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[TheGreatDave]

Activision certainly won't be doing better than Harmonix if they keep trying to play catch-up by doling out some broke-ass shit that's better suited as DLC for GH3. If create-a-rocker and create-a-song (as if we haven't seen this before) is all they can come up with besides cloning Rock Band then I think that Activision has already lost the war.

Let's see what groundbreaking features are in Rock Band 2.

 

[Sharp]

Activision certainly won't be doing better than Harmonix if they keep trying to play catch-up by doling out some broke-ass shit that's better suited as DLC for GH3. If create-a-rocker and create-a-song (as if we haven't seen this before) is all they can come up with besides cloning Rock Band then Activision has already lost the war.

Really now, which game did you have in mind? Mario Paint? I mean, Spore has it, but Spore has everything and it's not the same type of feature at all, and the same is true for pretty much every case I can think of that's not a music editing program.

 

[Pre]

Really now, which game did you have in mind? Mario Paint?

Someone needs to Youtube "custom guitar hero songs."

 

[SaggyMonkey]

Activision certainly won't be doing better than Harmonix if they keep trying to play catch-up by doling out some broke-ass shit that's better suited as DLC for GH3. If create-a-rocker and create-a-song (as if we haven't seen this before) is all they can come up with besides cloning Rock Band then Activision has already lost the war.

You have this, don't you...

 

[Sharp]

Someone needs to Youtube "custom guitar hero songs."

Custom Guitar Hero songs are currently done by hacking, and in any case the exciting part would be more the music creation part. Customs as it is tend to just be rips of existing songs, not even muted when you miss a note. I'm not sure the comparison you're trying to draw. In any case, that has always been an unofficial feature and it's not really a strong argument in favor of your viewpoint.

 

[TheGreatDave]

Custom charts and custom songs are completely different. IF (and it's a big if) they can make a mode that replicates a guitar and sounds half decent it will be so much fun to play around with. If you mess with something like FL Studio there's tech out there that can emulate a guitar fairly well, but I don't know if Neversoft can do it.

 

[Pre]

You have this, don't you...

How about trying to counter the point and we'll go from there.

 

[Ridley327]

It's not exactly the same, apparently. You can do things with animations, and facial expressions. They're apparently taking inspiration from the Tiger Woods games.

Plus create a guitar is pretty awesome.

I admit that I skimmed the article, so I didn't notice that. That's actually pretty fucking cool; the attitudes you can assign to your character in Rock Band definitely do show up during your performances, but your still stuck with the general animations that they keyed in for that particular song. If GH4 can allow me to strut my stuff in the middle of a song, well....that would certainly be something.

 

[TheGreatDave]

How about trying to counter the point and we'll go from there.

The fact you don't know everything about the game kinda makes it hard for you to be doing anything but jumping to assumptions.

 

[Sharp]

How about trying to counter the point and we'll go from there.

Your point was countered, but you aren't answering it. How is a chart for Eruption (one that includes probably only Expert difficulty and one track) comparable to a completely original song designed in-game with Activision support, complete with a rating system and centralized download service, with multiple tracks and difficulty levels? SH's custom site is only a makeshift solution. Playing the songs still pretty much requires hacking, unless you have the PC version.

 

[SaggyMonkey]

The fact you don't know everything about the game kinda makes it hard for you to be doing anything but jumping to assumptions.

Right. Suddenly he's an expert by a summary from the first story on it. Could it be you're missing a COUPLE details this early?

 

[Pre]

Your point was countered, but you aren't answering it. How is a chart for Eruption (one that includes probably only Expert difficulty and one track) comparable to a completely original song designed in-game with Activision support, complete with a rating system and centralized download service, with multiple tracks and difficulty levels?

I personally don't care about creating songs or playing other people's songs, and this difference in opinion makes this discussion pointless. I think custom songs are stupid and you don't, so there's really no need to continue the argument.

 

[TheGreatDave]

I personally don't care about creating songs or playing other people's songs, and this difference in opinion makes this discussion pointless. I think custom songs are stupid and you don't, so there's really no need to continue the argument.

So Neversoft are doing nothing but playing catch up because the big new feature they added doesn't appeal to you personally.

 

[fistfulofmetal]

If Rock Band 2 has new drums similar to the GH4 ones, I'll rebuy them.

 

[Sharp]

I personally don't care about creating songs or playing other people's songs, and this difference in opinion makes this discussion pointless. I think custom songs are stupid and you don't, so there's really no need to continue the argument.

Fair enough, but it wasn't even about that, it was about your claim that it had been done before. Obviously not everyone is interested in custom songs.

 

[TheGreatDave]

If Rock Band 2 has new drums similar to the GH4 ones, I'll rebuy them.

If Rock Band 2 is backwards compatible with existing Rock Band DLC, it can't have drums like that.

 

[Tiduz]

Yeah after seeing gh4, im definately getting it day 1 and skipping on rockband, if rockband 2 comes out closely to the USA date at a good price ill get that instead of Rockband1. How they are handling that in Europe is just really really wrong and im not taking it.

 

[Pre]

Fair enough, but it wasn't even about that, it was about your claim that it had been done before. Obviously not everyone is interested in custom songs.

I'm sorry that I was jumping to conclusions, it was just that custom songs didn't really grab me when I read it. I'm more concerned with the core game, which I have no reason to believe will be any better than what we've seen in the past. I stand my earlier claim that this would do better as DLC.

 

[fistfulofmetal]

If Rock Band 2 is backwards compatible with existing Rock Band DLC, it can't have drums like that.

Yes it can, have you not seen the drum mod that was on youtube? It has real cymbals and drums. Just had repeated colors.

 

[TheGreatDave]

I'm sorry that I was jumping to conclusions, it was just that custom songs didn't really grab me when I read it. I'm more concerned with the core game, which I have no reason to believe will be any better than what we've seen in the past. I stand my earlier claim that this would do better as DLC.

And entire drum and singing mode delivered via DLC? Or just the character creation stuff?

Yes it can, have you not seen the drum mod that was on youtube? It has real cymbals and drums. Just had repeated colors.

The way the GH set is made, it has 3 main pads, then two cymbals. I guess you could just use one of those cymbals as the fourth pad, but wouldn't that be awkward for songs that were designed to be played on the current 4 level pad set up?

 

[verio]

Well, saw GH4 scans.

I'm not as bothered by the fact that it has multiple instruments.

If Rock Band didn't happen, that would be SO AWESOME. GAF would shit itself.

But they're just blatantly copying Rock Band now. They should try and make their own path.

I see no issue in them copying Rock Band. Rock Band is a great game. I, myself, don't have much interest in a "regular" Guitar Hero game. However, that's changed with the announcement of GH4. Still, the art style is still a little over the top.

GH4 is now a day one purchase for me.

 

[Pre]

And entire drum and singing mode delivered via DLC? Or just the character creation stuff?

The creation stuff. After this, it wouldn't hurt if they just started delivering the games digitally as they should be doing with GH Aerosmith.

 

[TheGreatDave]

The creation stuff. After this, it wouldn't hurt if they just started delivering the games digitally as they should be doing with GH Aerosmith.

This would be a hell of a thing to deliver through DLC. Most people ignore downloadable content anyway, especially if it's paid for stuff.

Most people still want discs.

 

[Sharp]

I'm sorry that I was jumping to conclusions, it was just that custom songs didn't really grab me when I read it. I'm more concerned with the core game, which I have no reason to believe will be any better than what we've seen in the past. I stand my earlier claim that this would do better as DLC.

Recall that on two of the platforms on which it sells best, there is no good way of pushing out DLC to consumers. And I doubt that most GH owners would be willing to purchase songs with the same fervor that those of Rock Band do, because of the nature of the game.

And yeah, Aerosmith is a travesty. But that's neither here nor there (thank God).

 

[fistfulofmetal]

The way the GH set is made, it has 3 main pads, then two cymbals. I guess you could just use one of those cymbals as the fourth pad, but wouldn't that be awkward for songs that were designed to be played on the current 4 level pad set up?

I didn't say exactly like the GH4 drums. Just like it. As in, cymbal pads in the correct position. I'm sure they can figure out how to make it work with old RB songs.

 

[TheGreatDave]

And yeah, Aerosmith is a travesty. But that's neither here nor there (thank God).

|

I didn't say exactly like the GH4 drums. Just like it. As in, cymbal pads in the correct position. I'm sure they can figure out how to make it work with old RB songs.

Fair enough.

 

[Pre]

This would be a hell of a thing to deliver through DLC. Most people ignore downloadable content anyway, especially if it's paid for stuff.

Most people still want discs.

I like discs too, but for something like Guitar Hero DLC seems like a better delivery mechanism because it's already basically a disc full of songs to play being pushed out annually. Of course, HDD space is only adequate on the PS3 for that kind of thing.

Maybe it's a ways off, but I'd like to see the franchise go digital in the future.

 

[rollingstart]

Is the drum kit just an early version or final? I really hope that isnt what it ends up looking like (I like the placement and all that, but it looks bad.)

and you can really see how Rock Band influenced GH4.

 

[TheGreatDave]

I like discs too, but for something like Guitar Hero DLC seems like a better delivery mechanism because it's already basically a disc full of songs to play being pushed out annually. Of course, HDD space is only adequate on the PS3 for that kind of thing.

Maybe it's a ways off, but I'd like to see the franchise go digital in the future.

If it's digital only you can't easily add new features. I'm not somebody that sees these games as "party games" (though I like playing them with friends) and nothing more. I like new features, new content, new challenges, etc. And no game has ever delivered as much via DLC as I'd expect a sequel to do.

 

[Tiduz]

The creation stuff. After this, it wouldn't hurt if they just started delivering the games digitally as they should be doing with GH Aerosmith.

yeah sure, because alot of euro people with ps3's have credit cards and all the nagging i and others are doing for psn cards doesnt count.

OH, wait....

 

[Pre]

If it's digital only you can't easily add new features. I'm not somebody that sees these games as "party games" (though I like playing them with friends) and nothing more. I like new features, new content, new challenges, etc. And no game has ever delivered as much via DLC as I'd expect a sequel to do.

If Activision can innovate and really change things up every year, then I'm okay with having a disc release every year, such as with GH4 because of the new peripherals. It's if they revert back to the "new songs only" approach that'll keep me wondering why they just don't go digital.

 

[BobFromPikeCreek]

You know, I think they kind of have to support Rock Band drums. There are already a ton of people out there, and they're not going to buy a second kit just to play a different game. They'll wait for RB2 if they can't use their drums in GH4.

That said, if RB drums work in GH4 I will gladly buy it.

 

[TheGreatDave]

I just can't imagine Activision letting it happen, even when it is in their best interests.

 

[Coop]

If there was one thing they should have copied off RB it should have been how to activate SP. How are you going to keep your combo on fast songs?

edit: maybe for good drummers it's possible but for shitty drummers like me it's not.

 

[TheGreatDave]

If there was one thing they should have copied off RB it should have been how to activate SP. How are you going to keep your combo on fast songs?

edit: maybe for good drummers it's possible but for shitty drummers like me it's not.

Well, at least you can use star power whenever you like. In terms of using it to rescue yourself its a better design.

 

[CharminUltra]

Uncharted 2! Hope it makes it out by the end of the year

 

[Chris R]

Damn you Activision. I hate your product, but I might have to buy it just for the fucking Eagles.

 

[firehawk12]

Are people really going to buy a second set of drums for GH4?
I guess Activision has nothing to worry about when they lock out other peripherals.

 

[daegan]

Really now, which game did you have in mind? Mario Paint? I mean, Spore has it, but Spore has everything and it's not the same type of feature at all, and the same is true for pretty much every case I can think of that's not a music editing program.

Remember this game?

...What's that? No? What about Dance Factory?

I agree that it'll be interesting if it's like Fruity Loops.

 

[TurtleSnatcher]

You all have no idea.

GH4 will be awesome. This article doesnt do it justice.

 

[Sharp]

Remember this game?
http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/danime_network/goo_goo_soundy_web_a.jpg[IMG]

...What's that? No? What about Dance Factory?

I agree that it'll be interesting if it's like Fruity Loops.[/QUOTE]
You're right, I hadn't! There are a ton of games out there. Did that have the song sharing and online features, though?

 

[JonathanEx]

I don't think adding instruments is a good idea for Guitar Hero. The last thing we need is 2 pretty identical products on the market: Guitar Hero's focus on the guitar with song choices, game structure and note charts is the thing that makes it different from Rock Band: it's aimed at a much more competitive audience, and to use a stereotype, the ScoreHero audience.

However, by introducing other instruments, you're having to be more careful about song selection, there's also a worry about notechart quality, will it 'dumb down' a bit like Rock Band for more accessibility?
Or, if you keep the Guitar the main focus and chose songs around that, you end up with a game which has singing and drums tacked on for the sake of a bullet point on a spec list, with them feeling really out of place.


I do like the Create a Create a Mode direction they're taking though, especially create a song, if done well that could be a really really good feature.

But a last point: every recent corporate move from Activision shows a very selfish, self-centered company, with Guitar Hero peripherals in the past being a part of it. I'm not going to buy a second drum kit or more GH guitars, or a Guitar Hero Microphone (because you know Activision are bastards enough to actually make you have to use their microphone).

 

[fresquito]

I don't think adding instruments is a good idea for Guitar Hero. The last thing we need is 2 pretty identical products on the market: Guitar Hero's focus on the guitar with song choices, game structure and note charts is the thing that makes it different from Rock Band: it's aimed at a much more competitive audience, and to use a stereotype, the ScoreHero audience.

However, by introducing other instruments, you're having to be more careful about song selection, there's also a worry about notechart quality, will it 'dumb down' a bit like Rock Band for more accessibility?
Or, if you keep the Guitar the main focus and chose songs around that, you end up with a game which has singing and drums tacked on for the sake of a bullet point on a spec list, with them feeling really out of place.


I do like the Create a Create a Mode direction they're taking though, especially create a song, if done well that could be a really really good feature.

But a last point: every recent corporate move from Activision shows a very selfish, self-centered company, with Guitar Hero peripherals in the past being a part of it. I'm not going to buy a second drum kit or more GH guitars, or a Guitar Hero Microphone (because you know Activision are bastards enough to actually make you have to use their microphone).

There're two things you're forgetting here: Wii owners and European gamers. If you happen to be an European Wii gamer, then believe me, this is the greatest news one could have after the debacle that Rock Band is for someone like me.

Besides, you're implying that by adding more instruments GH will be dumbed down, which is not in any way bound to happen just because more instruments were added. I've read the GI article, and it clearly says bass and drums will be more demanding to play this time. For reference for once there will be a bass career mode, which somehow implies it won't be as dumbed down as you might think.

One the other side, you could have a much more competitive band experience as opposed to a more laid down experience. All in all, you could have two very different products, although they may seem identical. This is just guessing work, we won't know until we see more.

And well, after reading the article, I can't get any more excited. I can understand American and PS3/360 users don't caring that much, but this is some awesome news.

 

[JonathanEx]

I'm European and a Wii owner. The better Wii/PS2 versions point is obviously a good thing, you're right, I did miss that. But don't expect the full band GH4 to be lovely and cheap.

On the dumbed down note, that's something that could happen if it goes for a more co-operative tone, but the real worry is that it becomes dumbed down in terms of song choices, as they have to fit all instruments, but I wouldn't put it past Neversoft to artificially inflate the difficulty of the note tracks. However, if they still go for hard guitar tracks as the primary focus, you might end up with drum/bass/vocal sections that aren't that fun, making those bits seem tacked on. It's all 'potential' and 'worries' at this point, but I do think they are quite real concerns.

 

[Mr. Pointy]

Prince of Persia (PS3, 360, PC)
- Inon Zur is the composer

Is he collaborating with Stuart Chatwood again? Dude is the bomb.

Fuck, I want Ubisoft to reform The Tea Party, but that ain't gonna happen.

 

[WickedLaharl]

Maybe people dont want vehicles as the innovation...or is this hard to understand. Just cause its different doesnt mean its better

just because it's different doesn't mean it's bad either. works both ways!

 

[Truant]

Anything interesting in the Fallout 3 preview?

 

[Zzoram]

So are the Wii/PS2 versions of GH4 confirmed to be feature complete? Why is everyone so sure the EU version of GH4 won't cost the same as RB?

 

[SolidSnakex]

Anything interesting in the Fallout 3 preview?

It's more of an interview than a preview, but this is what they say.

- They'll handle the ending as a dynamic cutscene that changes depending on specific decisions you make. Right now there are over 500 variations of the cutscene.

- You can talk to Dogmeat although he only barks and wags his tail. But they say you always tell if he agrees or disagrees with you.

- There are no guilds like in Oblivion. You just go around doing different quests for various groups.

- The world is entirely open from the start although certain areas can be difficult at the start.

- There will be licensed music from the 40's and 50's. Songs and artists include Ink Spots"I Don't Want to Set the World on Fire", Bob Crosby's "Way Back Home", and Roy Brown's "Butcher Pete".

- There are no vehicles.

- The game has gotten bigger since the initial announcement. They've had to remove some features but they say they weren't anything they'd officially announced.

- GI asked if there will be downloadable dog armor and they say that they've been making that joke around the studio. They say they doubt it'll be in there and that they really aren't even thinking of any downloadable content until the game is complete.

 

[TheGreatDave]

I don't think adding instruments is a good idea for Guitar Hero. The last thing we need is 2 pretty identical products on the market: Guitar Hero's focus on the guitar with song choices, game structure and note charts is the thing that makes it different from Rock Band: it's aimed at a much more competitive audience, and to use a stereotype, the ScoreHero audience.

However, by introducing other instruments, you're having to be more careful about song selection, there's also a worry about notechart quality, will it 'dumb down' a bit like Rock Band for more accessibility?
Or, if you keep the Guitar the main focus and chose songs around that, you end up with a game which has singing and drums tacked on for the sake of a bullet point on a spec list, with them feeling really out of place.


I do like the Create a Create a Mode direction they're taking though, especially create a song, if done well that could be a really really good feature.

But a last point: every recent corporate move from Activision shows a very selfish, self-centered company, with Guitar Hero peripherals in the past being a part of it. I'm not going to buy a second drum kit or more GH guitars, or a Guitar Hero Microphone (because you know Activision are bastards enough to actually make you have to use their microphone).

Neversoft have already dumbed down their charts. Go look at the Muse pack DLC, or the Dream On single. They're basically making GH:2 charts now