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[Zombie James]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/laptop-ban-us-1.4119291?cmp=rss

Critics at the time said the move amounts to a thinly veiled attempt to favour U.S. carriers, who have long accused Middle Eastern based airlines such as Emirates and Etihad of unfairly subsidizing long-haul business travel flights.

The ban proposal is now set to be extended to Europe in some manner, a move that the International Air Transport Association (IATA) said would cost more than $1 billion to implement and be a logistical nightmare to adhere to for airlines.

IATA, which represents 265 airlines, says as many as 65 million people a year travel between Europe and North American on nearly 400 daily flights. Many of the passengers are business travellers who rely on their computers to work during flights.

Specifically, IATA says a laptop ban on transatlantic flights would cost $655 million US a year in loss of productive time, $216 million in travel delays at airports and $195 million in reduced well-being.

Critics of the ban note that moving dozens — if not hundreds — of laptops from inside cabins into the plane's cargo hold presents a safety threat of its own, as they contain lithium ion batteries, which have been known to catch fire.

"These alternative measures would also avoid the concentration of lithium battery-powered devices in the cargo hold of passenger aircraft which is deemed to create an additional safety threat," De Juniac wrote.

A stupid short-sighted policy having negative impact? Who would have thought?

 

[andythinkpad]

Unless you hold airline stock, why would you care.

I rather have better security, not that I flight US airlines on international flights anyway.

 

[ClosingADoor]

Unless you hold airline stock, why would you care.

I rather have better security, not that I flight US airlines on international flights anyway.

You'd care because the costs will be transferred to you, the waiting times at airports will increase and you get a broken laptop back at the end of the journey.

 

[kirblar]

We literally just got confirmation that there was actionable intelligence that led to this courtesy of Trump's loose lips.

 

[anonymous_abc]

Unless you hold airline stock, why would you care.

I rather have better security, not that I flight US airlines on international flights anyway.

This is not improving anyone safety or security...

 

[Stinkles]

Unless you hold airline stock, why would you care.

I rather have better security, not that I flight US airlines on international flights anyway.

Because you don't want to make the existing prices and pointless security theater geometrically worse?

I want to be safe, but I'm not sure the three hundred pound bad tempered lady slyly watching her iPhone at the conveyor belt is actually securing my safety.

And if they can hide it in a laptop, they can hide it in other objects.

 

[Coriolanus]

So that's not even trying to factor the potential cost of the impact on tourism that being paranoid fucks might cause. Huh.

 

[Betty]

This is not improving anyone safety or security...

Preventing terrorists from using Laptops as bombs on planes isn't preventing peoples safety?

 

[Hellsing321]

Unless you hold airline stock, why would you care.

I rather have better security, not that I flight US airlines on international flights anyway.

This Does little to increase safety. In fact pilots argue it makes flights less safe since if a laptop battery catches fire in the cargo hold then there is nothing anyone can do to stop it before it gets out of control.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

Preventing terrorists from using Laptops as bombs on planes isn't preventing peoples safety?

It is typical TSA security theater:

Critics of the ban note that moving dozens — if not hundreds — of laptops from inside cabins into the plane's cargo hold presents a safety threat of its own, as they contain lithium ion batteries, which have been known to catch fire.

 

[zulux21]

Preventing terrorists from using Laptops as bombs on planes isn't preventing peoples safety?

it will likely turn normal laptops into bombs in the cargo hold due to the batteries exploding, and such terrorist bombs would basically be just as effective in the cargo hold as they would in the cabin.... heck likely more so in regards to making a plane go down given how reinforced the cabins are anymore.

aka, all it will do is likely kill people, cost money, and waste time. it won't prevent anything.

 

[Nabbis]

Preventing terrorists from using Laptops as bombs on planes isn't preventing peoples safety?

To hell with your safety, i want my laptop. Might as well go ban cars given the amount of deaths they cause.

 

[andythinkpad]

You'd care because the costs will be transferred to you, the waiting times at airports will increase and you get a broken laptop back at the end of the journey.

Maybe it will increase the airport subcharge, I don't see how it will transfer the cost to me.

 

[andythinkpad]

This Does little to increase safety. In fact pilots argue it makes flights less safe since if a laptop battery catches fire in the cargo hold then there is nothing anyone can do to stop it before it gets out of control.

Then argue the laptop ban in ineffective angle, don't argue from the cost money angle.

I still don't agree that this ban is ineffective. However that's not this article is about.

 

[kirblar]

It is typical TSA security theater:

It's not when we now know the information that led to the ban came from an Israeli spy inside ISIS.

 

[SlimySnake]

Small price to pay live through your flight.

 

[patapuf]

Preventing terrorists from using Laptops as bombs on planes isn't preventing peoples safety?

The laptops will still be on the plane. Except they will all be in the same place.

 

[Syriel]

Unless you hold airline stock, why would you care.

I rather have better security, not that I flight US airlines on international flights anyway.

So you WANT to increase the risk of a fire in the cargo hold?

Stuff like this is what happens when you have rules made by people who don't understand what they are regulating.

Lithium batteries pack quite a bit of energy for their size.

 

[Piggus]

To hell with your safety, i want my laptop. Might as well go ban cars given the amount of deaths they cause.

I look forward to your thoughts should one of these bombs end up actually taking down a plane. This was apparently the most imminent threat in years. Hopefully they're working on better ways to detect it so nobody has to worry.

 

[wutwutwut]

I look forward to your thoughts should one of these bombs end up actually taking down a plane. This was apparently the most imminent threat in years. Hopefully they're working on better ways to detect it so nobody has to worry.

Security always involves tradeoffs.

 

[Nabbis]

I look forward to your thoughts should one of these bombs end up actually taking down a plane. This was apparently the most imminent threat in years. Hopefully they're working on better ways to detect it so nobody has to worry.

http://www.datagraver.com/case/people-killed-by-terrorism-per-year-in-western-europe-1970-2015

Tough luck.

 

[Syriel]

I look forward to your thoughts should one of these bombs end up actually taking down a plane. This was apparently the most imminent threat in years. Hopefully they're working on better ways to detect it so nobody has to worry.

1) If there is no bomb in said laptops, moving them all to the cargo hold increases the risk of catastrophic fire on the plane. This is what you are arguing for.

2) If there is a bomb in a laptop, moving it from the passenger compartment to the cargo hold doesn't eliminate the bomb. It's still on the plane. Oh and now, it's in a compressed space along with a bunch of high energy batteries. This is what you are arguing for.

If there is a real threat, then laptops should not be allowed.

Moving the thread from one part of the plane to another does not neutralize the threat. It only makes it worse.

But hey, if the security theater makes the general public feel better so they're more likely to spend $$$, go for it, right? This is what you are arguing for.

 

[zulux21]

I look forward to your thoughts should one of these bombs end up actually taking down a plane. This was apparently the most imminent threat in years. Hopefully they're working on better ways to detect it so nobody has to worry.

thoughts won't change.
this ban is still completely pointless.

Any bomb that could take down a plan from where the passengers sit could still take down the plan with ease in the cargo.

you will just have the added plus that every single laptop like device that isn't already a bomb might turn into a bomb due to the increased pressure greatly increasing the odds that a laptop will be reasonable for taking down a plane.

this move won't help safety it will greatly increase risk. it won't matter though as the people behind it will still be able to claim that it was needed when a normal laptop brings down a plane because a laptop brought down a plane.

Security always involves tradeoffs.

this isn't security. this is something pretending to be security that actually greatly increases danger.

 

[BahamutPT]

This doesn't stop possible threats going through security. Just changes where they end up on the plane.

It won't improve detection methods. It won't change the fact that a bomb can still board a plane and explode.

 

[Fewr]

Unless you hold airline stock, why would you care.

I rather have better security, not that I flight US airlines on international flights anyway.

????
Seriously? Wow

 

[Mr. Giggles]

You know i always wondered, why not just ban laptops from flights, they're just moving the laptops from one spot to another.... and if one laptop has a short and catches fire isnt the risk greater since there are a huge amount of batteries in the same location?

 

[Betty]

The laptops will still be on the plane. Except they will all be in the same place.

... then that's dumb, they could be triggered from the ground from mobiles or something.

I thought they'd be shipped separately.

 

[Lombax]

Unless you hold airline stock, why would you care.

I rather have better security, not that I flight US airlines on international flights anyway.

This improves nothing about security, and just like all TSA'ish rules its total nonsense.

edit: there is far too much truth in this.

 

[Not Spaceghost]

why don't we just remove all the hassle and force all passengers to be totally restrained during a flight!

or even better in a temporary coma!

 

[Kinyou]

why don't we just remove all the hassle and force all passengers to be totally restrained during a flight!

or even better in a temporary coma!

The B.A. Baracus airline.

 

[How About No]

So I'll still be on an exploding plane but at least my face will be pristine and identifiable~

 

[Mesoian]

American tourism to be at an all time low.

 

[Kerensky]

If the cargo bay is so dangerous, should laptops on planes be forbidden altogether?

 

[Lilalaunebaer]

Cool.

Can´t use laptops because could be bomb. Still on same plane.

 

[Fewr]

If the cargo bay is so dangerous, should laptops on planes be forbidden altogether?

So, what's the solution for business travelers and office workers in general in this scenario then?

 

[How About No]

Checkmate, TSA

 

[The Faceless Master]

they should jut ban all luggage and have people buy new shit when they land.

 

[UncleSporky]

Will this also affect the Nintendo Switch?

 

[gutter_trash]

1) If there is no bomb in said laptops, moving them all to the cargo hold increases the risk of catastrophic fire on the plane. This is what you are arguing for.

2) If there is a bomb in a laptop, moving it from the passenger compartment to the cargo hold doesn't eliminate the bomb. It's still on the plane. Oh and now, it's in a compressed space along with a bunch of high energy batteries. This is what you are arguing for.

If there is a real threat, then laptops should not be allowed.

Moving the thread from one part of the plane to another does not neutralize the threat. It only makes it worse.

But hey, if the security theater makes the general public feel better so they're more likely to spend $$$, go for it, right? This is what you are arguing for.

Protip :just leave the laptop at home if you are not using it for work

 

[wenis]

Will this also affect the Nintendo Switch?

just dont use the kickstand.

 

[Yayate]

I'm moving to America in a few months. I really hope this doesn't happen. Moving all of my stuff is already going to be enough of a clusterfuck without pointless bans.

If this were really a safety precaution, shouldn't they ban laptops altogether? I don't see how moving suspected bombs to cargo holds will make anything more safe. It'd just add an additional fire hazard.

 

[Regulus Tera]

Unless you hold airline stock, why would you care.

I rather have better security, not that I flight US airlines on international flights anyway.

These costs are gonna be passed over to the customer.

Also none of this makes flight more secure. Cost benefits analyses show that. It's nothing but posturing to make it look like something is being done when it is only inconveniencing everyone.

 

[Schattenjäger]

These costs are gonna be passed over to the customer.

Also none of this makes flight more secure. Cost benefits analyses show that. It's nothing but posturing to make it look like something is being done when it is only inconveniencing everyone.

Can you share that analysis?
I say ban laptops all together

Traveling on business?
Send your files ahead of time and use your phone to answer email

 

[Breads]

The terrists won.

 

[shira]

Unless you hold airline stock, why would you care.

I rather have better security, not that I flight US airlines on international flights anyway.

This is good news for Apple - who have been pushing iPad Pro as a laptop replacement

 

[zulux21]

This is good news for Apple - who have been pushing iPad Pro as a laptop replacement

really don't see how given ipads are considered laptops for the purposes of this ban.
so are switches if I recall right.

I think only smart phones are allowed.

 

[Coriolanus]

Protip :just leave the laptop at home if you are not using it for work

Protip: fly to some other country if you can.

 

[Desmond]

What about Vitas and 3DSes?

 

[CDX]

Well if the threat is that serious, I don't see how moving a laptop bomb to the cargo hold is safer for the flight.

If the threat is that credible and serious, personal laptops might have to be banned from planes completely.

So, what's the solution for business travelers and office workers in general in this scenario then?

I read a news article that said some Middle East airlines were getting around the laptop ban by stocking and providing, to First Class passengers only, preapproved laptops that were already on the plane and stay on the plane.

So if ALL personal laptops get banned, the airlines will probably just start providing laptops that you can rent for the flight or something.

 

[Kreed]

they should jut ban all luggage and have people buy new shit when they land.

After some of the responses in this thread I needed this laugh.