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[Blame!]

Because white Canadians weren't enslaved, invaded, colonized, treated as second-class citizens, or portrayed as inhuman murderous savages for hundreds of years.

and that is capcom's fault how? does this mean every game needs to be set in a place that hasn't been oppressed?

 

[HomerSimpson-Man]

So a game can't be racist unless it flashes BLACK PEOPLE ARE BAD on the screen every so often?

Let's pack it up guys, we've got this one sorted out.

You just don't get it do you? Why don't you make the next stop a Jewish ghetto in Europe exclusively infested by Jewish Zombies where the protagonist just happens to be a German in military attire and just happens to team up with a sexy blond haired jewish girl that looks remarkably "Aryan" ? Is that so wrong?

Maybe it's because of my upbringing and details I won't divulge of having to learn of the horrible things a child finds out of their parents surviving through some of humanities's worse, that in ingrains my lost of faith regardless of skin color makes me not give a damn for something like this more than people think I should.

I said it was the closest thing I could possible agree upon. What ever you believe it's yours.

 

[Log4Girlz]

So you are telling me that racism against blacks is worse than discrimination against French speakers in Canada?

That some types of discrimination can be more okay than other types? That's it's more okay to discriminate against some people than others?

You are racist, aren't you?

Some types of discrimination are far worse than others in the eyes of the public.

 

[Chris Remo]

Why doesn't Far Cry 2 have threads that go on for pages and pages about the racism in Far Cry 2? It's not as big as Resident Evil but it's sold well over a million copies.

The problem with Canada RE edition would be that it's playing on stereotypes held by the majority of the population. That French speaking Canadians are bad people that want to take over Canada.

It's not racist to make zombies African or French Canadian, the problem is in how they're portrayed in the game.

EXACTLY.

Obviously it's not objectionable simply for black people, Africans or otherwise, to be enemies in a game. I played dozens of hours of Far Cry 2 and never once saw anything that conjured up any racially-charged imagery. It's entirely in the context.

 

[Igo]

I'm interested to know if Capcom made any attempt to differentiate between the pre and post infected.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

and that is capcom's fault how? does this mean every game needs to be set in a place that hasn't been oppressed?

It's not Capcom's fault that it's been oppressed, but if the game truly portrays uninfected Africans as being menacing and nearly the same as the infected ones, then yeah, it is their fault. Not to mention pretty light-skinned "good" African Sheva.

 

[Shouta]

How am I not supposed to be offended by that?

If you think about it a bit, then I'd say not as offended. The only reason people react to those videos so negatively is because of our history with racism. You're using your context to judge the videos. Besides, the videos aren't even negative towards black people, except maybe the Obama one but that's more to do with Obama's catchphrases than anything.

 

[benita316]

muscular, stout, black, american, human

ape

:lol

Again, what's the problem?

Race is irrelevant. If they used DK as a proxy for a muscular, stout, white dude with a tan would your panties be bunched?

 

[Atrus]

I'll try to calmly explain this to you.

-Racism exists in the world
-You're pretending it doesn't exist in some half-assed attempt to look intelligent and different

That's pretty much all there is to that bullshit philosophy.

Please show where I stated racism did not exist in the world? Like I mentioned before, you seem to be babbling like an infant here.

I stated that the 'racism' within this game is non-existent except as imported into it by racists and those guilt-driven to recoil from any issue that has to do with racial interaction. You being a case in point.

Did Resident Evil 4 promote violence against women because some Ganado's were women or that women were found butchered? Again, such a topic would only exist if you came into the game with that biased outlook.

 

[Chris Remo]

If you think about it a bit, then I'd say not as offended. The only reason people react to those videos so negatively is because of our history with racism. You're using your context to judge the videos. Besides, the videos aren't even negative towards black people, except maybe the Obama one but that's more to do with Obama's catchphrases than anything.

Well...yeah. History and context exist. They are real and pervasive factors in our perception of events and images every day, and should be taken into account.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

EXACTLY.

Obviously it's not objectionable simply for black people, Africans or otherwise, to be enemies in a game. I played dozens of hours of Far Cry 2 and never once saw anything that conjured up any racially-charged imagery. It's entirely in the context.

I don't know how many people outside of Canada are aware of such a stereotye, nor do they care.

Honestly. No offense, but I rarely...RARELY hear much of anything about Canada's issues.

 

[sonicmj1]

and that is capcom's fault how? does this mean every game needs to be set in a place that hasn't been oppressed?

No. You may not have noticed, but Far Cry 2 came and went without people bitching about racism for hundreds of posts and across blogs.

It means that if a game makes its primary antagonists a group of people who have been oppressed, they might want to tread a little more lightly than usual, lest they seem like insensitive pricks.

 

[a Master Ninja]

Have you guys seen the zombies you fight in the underground tomb? They appear to have grass skirts, spears, and tribal shields. I'm pretty sure that is what Eurogamer meant when they said:

There are even more outrageous and outdated images to be found later in the game, stuff that I was honestly surprised to see in 2009...

Watch from 2:30 on and judge for yourself.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Please show where I stated racism did not exist in the world? Like I mentioned before, you seem to be babbling like an infant here.

I stated that the 'racism' within this game is non-existent except as imported into it by racists and those guilt-driven to recoil from any issue that has to do with racial interaction. You being a case in point.

Did Resident Evil 4 promote violence against women because some Ganado's were women or that women were found butchered? Again, such a topic would only exist if you came into the game with that biased outlook.

Dude, you are totally missing the point. It has to do with the context that the game presents this with. And if Eurogamer and Chris Remo's friend Nick are to go by, then the context portrays Africans in general in a demeaning fashion that's in line with some of the oldest and most hateful stereotypes in human history.

 

[Future PhaZe]

I'm interested to know if Capcom made any attempt to differentiate between the pre and post infected.

This is unfortunately a result of the nature of the las plagas virus. At first glance there simply isn't enough there physically (until later stages of the game at least or unless they lose body parts) that really shows that they are infected.

It's part of the reason why I hope Capcom dumps this shit and gets back to good ol' American infected zombies.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Race is irrelevant.

No, it's not.

Race is irrelevant. If they used DK as a proxy for a muscular, stout, white dude with a tan would your panties be bunched?

that's pretty detached from historical truths and realities. very weak. if that's the substance of your argument, I strongly encourage you to read some books. I can recommend a few to you.

 

[sevenchaos]

You just don't get it do you? Why don't you make the next stop a Jewish ghetto in Europe exclusively infested by Jewish Zombies where the protagonist just happens to be a German in military attire and just happens to team up with a sexy blond haired jewish girl that looks remarkably "Aryan" ? Is that so wrong?

Well aren't we a little too sensitive. As a Jew the scenario you just described wouldn't bother me one bit. You know why? Not all German's supported the Nazi regime (even if they were in military attire). White doods have dark hair. Jews (we are not a fucking race) can have blonde hair.

People like to read into shit that isn't there.

 

[aeolist]

Have you guys seen the zombies you fight in the underground tomb? They appear to have grass skirts, spears, and tribal shields. I'm pretty sure that is what Eurogamer meant when they said:


Watch from 2:30 on and judge for yourself.

Oh

Oh wow

 

[aprisoner]

Gun had a terribly stereotypical portrayal of Native Americans, but not much fuss was raised.

Did you play GUN until the end? Racism played a crucial role in that game, but by the time you get the end you'll understand that it was all apart of a political statement they were trying to make.

Somehow I doubt Capcom is being that clever with RE5.

 

[Htown]

Again, what's the problem?

Race is irrelevant. If they used DK as a proxy for a muscular, stout, white dude with a tan would your panties be bunched?

The problem is that there is a history of racist imagery that depicts black people as monkey-like that does not apply to white people.

 

[Shouta]

Well...yeah. History and context exist. They are real and pervasive factors in our perception of events and images every day, and should be taken into account.

Of course. My point is that simply using our own perception without taking into account history of other places is dumb. Japan does that kind of thing to everyone and it's more about "Holy shit, they did a really cool impression of that person" than it is "Blacks r teh dumz!" or whatever.

 

[Byakuya769]

Oh

Oh wow

???????

"We killed red neck spaniards, why is killing some spear chuckers bad?"

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Have you guys seen the zombies you fight in the underground tomb? They appear to have grass skirts, spears, and tribal shields. I'm pretty sure that is what Eurogamer meant when they said:


Watch from 2:30 on and judge for yourself.

Uh. Holy shit. Unless there's some kind of in-game explanation for that (like the people deliberately dressing up as part of some kind of bizarre Plagas ritual), then that's pretty bad.

 

[Zeliard]

I think the point is that the people that inhabit that area aren't savages because they're Africans, they're savages that are African. There's a profound difference. If the game plays on a culture's general insecurity on the issue of shooting "the bad guys", who are incidentally African, then I'd say that it speaks more to one's personal insecurities, rather than anything the game directly throws at you.

But then I haven't played the retail game, obviously.

I don't think the issue is that your enemies are black, but rather the imagery that's being constantly thrown at the player. Just look at what Dan Whitehead specifically wrote, it's very telling and perfectly encapsulates the problem:

One of the first things you see in the game, seconds after taking control of Chris Redfield, is a gang of African men brutally beating something in a sack. Animal or human, it's never revealed, but these are not infected Majini. There are no red bloodshot eyes. These are ordinary Africans, who stop and stare at you menacingly as you approach. Since the Majini are not undead corpses, and are capable of driving vehicles, handling weapons and even using guns, it makes the line between the infected monsters and African civilians uncomfortably vague. Where Africans are concerned, the game seems to be suggesting, bloodthirsty savagery just comes with the territory.

Later on, there's a cut-scene of a white blonde woman being dragged off, screaming, by black men. When you attempt to rescue her, she's been turned and must be killed. If this has any relevance to the story it's not apparent in the first three chapters, and it plays so blatantly into the old clichés of the dangerous "dark continent" and the primitive lust of its inhabitants that you'd swear the game was written in the 1920s.

There are even more outrageous and outdated images to be found later in the game, stuff that I was honestly surprised to see in 2009, but Capcom has specifically asked that details of these scenes remain under wraps for now, whether for these reasons we don't know.

It's exactly what N'Gai Croal had written in that infamous article, that it plays on historic racist imagery.

 

[ultim8p00]

Racist against whom by the way? Whites or Blacks? Because I'm neither.

Rather I'm a humanist that sees your pathetic arguments to shoehorn race wherever it can applicable to be fundamentally racist and divisive. Why are you not racist? It seems to me that paying unequal attention to particular peoples based on skin color makes you by definition a racist.

Do you even know what racism means? I don't think you are even reading the replies dude.
"I'm an enlightened Humanist. Do not call me out on my bullshit" :lol

 

[elohel]

i always wondered when this stuff would resurface

i'm kind of torn on what to think based off of the demo; i understand eurogamer, obviously got to play more but

should we just think of it as people doing crazy shit? or....african people doing crazy shit?

is where i am i guess...

 

[benita316]

that's pretty detached from historical truths and realities. very weak. if that's the substance of your argument, I strongly encourage you to read some books. I can recommend a few to you.

So reading a book is going to convince me that Kimbo Slice doesn't look like an ape?

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Have you guys seen the zombies you fight in the underground tomb? They appear to have grass skirts, spears, and tribal shields. I'm pretty sure that is what Eurogamer meant when they said:


Watch from 2:30 on and judge for yourself.

JESUS CHRIST, CAPCOM. WTF were you thinking about?

kiss my ass. that's some bullshit. there are no facepalms epic enough for this.

 

[rollingstart]

Have you guys seen the zombies you fight in the underground tomb? They appear to have grass skirts, spears, and tribal shields. I'm pretty sure that is what Eurogamer meant when they said:


Watch from 2:30 on and judge for yourself.

uh...qq

 

[Dot50Cal]

Uh. Holy shit. Unless there's some kind of in-game explanation for that (like the people deliberately dressing up as part of some kind of bizarre Plagas ritual), then that's pretty bad.

Aren't there actual tribes who still stick to those types of customs though? I recall hearing about some who still deny the modern advances and live following the old traditions.

 

[News Bot]

One of the first things you see in the game, seconds after taking control of Chris Redfield, is a gang of African men brutally beating something in a sack. Animal or human, it's never revealed, but these are not infected Majini.

Uhh...yes they are.

Article is bullshit.

There are no red bloodshot eyes.

The Ganado had no red bloodshot eyes for a good while either, the eyes of the Majini and Ganado only go red at certain times.

Later on, there's a cut-scene of a white blonde woman being dragged off, screaming, by black men. When you attempt to rescue her, she's been turned and must be killed. If this has any relevance to the story it's not apparent in the first three chapters, and it plays so blatantly into the old clichés of the dangerous "dark continent" and the primitive lust of its inhabitants that you'd swear the game was written in the 1920s.

Ridiculous. Simply ridiculous. OMG WHITE GIRL GOT INFECTED BY BLACK DUDE BLATANT RACIZZMZZ

then the Spanish don't have the baggage of being stereotyped as subhuman animals for the past two hundred years.

What a weak, pathetic argument. Capcom are held responsible for this how?

Author is a hack.

 

[sonicmj1]

Of course. My point is that simply using our own perception without taking into account history of other places is dumb. Japan does that kind of thing to everyone and it's more about "Holy shit, they did a really cool impression of that person" than it is "Blacks r teh dumz!" or whatever.

Capcom has publicly said on multiple occasions that they're making games for a worldwide audience, and they have made conscious efforts to make their games more appealing to Western audience. RE5's "Type D" controls are an example of this at work.

Given that, perhaps they should try to be more aware that stuff that might fly without incident in Japan could be offensive to those in the West.

 

[RoboPlato]

Have you guys seen the zombies you fight in the underground tomb? They appear to have grass skirts, spears, and tribal shields. I'm pretty sure that is what Eurogamer meant when they said:


Watch from 2:30 on and judge for yourself.

I was on a media blackout for RE5 so I never saw this. They really, really didn't think that one through.

 

[badcrumble]

Have you guys seen the zombies you fight in the underground tomb? They appear to have grass skirts, spears, and tribal shields. I'm pretty sure that is what Eurogamer meant when they said:


Watch from 2:30 on and judge for yourself.

Oh my god. I can't believe Capcom is this dumb.

 

[Sectus]

Oh god, that article made me feel considerably less intelligent after reading it.

 

[Atrus]

I have no idea how you possibly took that from what I or Eurogamer wrote.

Maybe you should stop creating idiotic strawmen and actually pay some attention to what's being posted in the thread.

But that's the crux of the position.

Apparently Capcom can't portray Africans in a war torn region as savage, because it's 'racist'. Yet theres no problem when Jack Bauer goes to Africa and deals with some African warlords who kill children.

You would think that the Africa that currently exists today is not rife with problems, and it is one of these so-called problematic regions that sets up the scene for RE5. Instead we are led to believe by some here that Capcom is only using Blacks as novella 'savages'.

 

[gutter_trash]

I don't know how many people outside of Canada are aware of such a stereotye, nor do they care.

Honestly. No offense, but I rarely...RARELY hear much of anything about Canada's issues.

there is no issue nowadays, it's just regional... just like some States don't like other States for their regional differences and self interest.

in the past, blue-collar French Canadians were to Protestant English Canada exactly what the blue-collar Irish Catholics were to elite Protestant Americans back in the day.

emphasize... BACK IN THE DAY. We have came along way since back in the day in regards to French Canadians and Irish Americans.

America elected J.F.K as it's fist Irish Catholic President
as Canada elected several French Canadian Prime-Ministers from Quebec such as Laurier, St-Laurent and Chrétien

BUTTT
that has nothing to do with Africa.
Not African-Americans....... but Africa the continent which in historical context is a touchy part of the world where Europeans then later Cold War US vs Cold War USSR have messed around

 

[News Bot]

Oh my god. I can't believe Capcom is this dumb.

You do know there are tribes in Africa even today, right?

LOL UR BEING RACIALLY IGNORANT

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Oh my god. I can't believe Capcom is this dumb.

there's no way to defend that video.

None.

Ari Fleischer (God rest his soul), couldn't have spun this shit.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Aren't there actual tribes who still stick to those types of customs though? I recall hearing about some who still deny the modern advances and live following the old traditions.

Yeah there are some that stick to old customs, but the design of those enemies in particular is amazingly similar to racist caricatures of Africans, (especially Zulus), with wooden shields and masks and grass skirts and spears.

FFS, it looks like something from an old banned Bugs Bunny cartoon.

 

[Byakuya769]

But that's the crux of the position.

Apparently Capcom can't portray Africans in a war torn region as savage, because it's 'racist'. Yet theres no problem when Jack Bauer goes to Africa and deals with some African warlords who kill children.

You would think that the Africa that currently exists today is not rife with problems, and it is one of these so-called problematic regions that sets up the scene for RE5. Instead we are led to believe by some here that Capcom is only using Blacks as novella 'savages'.

So now you're arguing that RE5 has been unfairly singled out because it's a video game?

 

[Shouta]

Capcom has publicly said on multiple occasions that they're making games for a worldwide audience, and they have made conscious efforts to make their games more appealing to Western audience. RE5's "Type D" controls are an example of this at work.

Given that, perhaps they should try to be more aware that stuff that might fly without incident in Japan could be offensive to those in the West.

I really wasn't talking about Capcom myself, haven't stated much at all on it. I was only speaking to the videos from the Japanese variety shows that were posted.

 

[News Bot]

Yeah there are some that stick to old customs, but the design of those enemies in particular is amazingly similar to racist caricatures of Africans, (especially Zulus), with wooden shields and masks and grass skirts and spears.

FFS, it looks like something from an old banned Bugs Bunny cartoon.

Have you ever even seen a tribe before?

 

[Dot50Cal]

FFS, it looks like something from an old banned Bugs Bunny cartoon.

What? Not even remotely the same. It just looks to me like they are wearing very old tribal gear. Theres no giant lips and stupid shit like in the bugs bunny cartoons.

 

[badcrumble]

You do know there are tribes in Africa even today, right?

LOL UR BEING RACIALLY IGNORANT

Er, I'm fully aware that there are still tribes of Bushmen and other colonialism-resisting societies in Africa. Doesn't mean I think it's okay to make a game about a muscular white ubermensch gunning them all down because they're all ooga booga savages.

 

[TheCardPlayer]

Have you guys seen the zombies you fight in the underground tomb? They appear to have grass skirts, spears, and tribal shields. I'm pretty sure that is what Eurogamer meant when they said:


Watch from 2:30 on and judge for yourself.

Okay forgot everything I said in this topic before, that video was fucking retarded.

What the fuck, Capcom?

 

[templeusox]

there's no way to defend that video.

None.

Ari Fleischer (God rest his soul), couldn't have spun this shit.

Ari Fleischer isn't dead (maybe you're thinking of Tony Snow).

 

[Shouta]

Have you ever even seen a tribe before?

To be fair, I think they'd probably be wearing outdated sports apparel nowadays!

 

[Dot50Cal]

Er, I'm fully aware that there are still tribes of Bushmen and other colonialism-resisting societies in Africa. Doesn't mean I think it's okay to make a game about a muscular white ubermensch gunning them all down because they're all ooga booga savages.

So basically if the main character were black, its ok? Well, you are in luck! Sheva is playable!

 

[Dreams-Visions]

there is no issue nowadays, it's just regional... just like some States don't like other States for their regional differences and self interest.

in the past, blue-collar French Canadians were to Protestant English Canada exactly what the blue-collar Irish Catholics were to elite Protestant Americans back in the day.

emphasize... BACK IN THE DAY. We have came along way since back in the day in regards to French Canadians and Irish Americans.

America elected J.F.K as it's fist Irish Catholic President
as Canada elected several French Canadian Prime-Ministers from Quebec such as Laurier, St-Laurent and Chrétien

BUTTT
that has nothing to do with Africa.
Not African-Americans....... but Africa the continent which in historical context is a touchy part of the world where Europeans then later Cold War US vs Cold War USSR have messed around

of course.

of course, the continent was subject to the same manner of discrimination, apartheid and racism that African-Americans know so well. So there is some understanding there.