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[PeteBull]

Ofcourse that's part of it, but Pro was meant to boost PSVR performance. I believe it was Hirai (or maybe Yoshida) that talked about it pre-release.

Pro also released shortly after PSVR.
But you don't release it just for PSVR, you try to cover as many bases, those enthusiast you're referring to are another reason (4k gaming being another, for the masses).
But the vast majority of console-gamers don't care enough about PC gaming for it to be an issue.

Psvr same like psvr2 was made just incase vr takes of, as an insurance sony doesnt get left behind, u can tell by it having literally 0 big exclusives/games for it (both psvr and psvr2), its not something that makes sony money.
Reason we dont have big budget games for vr- simple- its niche af and games dont sell well there, so no publisher gonna risk spending mountains of cash/dev time for this shit.

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Psvr same like psvr2 was made just incase vr takes of, as an insurance sony doesnt get left behind, u can tell by it having literally 0 big exclusives/games for it (both psvr and psvr2), its not something that makes sony money.
Reason we dont have big budget games for vr- simple- its niche af and games dont sell well there, so no publisher gonna risk spending mountains of cash/dev time for this shit.

Fair point, but fact is that PSVR struggled with bare minimum performance due to PS4 hardware.
To give PSVR more chance to succeed, they released Pro a month later.

Really, they did the bare minimum for PS4 Pro, like an extra GPU and a bit of extra RAM to have the OS and some background stuff running, so they could use as much RAM as possible for VR.

But like you said, PSVR was not going to fly off the shelves and have an amazing library, hence the "4K gaming and preventing enthusiasts going to PC" PR for the masses.

 

[Lysandros]

ESRAM. Ring a bell? It was supposed, at least according to Rich, to make all the difference for One.

<narrator>it didn't</narrator>

Don't forget about the 'data move engines', people don't remember his damage control article on XboxOne apparently. It was supposed to be closer in power to PS4 than the specs indicated.

 

[GHG]

Don't forget about the 'data move engines', people don't remember his damage control article on XboxOne apparently. It was supposed to be closer in power to PS4 than the specs indicated.

Never forget the damage control they attempted via DF:

Digital Foundry vs. the Xbox One architects

"There's a lot of misinformation out there and a lot of people who don't get it. We're actually extremely proud of our design."

www.eurogamer.net

Narrator: people never got it.

 

[Crispy Gamer]

Now I wish they would've released that 1 hour long breakdown in 2020 on how series x was superior to ps5 for posterity, looks like they were saved by the devs

 

[BbMajor7th]

Are you kidding me? Almost everyone thought DF was pro Sony during the PS4/Xbox One time period. Now you think they are pro Xbox?

I don't think they're pro any platform necessarily, but as they've grown in size and influence, they've become prey to client journalism. In recent years, Microsoft has given them a lot of early access to new consoles and games in a way that the other two don't ordinarily. This is a good content opportunity for DF, but a publisher is only going to scratch your back and give you preferential treatment (early access to Starfield codes, for example) if you scratch theirs in return. I think that's what's happening here.

At the start of the last generation, DF were fairly small-time, but their influence grew massively over the generation and increased both the public's understanding of and publishers' attention to technical performance. Combined with console war rhetoric, they vividly amplified the power delta between the XB1 and the PS4 and dealt a huge amount of PR damage to MS. In the early years, they were more even-handed but as the generation wore on, they made no bones about XB1 being the least powerful console.

Leaked emails show how much this bothered Spencer and the XB team. They were desperate to avoid a repeat this gen and - as the most influential voice on console power - it made sense for them to have DF help spread the good news. I think this is where the slide towards client journalism began for DF. Microsoft has worked hard to build a relationship with these guys and keep them sweet. In return, DF have had to grease the wheels a little themselves. John's most recent coverage on Starfield was a telling example of this: he didn't claim it was the second coming or anything and raised a few critiques, but he did pick his comparisons carefully, placing more emphasis on how far Bethesda had come since their prior games (in areas where they had - he omitted comparisons on things like water interaction, that were done better in Skyrim), rather than how far behind their contemporaries they'd begun to fall.

It's more nuanced than 'fanboys'. DF are doing it because it helps their channel grow; MS are doing it because they fear a re-run of XB1. For audiences, it's a double-edged sword: we get more in-depth content from the horse's mouth, but we also have to accept more PR-friendly reviews. A lot of outlets are going this way sadly, not just in games media, but right across the board.

 

[Horseganador]

What a massage DF gives to Xbox one, I wish they had had the same attitude with Mark Cerny when he presented PS5...they are having nightmares just thinking about Sony releasing a more powerful midgen console and Xbox not and they have full damage control ( with what they liked the one x...), I suppose the roadmap will be to make comparisons of the PS5 PRO with a 5090 to make it look bad.

 

[Senua]

I don't think they're pro any platform necessarily, but as they've grown in size and influence, they've become prey to client journalism. In recent years, Microsoft has given them a lot of early access to new consoles and games in a way that the other two don't ordinarily. This is a good content opportunity for DF, but a publisher is only going to scratch your back and give you preferential treatment (early access to Starfield codes, for example) if you scratch theirs in return. I think that's what's happening here.

At the start of the last generation, DF were fairly small-time, but their influence grew massively over the generation and increased both the public's understanding of and publishers' attention to technical performance. Combined with console war rhetoric, they vividly amplified the power delta between the XB1 and the PS4 and dealt a huge amount of PR damage to MS. In the early years, they were more even-handed but as the generation wore on, they made no bones about XB1 being the least powerful console.

Leaked emails show how much this bothered Spencer and the XB team. They were desperate to avoid a re-repeat this gen and - as the most influential voice on console power - it made sense for them to have DF help spread the good news. I think this is where the slide towards client journalism began for DF. Microsoft has worked hard to build a relationship with these guys and keep them sweet. In return, DF have had to grease the wheels a little themselves. John's most recent coverage on Starfield was a telling example of this: he didn't claim it was the second coming or anything and raised a few critiques, but he did pick his comparisons carefully, placing more emphasis on how far Bethesda had come since their prior games (in areas where they had - he omitted comparisons on things like water interaction, that were done better in Skyrim), rather than how far behind their contemporaries they'd begun to fall.

It's more nuanced than 'fanboys'. DF are doing it because it helps their channel grow; MS are doing it because they fear a re-run of XB1. For audiences, it's a double-edged sword: we get more in-depth content from the horse's mouth, but we also have to accept more PR-friendly reviews. A lot of outlets are going this way sadly, not just in games media, but right across the board.

Someone with their head screwed on, for once

 

[Panajev2001a]

I don't think they're pro any platform necessarily, but as they've grown in size and influence, they've become prey to client journalism. In recent years, Microsoft has given them a lot of early access to new consoles and games in a way that the other two don't ordinarily. This is a good content opportunity for DF, but a publisher is only going to scratch your back and give you preferential treatment (early access to Starfield codes, for example) if you scratch theirs in return. I think that's what's happening here.

At the start of the last generation, DF were fairly small-time, but their influence grew massively over the generation and increased both the public's understanding of and publishers' attention to technical performance. Combined with console war rhetoric, they vividly amplified the power delta between the XB1 and the PS4 and dealt a huge amount of PR damage to MS. In the early years, they were more even-handed but as the generation wore on, they made no bones about XB1 being the least powerful console.

Leaked emails show how much this bothered Spencer and the XB team. They were desperate to avoid a re-repeat this gen and - as the most influential voice on console power - it made sense for them to have DF help spread the good news. I think this is where the slide towards client journalism began for DF. Microsoft has worked hard to build a relationship with these guys and keep them sweet. In return, DF have had to grease the wheels a little themselves. John's most recent coverage on Starfield was a telling example of this: he didn't claim it was the second coming or anything and raised a few critiques, but he did pick his comparisons carefully, placing more emphasis on how far Bethesda had come since their prior games (in areas where they had - he omitted comparisons on things like water interaction, that were done better in Skyrim), rather than how far behind their contemporaries they'd begun to fall.

It's more nuanced than 'fanboys'. DF are doing it because it helps their channel grow; MS are doing it because they fear a re-run of XB1. For audiences, it's a double-edged sword: we get more in-depth content from the horse's mouth, but we also have to accept more PR-friendly reviews. A lot of outlets are going this way sadly, not just in games media, but right across the board.

Very well said.

 

[anothertech]

MS already released their pro console. They're just embarrassed to say it.

Series S is their next gen offering. X is pro. When PS5 pro comes out, nothing will change. Series S will still be the base line. And they're gonna double down.

 

[Zuzu]

MS already released their pro console. They're just embarrassed to say it.

Series S is their next gen offering. X is pro. When PS5 pro comes out, nothing will change. Series S will still be the base line. And they're gonna double down.

It's crazy isn't it? Relative to their era, I think the Series S is even weaker than the Xbox One was. And now it's the most popular console in their current gen ecosystem by a 3:1 margin. The Xbox One was bad enough & now we have this. The Series X is a great console but the S is just absurd. And it will be necessary to accommodate this console until 2028 most likely. Ridiculous...

 

[shamoomoo]

I don't think they're pro any platform necessarily, but as they've grown in size and influence, they've become prey to client journalism. In recent years, Microsoft has given them a lot of early access to new consoles and games in a way that the other two don't ordinarily. This is a good content opportunity for DF, but a publisher is only going to scratch your back and give you preferential treatment (early access to Starfield codes, for example) if you scratch theirs in return. I think that's what's happening here.

At the start of the last generation, DF were fairly small-time, but their influence grew massively over the generation and increased both the public's understanding of and publishers' attention to technical performance. Combined with console war rhetoric, they vividly amplified the power delta between the XB1 and the PS4 and dealt a huge amount of PR damage to MS. In the early years, they were more even-handed but as the generation wore on, they made no bones about XB1 being the least powerful console.

Leaked emails show how much this bothered Spencer and the XB team. They were desperate to avoid a re-repeat this gen and - as the most influential voice on console power - it made sense for them to have DF help spread the good news. I think this is where the slide towards client journalism began for DF. Microsoft has worked hard to build a relationship with these guys and keep them sweet. In return, DF have had to grease the wheels a little themselves. John's most recent coverage on Starfield was a telling example of this: he didn't claim it was the second coming or anything and raised a few critiques, but he did pick his comparisons carefully, placing more emphasis on how far Bethesda had come since their prior games (in areas where they had - he omitted comparisons on things like water interaction, that were done better in Skyrim), rather than how far behind their contemporaries they'd begun to fall.

It's more nuanced than 'fanboys'. DF are doing it because it helps their channel grow; MS are doing it because they fear a re-run of XB1. For audiences, it's a double-edged sword: we get more in-depth content from the horse's mouth, but we also have to accept more PR-friendly reviews. A lot of outlets are going this way sadly, not just in games media, but right across the board.

Don't forget Nvidia,the DF crew are becoming PR for Nvidia too.

 

[Three]

Don't forget about the 'data move engines', people don't remember his damage control article on XboxOne apparently. It was supposed to be closer in power to PS4 than the specs indicated.

Read the first paragraph of this article and see the stark contrast in suggesting people haven't waited "for a single game to release" during xbox one vs PS4 and what their narrative was during xbox Series and PS5 where they were suggesting hardware raytracing and a big xbox advantage until games showed it just wasn't there.

 

[Thirty7ven]

Nah, there has already been performance issues due to lack of optimization talent fallout since 2020.

This would be DF if MS said they had a Pro console as well,

You can see it in the video, with Alex pouting about the whole “They aren’t optimizing for Xbox” bs and then getting an erection thinking about Xbox going with Nvidia just so they can have an advantage over PlayStation.

Pathetic lil shills, it’s always about what Xbox can do vs PlayStation and never the other way.

 

[Kurotri]

It's crazy isn't it? Relative to their era, I think the Series S is even weaker than the Xbox One was. And now it's the most popular console in their current gen ecosystem by a 3:1 margin. The Xbox One was bad enough & now we have this. The Series X is a great console but the S is just absurd. And it will be necessary to accommodate this console until 2028 most likely. Ridiculous...

Don't forget that they want to continue with the 2-model approach next gen.

 

[Lysandros]

Read the first paragraph of this article and see the stark contrast in suggesting people haven't waited "for a single game to release" during xbox one vs PS4 and what their narrative was during xbox Series and PS5 where they were suggesting hardware raytracing and a big xbox advantage until games showed it just wasn't there.

I think the word hypocrisy describes this situation well enough.

 

[DaGwaphics]

Man I really hate do venture into conspiracy theory territory but these guys give me no choice. There's no need to dive into Alex's nonsense perspective, his irrational opposition to anything console (especially Sony) is well known and documented. It's Richard that pisses me off and convinced me he is going out of his way to stay in Microsoft good graces by downplaying any positive rumors relating to PlayStation. How does the leader of a tech channel go on and on praising the Xbox Series S as a "great value" for entry into next gen while being mellow/skeptical on the potential of a PS5 Pro which at the very least has solid rumors of enhanced RT? Could you imagine Rich praising the 4060ti 8gb simply because it is the cheapest NVidia card that offers tensor cores for RT and DLSS while questioning whether or not the 4090 is necessary? In fact, he/they've done the EXACT OPPOSITE of this as it relates to PC cards (as they should). So why is there a different mentality applied to console arena?

Sorry, but this stinks of biased, selective favoritism of one corporation over another. It's sad and pathetic to see this from DF.

PC is a completely different space, thus a halo product can exist with a much higher transistor count and a price tag to match. Console has always been about bang for the buck, thus the typical criteria for it is different.

There are ways that Sony can put out a Pro that no one will care about (they only upgrade the GPU and RT, etc.) and ways that it could be interesting (the CPUs also get a substantial upgrade to hit 60fps in UE5 and similar games). Just looking at AMD's own products they don't seem to have advanced much in terms of performance per transistor. We'll have to see what they put together.

Personally, I've never liked the "Pro" console approach. As it is basically a late to market product that will exist for half a generation and then disappear. Overall there was very little interest in the PS4 Pro and 1X for this reason (in comparison to the base units). If it were me, I'd just go with an iterative design that completely replaces the outgoing units. Stick the price points and just pickup whatever performance improvements could be had, which probably wouldn't be enormous but might freshen things up. That's what I had figured MS's plans might be, or they would stick to a generational structure but shorten them. It looks like all the talk about the end of generations from them was smoke and mirrors though, as the underlying plans are just the basic long generation.
It really goes to show that it is extremely hard to predict what these companies will do. Hopefully they at least get some small price reductions on the base units. Sticking with the old 7 or 8 year generation approach but with no price reductions will really be something new. If they designed an all digital XSX, I figured it would be to price match the base PS5, not to maintain the "same great price". LOL

With all that said, I don't think it is a mistake for Sony to release a pro or anything like that. There will be some buyers for it and those buyers will enjoy it. If Sony can make the numbers work for a console that is selling at a slower rate than the base unit, go for it.

 

[SegaSnatcher]

If Sony has the ability to release PS5 Pro at $499.99 that will be even a more devastating blow for Microsoft.

I could have maybe looked past the all digital Series X if they intended to release it at $399.99, but at the "same low price of $499" they can kick rocks.

 

[Senua]

You can see it in the video, with Alex pouting about the whole “They aren’t optimizing for Xbox” bs and then getting an erection thinking about Xbox going with Nvidia just so they can have an advantage over PlayStation.

Pathetic lil shills, it’s always about what Xbox can do vs PlayStation and never the other way.

This part is in your head Sonybro, he just sucks the teets of Nvidia like most PC gamers

 

[Tsaki]

Yes, but those are bundles. Consumers aren't stupid, there is much more value to a bundle than a console itself at the same pricepoint.
Plus the core gamers have moved on, it's mostly the (more) casual gamers that have to migrate to PS5, it's tougher to sell them quite an expensive console, so the question is if it's worth releasing a Pro console for a minority of more enthusiastic gamers this time.

Imo the only thing that makes sense for Sony to release a Pro, is if they really want to run Xbox into the ground, but I wonder if they think it's worth the effort as they're already crushing it.

The PS5 Pro has multiple reasons to exist:
1. You keep more people on the PS ecosystem when they might have switched over to PC due to the stronger hardware that comes over time.
2. The people that buy the more expensive machine have more disposable income, so on average they are more valuable customers. A person that buys such a machine is more inclined to invest into it to justify their purchase.
3. You create a new wave of marketing that keeps the Playstation brand fresh and into the news.
4. You have a Halo product. Its existence indirectly affects the base PS5. Like Richard said, a 4090 is miniscule in volume compared to the other GPUs, but Nvidia does all they can to have such a product in the market, showing that they have the strongest product even though it's bad performance/$ and you'll never buy it anyway.
5. DF, NXGamer, VGTech, etc become your free marketing tools. Every single 3rd party game will be played best on Playstation (console comparisons only ofc).
6. Better Backwards Compatibility. All PS5 games will benefit from the new hardware. Locked 30, 40, 60 fps. Does GT7 run at 90 fps? Boom 120.
7. Better Forward Compatibility. Games that have PS5 Pro taken into account, will have higher resolution, assets and frame rates unlocked for PS6.
8. PSVR2 becomes a more attractive product if you have stronger hardware running games on it.
9. "The most powerful console in the world" tagline is something Sony can actually use.
10. "Did you buy a Series X in order to have the most powerful console? Well I have a product for you!" Stealing costumers from MS is invaluable.
11. Better collaboration with AMD. Being in the weeds co-developing technology, seeing what works and what doesn't, is a great interim in acquiring knowledge, experience and usable data for the development of PS6.
These are all things that came to my head as I was writing. If someone really put more thought into it they could point out more.

The question of PS5 Pro existing is either yes or no. There is no interim where they might decide to make one or scrap the plans they already had. The design would be already locked, they'd had many samples back from TSMC and wafer allocation is probably already decided. In which case you'd have to say that Tom Henderson's info are straight up wrong. I do not pay attention to pretty much any leakers. I do trust Tom though, since he leaked the Earbuds, the new Elite headset and the PS Portal; all products Sony is about to release in the market. We have a video of the new ""slim"" model. When Sony announces this SKU it would be another feather in Tom's hat of Sony hardware leaks.

Edit: Watch Sony do something retarded and not put Zen4 so the GPU is heavily bottlenecked.

 

[LordBlodgett]

I don't think they're pro any platform necessarily, but as they've grown in size and influence, they've become prey to client journalism. In recent years, Microsoft has given them a lot of early access to new consoles and games in a way that the other two don't ordinarily. This is a good content opportunity for DF, but a publisher is only going to scratch your back and give you preferential treatment (early access to Starfield codes, for example) if you scratch theirs in return. I think that's what's happening here.

At the start of the last generation, DF were fairly small-time, but their influence grew massively over the generation and increased both the public's understanding of and publishers' attention to technical performance. Combined with console war rhetoric, they vividly amplified the power delta between the XB1 and the PS4 and dealt a huge amount of PR damage to MS. In the early years, they were more even-handed but as the generation wore on, they made no bones about XB1 being the least powerful console.

Leaked emails show how much this bothered Spencer and the XB team. They were desperate to avoid a repeat this gen and - as the most influential voice on console power - it made sense for them to have DF help spread the good news. I think this is where the slide towards client journalism began for DF. Microsoft has worked hard to build a relationship with these guys and keep them sweet. In return, DF have had to grease the wheels a little themselves. John's most recent coverage on Starfield was a telling example of this: he didn't claim it was the second coming or anything and raised a few critiques, but he did pick his comparisons carefully, placing more emphasis on how far Bethesda had come since their prior games (in areas where they had - he omitted comparisons on things like water interaction, that were done better in Skyrim), rather than how far behind their contemporaries they'd begun to fall.

It's more nuanced than 'fanboys'. DF are doing it because it helps their channel grow; MS are doing it because they fear a re-run of XB1. For audiences, it's a double-edged sword: we get more in-depth content from the horse's mouth, but we also have to accept more PR-friendly reviews. A lot of outlets are going this way sadly, not just in games media, but right across the board.

Hey look, a well said and nuanced take!

I agree that there might be some "client journalism", as you put it here. I think the way they received early access to the Xbox One X and the Series S and X probably makes them want to continue a relationship with Microsoft.

I do think they try to be fair though. They were constantly ragging on the Xbox One because it was legitimately worse on almost every game, no fanboy drivel there. They praised the One X as an excellent piece of hardware because it was (from a hardware, size, and look perspective that is one of my favorite consoles of all time), and they continue to praise both PS5 and Series X ports of games, with just slight differences between them because that's pretty much the situation. They have many times criticized the Series S in the same ways it's ragged on elsewhere because it probably is holding back Xbox developers.

Here's

 

[Lucie Goosey]

I think one of the reasons why a Pro console might be getting some push back is we're seeing few games actually using the next-gen features they already have, and a lot games are requiring many optimisation patches to get them running acceptably. PC has been swamped in poorly performing console ports that are simply too heavy for what the games are actually doing. It seems developers aren't held back by the hardware in the same way the Xbone/PS4 held them back, they're held back by a lack of optimisation, time, and QA. The constraints appear to be elsewhere. My two cents.

Yeah, I'm seeing similar things.

 

[DeepEnigma]

This part is in your head Sonybro, he just sucks the teets of Nvidia like most PC gamers

And like most PCMR types, they war in favor of MS against PS via proxy. Especially when PS produces great looking games they felt had no business doing last gen on a "lesser" 1.8TF notebook CPU box. He used to go hard in the paint when he had an account here before the reeeeetard exodus scam.

 

[Crayon]

With no competition from MS,Sony has absolutely no reason to release a Pro console for "cheaper".

With PC gaming prices gone off the deep end, all they have to do is to price it competitively with a GPU of around the same performance

Oh that's important - I think they would have more than one variation that they could choose to produce. I was thinking they were going to both go 600 in an arms race.

 

[Team Andromeda]

I've seen some pandering to a crowd but that was a little much. It's was a little disingenuous to make out that PC was near-perfect for BC, when it was not. I have quite a few PC games that will not work on my modern system at all. Sure there are work around, but there are also work around on consoles, like soft mods, MODE, Mega SD Everdrive Ect which means you don't need physical media. I don't get the point over Smart Drive it was a better solution to what we had on the PS5 and meant you never got a Death Standing like issue with trying to carry your data over.

Also, I find it a little puzzling not to long beyond a PC for your next console tech. I remember Bump mapping being a thing consoles could only dream of using probably in games until the age of the OG Xbox

 

[Senua]

And like most PCMR types, they war in favor of MS against PS via proxy. Especially when PS produces great looking games they felt had no business doing last gen on a "lesser" 1.8TF notebook CPU box. He used to go hard in the paint when he had an account here before the reeeeetard exodus scam.

I really don't think it's that deep. He downplays both consoles, he clearly has a huge stiffy for PC gaming but hey you kind want that for your PC guy, he moans about the shit that actually matters on the platform. This whole us vs them tribe shit is frankly gotten to a lot of people here and paints a twisted version of events. I'm a PC guy and he irritates even me a lot but he's not involved the console war.

 

[DeepEnigma]

I really don't think it's that deep. He downplays both consoles, he clearly has a huge stiffy for PC gaming but hey you kind want that for your PC guy, he moans about the shit that actually matters on the platform. This whole us vs them tribe shit is frankly gotten to a lot of people here and paints a twisted version of events. I'm a PC guy and he irritates even me a lot but he's not involved the console war.

His post history was on display here. It's not deep at all. Most PCMR war via proxy, especially when Sony started producing banging looking games but not for their platform. He's always had a hate boner for Sony 1st party graphics.

This isn't a revelation. Those types try and pretend they are above it all, but they're not.

DF would clap like seals if MS gave them a memo that they too are doing a pro model. Now they're just repeating MS PR about PC being the pro model.

 

[truth411]

I think neither MS nor Sony will.

Sony most likely will.

 

[systemr123]

The PS5 Pro has multiple reasons to exist:
1. You keep more people on the PS ecosystem when they might have switched over to PC due to the stronger hardware that comes over time.
2. The people that buy the more expensive machine have more disposable income, so on average they are more valuable customers. A person that buys such a machine is more inclined to invest into it to justify their purchase.
3. You create a new wave of marketing that keeps the Playstation brand fresh and into the news.
4. You have a Halo product. Its existence indirectly affects the base PS5. Like Richard said, a 4090 is miniscule in volume compared to the other GPUs, but Nvidia does all they can to have such a product in the market, showing that they have the strongest product even though it's bad performance/$ and you'll never buy it anyway.
5. DF, NXGamer, VGTech, etc become your free marketing tools. Every single 3rd party game will be played best on Playstation (console comparisons only ofc).
6. Better Backwards Compatibility. All PS5 games will benefit from the new hardware. Locked 30, 40, 60 fps. Does GT7 run at 90 fps? Boom 120.
7. Better Forward Compatibility. Games that have PS5 Pro taken into account, will have higher resolution, assets and frame rates unlocked for PS6.
8. PSVR2 becomes a more attractive product if you have stronger hardware running games on it.
9. "The most powerful console in the world" tagline is something Sony can actually use.
10. "Did you buy a Series X in order to have the most powerful console? Well I have a product for you!" Stealing costumers from MS is invaluable.
11. Better collaboration with AMD. Being in the weeds co-developing technology, seeing what works and what doesn't, is a great interim in acquiring knowledge, experience and usable data for the development of PS6.
These are all things that came to my head as I was writing. If someone really put more thought into it they could point out more.

The question of PS5 Pro existing is either yes or no. There is no interim where they might decide to make one or scrap the plans they already had. The design would be already locked, they'd had many samples back from TSMC and wafer allocation is probably already decided. In which case you'd have to say that Tom Henderson's info are straight up wrong. I do not pay attention to pretty much any leakers. I do trust Tom though, since he leaked the Earbuds, the new Elite headset and the PS Portal; all products Sony is about to release in the market. We have a video of the new ""slim"" model. When Sony announces this SKU it would be another feather in Tom's hat of Sony hardware leaks.

Edit: Watch Sony do something retarded and not put Zen4 so the GPU is heavily bottlenecked.

Sony would do something retarded like that, Cerny would not, all hail Cerny

 

[Senua]

His post history was on display here. It's not deep at all. Most PCMR war via proxy, especially when Sony started producing banging looking games but not for their platform. He's always had a hate boner for Sony 1st party graphics.

This isn't a revelation. Those types try and pretend they are above it all, but they're not.

DF would clap like seals is MS gave them a memo that they too are doing a Pro model. Now they're just repeating MS PR about PC being the pro model.

I have not seen his post history so you know more than me I guess, i'm just going off of DF Directs and his videos. It does make me laugh though when John or someone is really praising visuals of a console game and the body language of Alex just turns and he looks so uncomfortable and almost like he wants to scream

 

[DeepEnigma]

I have not seen his post history so you know more than me I guess, i'm just going off of DF Directs and his videos. It does make me laugh though when John or someone is really praising visuals of a console game and the body language of Alex just turns and he looks so uncomfortable and almost like he wants to scream

It pains him. It pains him that there will never be a AAA funded Crysis moment ever again on that platform.

 

[Lysandros]

It pains him. It pains him that there will never be a AAA funded Crysis moment ever again on that platform.

He is one of those characters which is so easy to read that i truly want to sell bridges to the naive who can't see through his bullshit.

 

[DeepEnigma]

He is one of those characters which is so easy to read that i truly want to sell bridges to the naive who can't see through his bullshit.

Oh they can see it, the hardest defenders just align with it.

 

[Neo_game]

Pro console do not sell and this time even 2x jump looks unlikely it is still much better than the new 500$ SX and 300$. Considering Sony is selling PS5 DE for 400$ since 2020

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Pro console do not sell and this time even 2x jump looks unlikely it is still much better than the new 500$ SX and 300$. Considering Sony is selling PS5 DE for 400$ since 2020

20% ish market so no they don‘t sell well but seems like that’s enough for Sony.

Will be very curious to see how the PS5 Pro does though with no Xbox competitor when clearly the best console to play 3rd party games will be in Sonys lineup

 

[Luigi Mario]

While I haven't kept up with all the leaks that happened this week, it has to be very unfortunate timing for Digital Foundry considering that members like John Linneman were slowly coming around the idea of a mid-gen refresh.

Now that we basically got the confirmation of Microsoft only having a hardware revision ready for next year, I'm wondering if they have to pivot again regarding the need for upgraded consoles.
There also seems to be some talk about Microsoft taking the PC = Pro Console route, so I could see this getting brought up more and more by the likes of Battaglia in the coming months.

 

[Nonehxc]

If anything Richard Leadbetter(and by extension, the whole of DF since it's HIS schtick and he sets the editorial tone) has gotten more impartial or, if you wish, less obvious as to which side his cock hangs over the years. But the man is CONSOLE PR made flesh with googles. All his career has been made in selling you what his bosses wanted him to sell you, period. He only made himself his boss and money safe when he started DF, and has had a healthy relationship with MS and Xbox since before he founded DF.

If you like, I can tell you tales of War, Console Wars. Because the man, damn, has been waging Console Wars PROFESIONALLY for as long as there has been a Console War to be waged.

 

[Poltz]

I just don't see Xbox let PS5 have a Pro uncontested for 3 years.

 

[Solidus_T]

I just don't see Xbox let PS5 have a Pro uncontested for 3 years.

After reading their internal emails, I will not be surprised by any level of blunder at Xbox.

These people called Baldur's Gate 3 a "second run" game, despite Divinity: Original Sin 2 receiving tons of awards.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

I just don't see Xbox let PS5 have a Pro uncontested for 3 years.

I think Xbox is going to try to be different coming up very soon

I think Xbox may shift course and launch their next Xbox sooner than 2028 and avoid launching in the same calendar year as Sony

These are just guesses

 

[Senua]

After reading their internal emails, I will not be surprised by any level of blunder at Xbox.

These people called Baldur's Gate 3 a "second run" game, despite Divinity: Original Sin 2 receiving tons of awards.

Second run =/= second rate

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

After reading their internal emails, I will not be surprised by any level of blunder at Xbox.

These people called Baldur's Gate 3 a "second run" game, despite Divinity: Original Sin 2 receiving tons of awards.

Second run =/= second rate

I will just quote Little Chicken here as many seem to not understand what second run means

Sorry but this is fucking stupid.

"Second-run" means that it isn't launching on Xbox, was originally going to launch on Stadia, I presume, as a timed exclusive.

The Xbox launch would be the "second run".

They didn't mean "second rate", as the moronic "journalist" thinks.

 

[Solidus_T]

I will just quote Little Chicken here as many seem to not understand what second run means

Despite this, its "second run" on the PS5 generated massive sales, placing it at the number one preordered game on the platform after it had released on PC. It was incredibly bad judgement no matter how you spin it - and the low offer they made for it speaks to the quality they expected from it, given the fact that they spent an order of magnitude more for a game that sold nearly 10 million on PS4 only for its "second run" on Xbox and to remove it from Playstation Plus (Persona 5).

Anyway, back to my original point on a mid gen refresh, I expect them to double down on their current model.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Despite this, its "second run" on the PS5 generated massive sales, placing it at the number one preordered game on the platform after it had released on PC. It was incredibly bad judgement no matter how you spin it - and the low offer they made for it speaks to the quality they expected from it, given the fact that they spent an order of magnitude more for a game that sold nearly 10 million on PS4 only for its "second run" on Xbox and to remove it from Playstation Plus (Persona 5).

Anyway, back to my original point on a mid gen refresh, I expect them to double down on their current model.

Pretty big difference between underestimating sales figures which happened and openly calling a game second rate, which didn’t happen

 

[Fake]

I just don't see Xbox let PS5 have a Pro uncontested for 3 years.

Neither a Xbox using ARM, but Microsoft do like to burn some money.

 

[Solidus_T]

Pretty big difference between underestimating sales figures which happened and openly calling a game second rate, which didn’t happen

I never said they called it second rate. I pointed out the massive blunder they made underestimating the game, which is undeniable. They underestimated it in many ways.

 

[Physiognomonics]

I think Xbox is going to try to be different coming up very soon

I think Xbox may shift course and launch their next Xbox sooner than 2028 and avoid launching in the same calendar year as Sony

These are just guesses

Yep. I am betting they are releasing a new Xbox either in 2025 or 2026.

 

[Crayon]

I don't know how launching a new console generation early would help. The way cross-gen works now, and with PS5 being the lead platform, it seems pointless to rush to the next generation.

Another problem is that there will be talk about the ps6 by then. Dreamcast was coming off of a bad run for Sega. Lots of users who felt like they bet on the wrong horse. They went for the early launch when a hundred million satisfied ps1 users were talking about the PS2 and it. Trying to get the jump did not work. In fact, it backfired. The dynamics in play here are at least partly similar.

Anyone have any insight?

 

[MarkMe2525]

ESRAM. Ring a bell? It was supposed, at least according to Rich, to make all the difference for One.

<narrator>it didn't</narrator>

Don't forget about the 'data move engines', people don't remember his damage control article on XboxOne apparently. It was supposed to be closer in power to PS4 than the specs indicated.

Never forget the damage control they attempted via DF:

Digital Foundry vs. the Xbox One architects

"There's a lot of misinformation out there and a lot of people who don't get it. We're actually extremely proud of our design."

www.eurogamer.net

Narrator: people never got it.

To be fair, I just read the article in full and Rich didn't make any statements that would have suggested this. He is a journalist, his job is to ask questions and report answers. That is what he did.

He had a conference call with MS engineers, asked them questions and voiced the communities concerns, and let them respond. Almost the entirety of the article is quotations from the engineers. He didn't do much at all in validating nor dismissing anything said. This would make sense as at this point, there was no real world game data to that could be used to dispute/validate the claims.

Tdlr: these claims were made by MS engineers, not Rich.

 

[Miyazaki’s Slave]

Bosman's has a My Girl reference...guy's a genius.