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Execution takes two hours for man to die

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NekoFever

Member
What I don't understand is why I always hear about them using a "new" drug for lethal injection. Aren't there probably dozens of absolutely proven drugs that will kill a person in seconds, and minutes at most?

OR, are we always getting these new drugs because lawyers are fighting to tell us how the current drug being used isn't "humane", so the government is forced to use a new one?

Either way, this shouldn't really be this complicated. I don't believe this guy suffered any more than a person on an operating table suffers through their heart surgery, but regardless it's silly we're still using "new" drugs at this point. I don't have much empathy for murderers.

Most of the drugs come from European pharmaceutical companies, and they've been banned from exporting their products to countries where they'll be used for executions since 2011. States are just running out of stockpiles now, which is why these stories have started happening.
 
"Antoine Lavoisier, the French chemist who lived between 1743 and 1794, was caught up in the revolution and faced beheading. He asked friends to observe closely as he would continue blinking as long as possible after being killed. He was reported to have blinked for 15 seconds after decapitation."

The guillotine sure doesn't seem like the most humane way. Something that leaves the brain alone entirely sounds a hell of a lot scarier and more cruel than a gunshot to the head.

Gunshot/firing squad, yes definitely. However, if that 15 secs thing is true with the guillotine, i sure as hell would choose 15 secs over 2 hours of agony.
 

CoolOff

Member
20041116b_8.gif


I wouldn't frame this as a republican issue since there is widespread support across party lines.

Seriously America? Well that's not getting abolished anytime soon.

Edit:

Not that I completely disagree, but your poll is more than 10 years old. Here's the most recent one I can find. Democrats are actually below 50% support now.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/165626/death-penalty-support-lowest-years.aspx
dkqiyswvluia9v-iebcmjq.png

Oh. Well then.
 
Depending on the situation, nothing to something,

I'd love to know what scenario you imagine nothing would happen to you if you just murdered someone for the sole reason that they had killed someone else.

Wouldnt the solution to this be making it harder to put people on deathrow rather getting rid of capital punishment all together.

Because when there's no death penalty, there's not just less or a chance of killing someone innocent, there's zero chance.
 

Pyccko

Member
I'm not gonna watch this, but they actually filmed an execution? Give me the details!

Yep. It's old footage. 12 seconds long, looks to be from like the very early 20th century. You don't see anything very graphic, just the blade dropping and the body flopping off to the side.

Edit: YOU LIED TO MEEEE
 

Amalthea

Banned
Ah it was not a brutal video. What is so awful about it?
That it shows somebody getting instantly killed by the sheer force of the falling blade. Maybe this illustrates well what a lowly behaviour it is that some humans don't know better than to redeem murder with more murdering.

(or whatever the executed commited. Maybe he didn't salute to his king or he sold picures of naked ankles.)
 

Amir0x

Banned
Man it's so sad to hear how many people so willing toss human compassion and empathy aside once it's someone we don't like or has done something we don't like. There's no doubt this guy is a horrible individual for what he has done. But how do we make that better for anyone by then turning around in kind and killing him?

There is no statistical data point anyone can point to that shows the death penalty works. Quite the contrary in fact, and virtually all data so far has shown that not only isn't it a deterrent, but crime is on average actually higher in countries that retain the barbaric practice.

The death penalty as it stands now exists only to satisfy the bloodlust of either the victims or the mob. And by any standard I can think of, that is the worst possible reason to keep something around, especially if that something is not working.

Not only do we need to keep people like this rather for life imprisonment rather than death, but we need to focus on a rehabilitative prison system which has massive wide-ranging benefits for society that has also been demonstrated at the statistical level through many studies. It may turn our animal instincts around a bit, maybe make some of us a little uncomfortable in the pit of our stomachs - but the benefits to society vastly outweigh any discomfort due to wanting blood.
 

Amalthea

Banned
That it doesn't works isn't even that paradoxical since a justice system that is harsh, brutal and vengeful tends to be antagonised and thus disrespected more.
 

zoukka

Member
That it shows somebody getting instantly killed by the sheer force of the falling blade. Maybe this illustrates well what a lowly behaviour it is that some humans don't know better than to redeem murder with more murdering.

(or whatever the executed commited. Maybe he didn't salute to his king or he sold picures of naked ankles.)

Yeah sure it was gross and I'm against capital punishment, but where execution styles go, this seemed more humane than the shit they do in US.
 

Liha

Banned
I'm not gonna watch this, but they actually filmed an execution? Give me the details!

Ah it was not a brutal video. What is so awful about it?
That was the last public execution in France and happend 1939.

The guillotine is barbaric for me.
 

King_Moc

Banned
I still can't get my head around the death penalty. You lose the moral high ground as soon as you use it. Just give them a life sentence. At least you can get them in on that jail slave trade thing you've got going on.

Also, why not just use cyanide or something?
 

Kayhan

Member
Hour and a half of torture before death?

I never understood why if you are going to have the death penalty you don't just put people down like you would an animal at the vet.

Or even a firing squad. That isn't going to take long to die.

This just seems barbaric and unworthy.
 
I'm fine with the death of a murderer and such, but not like this and not with this system.

Gas chamber is the way to go anyway. Nitrogen gas. Edit: or helium
 

Forsete

Gold Member
Firing squad,hanging or hypoxia (via nitrogen) are better options than lethal injection (and probably less expensive).
 

Kayhan

Member
Europeans stopped selling the old drug to the US for lethal injections because they found out it they were used for executions.

So States are trying to find ''alternative'' drugs and cocktails for lethal injections and experimenting on death row inmates.

What about the drugs Americans use for putting down pets?

Just up the dose.
 

Atrophis

Member
Nitrogen Oxide is probably the most humane way to execute someone but of course it will never be used as it gives a feeling of intense euphoria while it kills.
 

Nicktendo86

Member
Because another human needs to pull the trigger. It can really fuck with your head killing another person. That's why when they did firing squads, I think only one rifle had a bullet, and they didn't tell them who. That way they could all tell themselves it was not there gun that killed them.

I think it was the other way round, all but one shooter would have a live round and one would have a blank, that way they could all say they didn't know for sure of their shot was the fatal one.
 

Necrovex

Member
Man it's so sad to hear how many people so willing toss human compassion and empathy aside once it's someone we don't like or has done something we don't like. There's no doubt this guy is a horrible individual for what he has done. But how do we make that better for anyone by then turning around in kind and killing him?

There is no statistical data point anyone can point to that shows the death penalty works. Quite the contrary in fact, and virtually all data so far has shown that not only isn't it a deterrent, but crime is on average actually higher in countries that retain the barbaric practice.

The death penalty as it stands now exists only to satisfy the bloodlust of either the victims or the mob. And by any standard I can think of, that is the worst possible reason to keep something around, especially if that something is not working.

Not only do we need to keep people like this rather for life imprisonment rather than death, but we need to focus on a rehabilitative prison system which has massive wide-ranging benefits for society that has also been demonstrated at the statistical level through many studies. It may turn our animal instincts around a bit, maybe make some of us a little uncomfortable in the pit of our stomachs - but the benefits to society vastly outweigh any discomfort due to wanting blood.

This is an example of a brilliant post.

We gave him 2 free hours on Earth. He should be thankful. Now he's being tortured by the devil.

If this post was serious, this would be an example of a bad post.
 

danwarb

Member
Not all things should be decided by popular vote. Drop this idiocy.

The more we understand of how our minds work, the more ridiculous these harmful acts of revenge will seem. Harmful to the wrongfully convicted, harmful to the public.
 

Azulsky

Member
Seems hard to believe we let this sort of stuff happen.

Even harder to believe the court system is setup to allow 13 years of litigation post sentencing.
 

Majine

Banned
the justice system shouldn't work on an Eye-for-an-eye basis. It should always aim to rehabilitate. Just look at the norwegian model and how succesful that is.
 

KrellRell

Member
Dude shoots two people and we are supposed to be concerned about how he went out at the end?

I think not.

I don't believe torture is ever justified. It sounds like he was struggling, probably in a ridiculously unbearable way, for almost two hours.
 

JCX

Member
What I don't understand is why I always hear about them using a "new" drug for lethal injection. Aren't there probably dozens of absolutely proven drugs that will kill a person in seconds, and minutes at most?

OR, are we always getting these new drugs because lawyers are fighting to tell us how the current drug being used isn't "humane", so the government is forced to use a new one?

Either way, this shouldn't really be this complicated. I don't believe this guy suffered any more than a person on an operating table suffers through their heart surgery, but regardless it's silly we're still using "new" drugs at this point. I don't have much empathy for murderers.

Some pharma companies don't want their products to be associated with killing people. That's part of what caused some of the botched lethal injections in recent years.
 

Oersted

Member
Some pharma companies don't want their products to be associated with killing people. That's part of what caused some of the botched lethal injections in recent years.

It is quite ironic that some companies faster developed a social conscience than some states do.
 

GungHo

Single-handedly caused Exxon-Mobil to sue FOX, start World War 3
I want to preface this with that I'm not in favor of the death penalty, and I think this whole "experimental cocktail" shit is immoral as all hell, but in regards to this

"An Associated Press reporter who witnessed an Arizona murderer's execution watched him gasp and snort for more than an hour and a half before he finally took his last breath"

It may have been sleep apnea, rather than a conscious suffering. That's exactly how I sound when my sleeping pills kick in and I'm sitting upright. I'm a snorer and have apnea, and it scares the shit out of my wife at times, but I'm not conscious of having trouble breathing. I've also heard people start snoring/gasping when they're knocked out by a punch in a boxing ring.

Again, I'm not saying their whole deal isn't all kinds of fucked up and that this should never happen again... it absolutely is and it shouldn't, but those specific signs don't necessarily mean the guy was in conscious terror, despite how horrible it was for everyone watching.

Would I want them to die? Yes. Should the government kill them for me? No.
Yeah, there's a difference between desiring revenge and having the state help you out with it.

How about a heroin overdose?
This has been covered. This is pretty much what they did. It's not fast and it's not clean. The person who is being ODed may not really notice it, but the people watching sure as hell will. It depresses breathing so you get the apnea I'm discussing above, along with the other signs of heroin overdose.
 
Why not just give them a lethal dose of morphine? Or any of the bazillion other drugs that can kill you painlessly and quickly.
 

Amir0x

Banned
Why not just give them a lethal dose of morphine? Or any of the bazillion other drugs that can kill you painlessly and quickly.

what about if instead of satisfying our bloodlust, we just do away with it and focus on what works?

I mean I know practical solutions are often difficult when they don't set right with our stomachs, but the death penalty does not work in its intended function. The only remaining purpose therefore is to satisfy bloodlust.
 

ChuyMasta

Member
Wasn't an incident like this a movie subplot?

It's the first thing that came to my mind. I'm so burned out reading articles like this so often I'm starting to get indifferent towards them.
 
We gave him 2 free hours on Earth. He should be thankful. Now he's being tortured by the devil.

does anyone normal (as in not a full blown psychopath) actually enjoy the thought of a human tortured by an extremely evil supernatural being for all of eternity?

What's so barbaric about it?
As far as execution goes it's pretty quick and clean.
On top of that it's not beholden to companies selling drugs to make it work.

would you be saying the same if it was a slow motion close up where you could see the blade slice through veins and bone and meat?
 

Mael

Member
would you be saying the same if it was a slow motion close up where you could see the blade slice through veins and bone and meat?

Well any slowmo close up of any method of killing will do the same.
I mean how about a closeup of the precise point where bullets break the skins and enter the organs?
Or a closeup of all the internal organs shutting down and shriveling when they get into contact with the toxin?
As it is, decapitation is as clean as you can it to be.
Minimal hassle for everyone involved
 
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