I guess sex-memes sells.
Although I don't miss the million pre-buffs ritual before each fight in BG2, I do miss RTWP. The best way to do it is like Pathfinder Wrath of the Righteous where you could toggle it on/off to quickly get through trashmobs. Although to be fair there weren't all that many in BG3. Still though the gameplay is great, no complaints there and replaying it it's quite amazing how far they went with multiple endings to quests. Still I don't really know if I could say that it actually surpassed BG2 as a game, but there's no shame in that. BG3 was the best new game I played that released last year for sure.
The Witcher 3 has it's faults, it's like the king of eurojank. Movement is cumbersome, not least Roach is incredibly frustrating. Combat is fine enough for me, but nothing great and I always end up playing more or less the same light attack build with some Quen + Igni or Aard, spinning around like a ballerina.
But the world, music, characters, side quests and quality of writing makes it greater than the sum of it's parts and all in all it's a masterpiece. They really nail the sense of travelling through a war-torn and mostly hopeless land without many happy endings. You feel like a bit part player in this dark world (albeit with superpowers). People always talk about the Bloody Baron quest which is obviously great, but there are countless quests of similar or near similar quality: Ladies of the Woods, Carnal Sins, A Towerful of Mice, Scenes from a Marriage (Hearts of Stone), La Cage a Fou (Blood & Wine), The Warble of a Smitten Knight (Blood & Wine) just to name a few memorable ones. The MVP of the whole game is the Hearts of Stone expansion in my opinion, it's just such a masterfully done expansion that I feel is peak RPG writing. BG3 did well to not do quest padding, but the overall quality is not that close in my opinion. Of course CDPR had great source material, but that shouldn't matter in the comparison as it is what it is.
Larian are great at what they do, but for me CDPR are a step above for what I like most about games (story and imursssshun) and now with 2.0 and the expansion I would also rank Cyberpunk above BG3.
I guess it comes down to what you enjoy most though. Do you prefer story bits or tactical RPG mechanics. I like both, but enjoy story the most when it's this well done. Trouble is it basically never is and that's why I've played it 4 times and I almost never replay games otherwise. Either way these two are definitely among the best RPGs ever made.
Although I don't miss the million pre-buffs ritual before each fight in BG2, I do miss RTWP. The best way to do it is like Pathfinder Wrath of the Righteous where you could toggle it on/off to quickly get through trashmobs. Although to be fair there weren't all that many in BG3. Still though the gameplay is great, no complaints there and replaying it it's quite amazing how far they went with multiple endings to quests. Still I don't really know if I could say that it actually surpassed BG2 as a game, but there's no shame in that. BG3 was the best new game I played that released last year for sure.
The Witcher 3 has it's faults, it's like the king of eurojank. Movement is cumbersome, not least Roach is incredibly frustrating. Combat is fine enough for me, but nothing great and I always end up playing more or less the same light attack build with some Quen + Igni or Aard, spinning around like a ballerina.
But the world, music, characters, side quests and quality of writing makes it greater than the sum of it's parts and all in all it's a masterpiece. They really nail the sense of travelling through a war-torn and mostly hopeless land without many happy endings. You feel like a bit part player in this dark world (albeit with superpowers). People always talk about the Bloody Baron quest which is obviously great, but there are countless quests of similar or near similar quality: Ladies of the Woods, Carnal Sins, A Towerful of Mice, Scenes from a Marriage (Hearts of Stone), La Cage a Fou (Blood & Wine), The Warble of a Smitten Knight (Blood & Wine) just to name a few memorable ones. The MVP of the whole game is the Hearts of Stone expansion in my opinion, it's just such a masterfully done expansion that I feel is peak RPG writing. BG3 did well to not do quest padding, but the overall quality is not that close in my opinion. Of course CDPR had great source material, but that shouldn't matter in the comparison as it is what it is.
Larian are great at what they do, but for me CDPR are a step above for what I like most about games (story and imursssshun) and now with 2.0 and the expansion I would also rank Cyberpunk above BG3.
I guess it comes down to what you enjoy most though. Do you prefer story bits or tactical RPG mechanics. I like both, but enjoy story the most when it's this well done. Trouble is it basically never is and that's why I've played it 4 times and I almost never replay games otherwise. Either way these two are definitely among the best RPGs ever made.
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captainnapalm
Member
There are no real stakes and nothing and no one to care about in BG3. It's like the anti-Witcher 3 in that regard. The game has no real moral core. Your band of adventurers comes across more like a zoo than a party of people uniting to embark on an adventure.
