Support NeoGAF

[rollingstart]

other than Vader's "no" scene, there aren't really any worthwhile changes from the previous editions.

That Vader scene is really bad, but as a whole, if you've accepted the (dumb) changes from the 2004, there's nothing to get worked up about.

At least Empire is largely untouched. Star Wars has new rocks and Ben's new yell, so no big deal. It's weird how the few good scenes from Return of the Jedi have been vandalized. It's like they're trying to make them as bad as the rest of that movie.

probably won't ever happen, but yeah, a blade runner-style collection with originals would be best.

 

[Medalion]

George got around to seeing The People vs George Lucas documentary and this is his response

 

[mrklaw]

We're in a thread mainly discussing the blu-ray versions, so yes, somewhat.

It's still better than the pan-and-scan versions, which is what I thought the post I was quoting was talking about with the lack of widescreen.

Aren't they all 2.35:1? So on a non-anamorphic DVD that'll be something like 640x240. Blow that up full screen and it'll look pretty bad. I'm not even sure my TV still has a zoom button, I guess it must have.

I'm tempted but put off by the resolution. And having just struggled through watching the SEs with my kids, I think I can hold off for a few years for a possible original version release in HD.

Now what to do with the prequels? My kids want to watch them, but I don't have them on DVD. Do I buy cheap used DVDs or consider the blurays?

 

[Marty Chinn]

Again, I don't think anyone is saying the updated editions shouldn't exist (well maybe a few of us are). All we want is the CHOICE of watching the fancied-up versions or the originals we remember. Put both on the discs and all this goes away.

Gary, as a hardcore Apple fan, shouldn't you be used to being told what you get without any choice? =)

 

[Marty Chinn]

Aren't the LD transfers on the DVD set widescreen? They might not be anamorphic, but in DVD terms that only means they're somewhat lower resolution.

Well, I was being picky with semantics. The LD transfers are letterboxed, not anamorphic widescreen. The only way to get a good anamorphic widescreen copy is not through any legal means. The Despecialized edit comes to mind and that's in HD too.

 

[THE-Pink-Dagger]

Dont know if this has been posted here but I saw a couple of days ago something Lucas said which basically was "the fans have a very strong opinion about how they think things should be, this is a good thing, but I made those movies, so I'm the one who makes the call"


Which is exactly what I think, you can complain anyway you want, pretty sure that Lucas must be laughing about this, and doesnt give a shit (obviously), it's like the LOTR EE BR trilogy, with the green tint all over again, it's not like Pete Jackson and Andrew Lesnie (cinematographer) said that they supervised the transfer, no no, the fans couldnt admit it and kept saying that an other edition should be issued.

 

[mrklaw]

Dont know if this has been posted here but I saw a couple of days ago something Lucas said which basically was "the fans have a very strong opinion about how they think things should be, this is a good thing, but I made those movies, so I'm the one who makes the call"


Which is exactly what I think, you can complain anyway you want, pretty sure that Lucas must be laughing about this, and doesnt give a shit (obviously), it's like the LOTR EE BR trilogy, with the green tint all over again, it's not like Pete Jackson and Andrew Lesnie (cinematographer) said that they supervised the transfer, no no, the fans couldnt admit it and kept saying that an other edition should be issued.

and is contradicting his own comments he has previously made.

 

[Jin34]

Dont know if this has been posted here but I saw a couple of days ago something Lucas said which basically was "the fans have a very strong opinion about how they think things should be, this is a good thing, but I made those movies, so I'm the one who makes the call"


Which is exactly what I think, you can complain anyway you want, pretty sure that Lucas must be laughing about this, and doesnt give a shit (obviously), it's like the LOTR EE BR trilogy, with the green tint all over again, it's not like Pete Jackson and Andrew Lesnie (cinematographer) said that they supervised the transfer, no no, the fans couldnt admit it and kept saying that an other edition should be issued.

Or how about you put the originals on Blu-ray with the proper care too? You know like pretty much every movie that has alternate versions?

 

[Marco1]

I can't wait for these to arrive, changes and all. The only thing that annoys me is, if you're going to redo the effects of the OT then redo them all. Anything that looks fake then CGI it.
I don't know why but star wars is my childhood and I don't understand all of the fuss regarding these changes, I think they're great.
And the price for all 6 movies is superb too.
I am really looking forward to sitting watching these with my 4 year old son, the same age I was when I watched episode 4.

 

[mrklaw]

its not even 'directors intent' - he only directed the first one.

 

[Ushojax]

its not even 'directors intent' - he only directed the first one.

He more or less directed Jedi as well. Marquand didn't do much.

 

[THE-Pink-Dagger]

its not even 'directors intent' - he only directed the first one.

What are you talking about?! Lucas directed Episode 1, 2, 3, 4, and 6 (Marquand is credited as the director but Lucas apparently did most of it)

 

[Barberetti]

Dont know if this has been posted here but I saw a couple of days ago something Lucas said which basically was "the fans have a very strong opinion about how they think things should be, this is a good thing, but I made those movies, so I'm the one who makes the call"

 

[Tobor]

Aren't they all 2.35:1? So on a non-anamorphic DVD that'll be something like 640x240. Blow that up full screen and it'll look pretty bad. I'm not even sure my TV still has a zoom button, I guess it must have.

I'm tempted but put off by the resolution. And having just struggled through watching the SEs with my kids, I think I can hold off for a few years for a possible original version release in HD.

Now what to do with the prequels? My kids want to watch them, but I don't have them on DVD. Do I buy cheap used DVDs or consider the blurays?

You do the only rational thing. You tell your kids that there are no prequels, and anyone who tells them otherwise is a liar.

 

[33-Hit-Combo]

You do the only rational thing. You tell your kids that there are no prequels, and anyone who tells them otherwise is a liar.

And anything they do catch a scent of, it's an elabo-... No, it's just fan-made.

 

[Ether_Snake]

Dont know if this has been posted here but I saw a couple of days ago something Lucas said which basically was "the fans have a very strong opinion about how they think things should be, this is a good thing, but I made those movies, so I'm the one who makes the call"


Which is exactly what I think, you can complain anyway you want, pretty sure that Lucas must be laughing about this, and doesnt give a shit (obviously), it's like the LOTR EE BR trilogy, with the green tint all over again, it's not like Pete Jackson and Andrew Lesnie (cinematographer) said that they supervised the transfer, no no, the fans couldnt admit it and kept saying that an other edition should be issued.

And the fact is, the fans want things to be the way they were. We want the movies as they were. Lucas is the only one here who "has a strong opinion on how things should be" and can't accept the fact that the original movies were as they were. He has issues.

I wouldn't be surprised if Lucas is changing everything he originally argued about with other people while making the movie.

 

[Azure Dream]

I was just watching a video about copyright to see if it was a good summary of things, and it had some strong words about Lucas. It is funny (and a little depressing) to think that with the way the original law stood, the original Star Wars trilogy would be public domain by now.

 

[THE-Pink-Dagger]

And the fact is, the fans want things to be the way they were. We want the movies as they were. Lucas is the only one here who "has a strong opinion on how things should be" and can't accept the fact that the original movies were as they were. He has issues.

I wouldn't be surprised if Lucas is changing everything he originally argued about with other people while making the movie.

So?! It doesnt matter, Lucas is in charge, nothing you can do about it, fans can keep whining, complaining, not gonna change a thing.

 

[Nappuccino]

So?! It doesnt matter, Lucas is in charge, nothing you can do about it, fans can keep whining, complaining, not gonna change a thing.

Sure it matters.

 

[Medalion]

So?! It doesnt matter, Lucas is in charge, nothing you can do about it, fans can keep whining, complaining, not gonna change a thing.

The whiners are what convinced George to eventually re-release the unaltered version a few years back, so whining does help to some degree

 

[Ether_Snake]

So?! It doesnt matter, Lucas is in charge, nothing you can do about it, fans can keep whining, complaining, not gonna change a thing.

What matters is that it is clear that George Lucas is a bad movie maker and has major issues. The original Star Wars were good because of all the people that worked on it. Since Lucas has had free reign to do whatever he wants, he made it suck.

 

[LegendOfGood]

Picked up Episode IV and VI Limited Edition DVDs today for 20 each.

 

[Anth0ny]

So?! It doesnt matter, Lucas is in charge, nothing you can do about it, fans can keep whining, complaining, not gonna change a thing.

Whining got us a release in 2006. It was bad, but it was something. Prior to 06, Lucas claimed the original films no longer existed, and that everyones VHS tapes would wear out eventually and all that would be left are the 2004 DVD editions.

 

[KittenMaster]

I wouldn't be surprised if Lucas is changing everything he originally argued about with other people while making the movie.

I'm 90% certain this is the case.

"So we have Han Solo in the table, right? And the green alien has his blaster pointed at him. To make the scene more exciting we have them both shoot at each other and we'd show off our special effects."

"Hmm, the scene doesn't seem to work. Perhaps if we only have our hero shoot, being the quicker draw like in Westerns?"

"No, I REALLY want to see the blaster shot. I just want to SEE IT."

"Yeah, no."

""

 

[Barberetti]

What matters is that it is clear that George Lucas is a bad movie maker and has major issues. The original Star Wars were good because of all the people that worked on it. Since Lucas has had free reign to do whatever he wants, he made it suck.

And on that note, Phil Tippett's opinion of the latest changes:

Surprise: He hates it too. It didn't take long before the topic came up last night in the Q&A, and Tippett's response was a simple, "They're sh-t." He doesn't think they're necessary at all, citing as one example how he loved Lucas' original, Sergio Leone-like approach to shooting Mos Eisley as this minimal, barren place and how now it's just "filled with a bunch of... CGI sh-t."

 

[womp]

That is something that always drove me crazy about the Mos Eisley update in the special edition of ANH. Throughout the entire film you are left with this impression just via conversation from Luke and Obi-Wan that Tattoine is this desolate shit hole planet out in timbuck hills and in the original it is, hence that Sergio Leone look Lucas went for. He was a big fan of Leone's films to the point that there was a scene depicting a standoff with two aliens in a showdown with laser pisols that was left on the cutting room floor . Then in the SE we get this freaking all out happening party going down with CGI shit fest guests showing up destroying the entire effect. Episode I made it even worse.

 

[XMonkey]

What matters is that it is clear that George Lucas is a bad movie maker and has major issues. The original Star Wars were good because of all the people that worked on it. Since Lucas has had free reign to do whatever he wants, he made it suck.

He was actually quite a good filmmaker when he was younger. Just because he's lost his marbles now doesn't mean he never had them.

 

[DrForester]

It's not really the changes that piss fans off.

While most fans seem to like it, there were some not happy with the Star Trek remastered episodes, but you rarely hear complaints because they can always watch the originals or the update on the Blu-Ray.

What pisses fans off about what Lucas does is that Lucas would like nothing better than to bury the theatrical editions. If these BluRay's had a choice of the new editions or the theatrical editions, no one would care about the changes.

 

[funkystudent]

He is just crazy OCD about things is all.

And when your as rich as him I dont think many of his co workers would want to tell him to cut it off and leave everything be.


Over the years as his vision on star wars changed he wants to go back and change it to better fit his vision. a creator normally doesn't get why the fans have such a connection to there creation.

you see it alot when games get remains by there original creator. They normally want to add new shit and tweak the old to make it better fit there current view on the idea. See sonic team.


When you think about it Sonic Team is the video game equivalent of George Lucas.

They both have no idea what made there original ideas great in the first place anymore.

you normally need a outside voice to get things back on track.

 

[Mr. Sam]

As someone who wasn't even born when the OT was originally released, do I have a moral obligation to boycott the new releases?

 

[Marty Chinn]

As someone who wasn't even born when the OT was originally released, do I have a moral obligation to boycott the new releases?

Yes. Just because you weren't born doesn't excuse Lucas to rewrite history for you.

 

[Gary Whitta]

As someone who wasn't even born when the OT was originally released, do I have a moral obligation to boycott the new releases?

Yeah you weren't born during WWII either but if The History Channel released a Blu-ray set in which Hitler said NOOOOOOOO right before he shot himself and Winston Churchill was replaced by Jar Jar Binks I wouldn't recommend you buy that either.

 

[Barberetti]

He is just crazy OCD about things is all.

And when your as rich as him I dont think many of his co workers would want to tell him to cut it off and leave everything be.


Over the years as his vision on star wars changed he wants to go back and change it to better fit his vision. a creator normally doesn't get why the fans have such a connection to there creation.

you see it alot when games get remains by there original creator. They normally want to add new shit and tweak the old to make it better fit there current view on the idea. See sonic team.


When you think about it Sonic Team is the video game equivalent of George Lucas.

They both have no idea what made there original ideas great in the first place anymore.

you normally need a outside voice to get things back on track.

Yeah, I get what you mean, but when you look at all of the re-imaginings, reboots, and remixes that film makers, game developers, and musicians create these days, none of those people go out of their way (to my knowledge) to stop you watch, play, or listen to the originals. Why has Lucas got such a fucking bee in his bonnet about it?

 

[Risette]

Dont know if this has been posted here but I saw a couple of days ago something Lucas said which basically was "the fans have a very strong opinion about how they think things should be, this is a good thing, but I made those movies, so I'm the one who makes the call"

So he made the movies entirely by himself? Good to know. I wonder what all those people in the credits are doing there. Maybe Lucas just made them up so it didn't look like he was bragging.

 

[Jarmel]

And on that note, Phil Tippett's opinion of the latest changes:

The most important part of that is Spielberg understands and Lucas doesn't know how to direct shit.

 

[3rdman]

As someone who wasn't even born when the OT was originally released, do I have a moral obligation to boycott the new releases?

Being 7 years old at the time Star Wars was released, I certainly see things differently than you do. I also studied film so I've got particularly strong opinions on this. But I truly believe that the CGI-fest makes the film worse.

Some CG additions (space shots) are worth using but the there are so many superfluous additions that I find them extremely distracting. I say boycott them until Lucas relents and gives us both versions but then again I'm a cantankerous old fart.

 

[Mr. Sam]

Yeah you weren't born during WWII either but if The History Channel released a Blu-ray set in which Hitler said NOOOOOOOO right before he shot himself and Winston Churchill was replaced by Jar Jar Binks I wouldn't recommend you buy that either.

So you'd argue that Star Wars is such a huge part of filmic history and these changes are so abhorrent that any film fan, regardless of their attachment to the series, should not stand for them?

I'm not condoning these changes at all; just wondering if it's worthwhile for someone with no particular ties to any version to own these new versions.

Edit: If I could be assured that the OOT was eventually going to get a HD release, I'd definitely avoid these tinkered versions. As it stands, it's 50/50.

 

[NekoFever]

That is something that always drove me crazy about the Most Eisley update in the special edition of ANH. Throughout the entire film you are left with this impression just via conversation from Luke and Obi-Wan that Tattoine is this desolate shit hole planet out in timbuck hills and in the original it is, hence that Sergio Leone look Lucas went for. He was a big fan of Leone's films to the point that there was a scene depicting a standoff with two aliens in a showdown with laser pisols that was left on the cutting room floor . Then in the SE we get this freaking all out happening party going down with CGI shit fest guests showing up destroying the entire effect. Episode I made it even worse.

Plus there's the "wretched hive of scum and villainy" line, setting up Mos Eisley as a dangerous, lawless town, now immediately followed by those zany Jawas falling off shit. Way to build the tension.

 

[Anth0ny]

When you think about it Sonic Team is the video game equivalent of George Lucas.

They both have no idea what made there original ideas great in the first place anymore.

you normally need a outside voice to get things back on track.

Yeah this is so true.

Whenever new footage of a Sonic game is released, the fans just go crazy about how it's not like the Genesis games. Rightfully so =)

But at least Sega re-re-re-re-re releases Sonic 1, 2 and 3 for every console imaginable. The true equivalent would be leaving Sonic 1,2 and 3K as Genesis exclusives, and remaking the games with Sonic Rush physics and claiming that this is the correct way to experience this game.

But even STILL, you could just go and buy a used Genesis and Sonic game on ebay! Sure it might be expensive, but who cares? If they started selling the original trilogy on 35mm or something, and it the quality was absolutely pristine, I'd be there day one. These are my favorite movies of all time.

 

[Gary Whitta]

So you'd argue that Star Wars is such a huge part of filmic history and these changes are so abhorrent that any film fan, regardless of their attachment to the series, should not stand for them?

Obviously it is a huge piece of cinema history and I believe it's tantamount to vandalism to keep changing the movies while slowly erasing the originals from existence. Again, it's not the changes I object to (although I think most of them make the films worse) but the refusal to make the originals available as an alternative for those who love them the way they were.

But ultimately people can and will do whatever they want. All this rage is not going to make the slightest bit of difference in the long run, Lucas doesn't care and the Blu-rays will sell millions. The rest of us still reserve the right to bitch and moan about it.

 

[Anth0ny]

Obviously it is a huge piece of cinema history and I believe it's tantamount to vandalism to keep changing the movies while slowly erasing the originals from existence. Again, it's not the changes I object to (although I think most of them make the films worse) but the refusal to make the originals available as an alternative for those who love them the way they were.

This.

Imagine how much smaller this thread would be if we just had a well done release of the original unaltered trilogy. Or how many "lol at these new changes, I'll just stick to my original unaltered blu ray" posts there would be.

 

[AbsoluteZero]

I don't really want the original versions anymore, but I don't want what he'd made them into either.

I liked about half of what the special edition brought to the table. Adding in Jabba was nice, as it made ROTJ make more sense finally. The stuff like the flyby of the X-wings and addition shots during the death star attack run was nice as well. Even the entry into the Tatooine town shots were terrible.

But stuff like the singing bit added to ROTJ just ruins the rest.

 

[Mr. Sam]

Like I said, I'm not a Lucas apologist by any means. Indeed, I can plainly see why these changes would make people angry, and find many of them bizarre (and even laughable) myself. Why the theatrical versions aren't available with these films as they are with, say, Gladiator or the first three Alien films is just so odd to me.

I suppose I'm just a materialistic whore, trying to justify buying some shiny new box sets.

 

[Gary Whitta]

I don't really want the original versions anymore, but I don't want what he'd made them into either.

I liked about half of what the special edition brought to the table. Adding in Jabba was nice, as it made ROTJ make more sense finally.

I'm curious to know why you think the new Jabba scene in ANH helps ROTJ make more sense. We already know Han is wanted by a gangster named Jabba the Hutt because that all got explained in the Greedo scene. All the Jabba scene does is repeat information we already learned a few minutes prior. It's utterly redundant. And viewed as a trilogy I think the appearance of Jabba is much more effective when it's saved until later, after we've been hearing about what a fearsome character he is in the previous two movies.

 

[Summary Man]

Can we all agree that the 1997 Special Editions are the best versions of the movie? They added some much-needed space shots, made some nice minor adjustments (such as the back of the rancor leg in Jedi), and made some of the environments nicer to look at (Bespin being the best change).

Sure, there are some duds (the music scene in Jabba's palace), but as a whole, I think the Special Editions made some really cool and much-needed changes. I actually like the new Sarlaac. It's actually menacing now instead of just being a spiky hole in the ground.

 

[Tobor]

Let's not forget that Lucas himself argued before Congress that films need to be protected and preserved for future generations.

 

[AbsoluteZero]

I'm curious to know why you think the new Jabba scene in ANH helps ROTJ make more sense. We already know Han is wanted by a gangster named Jabba the Hutt because that all got explained in the Greedo scene. All the Jabba scene does is repeat information we already learned a few minutes prior. And viewed as a trilogy I think the appearance of Jabba is much more effective when it's saved until later, after we've been hearing about what a fearsome character he is in the previous two movies.

But I thought Han was supposed to be speaking to Jabba in the hangar the Falcon's in. If he's a completely different species two movies later that makes you go "Wait, what? Did who did Han speak to in the first movie?"

 

[RyanDG]

But I thought Han was supposed to be speaking to Jabba in the hangar the Falcon's in. If he's a completely different species two movies later that makes you go "Wait, what? Did who did Han speak to in the first movie?"

There is no point in the original cut of A new hope that Han speaks to Jabba at all. I could be completely off my rocker here - but that whole sequence was removed entirely from the original cut - it just was simply not there.

 

[Risette]

I think one of the better (/only sensible) changes is the editing of the strange looking proto-Emperor in ESB to Ian McDiarmid's Emperor.

 

[Gary Whitta]

But I thought Han was supposed to be speaking to Jabba in the hangar the Falcon's in. If he's a completely different species two movies later that makes you go "Wait, what? Did who did Han speak to in the first movie?"

What? He speaks to Greedo in the bar, and Jabba in the hangar. In the special editions Jabba is the same in both ANH and ROJ, except it's a physical puppet in one movie and CG in the other. How is this confusing?