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[Koren]

As long as my hands remain symmetrical I'm always going to prefer the symmetrical layout. I can adjust easily enough, but I'd rather not settle.

Mostly feeling the same, I value thumbs symmetry (and in upper position) the most.

The main reason I still enjoy PS layout is not games using dual analog (I also don't like dual analog for FPS that uses both sticks, but there's other games with dual analog, like Katamari or Unison... those would probably be better on U pro) but for games using D-pad + buttons.

And there's still a LOT of games I enjoy that doesn't use either sticks for input. Like most puzzle games, many RPGs, etc.

And growing up primarily playing Nintendo consoles, the different placement of letters for the face buttons never fails to fuck with me when I use PC/Xbox controllers.

Colors, too (there's at least FIVE different colors sets for a diamond-shape set of ABXY buttons... Nintendo (SNES), Sega (DC), SNK (Neo-Geo CD), Bandai/Apple (Pippin), and Microsoft/Google are ALL differents arrangements for the same four colors!)

 

[sankt-Antonio]

This was a quick photoshop job, but I'm pretty sure this would be my ideal controller. Honestly though, I can use either. It's not a huge deal to me.

From a design standpoint... this and all the asymmetrical controllers look like shit.

 

[petran79]

The argument against symmetry actually often cites keyboard and mouse as the ultimate asymmetrical input. You don't even have analogue movement control.

Arcade sticks are also better for arcade games, especially for fighters, due to larger buttons that are pressure sensitive. Fighters on a pad are a chore that ends with blisters.

 

[-griffy-]

Anyway, symmetry doesn't matter as long as the ergonomics are comfortable.

This is my feeling. Dual Shock 3 felt bad because its ergonomics were completely outdated. Dual Shock 4 feels great because it has modern ergonomic standards.

 

[Baleoce]

I'm a huge Wii U Pro controller convert so much so that it's also my main PC controller now. The stick symmetry at the top suits me the best. Just feels right. I think hopping between that and the eventually released steam controller will be a perfect combo. Can't really comment on the steam controller, but hopefully it lives up to expectations, and thankfully the haptic pad placement is in line with my preference.

 

[Koren]

From a design standpoint... this and all the asymmetrical controllers look like shit.

That's an interesting point.

As a gamer, I'm like "as if I cared". I would never trade confort and usability for design.

But for a hardware maker, I'm curious whether going design over more practical choices could be actually a good choice from a business point of view.


And for all the hate the N64 pad received (there's many things that can indeed be improved, and definitively stupid choices in games), I still like how both D-pad and stick are in "natural" position for the thumb...

 

[daman824]

Left stick should be up top. I could care less about symmetry as long as the left stick is up top.

 

[Ray Wonder]

I prefer the xbox controller's layout by far, but it doesn't take me long to forget that I'm using a symmetrical controller when I do use one.

 

[dock]

If Microsoft moved down the left analog, the controller wouldn't feel right. Nintendo went back and forth on symmetry, without each attempt working just fine.

Sorry, I'm unsure what you mean.
Do you think that Nintendo games are unaffected by stick placement, but Xbox games are?

 

[dock]

Games like Katamari and Robot Alchemic Drive rely heavily on 'tank controls', which feel pretty strange on an asymmetrical controller.

I'd love to see more games playing with these mirrored stick controls, but the prominence of xbox controllers on the desks of PC developers discourages this area of exploration.

 

[Khrno]

DualShock and Wii U Pro-Controller for me.

My only problem about the Pro-Controller is the size of the face buttons, they are a little bit too small and bumpy, I'm used to playing button mashing games (Dynasty Warriors) on DualShocks, so playing Hyrule Warriors has been hurting my thumb a little bit with so much Ysing.

 

[Doominated]

Asymmetric concave sticks

Fuck you if you want anything else

 

[Oppo]

nm

 

[see5harp]

No, and it probably doesn't matter to the large majority of people.

 

[ExoSoul]

Symmetry for life, specially for people with OCD.

Spoiler

like me

 

[emb]

I think I slightly prefer asymmetry, but it really isn't a big deal.

The real issue is the fact that we've settled into a standard where the gate on an analog stick is rounded instead of octagonal. I hate that.

 

[TimeEffect]

My man, the future will have swappable controls: Pull out the Dpad and analog stick and swap them wherever you want!

 

[Gravy Boat]

I've been playing Playstation since the PS1 and didn't own a N64 or Game Cube growing up (I do now) so I'm more used to the symmetrical sticks. It also makes more sense to me, since my hands are symmetrical.

Saying that I can use either because I'm not stubborn and don't mind having to move my thumb half an inch to play a game. It really annoyed me during all Xbone meltdown last year when I remember saying they were sticking with Xbox just because of the stick layout. I remember one specific guy on another site I frequent arguing 'I'm going to be using the console for a long time so as a hardcore game this is important to me'. I hate the term 'hardcore', but surely someone who is 'hardcore' can adapt to many controller layouts.

/annoyance

 

[TimeEffect]

This was a quick photoshop job, but I'm pretty sure this would be my ideal controller. Honestly though, I can use either. It's not a huge deal to me.

Do the Xbox!

 

[New002]

My personal preference is as follows:

Asymmetrical (Xbox) > Symmetrical - Top (Wii U) > Symmetrical - Bottom (PS)

But at the end of the day I'll use whatever and it'll take two seconds to adjust.

 

[hoserx]

Why do all gamepads (that use letters) use A,B, X, and Y? Why not Q R S T? or something else?

 

[Gravy Boat]

Why do all gamepads (that use letters) use A,B, X, and Y? Why not Q R S T? or something else?

It used to be ABC, XYZ on the Sega Saturn controllers (maybe other, I don't know) which I'm guessing is just because the first 3 and last 3 letters of the alphabet were easier to remember or something? Not sure why MS dropped the Z on the Xbox controllers.

 

[AkimbO_Arcana]

I don't give jack shit where the left stick is located. What's important is that the dpad-face buttons layout is symetrical.

I want to enjoy my 2D games like a human being.

 

[nullpoynter]

Personally, I don't care I can play with both, it doesn't matter so much.

This ^

 

[sixteen-bit]

No, everyone has their preferences.

 

[RowdyReverb]

It will never standardize. Personally, I don't think it matters that much anyway. Once you get used to a controller, you forget about where your thumbs need to go. DS3 vs DS4 thumb position comfort goes to show that it's more about the shape of the handles than the placement of the sticks anyway.

 

[Alo81]

As long as the WiiU layout doesn't come standard I don't really care.

Claw gamer 4 lyfe.

 

[AkimbO_Arcana]

As long as the WiiU layout doesn't come standard I don't really care.

Claw gamer 4 lyfe.

Please make a video of you mashing B during a QTE...

 

[Woffls]

Xbone controller with face buttons and RS switched, the WiiU Pro's dpad, and 360's bumpers would be perfect as far as I'm concerned.

BAXY and the colours should be standardised, but stick positions aren't really a big deal.

 

[SatelliteOfLove]

As long as the WiiU layout doesn't come standard I don't really care.

Claw gamer 4 lyfe.

OH man, my hand is aching just looking at this...

 

[Sorta Maximus]

Besides Frankenstein Controllers I like DS4 > XBO Controller > Wii U Gamepad > Wii U Pro. The DS4 seems close to perfect to me, XBO is good but the sticks are on higher stilts and I prefer the DS4 Triggers more, the Gamepad has easier to reach shoulder buttons due to its size vs the Wii U Pro, but all Wii U controller sticks are a bit high for my thumbs.

 

[Azriell]

This was a quick photoshop job, but I'm pretty sure this would be my ideal controller. Honestly though, I can use either. It's not a huge deal to me.

This is my wet dream. Given how much fervor there was last year from 360 fans jumping ship to PS4, I'm really surprised Sony never released an alternative asymmetrical for the converts, even if it isn't a pack-in or the controller shown in official documentation (manuals, loading screens, etc). It isn't like it would hurt the brand or image to offer an alternative design.

 

[kunonabi]

I really don't care one way or the other. Neither is better or worse to me. As long as the sticks aren't stupidly close together like most of the Playstation pads I'm good.

 

[Dr_LucienSanchez]

Moving over from the 360 to the ps4, I thought the stick placement would be really bothersome. Turns out it's just fine and I really like using the dualshock 4.

So I'm really OK with whatever stick placement, I guess. There will never be consensus over it.

 

[BRocknRolla]

This is going to end well.

Anyway, symmetry doesn't matter as long as the ergonomics are comfortable.

You're probably right about this thread...

But you hit the nail on the head. SYMMETRY DOES NOT MATTER. Ergonomics do. Neither symmetry or asymmetry in and of itself has better ergonomics, and as such, it is ultimately an irrelevant factor in what makes a good controller. And there's no proper logic to either set-up. It's an invented layout for an invented input for a virtual interaction. Your brain would have to make sense of either, and the stick difference doesn't make either easier or harder to use or comprehend.

 

[Alo81]

Please make a video of you mashing B during a QTE...

Nobody does QTE with their thumb anyway...do they? It's so slow!

OH man, my hand is aching just looking at this...

Don't knock it til you try it! It makes sprinting in Dark Souls while still having camera control much easier, and in FPS games allows you to switch weapons, reload, melee, whatever, without having to take your hand off the stick.

 

[jblank83]

It used to be ABC, XYZ on the Sega Saturn controllers (maybe other, I don't know) which I'm guessing is just because the first 3 and last 3 letters of the alphabet were easier to remember or something? Not sure why MS dropped the Z on the Xbox controllers.

Well, NES was A-B. Then the next generation (16 bit) added more letters. SNES used a diamond layout of A-B, X-Y, with L and R for shoulder, while Genesis had a single curved row with ABC (and eventually two curved rows, not diamond shaped, adding XYZ on the 6 button fighting game pad). The SNES layout stuck and Sega's layout did not (except for the Saturn). So ensuing generations, even the Dreamcast, adopted the diamond pattern with A-B, X-Y, and L/R. The lineage is made more clear as companies even adopted the SNES JPN/EU color scheme for the buttons (yellow, green, blue, red).

Except Sony, which copied the SNES layout but used geometric symbols for button labels, to confuse everyone or something.

 

[apieceofstrange]

I guess I have a slight preference for the asymmetric style since xbox and PC have been my primary game platforms over the last decade, but I am able to play on all 3 current consoles without any issues. Controller type would be pretty low on my list of deciding which platform to play on.

 

[AkimbO_Arcana]

Nobody does QTE with their thumb anyway...do they? It's so slow

No one is doing them by moving the finger up and down I hope. Flex your arm and let the trembling of your arm muscle do the rest. Thumb is the best option this way since it's stronger than the index finger.

 

[Nvzman]

This was a quick photoshop job, but I'm pretty sure this would be my ideal controller. Honestly though, I can use either. It's not a huge deal to me.

Any controller with a dpad position like that makes me feel sick. I like the 360 controller but dpads like that are fucking awful. Symmetrical FTW.

 

[DJ Lushious]

I think the Xbox's asymmetrical design works much better for your hand and thumb's natural resting place. I do find my wrists hurting after time with Dual Shocks, but never with the Xbox family.

 

[RodanCeros]

Well, NES was A-B. Then the next generation (16 bit) added more letters. SNES used a diamond layout of A-B, X-Y, with L and R for shoulder, while Genesis had a single curved row with ABC (and eventually two curved rows, not diamond shaped, adding XYZ on the 6 button fighting game pad). The SNES layout stuck and Sega's layout did not (except for the Saturn). So ensuing generations, even the Dreamcast, adopted the diamond pattern with A-B, X-Y, and L/R. The lineage is made more clear as companies even adopted the SNES JPN/EU color scheme for the buttons (yellow, green, blue, red).

Except Sony, which made-up silly symbols, to confuse everyone or something.

To add to the confusion, I recall reading in an old OXM that the original Xbox used A and B placement to coincide with racing games (A and B= Accelerate and Brake), hence coloring them green and red (Green and Red= Go and Stop). Not that you drive around staring at your controller, but the iconography does make sense...

 

[thechristoph]

I can adjust from game to game quite easily I never lose my place on different controllers. They all have their upsides, and I can't even say if I have a preference.

Though, for some reason, it was difficult to adjust to using the Wii U Pro on PC. I tried playing Skyrim with that and it was difficult to find a good button layout. I played a lot with the 360 pad and a fair bit with the DS4 with no issues on each.

 

[DrROBschiz]

This is going to end well.

Anyway, symmetry doesn't matter as long as the ergonomics are comfortable.

This

The core point is having the sticks far enough apart to be comfortable

DualShock3 was awful for precision dual stick control because of this. Thankfully DS4 gives our thumbs that much needed separation

 

[Jaxx]

I bought an Xbox One yesterday.

Sticks aside, who thought RB + LB were a good idea. I literally have to strain myself to press them.

DS4 is still probably my favourite controller this generation. Still think I'll stick with my 360 controller on PC.

If you're straining yourself to hit the bumpers, you're failing to use them as designed. They're made to hit with the same finger that's resting on the trigger below it without ever needing to pull that finger off the trigger. You use the inside of your trigger finger to hit the outside of the bumper. It's that design decision that makes me prefer playing shooters on Xbox consoles over Sony. I prefer asymmetrical sticks, but I'm capable of adjusting to anything. What I have a hard time dealing with is the lousy battery life on the DS4 and Wii U Gamepad.

 

[loaf of bread]

Asymmetrical is best for shooters, symmetrical is best for everything else.

 

[DrROBschiz]

Asymmetrical is best for shooters, symmetrical is best for everything else.

Another solid post

Ive found this to be the case for me as well though using the DS4 with Destiny has been really comfortable.

They found a really nice balance with the DS4.

 

[thechristoph]

Well, NES was A-B. Then the next generation (16 bit) added more letters. SNES used a diamond layout of A-B, X-Y, with L and R for shoulder, while Genesis had a single curved row with ABC (and eventually two curved rows, not diamond shaped, adding XYZ on the 6 button fighting game pad). The SNES layout stuck and Sega's layout did not (except for the Saturn). So ensuing generations, even the Dreamcast, adopted the diamond pattern with A-B, X-Y, and L/R. The lineage is made more clear as companies even adopted the SNES JPN/EU color scheme for the buttons (yellow, green, blue, red).

Except Sony, which copied the SNES layout but used geometric symbols for button labels, to confuse everyone or something.

To add to the confusion, I recall reading in an old OXM that the original Xbox used A and B placement to coincide with racing games (A and B= Accelerate and Brake), hence coloring them green and red (Green and Red= Go and Stop). Not that you drive around staring at your controller, but the iconography does make sense...

But why did the SNES have X and Y instead of Y and Z? I think it had to do with the X and Y axes, but I've never read that anywhere.

I don't buy that bit about the accelerator and the brake, because the accelerator pedal is on the right. The Xbox controller has the A button on the left and B on the right; opposite of the NES. I guess this all goes out the window when considering regions where you drive on the left...

Another thing I didn't get about the Xbox controller, and this is about the dumbest comment ever...but shouldn't the X button be green? Their logo is a big green X. Makes sense to me.

 

[protomouse]

The Wii U gamepad / pro controller symmetric placement is the best IMO.
Closely after that, the asymmetric 360/One/Ouya layout.
At the far bottom is the DualShock and Wii Classic Controller symmetric layouts (especially DS1, DS2 and DS3 where the sticks are too close together and the controller itself is too small - very uncomfortable).

 

[CDX]

I like WiiU's upper symmetry the best, much more compared to Sony's lower symmetry.