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Dark Souls III [unmarked Spoilers Thread]

B

B-Genius

Unconfirmed Member
Azzanadra said:
That's strange, the first trailer very much made him out to be a DS2 giant, I feel like it was a change during development.
Click to expand...

How did it "make him out" to be anything other than a big dude? Just because you couldn't see his face in the cinematic?

Giants were a pretty big theme in Dark 2, and Yhorm's backstory certainly hints at some mistrust towards giants (as a universal race), so maybe you could say Yhorm represents them (being pretty much the only "giant" in the game).

But come now, why would there be a change during development? I resent the idea that every time someone makes an assumption, there has to be a crazy web of conspiracy hidden beneath that proves they were right to begin with.
 
A

Azzanadra

Member
B-Genius said:
How did it "make him out" to be anything other than a big dude? Just because you couldn't see his face in the cinematic?

Giants were a pretty big theme in Dark 2, and Yhorm's backstory certainly hints at some mistrust towards giants (as a universal race), so maybe you could say Yhorm represents them (being pretty much the only "giant" in the game).

But come now, why would there be a change during development? I resent the idea that every time someone makes an assumption, there has to be a crazy web of conspiracy hidden beneath that proves they were right to begin with.
Click to expand...

Wow, relax there. That was just an innocent comment, not like I incited some blasphemy lol.

Dark-Souls-3.jpg


But this image REALLY looks like a DS2 giant, and a lot of people through so too. I mean he's explicitly called a giant... and they went through the trouble of hisidng his face... the pieces fit to make that assumption.

Honestly I think Miyazaki just decided to purge as much DS2 references as he good, like with this guy. I acknowledge that there are some DS2 references in the game, but DS3 is very much a sequel to Dark Souls as opposed to dark Souls II. Not saying DS2 isn't canon before anyone accuses me of being a hater, juts saying that is its very obvious that DS3 adheres more towards DS than DS2, don't even think that's debatable.
 
K

krakov

Member
ZeroTheShadow said:
Bosses I killed on my first attempt in DS3:

Gundyr 2
Dragon Slayer
The Young Prince
Abyss Walkers
Demon King
Defiled King
Big Tree
Decans
Dancer
Crystal Sage

Bosses I beat on my second attempt

Aldrich
Gundyr 1
Dragon
Skelaton King

That's off the top of my head. Game is easiest souls by far. You just have too many advantages.
Click to expand...

I don't think this is how most people will experience the game. Maybe you are just too gud?
 
A

Azzanadra

Member
krakov said:
I don't think this is how most people will experience the game. Maybe you are just too gud?
Click to expand...

I expect this game to be easier for many for the simple fact that this will be many peoples fifth souls game. The easy factors even crept in with Bloodborne to be honest, the transitional skills despite the differences between games make them easier then if you experienced them for the first time.
 
P

pa22word

Member
Hypron said:
No bloody way.

I can't fathom someone seriously arguing that unless you really misremember the old ones.

Enemies and bosses are faster, more complex mechanically, track in a similar fashion to DaS2 (except with good animations this time) and tend to deal more damage.

It's straight up more challenging.

It might not feel that way if you just play each game once, because by now you would have gotten a lot better at those sorts of game so you know what to expect and shit.

But when replaying the games after that, it should be obvious that you first impression is quite different from how the games actually stack up once you have experienced all of them.

I believe this is one of the reasons some people somehow say DeS is the most challenging when in fact it's by far the easiest.
Click to expand...

The problem with the bosses aren't their patterns or the mechanics, it's that all of them are glass cannons.

I mean sure, pontif sullyvahn might be more "complex" than ornstein and smough, but when you can kill him in 3-5 mins you reduce the fight to tanking through his complexities by chugging estus
 
K

krakov

Member
Azzanadra said:
I expect this game to be easier for many for the simple fact that this will be many peoples fifth souls game. The easy factors even crept in with Bloodborne to be honest, the transitional skills despite the differences between games make them easier then if you experienced them for the first time.
Click to expand...

True, though the difficulty in previous games probably had more to do with inexperience rather than them being hard if one were to compare. It's not like O&S or Fume Knight would stand out as exceptonally hard bosses if they were in the game.

I think both this and Bloodborne posed a decent challenge and I would consider myself a very experienced player. Never go out my way to make myself powerful for PvE though.
 
C

convo

Member
pa22word said:
The problem with the bosses aren't their patterns or the mechanics, it's that all of them are glass cannons.

I mean sure, pontif sullyvahn might be more "complex" than ornstein and smough, but when you can kill him in 3-5 mins you reduce the fight to tanking through his complexities by chugging estus
Click to expand...

Some people won't have the same damage output when they get to those bosses. Not everyone will stomp on bosses using buffed greataxes and trying to stagger them using other heavy weapons although that is the way to make things easy for you. But making things uninteresting for yourself can be done with the other games using magic and other tactics that maximizes your damage. But not everyone is a genius like that.
Are you arguing people will ONLY play your way? We've reached a point in the franchise where people can chose how to play the game and give themselves self-imposed restrictions like no-shields and other stuff.
 
P

pa22word

Member
convo said:
Some people won't have the same damage output when they get to those bosses. Not everyone will stomp on bosses using buffed greataxes and trying to stagger them using other heavy weapons although that is the way to make things easy for you. But making things uninteresting for yourself can be done with the other games using magic and other tactics that maximizes your damage. But not everyone is a genius like that.
Are you arguing people will ONLY play your way? We've reached a point in the franchise where people can chose how to play the game and give themselves self-imposed restrictions like no-shields and other stuff.
Click to expand...

I did a dex build and used primarily the rapier, carthus shotel, and ricard's. With Leo's ring and pontiff left eye ring I was murdering most bosses by simply rolling and counter striking out of a roll.

Arguing that the bosses aren't made out of glass because "you can always do lvl 1 deprived run mr badass of badasses" is a pathetically weak and honestly, a rather stupidly vapid argument off a complaint that most anyone can have off of basically any melee build in the game.
 
H

Hypron

Member
pa22word said:
The problem with the bosses aren't their patterns or the mechanics, it's that all of them are glass cannons.

I mean sure, pontif sullyvahn might be more "complex" than ornstein and smough, but when you can kill him in 3-5 mins you reduce the fight to tanking through his complexities by chugging estus
Click to expand...

Bosses in DaS3 don't have a huge amount of health (a lot less than BB's for example), but let's not act like there's a huge difference between DaS1 and DaS3 on that aspect. The vast majority of DaS bosses don't have much health either and can be killed quickly (and easily) with an average build. That, or they are stupidly simple like the Gaping Dragon.

Some armoured bosses (Ornstein, Artorias) have higher resistance, which disproportionately penalises fast weapons with low damage output per hit, but weapons with a high damage output per hit (like the claymore and anything bigger, or buffed weapons) still go through those bosses like a hot knife through butter.

Yeah there's no Manus (which is just one boss) in this game in terms of HP, but from FROM's history with the past three games, you can bet your ass that the DLC will be a significant step up in terms of boss HP and difficulty.

So yeah. For me there doesn't seem to be a significant difference in HP for the vast majority of bosses while everything else is more complex, therefore making DaS3 the more challenging game.
 
B

B-Genius

Unconfirmed Member
Azzanadra said:
Wow, relax there. That was just an innocent comment, not like I incited some blasphemy lol.

Dark-Souls-3.jpg


But this image REALLY looks like a DS2 giant, and a lot of people through so too. I mean he's explicitly called a giant... and they went through the trouble of hisidng his face... the pieces fit to make that assumption.

Honestly I think Miyazaki just decided to purge as much DS2 references as he good, like with this guy. I acknowledge that there are some DS2 references in the game, but DS3 is very much a sequel to Dark Souls as opposed to dark Souls II. Not saying DS2 isn't canon before anyone accuses me of being a hater, juts saying that is its very obvious that DS3 adheres more towards DS than DS2, don't even think that's debatable.
Click to expand...

Didn't mean to make it seem like I flew off the handle...
But it just gets my goat when people make it all personal like this.

Obviously I can't go into too much detail, but for the sake of argument:
Miyazaki never "purged" anything just because it was related to a previous game.
There was never any direction (2D concept or CG-wise) indicating this was a "DS2 giant".
(There wasn't even anything saying it should reference a giant from any other game.)

I wish you folks could see the evolution of Yhorm's design, let alone other characters and settings.
Maybe some day From will be more open with this kind of stuff. In the meantime, people are free to believe what they want, but I don't think this whole "they blates chucked DS2 lol" schtick is healthy.
 
P

pa22word

Member
Hypron said:
Bosses in DaS3 don't have a huge amount of health (a lot less than BB's for example), but let's not act like there's a huge difference between DaS1 and DaS3 on that aspect. The vast majority of DaS bosses don't have much health either and can be killed quickly (and easily) with an average build. That, or they are stupidly simple like the Gaping Dragon.

Some armoured bosses (Ornstein, Artorias) have higher resistance, which disproportionately penalises fast weapons with low damage output per hit, but weapons with a high damage output per hit (like the claymore and anything bigger, or buffed weapons) still go through those bosses like a hot knife through butter.

Yeah there's no Manus (which is just one boss) in this game in terms of HP, but from FROM's history with the past three games, you can bet your ass that the DLC will be a significant step up in terms of boss HP and difficulty.

So yeah. For me there doesn't seem to be a significant difference in HP for the vast majority of bosses while everything else is more complex, therefore making DaS3 the more challenging game.
Click to expand...



The biggest difference between the two is that DS3 is a much faster game, and with the increased pace health bars should have been raised to compensate. The increased lethality of combat From employed to up the game's pace was an ehh idea with I think mixed results in a lot of places, bosses being the biggest example of where it doesn't really work out because without the added mechanics Bloodborne implemented to counter increased lethality it forces a much more of a strategic emphasis on battles vs a tactical one. Some might like that, but as someone who's never really enjoyed a strategic focus in his action games it's a minus for me personally.

Honestly I think most of the bosses would have been better in the game if they took damage output down a peg and raised lifebars by double for most bosses, forcing players to learn the boss more than boiling basically all non-gimmick fights down to rushdowns. It's a shame too, because most of the bosses in the game have very interesting movesets that never get a chance to shine because they all die so fast.
 
G

george_us

Member
ZeroTheShadow said:
DS3 is the easiest Souls game for sure.
Click to expand...
Definitely not. Only reason it would be easy to anyone is if they're either A) naturally good at games or B) very experienced with the Souls game. A newcomer to the series is going to get smoked worse than any of the previous Souls games except maybe Bloodborne.
 
Q

Quesa

Member
So what determines stagger? Is it like a stun meter in fighting games where if you manage to hit them enoguh in a short amount of time they stagger?
 
T

tesqui

Member
I'm kind of disappointed I didn't get to hear much of the boss music in this game. I guess I'll go look them up on Youtube. I can only remember like 2 or 3 that actually stood out. Bloodborne is still king in the OST department I think.
 
C

convo

Member
tesqui said:
I'm kind of disappointed I didn't get to hear much of the boss music in this game. I guess I'll go look them up on Youtube. I can only remember like 2 or 3 that actually stood out. Bloodborne is still king in the OST department I think.
Click to expand...

Maybe when you include Ludwig in there and i'd have two themes including Gehrman's that were memorable.Maybe Maria too but i don't remember what it sounded like. Someone could give me a refresher on good themes.
 
U

Uncle Sensei

Banned
tesqui said:
I'm kind of disappointed I didn't get to hear much of the boss music in this game. I guess I'll go look them up on Youtube. I can only remember like 2 or 3 that actually stood out. Bloodborne is still king in the OST department I think.
Click to expand...

Abyss Watchers new GOAT
 
N

Noray

Unconfirmed Member
Pyro build finally complete, good weapon doesn't come until late late late game

Ce_WnzGXIAE7UrQ.jpg:large
Click to expand...

Alternating between this, the fire whip from the archives (it's surprisingly good!), and the Dancer's swords.
 
Zurick

Zurick

Banned
cciwpbk


My AFK PVP Hiding Spot. The Dead pose, is amazing just amazing. I've had 17 invaders since I started this and none of them found me haha.

www.twitch.tv/zurick is just going to be AFK PVP for the night!
 
G

grimmiq

Member
Playing the JP version, did I just completely miss something with Anri? She was partnered up with Horace, then in the catacombs I meet a guy with the same armour who was also partnered with Horace, then had to kill Horace..Did I miss something where Anri and Horace seperated?

Also, am I done with the lake area? Killed the Old Demon King boss, ran up top and turned off the giant crossbow but can't find anywhere else to explore (Noticed 1 set of rocks that looks like it can be broken by the crossbow but leads to somewhere I've already been, can't tell if any of my rings gives lava walking unfortunately, but I think the lava rooms are the only things left in the zone.
 
Z

Zocano

Member
B-Genius said:
I wish you folks could see the evolution of Yhorm's design, let alone other characters and settings.
Maybe some day From will be more open with this kind of stuff. In the meantime, people are free to believe what they want, but I don't think this whole "they blates chucked DS2 lol" schtick is healthy.
Click to expand...

I mean the original comments are just based on the fact that the original reveal of Yhorm, whether you know extra information or not, looks and evokes the Dark Souls 2 giants where the confusion stems from.

I just wish the game didn't feel like it completely ignores any of the cool concepts and story that Dark Souls 2 introduced. It *definitely* has that feel. I think it's insane for anyone to think that the approach for this game was "ERASE DARK SOULS 2". Rather, it was most likely just the leads wanting to create the world they wanted. Nonetheless, I think it's a disappointing thing to go into this game and not hear a peep about Dark Souls 2 lore (not just faint superfluous references). The fragments of the abyss, the old chaos, the Dark "growing/evolving", Aldia.

I mean at least with Aldia I can excuse it cause the dark serpents got the same treatment of just basically disappearing. But more substantial events would have been cool to see realized into this game.
 
E

Easy_D

never left the stone age
Kinda shocked Aldia's not referenced more, I thougth they added him in specifically to create a stronger tie to Dark Souls 3, which I assume was very far in development when the Scholar patch and the re-release came out.
 
P

pa22word

Member
holy shit I just had the most awesome fight with nameless king

Ran out of estus when he was @25%, battled down to the end and we both had one hit of HP left. He started his attack animation, but I only had the stamina left for one roll before he could smash me, so I went YOLO on his ass and did a lunging attack with Ricard's. My hit landed first, then he killed me. We both die at the same time, and the screen just went black. I honestly thought I had crashed the game until the cutscene started playing and it just dumped me there at that bonfire.
 
I

Iva Demilcol

Member
Easy_D said:
Kinda shocked Aldia's not referenced more, I thougth they added him in specifically to create a stronger tie to Dark Souls 3, which I assume was very far in development when the Scholar patch and the re-release came out.
Click to expand...

Well, you have a bunch of people that have transformed into trees -like Aldia did- scattered through some levels.

My interpretation is that people are trying to emulate Aldia to try to get out of the cycle of the fire.

Haven't finished the game yet, so I'm still trying to figure out stuff.
 
R

Relaxed Muscle

Member
B-Genius said:
Didn't mean to make it seem like I flew off the handle...
But it just gets my goat when people make it all personal like this.

Obviously I can't go into too much detail, but for the sake of argument:
Miyazaki never "purged" anything just because it was related to a previous game.
There was never any direction (2D concept or CG-wise) indicating this was a "DS2 giant".
(There wasn't even anything saying it should reference a giant from any other game.)

I wish you folks could see the evolution of Yhorm's design, let alone other characters and settings.
Maybe some day From will be more open with this kind of stuff. In the meantime, people are free to believe what they want, but I don't think this whole "they blates chucked DS2 lol" schtick is healthy.
Click to expand...

Anyway, is clear that Miyazaki DS3 expands upon DS1 lore more than DS2 lore, DS2 lore looks kinda sidetracked.

Is understandable, DS1 is his game, and I'm sure he's more comfortable following one of his games than other people games.
 
J

JerkShep

Member
There are more Demons Souls references than DaS2 probably lol

- Ministers
- Morion Blade and Luck Sword
- Stormruler gimmick + Onion bro as Bjorr
- The final stretch before the Lothric bros is Boletaria 1-3 ending: big staircase, thrash mobs at the bottom, three red eyes knight at the top guarding the boss. And a short time before that sequence you face a group of three NPCs that drop their respective weapons, just like at the beginning of 1-4

I guess I missed some more
 
N

Noray

Unconfirmed Member
JerkShep said:
There are more Demons Souls references than DaS2 probably lol

- Ministers
- Morion Blade and Luck Sword
- Stormruler gimmick + Onion bro as Bjorr
- The final stretch before the Lothric bros is Boletaria 1-3 ending: big staircase, thrash mobs at the bottom, three red eyes knight at the top guarding the boss. And a short time before that sequence you face a group of three NPCs that drop their respective weapons, just like at the beginning of 1-4

I guess I missed some more
Click to expand...

There's definitely a lot of Demon's references. The Firekeepers look like the Maiden in Black, Firelink Shrine is structured very similarly to The Nexus (it's hard not to think of the Nexus when you see the stairs going around the 5 thrones/worldstones). Also in Lothric Castle the part with the 2 dragons guarding the stairs is a lot like the dragon in 1-4. Lothric Castle in general is very Boletaria-esque to me. It kind of bums me out that DS2's events aren't referenced more directly, but it is what it is.
 
I

iRAWRasaurus

Banned
Kinda disappointed the leak "melting sun everything has gone to hell" picture was not really used. I mean it is kinda but I was excepting thing to be out of wack and crazy. O well it is a leak picture :(
 
N

Noray

Unconfirmed Member
Speaking of, let's get into some lore shit. What the fuck is going on in this game? What's the deal with the solar eclipse/sun looking like the Darksign? What's with the pilgrim butterflies? What's (prince) Lothric's deal? What is the deal with the Untended graves / empty Firelink shrine in our own world? Are we traveling through time?
 
H

HGH

Banned
JerkShep said:
There are more Demons Souls references than DaS2 probably lol

- Ministers
- Morion Blade and Luck Sword
- Stormruler gimmick + Onion bro as Bjorr
- The final stretch before the Lothric bros is Boletaria 1-3 ending: big staircase, thrash mobs at the bottom, three red eyes knight at the top guarding the boss. And a short time before that sequence you face a group of three NPCs that drop their respective weapons, just like at the beginning of 1-4

I guess I missed some more
Click to expand...
One subtle one in the Usurper ending.
Your protagonist steps on the firekeeper's head just like the DeS protagonist steps on the Maiden in Black's.
 
C

charsace

Member
pa22word said:
The biggest difference between the two is that DS3 is a much faster game, and with the increased pace health bars should have been raised to compensate. The increased lethality of combat From employed to up the game's pace was an ehh idea with I think mixed results in a lot of places, bosses being the biggest example of where it doesn't really work out because without the added mechanics Bloodborne implemented to counter increased lethality it forces a much more of a strategic emphasis on battles vs a tactical one. Some might like that, but as someone who's never really enjoyed a strategic focus in his action games it's a minus for me personally.

Honestly I think most of the bosses would have been better in the game if they took damage output down a peg and raised lifebars by double for most bosses, forcing players to learn the boss more than boiling basically all non-gimmick fights down to rushdowns. It's a shame too, because most of the bosses in the game have very interesting movesets that never get a chance to shine because they all die so fast.
Click to expand...

Of course if you understand dark souls the bosses can be bodied quickly. What is your build? If you are a regular souls player then by now you know to lvl a great weapon and stagger smash everything into the dirt.
 
R

Relaxed Muscle

Member
iRAWRasaurus said:
Kinda disappointed the leak "melting sun everything has gone to hell" picture was not really used. I mean it is kinda but I was excepting thing to be out of wack and crazy. O well it is a leak picture :(
Click to expand...

Is a shame that the last area was just a last boss arena area and not a proper area. The vistas and the potential level design madness of such a place could have been put to some use.
 
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