Keyser Soze
Member
Guys.... what?
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EDGE 212 scores
- Thread starter flipping_heck
- Start date
Some of the examples brought up here as bias are interesting... it's as if some of you don't read the magazine at all.
Edge is targeted at multi-console owners. They are biased, but towards the Zeitgeist (sorry, but I can't think of a better / less poncy way of putting it).
The NG Sigmas were reviewed under the assumption that you bought and played the original games on Xbox/X360 (and as a multi-owner, why wouldn't you). Resistance 1&2 under the assumption that you have played the many other FPS series that these titles aped. MotorStorm: Pacific Rift under the assumption that you've played through the original. Originality is rewarded.
They're not schoolteachers marking 30 homework assignments. You can't start using the same statistical maths to evaluate them against the "buyers guide" scores from IGN/Gamespot etc. You can't take the score from Patapon 2 (5/10) and complain about it, because it is given in the context of the original game's review (8/10).
Edge is targeted at multi-console owners. They are biased, but towards the Zeitgeist (sorry, but I can't think of a better / less poncy way of putting it).
The NG Sigmas were reviewed under the assumption that you bought and played the original games on Xbox/X360 (and as a multi-owner, why wouldn't you). Resistance 1&2 under the assumption that you have played the many other FPS series that these titles aped. MotorStorm: Pacific Rift under the assumption that you've played through the original. Originality is rewarded.
They're not schoolteachers marking 30 homework assignments. You can't start using the same statistical maths to evaluate them against the "buyers guide" scores from IGN/Gamespot etc. You can't take the score from Patapon 2 (5/10) and complain about it, because it is given in the context of the original game's review (8/10).
I'm pretty sure that list is quite flawed. At first glance I noticed that Heavenly Sword and Lair are missing, so who knows what else.rpmurphy said:
If you want to flesh it out further, this link is accurate: http://www.lowbrowculture.com/edge/
Edge don't review everything - certainly there will be a lot of sports games missing, if that's what you mean.
P-value would be .071 because the test is two-tailed. I would argue Edge score deviation differences for PS3 and 360 exclusives would not be statistically significant. But anyway this is just one analysis, and I don't really want to go any deeper into something that isn't all that important.
However though, I think your understanding of what a P value means is not correct.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/P-value
Your interpretation of the p-value is completely backwards my friend....check your own link for example....
Stink said:
i think you are giving them way too much credit. its not like they have a committee that meets to discuss how each game should be judged.
i think a lot of their reviews are written by freelancers just told to do an 'edge review'.
their scores are just isolated opinion pieces by 'journalists' and might as well be random at the end of the day, trying to give them some higher meaning that you can pull out of the randomness is reaching.
rpmurphy said:P-value would be .071 because the test is two-tailed. I would argue Edge score deviation differences for PS3 and 360 exclusives would not be statistically significant. But anyway this is just one analysis, and I don't really want to go any deeper into something that isn't all that important.
However though, I think your understanding of what a P value means is not correct.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/P-value
the t-value can already have accounted for the two tailedness of the problem depending on how you have done the problem (again, I mentioned I did not do the calculation myself, so there were some assumptions made). The p-value is simply the inverse interpretation of the t statistic. The t-statistic says that there is a greater than 96% probability of Edge being not objective (null hypothesis rejected), the p-value is simply the converse, that there is a less than 4% of the null hypothesis not being rejected. Even if you multiply the probability twice to account for the two tailedness of the problem, there is still a greater than 93% chance that Edge is biased.
It in fact says so in the wikipedia link you provided, as a previous poster mentioned. It is probably worth it for you to read the article again.
Edit: It is probably worth mentioning that I have no interest in edge whatsoever (other than occasionally looking at the scores while browsing neogaf), I was simply correcting what I perceived as a mistake in the statistical analysis by rpmurphy. If I was wrong on that account as well, then I apologise.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
EDGE is a marketing concept.
The whole premise of the magazine is that they are somehow a cut-above your regular gaming publication, which may be true from a presentation and page-layout standpoint, but is otherwise a complete sham.
Contrary to the impression they give, they aren't revered or in any way considered "definitive" within the (UK) dev-scene, in fact if anything they are among the least liked and respected.
Yes, you will see Edge lying around with Develop and MCV in most studios, but that's only because (1) its a nice looking rag which adds a patina of respectability to a scene that's always struggled with its public image, and (2) because for many years it had the best jobs section of any mainstream publication.
The last thing anyone in the biz (at least in my experience) looks for in EDGE is "truth" in its dodgy fashion-driven reviews. Yes getting a high score in EDGE is considered noteworthy, but its only because its a novelty that these puffed-up poseurs condescended to think that your game is "worthy"!
Bottom-line guys: EDGE scores are only as important as you think they are. So there's no need to get riled up about them. Considering visibility and actual influence getting lauded / murdered on Eurogamer is likely to be far more impactful than anything EDGE says - their ABC's have never been spectacular - their new high at ~33k says it all.
The whole premise of the magazine is that they are somehow a cut-above your regular gaming publication, which may be true from a presentation and page-layout standpoint, but is otherwise a complete sham.
Contrary to the impression they give, they aren't revered or in any way considered "definitive" within the (UK) dev-scene, in fact if anything they are among the least liked and respected.
Yes, you will see Edge lying around with Develop and MCV in most studios, but that's only because (1) its a nice looking rag which adds a patina of respectability to a scene that's always struggled with its public image, and (2) because for many years it had the best jobs section of any mainstream publication.
The last thing anyone in the biz (at least in my experience) looks for in EDGE is "truth" in its dodgy fashion-driven reviews. Yes getting a high score in EDGE is considered noteworthy, but its only because its a novelty that these puffed-up poseurs condescended to think that your game is "worthy"!
Bottom-line guys: EDGE scores are only as important as you think they are. So there's no need to get riled up about them. Considering visibility and actual influence getting lauded / murdered on Eurogamer is likely to be far more impactful than anything EDGE says - their ABC's have never been spectacular - their new high at ~33k says it all.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Panda21 said:
Yeah I'm a dev, been working in the UK scene since '88. Not that I'm anyone special or famous - seriously- no false modesty here, I'm just a working Joe who's been around the industry for a long time and has seen his share of stuff.
I really should say that I'm sure there are people in the industry who think EDGE does represent something special, after all I can't speak for everybody. But honestly speaking in my experience, both personally and from what I've read over the years on insider forums like Chaos Engine or Filthy Truth, EDGE is treated by and large with deep cynicism.
To be absolutely fair, it could be a British thing - we generally don't welcome people who posture and act all holier-than-thou like EDGE does (like expecting the magazine title to always be capitalized... grrr), but either way I'm just calling it as I see it.
Clear said:
what the fuck are you talking about? the reason that shows like The X Factor and Strictly Come Dancing are so popular is because there's always an uppity twat like simon cowell on them. Edge is also well written and has had some great editorials from the likes of paul rose, things that a lot of people tend to enjoy. If you dont that's fine, stick to gamesmaster magazine or the official playstation mag for da real insight!
you just sound like every buttthurt sonydefenceforce.com reject who's screaming bias in the thread. all you need to do now is to perform some kind statistical analysis to infer that people with different opinions to you are "biased". it's fucking pathetic
zoukka said:
it's chock full of ads for industry jobs, which seems a bit odds with what our industry spokeman there is saying
it's a bit expensive but a lot of people including myself enjoy reading it
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
well, at least clear added some new flavour the the monthly edge thread. i've only been skimming, but outside of that it reads like the a carbon copy of the other twelve threads we get a year.
Stink said:
well i guess they don't do their jobs very well then.
people like to discard any criticism of edge by shouting sony defence force and mocking about statistics and shit like that. that isn't what i'm trying to say though.
their reviews often read like the rantings of any internet poster about a game they like or dislike. since they are written by a variety of reviewers, to try and imply any kind of bias in that is silly.
there have been a lot of reviews where they have made significant factual errors, and not just minor mistakes but things they have based their criticism of the game on. so much for editorial staff.. they also make a lot of basic spelling mistakes these days.
the failings of their editing also makes them no more relevant than the thoughts of any internet person you might choose. i'm not saying that other sites/magazines are any better, but the attitude of superiority some people have about edge is wrong.
panda21 said:
No just no. You can be proved as a troll by just posting some Edge reviews and be done with it. The level or writing is on another galaxy than your typical videogame reviews. Again that's not some incredible achievement, but it's the best stuff we have.
Most gamers judge the magazines by calculating the scores on games of their console of choice.
And what the fuck are you blabbing about the individual writers? It doesn't make any sense.
D
Deleted member 30609
Unconfirmed Member
I'll read EDGE reviews because I like to feel compelled to read more than that opening and closing comments of a review, and they are one of the few places that actually succeed in doing that on a fairly consistent basis.
If you want all your media to (inadvertently?) talk down to you, then so be it.
If you want all your media to (inadvertently?) talk down to you, then so be it.
really?panda21 said:
can you quote any passages that read like "the rantings of any internet poster" ?
a lot? Then surely you can easily list several examples.
if it is an "attitude of superiority" to declare that the numerous interesting articles and columns every month make it a more interesting read than 97% of the other outlets out there, then consider me one of the "wrong".
disclaimer edit: I note that there are other authorised magazines using the same name, but with locally written content. I'm talking about the UK magazine, maybe you're not? I don't see how you can be, personally.
Here:bobbytkc said:
Yeah the list does seem to miss a lot of games on both platforms. I wonder though if there is a better list out there, especially ones that also includes more Xbla games and timed exclusives.Stink said:
EDIT: Thanks for the url. I updated the table and numbers in my post:
teh bias is confirmed! :lol
If anyone wants to do retail/download or tiered groupings and perform analysis on them feel free. 
travisbickle
Member
EDGE is a magazine that tries to sell itself, it used to do so by writing articles that attracted developers and people interested in the development of games, now it does so by writing articles to attract people that like to posture and argue about games 24/7 (ie. you guys).
Sho_Nuff82
Member
So hey guys what happened with Crysis 2 in this issue?
singularity
Member
I'm glad the few things I wrote for EDGE didn't have a single number appended to them.
Drinky Crow
Banned
Clear said:
you carried your lumber up the hill, dude. no surprise that gaffers carry nails on their persons.
ain't nothin' wrong with edge reviews -- 4 outta 5 times, they nail a game's specific failings and strengths, and do so in a pithy fashion. their editorial space is all kinda stupid and random, by and large, but the review text is pretty much spot-on. if sony exclusives appear to get shat on, i'd look for bias in the gamers and rag reviewers that talked UP middle-of-the-road pap like the original uncharted, ratchet, and killzone 2, and NOT the words of the folks with a better-than-average educated sensibility for the medium.
whatevermort
Member
Sho_Nuff82 said:
OH MY GOD IT'S IN NEW YORK!
Omotesando
Member
I don't know Edge but that 5/10 for DA: Origins is spot on.
