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[scitek]

For years, I tried to break into the marketing side of gaming, specifically video (trailers, Dev diaries, etc). Unfortunately, I lacked professional experience, so I found work in TV instead (local news). I spent the past few years making ads for everything from investigations to contests in a couple of big American markets, but it's starting to take a toll on my health. The subject matter is so negative, if you don't have that journalistic drive, it becomes a real burden after a while.

Due to this, I now find myself again wanting to work in gaming, and over the past year, I've tried to make the transition. I've had a couple of close calls with huge companies -- one series of interviews spanned a month and cost me 6 hours of time for a rejection -- but whereas before the knock against me was a general lack of experience, the main knock against me now is a lack of "industry experience."

I'm frustrated because it's a chicken and the egg thing...how does one gain industry experience without working in the industry? I spent years volunteering for sites and making gaming content for free. I've covered E3 twice, both times on my own dime. And I'm as passionate as anyone about the hobby. Still, anytime I get a company's attention, the general takeaway is "you might know how to market news, but that doesn't mean you know how to market games."

Spoiler

I can make city council meetings seem interesting. Trust me, I can do it with games.

On the flip side, I wouldn't mind working as a video producer or something for a gaming news outlet, but they, too, can be just as stubborn.

Overall, I assume this is a pretty common problem, but have you wanted to work in the industry and hit a wall at every turn? Maybe you got around it and have tips to share. Or maybe you're a hiring manager and can shed some light on what makes a candidate stand out to you. Either way, maybe this thread can be of some use. Thanks for letting me vent.

 

[GregLombardi]

Yeah I tried to get in via Finance for like 10 years as well. Honestly I just wanted to hopefully create creative value and pair that with what I knew could be significant financial value. I didn't think those things were opposed to each other, but what I've learned about the industry is that 1. It's a club and many times you have to demonstrate somehow that you are willing to sacrifice everything for it; 2. Many of the companies are outright owned by / forced to deal with such vicious financial constraints and manipulations that they aren't worth working for in the first place.

It makes me sad.

 

[Broritos]

You don't break into the game industry. The game industry breaks into you.

 

[scitek]

You don't break into the game industry. The game industry breaks into you.

This is actually a pretty accurate summary, from what I can tell.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

. Still, anytime I get a company's attention, the general takeaway is "you might know how to market news, but that doesn't mean you know how to market games." I can make city council meetings seem interesting. Trust me, I can do it with games.

I'm assuming they've seen the work you've done covering E3 and the like. Were they not fans?

 

[darth_infamous]

Trust me, I can do it with games.

I don't trust you, and neither should a company. Make a portfolio, show them you can do it with games. Take that drive and passion you say you have and put it into your work.

 

[Razlo]

You don't break into the game industry. The game industry breaks into you.

Ha, this is so true. Maybe a handful of the hundreds of people I've worked with are still in the industry.

 

[ToysAndMoreClub]

The problem with the game industry is that, to some extent, it is becoming saturated. You have the big players which have been around for years/decades. Then you have smaller developers which get shutdown every day, and that same people go on to create/work for new developers. It's a cycle that never ends and it is how most of the same people are the ones getting hired. It's hard to break into the industry unless you yourself create your own game (going the Indie route) or work on your own publication.


I am trying to work on writing and I'm part of the www.shigerunews.com website but my time is also limited because I have a full-time job and when it seems like I am about to get free time, I either get sent out on business trips or need to take care of my family. At this point I think of it as a hobby and if anything happens, great.

I should add, I am not familiar with your work OP, where would I be able to see it?

 

[Shifty]

Honestly OP, I'd find a marketing field that you can tolerate that isn't games and try to break into that.

I spent just under a year in the game industry as a programmer and ended up moving into the somewhat adjacent field of "interactive not-game stuff". Safe to say, I wouldn't go back unless I decided to go full indie.

 

[CalamityPixel]

You don't break into the game industry. The game industry breaks into you.

Christ. This needs to be written on me.

Yeah breaking in is hard and compares differently depending on what sector you are in. I can vouch only for animation and in the end it all comes down to your showreel. What it shows and how long it is. If any budding animators are reading this, PUT your best work first. ALWAYS. Some people are too lazy to sit through more than 30 seconds.

 

[John Harker]

Who have you been talking to and what angle are you taking? Are you trying to get hired in house at a creative service team, or are you trying to pitch companies for new business?

It's not that hard for video if you don't mind contracting, you just have to know the right people.

If you're looking to make trailers or docs, testimonials, editorial stuff, etc, you should instead apply to agencies- most publishers don't keep that staff in house, unless you're talking like, the playstation blog editorial team and those guys are small and tight

 

[Sho Nuff]

Make a portfolio

 

[rekkair]

Tbh, if you're not a fresh grad/intern, where you're expected to learn on the job, or you don't know someone in the industry that can vouch for you, its really damn hard. I know very few that didn't come in either of those 2 ways.

That said, I've also seen some people move up from QA. But usually, its only into production roles, and not much else.

 

[Dark_3nergy]

It's not about experience, per se...

A massive part about getting into this industry it is mainly who you know. And having all the right cards fall into place.

Make a portfolio

Yes, if it's art related, this is pretty much required.

 

[HandsomeCharles]

Honestly OP, I'd find a marketing field that you can tolerate that isn't the games and try to break into that.

I spent just under a year in the game industry as a programmer and ended up moving into the somewhat adjacent field of "interactive not-game stuff". Safe to say, I wouldn't go back unless I decided to go full indie.

A year? They broke you quick! Where abouts were you working?

 

[SOLDIER]

I just wish I had a group of friends to stream games with every week like the Super Best Friends or the Game Grumps.

Seems far less grueling and infinitely more rewarding (financially).

 

[ToysAndMoreClub]

Christ. This needs to be written on me.

Yeah breaking in is hard and compares differently depending on what sector you are in. I can vouch only for animation and in the end it all comes down to your showreel. What it shows and how long it is. If any budding animators are reading this, PUT your best work first. ALWAYS. Some people are too lazy to sit through more than 30 seconds.

Can't be said enough. And that goes with everything, from writing, to art, to animation, etc. etc. etc.

 

[Raging Spaniard]

Lol yep

As a marketing guy be on the lookout for indies, get in touch and discuss how you think you could help. There are TONS of small developers that would love help in that area and then you get to fill that resume a little bit

 

[Dark_3nergy]

That said, I've also seen some people move up from QA. But usually, its only into production roles, and not much else.

From my end of the spectrum, QA has moved into various different roles. Not just production.

 

[AZ Greg]

Show us some of your work

 

[Lunar15]

Same situation OP, but I actually work in a marketing role that's connected to gaming. But I'm in Florida, so I don't get the time of day from actual game companies. I completely get why, but yeah, it's frustrating.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

From what I understand, getting into the game industry is similar to TV and film.

Having experience is nice, but the main way to land a job is building connections and networking with lots of people.

 

[KageMaru]

This may not be a realistic idea but have you considered reaching out to some indie studios to do some cheap or maybe even free work to build a portfolio more in line with the industry?

 

[Qwark]

I have the same desire to break into the gaming industry, but I'm conflicted because I don't want it to ruin my favorite thing.

For now, I'm just making Indie games after my regular job. If something takes off, great, if not, it's still fun.

 

[DoctorDake]

Due to this, I now find myself again wanting to work in gaming, and over the past year, I've tried to make the transition. I've had a couple of close calls with huge companies -- one series of interviews spanned a month and cost me 6 hours of time for a rejection -- but whereas before the knock against me was a general lack of experience, the main knock against me now is a lack of "industry experience."

I've been there, and I definitely understand that mindset that brings you down. That said, I then ended up working in the industry for 8 years, so hopefully I can offer some simple advice:

1) Try not to approach rejections as "a waste of your time". I know it's hard because of the emotional attachment, but you really should try your best to think of them as learning opportunities. If a company specifically says your lack of experience is the issue, that's fine, but push them to give some more constructive feedback. Almost anyone I've ever interviewed with has been able to give me one or two pieces of advice for how to improve for next time, and that really helps turn rejections from "well there goes weeks of my life" into "okay, cool, now I've got some notes and things to work on."

2) If you're solely getting the feedback that you need more experience, then it's possible you're not applying for the right jobs (or are applying to too many different ones across the board). I know a ton of people who've tried to break in by throwing their resume at every position they find, and while that may work eventually, you're gonna have to deal with a LOT of rejection in the meantime.

3) Keep making stuff. Especially because you're a creative-type, this should come easier to you than others. Cut a 'trailer' for Destiny. Make some silly ads for a game you like. Not for publicity, but just to be able to show the things you are able to do within a gaming context. It's tough for me to look at news footage and figure out how to make the leap from that to 'would this person be able to make good trailers'. Having a reel, even when it's personal stuff you made rather than professional, is always going to help you out.

Hope that helps! Keep your head up; it's definitely really hard to break into such an insular industry, but if you keep working on it and improving it's gonna pay off someday.

 

[ToysAndMoreClub]

I have the same desire to break into the gaming industry, but I'm conflicted because I don't want it to ruin my favorite thing.

For now, I'm just making Indie games after my regular job. If something takes off, great, if not, it's still fun.

It's the same thing as being a screenwriter. It somewhat kills the enjoyment of films because you are then breaking it down at the cellular level instead of just enjoying it. But when there are movies that not even your critical mind can break and instead they break yours, that is an amazing feeling to experience.

 

[jaxpunk]

For years, I tried to break into the marketing side of gaming,

I've had a couple of close calls with huge companies -- one series of interviews spanned a month and cost me 6 hours of time for a rejection --

I spent years volunteering for sites and making gaming content for free. I've covered E3 twice, both times on my own dime. And I'm as passionate as anyone about the hobby. Trust me, I can do it with games

Overall, I assume this is a pretty common problem,

So here's what stood out to me in your venting. For years, but you've counted up the amount of time I'm guessing you wasted. Seems pretty insignificant, what did you learn from the experience?

You spent years with sites and making content, also covering E3 on your own dime. But it sounds like you aren't doing that anymore. Probably should be.

I'm going to assume the problem is while you're passionate about games, you are not passionate about doing whatever it takes to get into games.

My first IT job, I spent countless hours trying to get my foot in the door. The company I wanted I told them I'd work for minimum wage to prove myself. I just needed the in, I had the drive and knowledge.

Reviewing people to hire now, no one does that. They come in and expect me to open the money drawer for them because they deserve it. Almost no one is hungry, the few that are, I hire on the spot and are almost 100% of the time the best hires I've made.

 

[BurritoBushido]

Where do you live, OP?

 

[esmith08734]

I've always wanted to work in something with gaming. I am a developer but not capable of making my own games because that's way over my head. I would love to build websites based on an outlet and be apart of a team. I literally ask people to work for free and get nothing.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

OP, do you have a youtube/vimeo channel? I feel like that would be the equivalent of a portfolio for artists or a github repo for programmers and a good way to show off your work.

 

[element]

specifically video (trailers, Dev diaries, etc).

I've met tons of people who work on these that had no prior game experience, but hustle to get doors open.

Build spec trailers and use them in a portfolio.
Look for business EVERYWHERE! You can't expect to land Destiny 2, but between mobile, indies and other entertainment properties, you can find work.
Network. You might have to take a job or two that doesn't pay well, but it can help with your portfolio. There are tons of studios out there looking for content that don't do content because they don't think they can afford it.
Go to events like PAX and GDC and talk to people about what you can offer them.
Cold email people. Find 10 indie developers that you find interesting and email them.
Promote your portfolio on every job board/marketplace around! videopixie, veed.me, Dribbble, Fiverr, Easle, Cloudpeeps, People Per Hour and on.

For something like trailers and dev diaries, a company is looking for three qualities.
1. Does this person have the skills to be able to produce this content? Are they going to show up for filming with an iPhone?
2. Does this person have the follow through to be able to deliver this content on time? Are they organized enough that requests are taken into consideration on principal shoot or capture?
3. Can this person provide a vision OR take direction? Can you take an idea and make it real OR can you take someone else's idea and make it real?

As someone who has worked in games for 20 years, the "wasted 6 hours" is laughable. I flew to Germany twice for two interviews for a company and I didn't get it. All in I had to take 4 days off from the job I did have, not to mention other cost (dog care and stuff). So 'wasted 6 hours' is nothing.

The subject matter is so negative if you don't have that journalistic drive, it becomes a real burden after a while.

You are going to find this in any industry. I left the game industry for two years because it was taking a serious toll on me. When your 'hobby' becomes your job, your world really flips. Your previous outlets are no longer a method to relax or relieve stress. Walking away actually made games fun again, which is something I haven't been able to say for 10 years because my 'work' brain was always on when playing.

 

[entremet]

Gaming is such a fan driven industry that companies have a pick of the litter with labor supply.

 

[Yohane]

But is the marketing side of gaming just regular marketing? Doesn't gaming company outsource marketing to external companies?

Maybe you should try to collab with some Indie Devs

 

[ToysAndMoreClub]

I've been there, and I definitely understand that mindset that brings you down. That said, I then ended up working in the industry for 8 years, so hopefully I can offer some simple advice:

1) Try not to approach rejections as "a waste of your time". I know it's hard because of the emotional attachment, but you really should try your best to think of them as learning opportunities. If a company specifically says your lack of experience is the issue, that's fine, but push them to give some more constructive feedback. Almost anyone I've ever interviewed with has been able to give me one or two pieces of advice for how to improve for next time, and that really helps turn rejections from "well there goes weeks of my life" into "okay, cool, now I've got some notes and things to work on."

2) If you're solely getting the feedback that you need more experience, then it's possible you're not applying for the right jobs (or are applying to too many different ones across the board). I know a ton of people who've tried to break in by throwing their resume at every position they find, and while that may work eventually, you're gonna have to deal with a LOT of rejection in the meantime.

3) Keep making stuff. Especially because you're a creative-type, this should come easier to you than others. Cut a 'trailer' for Destiny. Make some silly ads for a game you like. Not for publicity, but just to be able to show the things you are able to do within a gaming context. It's tough for me to look at news footage and figure out how to make the leap from that to 'would this person be able to make good trailers'. Having a reel, even when it's personal stuff you made rather than professional, is always going to help you out.

Hope that helps! Keep your head up; it's definitely really hard to break into such an insular industry, but if you keep working on it and improving it's gonna pay off someday.

1. This is very important, make sure you can withstand rejection. My favorite comic book artist of all-time (Todd McFarlane) said he got rejected over 750 times before he was finally accepted. If that's truly what you want to do, when you fall down, make sure you dust yourself and stand back up again, and again...

2. Sometimes we are stubborn and want to do something specific, when in reality we are more prepared to do other things. If breaking into the industry is hard, then you might have to consider finding where to break in, and once inside, make your move to where you want to be.

3. There's a lot of content out there and games that millions of people constantly follow, talk about, and share. YouTube is your absolute best resource, as well as Twitter, Facebook, etc. Be smart on where you post your work (and like a previous poster stated, make sure it is your absolute best work!) and go from there. Justin Bieber was discovered in YouTube, the (new) lead singer of Journey was discovered in YouTube. Ken Jeong was discovered in YouTube...you get my point.

Wanted to expand on this but the initial points are some excellent advise.

 

[MXAGhost]

Yeah as someone who is trying to do the exact same thing, it's hard. So many are willing to do these jobs for nothing.

I can give you some tips and what I seen.
Tips:
1) Know what is your talent - Whatever you do best, that is what you need to apply for every job in this industry.

2) Networking is king, your skill is a close second - If you ever heard of the saying, "It's who you know, not what you know." Head to events and start making connections. Follow up and handout resumes.

3) Don't be a jerk - It might be strange advice but since this is a tight industry, people talk. If you are a jerk, it gets around.

4) Be open - Always be on the lookout for advice, answers, and jobs. When you see it, jump like a mad dog.

Since you are already in the working world, you probably know this. Like my second tip states, you have to network. The gaming industry is a small community, where everyone knows everyone else. I'm sure you make some contacts at E3, use them. The more people know your name the better chance they will use you.
I hope this helps and if you have anymore questions you can DM me here or on Twitter: @mxaghost
I'll leave you with a video: [Boss Key job tips] https://youtu.be/V2M0BhL4HvA

 

[Frozone]

For years, I tried to break into the marketing side of gaming, specifically video (trailers, Dev diaries, etc). Unfortunately, I lacked professional experience, so I found work in TV instead (local news). I spent the past few years making ads for everything from investigations to contests in a couple of big American markets, but it's starting to take a toll on my health. The subject matter is so negative, if you don't have that journalistic drive, it becomes a real burden after a while.

Due to this, I now find myself again wanting to work in gaming, and over the past year, I've tried to make the transition. I've had a couple of close calls with huge companies -- one series of interviews spanned a month and cost me 6 hours of time for a rejection -- but whereas before the knock against me was a general lack of experience, the main knock against me now is a lack of "industry experience."

I'm frustrated because it's a chicken and the egg thing...how does one gain industry experience without working in the industry? I spent years volunteering for sites and making gaming content for free. I've covered E3 twice, both times on my own dime. And I'm as passionate as anyone about the hobby. Still, anytime I get a company's attention, the general takeaway is "you might know how to market news, but that doesn't mean you know how to market games."

Spoiler

I can make city council meetings seem interesting. Trust me, I can do it with games.

On the flip side, I wouldn't mind working as a video producer or something for a gaming news outlet, but they, too, can be just as stubborn.

Overall, I assume this is a pretty common problem, but have you wanted to work in the industry and hit a wall at every turn? Maybe you got around it and have tips to share. Or maybe you're a hiring manager and can shed some light on what makes a candidate stand out to you. Either way, maybe this thread can be of some use. Thanks for letting me vent.

OP,

I have had the same experience with the gaming industry. I'm not sure why it's so closed to outsiders but it is. I've always been able to get interviews, but the process is a big burden that I've just lost patience with. If it's not taking a test, it's getting up on a whiteboard and taking more tests. Not everyone that works in that industry are geniuses or rocket scientists and yet, that's how they behave to get in.

I'd give it a few years and see if the industry changes to a more realistic job process. It's really the only thing you can do.

 

[eso76]

Have you tried doing it on YouTube in hopes someone would notice ?

 

[The Goat]

Try to find some small start ups or smaller devs in need of an AP. You can try the QA route as well, but that's no guarantee, but it can get your foot in the door.

Competition is really high, but keep pushing, you'll make it.

 

[shnurgleton]

I've toyed with the idea from the development side, but working in healthcare IT has its perks, ie. work-life balance and pay.

 

[rudger]

Try a crowbar

 

[Setaimx]

I'm finding today that many companies and game media outlets are putting less and less stock in traditional job experience and more in what the person's skills are and what they can do for them (should mention that this is not the case for jobs on the game development side; those usually do require a certain amount of experience, in which case you'd need to start making games yourself, take college courses in game design, and/or work for smaller devs and work your way up over time).

In most cases, if you can show the interviewer why you're the person for the job and that you have the skills and achievements to do what it takes (regardless of req. experience), that speaks volumes more than having worked X amount of years in a certain position. For example, speak about how you helped increase customer acquisition, or boosted productivity, or something that shows you have tangible proof of your skills at work. It also helps to have a decent portfolio of achievements on hand.

In the end, it's all about selling yourself as someone who can be invaluable to the company rather than someone who can just do the job.

 

[element]

You can try the QA route as well, but that's no guarantee, but it can get your foot in the door.

Don't do this. Once you have the QA stink on you, it is hard to get it off.

If you have a skill or a desire of a position, do everything you can to get that position. Study, work, build a portfolio. The days of 'getting in the door' are like they used to be. That also largely dismisses the job of QA as just being a stepping stone. If anything we need more quality people to WANT to be in QA and stay in QA and see it as a career.

 

[scitek]

Lol yep

As a marketing guy be on the lookout for indies, get in touch and discuss how you think you could help. There are TONS of small developers that would love help in that area and then you get to fill that resume a little bit

I've thought about doing this. It could be a good way to get some experience while also helping out smaller devs.

To anyone asking, yes, I have a reel and I've also done sample projects that have been complimented by the companies in question.

 

[Frozone]

From what I understand, getting into the game industry is similar to TV and film.

Having experience is nice, but the main way to land a job is building connections and networking with lots of people.

Not even close. TV and film is much much easier to get into. I've worked in it for over 16yrs and have never been able to land a gaming industry job - despite having worked on billion dollar movies.

 

[thomasmahler]

You're only as good as your current demo reel. And most companies can cherry pick - you have to show them that they need you. Nobody will hire you cause you're a nice guy.

 

[ToysAndMoreClub]

I've thought about doing this. It could be a good way to get some experience while also helping out smaller devs.

To anyone asking, yes, I have a reel and I've also done sample projects that have been complimented by the companies in question.

Is it something that we can see? If you can, post your website or link. Looking forward to seeing your talent.

 

[Natural]

Have you thought about working in game stores at marketing level? Some of the guys I work with have experience working in stores like GAME at trade marketing / licensing level roles, then it's easier to transition into actual game companies.

 

[Dremorak]

While knowing nothing about the video/marketing side of things, the way I got into animation in games and the way a lot of people I know got into it is by just doing it. My brothers and I started an indie company and made 2 (not so great ) games, and I worked on stuff for my reel too. I was able to apply for a really large mobile games company and they were more than willing to hire someone with no real experience but who could obviously DO the job. Then cut to 6 years later and I'm very happy working for a small indie studio. The best thing I can suggest in your case is probably to just email every single indie games studio within a 1000 Mile radius and sell yourself to them. Chances are they were thinking about it, or you might even start them thinking about needing a video guy. BAM! You've got industry experience. Even if it starts as part time stuff, its still something in the actual industry you want to work in.

 

[pulsemyne]

Don't do this. Once you have the QA stink on you, it is hard to get it off.

If you have a skill or a desire of a position, do everything you can to get that position. Study, work, build a portfolio. The days of 'getting in the door' are like they used to be. That also largely dismisses the job of QA as just being a stepping stone. If anything we need more quality people to WANT to be in QA and stay in QA and see it as a career.

Mate of mine started as a QA in sony Liverpool. Fast forward 15 years and he's one of the lead designers in the Far cry games.
Still that was the old days. Not sure what it is like now.

 

[Estellex]

Breaking into the Game industry is harder than breaking into something like Accounting.

That should tell you something.