Support NeoGAF

[wolfmat]

You guys do realize that Phil isn't the only one who worked on Fez, right? I feel like a lot of you are letting your opinions of Phil cloud your judgement of the game itself. Don't want the game but not buy it because Phil said something he shouldn't have; Renaud Bedard worked his ass off to program this thing, Disasterpeace put together a soundtrack, etc.

They'll be alright. Don't worry.

Plus, Phil has apologized, and that's worth a lot. Maybe I'll buy their game now. (Great marketing ploy hurr)

I'm really just waiting for an elaboration on why modern Japanese games suck. I wasn't there, and I want to hear it.

 

[joetachi]

You guys do realize that Phil isn't the only one who worked on Fez, right? I feel like a lot of you are letting your opinions of Phil cloud your judgement of the game itself. Don't want the game but not buy it because Phil said something he shouldn't have; Renaud Bedard worked his ass off to program this thing, Disasterpeace put together a soundtrack, etc.

Witch is even worse when you become the public image of your game you should watch your mouth because you are not only making your game look bad you're making your coworkers look bas. I guess i took an event like this to bring him back down to earth and its for the better for him and his game.

 

[Clevinger]

"You'll still buy my game, right guys?"

 

[IrishNinja]

catching up, sorry for the long post.

http://mobile.twitter.com/leighalexander/status/177723684365156352

Kidding or not, wat.

wow...really, Leigh? i keep arguing you're better than this, too.

jesus christ.

ahaha, i feel like i've already seen enough of indie movie now.

Leigh really needs to not slur Kanye like that.

*GAF-hop dap*

Why gloss over the fact he was insulted first?

i tend to have higher expectations of industry professionals, but i get that the notion's subjective.

Because the baka gaijin deserved it!

worthless posts like this really only detract from the discussion, man.

I just confirmed this as real.

I will not buy Fez, as appealing as it looks to me. This kind of behavior is absolutely unacceptable. Dude can go fuck himself. He's giving me and every other indie dev out there a horrible name.

+1 to Feep, if i was in your position i'd be more offended as well.

this thread feels like a corporate boardroom full of suits and red power ties who write pc emails to each other all day and then go make racist jokes at the golf course over shrimp and white wine mulling over the cart girl rape fantasy du jour.

this is some hardcore pojection right here. i feel i learned more about this poster than i wanted to.

He's buddy-buddy with the IGF heads, and given their lack of professionalism when responding to the complaints about judges not even playing the games they are assigned, I wouldn't expect much from them.

wait, it's a known thing that they award without playing the games? really?

What disgusts me the most is that Neogafs opinion of him is based on whether or not they agree with him. If he said iPad games suck you guys would be worshipping his nuts.

more hivemind posts, that's what this thread needed.

That's all I wanted to see come out of this. It doesn't excuse anything, but it's the best you can ask for.

All's well that ends... well-ish.

glad to see this, but there's still a loss of respect that it went down, dude planted his flag on this, then dragged his nuts to make the right move. still, the right thing was eventually done.

 

[SatelliteOfLove]

A bit too late to save face in the public eye, but Goto's accepted it, and that's whats important. We can now go back to blatantly ignoring innovations and quality in Japanese games that we won't buy.

 

[revolverjgw]

Comparing him to Hitler and Chris Brown, really? .

I love this sentence and its implications

 

[TaroYamada]

Apology is definitely too late for me, I followed Fez since the beginning and he has lost all of the interest I had in Fez and any of his future work.

 

[ThoughtsOfSpeaking]

Ive only just checked out this fez game.


Lmao at this guy.


In some cultures, he would have been nursing a black eye for that level of rudeness and he would of deserved it.

 

[BruiserBear]

Can someone tell me why people are THIS upset about this guy's comment? I mean, 50 pages? Really?

 

[Cipherr]

yeah i'm glad the dude apologized too, all this extra info about Hiro was kind of making phil look like a straight cartoon villain. i mean seriously, read this shit:





This is straight after school special territory.

lol, nice description.

Can someone tell me why people are THIS upset about this guy's comment? I mean, 50 pages? Really?

50 pages of explanations. Would be better for you to read, than to reignite this. Trust me.

 

[Oppo]

I hope Goto knows Phil Fish is Canadian. I don't want him being mistaken for being American.

your reply just sucks

 

[IrishNinja]

Can someone tell me why people are THIS upset about this guy's comment? I mean, 50 pages? Really?

well, kinda like (but not on the level, granted) of the ocean marketing guy, dude kept giving and doubling-down on the stupid.

 

[Agent Unknown]

Reading Hiro's Twitter (as well as the feeds of other Japanese people that spoke with Hiro), and I really feel sorry for him even more.

Apparently he paid his own way to come to GDC for the first time so he could hear some great talks and learn new things. He studied English hardcore beforehand, and even switched his language at home to English just to practice for the conference. Then, on his first day at GDC, he works up his courage to ask Fish a question, and gets berated like that.

Anyway, the guy seems like he's really nice. The response really got to him, though. He posted at 3:00am the night of the incident saying he couldn't sleep.

Poor guy. He made all that effort and dedication only to be put down by some tactless juvenile punk looking for a quick and dirty audience soundbite. Thanks for sharing that. I'll have to read up more on him and any projects he has.

 

[jet1911]

your reply just sucks

It's as stupid as Fish's original comment...

 

[Agent Unknown]

That's all I wanted to see come out of this. It doesn't excuse anything, but it's the best you can ask for.

This. Doesn't fully exonerate him that's for sure (and OBVIOUSLY would've been much better and more believable if it was immediate instead of after several days of epically insane Charlie Sheen style "winning duh!!!!" type rants) but at least he finally sorta manned up and did the right thing.

 

[Phonomezer]

All's well that ends... well-ish.

but... but poor little brave Japanese dev...!

This whole episode was a non-event, as I have been saying all along.

The fact that poor little brave Japanese dev doesn't give a shit just makes everyone else look like idiots.

 

[Agent Unknown]

..and the backpedaling begins? I wonder if Microsoft had a word with him.

Ha. Yeah, that is some serious backpedaling. I do indeed think there is at least a possibilty that someone in MS had a quick word with him.

 

[Erethian]

but... but poor little brave Japanese dev...!

This whole episode was a non-event, as I have been saying all along.

The fact that poor little brave Japanese dev doesn't give a shit just makes everyone else look like idiots.

Having videogame industry people treat each other with a degree of respect and courtesy, especially where different cultures are involved, isn't a high bar to meet.

Fish has been at these events long enough that he should know how to conduct himself in public.

 

[Agent Unknown]

but... but poor little brave Japanese dev...!

This whole episode was a non-event, as I have been saying all along.

The fact that poor little brave Japanese dev doesn't give a shit just makes everyone else look like idiots.

Uh no. Remember the tweet where he said he was bothered and couldn't sleep? "That's OK buddy, I'm fine don't worry about it anymore" is the typical good, positive response one dude gives to show that he accepts an apology from someone who was being a jerk. Sure as heck doesn't mean there wasn't a point to the apology being given in the first place.

 

[Reveirg]

Heh, and the local press was so proud of his part in Montreal's recognition at GDC: http://technaute.cyberpresse.ca/jeu...ontrealais-polytron-grande-vedette-du-gdc.php

It's a shame. It was a gratuitous thing to say (and not quite true).

And to those defending him, you're telling me this: http://polytroncorporation.com/what-is-fez looks better than Japan's average outings?

Ehhhhhh...

 

[IrishNinja]

The fact that poor little brave Japanese dev doesn't give a shit just makes everyone else look like idiots.

what you're seeing there is class. i get that it's foreign (see what i did there?) to the DF part of this thread, though.

 

[HiroProtagonist]

but... but poor little brave Japanese dev...!

This whole episode was a non-event, as I have been saying all along.

The fact that poor little brave Japanese dev doesn't give a shit just makes everyone else look like idiots.

It's crystal clear why you found this to be a 'non-event.' Crystal fucking clear.

 

[Duffyside]

Ok, so now that this is finally over (after about another 1800 posts, give or take), can someone explain to me what was said besides "I think Japan's games suck"?

As is, this seems like the most over-reactionary thing in the history of GAF, and that sure is saying something.

 

[Phonomezer]

It's crystal clear why you found this to be a 'non-event.' Crystal fucking clear.

I would love to know.

 

[Justin]

Ok, so now that this is finally over (after about another 1800 posts, give or take), can someone explain to me what was said besides "I think Japan's games suck"?

As is, this seems like the most over-reactionary thing in the history of GAF, and that sure is saying something.

Japanese dev asks during Q&A what everyone thinks of modern Japanese games. Fish answers "They Suck" and the internet proves once again how terrible it can be.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Ok, so now that this is finally over (after about another 1800 posts, give or take), can someone explain to me what was said besides "I think Japan's games suck"?

As is, this seems like the most over-reactionary thing in the history of GAF, and that sure is saying something.

He insulted and humiliated a dev at GDC, acted like a moron on Twitter, was embroiled in a big indie games controversy, and told people online to choke on his dick because he had won an award.

 

[VeryGooster]

Now he just sounds whiny.

Should have just apologized and walked away.

Also, where the hell can I read about how he went into more than his original comment? He goes on about context. Where is the rest of his discussion?

 

[Deleted member 17706]

This thread has really taught me that a lot of people are simply unable to take context into consideration when thinking about something.

He insulted and humiliated a dev at GDC, acted like a moron on Twitter, was embroiled in a big indie games controversy, and told people online to choke on his dick because he had won an award.

Don't forget the whole controversy behind his yet-again entry to the IGF. The whole thing just smells like shit.

 

[Duffyside]

He insulted and humiliated a dev at GDC, acted like a moron on Twitter, was embroiled in a big indie games controversy, and told people online to choke on his dick because he had won an award.

How did he insult and humiliate the dev?

 

[Deleted member 17706]

How did he insult and humiliate the dev?

How is that even a question? Do you have any idea what this thread is about?

And Jesus Christ, you come in here posting, "Now this is finally over!" as if you're glad it's over, and then proceed to insult people and instigate the whole thing starting right back up.

Come the fuck on.

 

[Duffyside]

How is that even a question? Do you have any idea what this thread is about?

It's, like, 2500 pages long. So no, not really, which is why a few posts up I asked, basically, "what's this thread all about?" Because "Japanese games have sucked lately" doesn't strike me as personally insulting or humiliating.

 

[AcceptableGhost]

What an idiot.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

It's, like, 2500 pages long. So no, not really, which is why a few posts up I asked, basically, "what's this thread all about?" Because "Japanese games have sucked lately" doesn't strike me as personally insulting or humiliating.

How about you read the the first post? Is that too much to ask?

 

[cw_sasuke]

It's, like, 2500 pages long. So no, not really, which is why a few posts up I asked, basically, "what's this thread all about?" Because "Japanese games have sucked lately" doesn't strike me as personally insulting or humiliating.

How about reading the OP ?

 

[EmCeeGramr]

How did he insult and humiliate the dev?

The dude stood up (it was his first GDC and he learned English for it) praised the indie scene and got "Your games just suck" as a response to his question. People in the audience apparently were very put off and there was a lot of grumbling after the event.

Someone at the panel tweeted that he saw the guy's face when he got the reply and felt sorry for him.


Standing up in front of a crowd of your peers and being told your work sucks is degrading and unprofessional.

 

[AniHawk]

He insulted and humiliated a dev at GDC, acted like a moron on Twitter, was embroiled in a big indie games controversy, and told people online to choke on his dick because he had won an award.

yeah, but why did people get mad at him

 

[DukeTogo1300]

It's, like, 2500 pages long. So no, not really, which is why a few posts up I asked, basically, "what's this thread all about?" Because "Japanese games have sucked lately" doesn't strike me as personally insulting or humiliating.

lol

Do you want to take part in the discussion, or just sleep, or...what?

 

[Duffyside]

How about you read the the first post? Is that too much to ask?

I did. Multiple times. Maybe I should be more specific? Or not, cuz you seem like a lunatic. But just in case I'm misinterpreting your tone;

"Japanese games have sucked lately" doesn't sound insulting or humiliating. However, in the OP it is mentioned that Fish "went on from there" in what may have been an insulting way.

Anyone know what he said afterwards?

Also, how about you calm the hell down. Is that too much to ask?

 

[Kandrick]

Also his followup messages on twitter telling people to suck his cock and choke on it were pretty bad.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I did. Multiple times. Maybe I should be more specific? Or not, cuz you seem like a lunatic. But just in case I'm misinterpreting your tone;

"Japanese games have sucked lately" doesn't sound insulting or humiliating. However, in the OP it is mentioned that Fish "went on from there" in what may have been an insulting way.

Anyone know what he said afterwards?

Also, how about you calm the hell down. Is that too much to ask?

Oh well. You're hopeless.

Learn how to comprehend words and understand context. Those are useful skills in life.

 

[Justin]

Also his followup messages on twitter telling people to suck his cock and choke on it were pretty bad.

Did you see the messages people were sending him and the things being said in this thread? Seems like an equal response.

 

[Amir0x]

Duffyside takes the bullet, smh

 

[IrishNinja]

was it the hivemind-ish comment, or just your secret clout/ninjas, ami?

Spoiler

you wouldn't say if it was the latter anyway would you

 

[DukeTogo1300]

Did you see the messages people were sending him and the things being said in this thread? Seems like an equal response.

Have you ever seen established game devs, or hell, anyone tied to a product they would like to sell, respond to criticism like that? Besides, it was his own initial rude actions everyone was criticizing.

 

[Justin]

Have you ever seen established game devs, or hell, anyone tied to a product they would like to sell, respond to criticism like that? Besides, it was his own initial rude actions everyone was criticizing.

No, but I am not sure many other developers have been hung in public like Fish has. It is not a surprise that an out spoken person will um... speak out after days and days of being told he is a piece of shit and his game is shit (even though no one has played it except for the people who gave it an award).

 

[Amir0x]

was it the hivemind-ish comment, or just your secret clout/ninjas, ami?

Spoiler

you wouldn't say if it was the latter anyway would you

secret clout? I am sure that many will be happy to hear that I do not have any outsider influence on what goes on in neoGAF anymore, and that although I love GAF, enjoyed my tenure and think the moderation does a great job, I think this is for the best

Judging by past bans, it was for saying "you seem like a lunatic"

 

[Agent Unknown]

yeah, but why did people get mad at him

lol

Also from their own site, the uh, apparently ultra relaxed nature of the gameplay sounds kinda ironic when you think about it:

There are no enemies in FEZ. No bosses, no combat. In fact, no conflict of any kind. You can die, but there is no penalty for doing so. FEZ aims to create a non-threatening world rich with ambiance, a pleasant place to spend time in.

 

[xbhaskarx]

On the one hand, that was a mean thing to say, on the other hand, he's absolutely right.

 

[stupei]

Did you see the messages people were sending him and the things being said in this thread? Seems like an equal response.

It's this kind of thinking that led to him making his original comment in the first place. He's the face of his game. How many developers do you see lashing out on twitter? Just because you're a part of the indie scene, that doesn't magically make your product something you're not asking other people to pay you money for. Once you are engaging with a commercial good or service, you are a part of the business world whether you like it or not. It's like he refuses to acknowledge the basic rules of etiquette that govern how a business works -- how people behave around coworkers and peers -- because indie means working outside the rules, right? Well, no, not if you want the people around you to respect you and your work.

Whether you or he consider the reaction extreme, what all those angry people are essentially saying to him is: "I do not respect you." In return he could try to do something to show he is worthy of respect; instead he only confirms everything he's being accused of.

Well, except for those questioning the quality of his game, since most of us don't know that yet. And while one might say that the game should be able to speak for itself, that would really only be possible if he learned to shut up first.

On the one hand, that was a mean thing to say, on the other hand, he's absolutely right.

Oh good, I was hoping someone would make such a unique comment. What this thread really needs is another discussion about what people who don't generally play Japanese games think about the direction they're headed in.

 

[Instrumedley]

On the one hand, that was a mean thing to say, on the other hand, he's absolutely right.

hell yes