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Guild Wars 2 News And Information Thread [Large Beta Weekends In March/April]

Victrix

*beard*
There's also the daily Zaishen missions, which are somewhat analogous to dailies in WoW. You can usually find groups for doing the Hard modes of those missions.

But really, you want to join a guild. That'll give you groups for doing whatever it is you're going after. The Hall of Monuments revitalized the game significantly, so there's always people tackling objectives for it - they're just usually doing it with 7 Heroes now that Anet enabled that feature.

I'm contemplating writing up a new post with advice for players interested in checking out (and enjoying) GW since we still have a ways to go before GW2 comes out.

Any interest?
 

Orayn

Member
Victrix said:
I'm contemplating writing up a new post with advice for players interested in checking out (and enjoying) GW since we still have a ways to go before GW2 comes out.

Any interest?
I think there's a "GAF, Let's Play Guild Wars!" thread that isn't too old, but a new one would be nice. I've been getting back into it myself and it would be nice to get some GAFers together for GW1.
 

Sai-kun

Banned
Wow. WvWvW sounds fucking incredible. I've never played GW1 or anything, so this will all be super new to me. The game looks gorgeous, and I've got like 4 of my friends all convinced to buy the game when it comes out, too! I can't wait :D Is GW1 any good?
 

gunbo13

Member
Victrix said:
I'm contemplating writing up a new post with advice for players interested in checking out (and enjoying) GW since we still have a ways to go before GW2 comes out.

Any interest?
I can help with PvP if there is an audience.

Orayn said:
I think there's a "GAF, Let's Play Guild Wars!" thread that isn't too old, but a new one would be nice. I've been getting back into it myself and it would be nice to get some GAFers together for GW1.
I feel like we could take a group of quality players from gaf and just dominate everything. I doubt the interest is very high though.
 

Victrix

*beard*
GW1 is great, but it's... different. It's not at all like WoW (or any other mmo), so going into it with the wrong expectations will cause you to have no funs at all.

I'll write up a new post for GW1, with the focus on explaining its unique features, and how to get the most out of the game as a newbie. Lemme finish up some work and I'll start writing it here in a bit.

edit: If you (or anyone else) wants to write up PvP sections, please do, my focus will be on the game as a whole/pve - I'll add in your content once it's ready.
 
gunbo13 said:
Yep, it comes with the territory. People likely just want to somehow get into the best groups right away. Why would the better groups want inexperienced players? PvP != PvE in this regard; there is not going to be any charity.

I started out as a PUG with nothing to show. I didn't get into good groups until a lot of hours were put in. What I did do to help though was start my own guild with players I met through elite PvE. If you can manage well in elite PvE, showing your consistency to many players, chances are you can manage a step up to PvP. So I collected some early PvP players and we went to work. Fast forward hundreds of hours and I'm in the groups who don't even advertise for PUGs. We didn't play if we didn't have all trusted friends.

There were tons of times in the very beginning where I would go in and lose the first match with a bunch of rage quits. That's the nature of PvP so people shouldn't be dissuaded.

I was actually looking into playing GW1 for a taste of what this one might be like but I'm afraid that I might not be able to really get into it ... which is fine, it's a few years old and I understand that.

Unless something happens I'll definitely be jumping into GW2 day 1 though.
 

gunbo13

Member
Victrix said:
edit: If you (or anyone else) wants to write up PvP sections, please do, my focus will be on the game as a whole/pve - I'll add in your content once it's ready.
A basic overview will only take a short time. That's just documenting the modes and stuff.

What I can really dig into deep are the actual game mechanics. Positioning, casting, interrupts, lines, etc... I'd really have to do this in pieces though since there is way to much to discuss. I can creates posts on say "avoiding interrupts" and you can piece it in. If that's OK, then just provide a link and I'll work it in.

A lot of that stuff also applies to PvE. You can label and use the information as you want.

flyinpiranha said:
I was actually looking into playing GW1 for a taste of what this one might be like but I'm afraid that I might not be able to really get into it ... which is fine, it's a few years old and I understand that.

Unless something happens I'll definitely be jumping into GW2 day 1 though.
Maybe gaf can help. I'd be willing to help with some intro play sessions or whatever. If you are interested in PvP for example, I can take a group into RA. GW1 is still an amazing game and the player-base is now diminished in quality. Therefore, we can have free reign to mess around.
 
I think one thing to remain cognizant of, if people want to try out Guild Wars 1 before playing the sequel, is that they are looking to be very, very different games. They share some similar design philosophies (anti-grind, emphasis on player skill over time, shared focus on PvP and PvE) and the same setting, but it looks like the games are going to play completely different from one another. GW1 is great and I would recommend it to damn near everyone who asked my opinion, but it's a different style of game. So I wouldn't go into GW1 expecting a "preview" of sorts for GW2.

I'm sure most everyone here already knew that, but I just thought I'd throw a heads up out there. (Go play it anyway, it's great.)
 

gunbo13

Member
The games are very different yet there will still be a ton of similarities. I can already write a book just based on the OP and GW1 about transferable concepts.
 
gunbo13 said:
The games are very different yet there will still be a ton of similarities. I can already write a book just based on the OP and GW1 about transferable concepts.

Oh, absolutely. It's interesting to see how the design of GW2 is really an evolution of the concepts behind GW1. I was just letting the people who were playing GW1 after hearing about GW2 not to expect identical experiences between the two.

On another note, since I haven't really participated in this thread, I just want to say that I'm insanely psyched for this game. It's really sounding like the kind of MMO I've always wanted. Been following it pretty heavily for about a year now, and the hype hasn't drained one bit. I'm especially excited for the dynamic event system, action combat, and character personality system.
 

Randy

Member
Victrix said:
I'm contemplating writing up a new post with advice for players interested in checking out (and enjoying) GW since we still have a ways to go before GW2 comes out.

Any interest?

Would be very helpful. Checking out the story and going for 30 HoM-points myself, so I'll be spending quite some time with the game.
 

etiolate

Banned
I'm in the midst of my GW1 rediscovery.

I am curious if the counter system will still come into play in GW2. GW1 sort of auto-balanced itself for smart players who learned the extensive list of skills. You could always find a counter.
 
etiolate said:
I'm in the midst of my GW1 rediscovery.

I am curious if the counter system will still come into play in GW2. GW1 sort of auto-balanced itself for smart players who learned the extensive list of skills. You could always find a counter.

I doubt countering will be done in the same way for two reasons.

1. Build's are going to be far less diverse due to the new weapon=skillset system.

2. The action-oriented combat system sounds as though countering will be more about dodging and using defensive skills at the right time and in the right situation rather than the more build oriented system in GW1.
 

Instro

Member
Spehornoob said:
I doubt countering will be done in the same way for two reasons.

1. Build's are going to be far less diverse due to the new weapon=skillset system.

2. The action-oriented combat system sounds as though countering will be more about dodging and using defensive skills at the right time and in the right situation rather than the more build oriented system in GW1.
In terms of GW1 PvP, many builds usually shared the same base of 4-5 skills, so it might not necessarily be that there will be significantly less diversity.
 

etiolate

Banned
Spehornoob said:
I doubt countering will be done in the same way for two reasons.

1. Build's are going to be far less diverse due to the new weapon=skillset system.

2. The action-oriented combat system sounds as though countering will be more about dodging and using defensive skills at the right time and in the right situation rather than the more build oriented system in GW1.

But it also feels like grouping/balling up with spirits will find new life with fire walls and magic shields and turrets.
 

Orayn

Member
Instro said:
In terms of GW1 PvP, many builds usually shared the same base of 4-5 skills, so it might not necessarily be that there will be significantly less diversity.
Traits can also affect the functionality of those basic skills pretty dramatically, so I'd say we're in for plenty of diversity even with people who use the same skills.
 
Instro said:
In terms of GW1 PvP, many builds usually shared the same base of 4-5 skills, so it might not necessarily be that there will be significantly less diversity.

Ah. I was more of a PvE player (yeah, I'm lame, come at me, bro), so I didn't realize that. Thanks for the info. That's interesting to me.

Orayn said:
Traits can also affect the functionality of those basic skills pretty dramatically, so I'd say we're in for plenty of diversity even with people who use the same skills.

Oh, yeah, I know there'll be plenty of customization in builds, but I still imagine it'll be less than the sheer amount of builds there were in the original, especially in regards to the whole "builds-countering-builds-countering-builds" you saw a lot of in GW1.
 

Orayn

Member
Spehornoob said:
Oh, yeah, I know there'll be plenty of customization in builds, but I still imagine it'll be less than the sheer amount of builds there were in the original, especially in regards to the whole "builds-countering-builds-countering-builds" you saw a lot of in GW1.
For the brief amount of time I was seriously involved in PvP, the build wars were indeed interesting. Also, you'd have the occasional silver bullet from ANet that killed a popular build outright. (Or repeatedly failed to kill, in the case of IWAY and its innumerable derivatives.)
 

Alex

Member
The long term, mass faction battles that were exclusive to the test realm in late 90s UO was the best time I've ever had in an online game. Looking forward to this greatly.
 

Instro

Member
etiolate said:
But it also feels like grouping/balling up with spirits will find new life with fire walls and magic shields and turrets.
It will be interesting to see how important the combo skills between players are to the game. Depending on how skill combination are handled it could be huge in PvP and PvE.

Orayn said:
Traits can also affect the functionality of those basic skills pretty dramatically, so I'd say we're in for plenty of diversity even with people who use the same skills.
Yeah thats true, I keep forgetting about traits.

Spehornoob said:
Ah. I was more of a PvE player (yeah, I'm lame, come at me, bro), so I didn't realize that. Thanks for the info. That's interesting to me.
I was mostly PvE as well, so my build knowledge is a bit low when it comes to PvP. I'm sure someone could provide better info, but whenever I did PvP it was with a ranger and of all the builds I tried out there were always some shared skills between them. The only difference I think you might see though is less crazy experimental builds in both PvE and PvP. How much the weapons skills effect character building will probably hinge on what the trait system is like, and possibly what the skill combos are like.
 

Helmholtz

Member
gunbo13 said:
Yep, it comes with the territory. People likely just want to somehow get into the best groups right away. Why would the better groups want inexperienced players?
The problem is that low-ranked players have trouble getting into ANY group whatsoever, let alone a good one. I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's undeniably very difficult making HA pretty much useless for the average player. I dare you to disable your title and try to get in any group at all :p
I think the only way for new people to even attempt HA is to find a pvp oriented guild that would be willing to take them, and those are few and far between from what I've heard.

gunbo13 said:
I started out as a PUG with nothing to show.
I'm guessing you started out years ago, right? Back then it was definitely possible to form some sort of group. I'm saying that currently you basically can't even PUG, there are literally zero groups accepting non-ranked players. I might be wrong, but that's how it was every time I checked in the past year or so.
 

Jira

Member
http://www.arena.net/blog/jon-peters-on-the-new-gamescom-demo

As a company, we like to say that we iterate on our game—a lot. There are three different ways that we can make changes: we can remove things, we can change things, and we can add things. Luckily for anyone playing the demo a second, third or twentieth time, we have done all three of these things to many aspects of the game.

For me, the best part of these demos is how they let players see the iterative process. From PAX East and the introduction of thief, to Comic-Con where we tried an initiative system with cheaper costs and slower regeneration, and to gamescom where the thief will use the original numbers once again. I’m sure that people are theory-crafting on which is better. Thankfully we don’t have to theorize; we can play it and see for ourselves. The slower-regen idea seemed so good on paper, but in practice the original design was just more fun. As we roll into this next demo season, there are a few major changes that we thought we should tell you about, and without further ado, here they are.
Energy

Skills no longer cost energy. This means energy potions are also gone. (Sorry to everyone who so vehemently helped us defend their existence.) In place of the energy-potion button is a new dodge button. This allows players to use the mouse to dodge and lets players bind dodge to a single keystroke. If you are moving in a direction, the dodge will take that into account and dodge in that direction. If you are not moving, you will dodge backward. Dodging now also evades attacks, making it a more effective and understandable way to avoid big creature attacks or to get out of AoE spells. Dodging is limited by energy, which regenerates over time.

We have a new long-term replacement for the other benefits that energy potions provided to our system, but since it is not in the game yet, we aren’t talking about it.
Skill Acquisition

The acquisition of skills is changing. Why? Because it wasn’t helping teach people the game, it didn’t fit with how skills actually worked, and it didn’t carry over the fun collection element that made the original Guild Wars unique.

A weapon’s skills are now learned by fighting with that weapon. Because weapon skills are tied to weapon use, there is no reason to visit a trainer and make choices about which ones to unlock. Instead, it makes more sense to learn how to use the weapon by, you know, actually using it.

Non-weapon skills are learned in a different way. The second half of the bar will be unlocked using a collection mechanic similar to Guild Wars. We want players to make fun choices about how they build their character, so the new systems will help promote this. Along with this, the player progression of traits, attribute-point spending, and skill tiers have been updated as well, but the final implementation is not a part of this build either. For this demo, the trait panel is disabled, and when the new system is ready, we will explain how it works.

Humans, Charr, Norn, Asura, and Sylvari, Oh My!

All of these races are now playable, and the demo content features the human, norn, and charr starting area, as well as a high-level zone where players can experience playing as an asura or sylvari. Here’s a bit of perspective from some of the content designers who worked on these areas.
Charr Personal Story

“This is the first time you’ll be seeing the story from the charr perspective. Given the charr’s antagonist role in the past, we took great care to craft a starter experience that will showcase the role of the charr in modern Tyria, focusing on what charr do best: war.

Depending on the legion you join, you’ll end up leading an elite squad of charr warriors, stalking traitors through the alleys of the Black Citadel or manning a gigantic ghost-busting cannon. Expect plenty of battlefield heroics. Folks that are already fans of the charr have nothing to worry about. We hope that through the story, you’ll see what drives the charr. But this isn’t about humanizing them; they’re still every bit as fearsome and bloodthirsty as you remember.” –Theo Nguyen, Game Designer
Plains of Ashford

“We are excited to show off the charr starter area, the Plains of Ashford, for the first time. You’ll get to experience the fight against the Flame Legion firsthand, and if you are really skilled, you may even get to fight against the ancient Ascalonians. The Plains of Ashford is a dangerous place, which suits the charr just fine, and it’s a great testing ground for the changes we’ve made to all the classes, and for the feel of the game in general. If you get some time with the game, you’ll also get to try out our newly prolific karma vendors. You can find them scattered throughout the starter area of the charr, and it’s our hope that they’ll add some depth to the dynamic event system, providing tangible rewards for playing through as many events as you can. Most importantly, you’ll get to experience our game from a new perspective, that of the ferocious and sometimes savage charr.” –Devon Carver, Game Designer
Sparkfly Fen

“Blazeridge Steppes set a high bar for our high-level demo content last year, giving players a completely fleshed out map to explore, and ending with an epic battle against the dragon lieutenant, the Shatterer. This year, we aim to bring even more to the table by allowing both asura and sylvari the chance to explore the high-level area of Sparkfly Fen. Without giving away too much, let’s just say that players who experienced our previous demos will not be disappointed. Be sure to keep your eyes open for a special demo opportunity.” –Justin Biller, Game Designer
Big, Giant Bosses

All of the big, giant bosses have improved; from better cameras to view them to new things we can do with their skills, we have tried to make fighting them a more epic and spectacular experience. Even if you’ve already tried the starter bosses, you will want to give them a second look. There are also some surprise giant events that take place in the high-level area to look out for.
Character Customization

You can now try out our character customization. We have technology to adjust body types, allowing for stocky, skinny, and muscular characters. Each race has its own unique set of options, including charr horns, norn tattoos, and asura ears. There is a large variety of faces and hairstyles, and you can even customize facial features, including five sliders just for your human character’s nose!

Although not every option in every category is available in the demo yet, you should be able to get a good idea of what will be possible by playing around with it.

Character-Customization.jpg


Skill Improvements

Almost every weapon for every profession has changed in some way or another. If you think you knew what a warrior did with a mace, think again. Rest assured, there is a good chance they will change again before the next time players try the game. Here are some new “weapons” that you might not have seen before:

Ranger greatsword – The ranger’s AoE melee weapon full of chopping, leaping, kicking, evading, and bashing.
Warrior hammer – Get ready to knock some folks around with this heavy hitter.
Guardian hammer – A hybrid damage-and-support weapon that helps to control an area.
Guardian greatsword – Unleash a combination of magic and melee with a massive two-handed blade.
Elementalist earth attunement – The heavy-duty elementalist attunement with Earthquake, Sandstorm, and a host of good defensive abilities.

PvP

Structured PvP is here, and it’s ready for players to try out on the show floor. We’re introducing our first map, the Battle of Kyhlo, a conquest map with siege weapons and destructible environments.
Don’t Panic!

Ranger lovers, I apologize, but you will have to wait a little bit longer to get your pet love. I assure you it is coming, though.
Underwater thieves, we didn’t forget about you, either. You will be able to steal underwater, just not in this current demo.

So why do we do all of this? We do it to improve upon all aspects of the game that we feel need it. We’re always focusing on making our combat more visceral, our events more dynamic, and our stories more personal. How long will we keep doing this? Until it is ready—and then some.
 

gunbo13

Member
Helmholtz said:
I'm guessing you started out years ago, right? Back then it was definitely possible to form some sort of group. I'm saying that currently you basically can't even PUG, there are literally zero groups accepting non-ranked players. I might be wrong, but that's how it was every time I checked in the past year or so.
Yep, years ago.

This I can believe. I thought the statement were made surrounding the existence of GW1 and not just presently. In this case you likely have a section of players left who have been playing GW1 for years. That will definitely cause a huge rift where new players are completely kept out. It sucks but not unexpected.
 

etiolate

Banned
Energy

Skills no longer cost energy. This means energy potions are also gone. (Sorry to everyone who so vehemently helped us defend their existence.) In place of the energy-potion button is a new dodge button. This allows players to use the mouse to dodge and lets players bind dodge to a single keystroke. If you are moving in a direction, the dodge will take that into account and dodge in that direction. If you are not moving, you will dodge backward. Dodging now also evades attacks, making it a more effective and understandable way to avoid big creature attacks or to get out of AoE spells. Dodging is limited by energy, which regenerates over time.

We have a new long-term replacement for the other benefits that energy potions provided to our system, but since it is not in the game yet, we aren’t talking about it.

ohshi!

So does this mean going back towards more of GW1's energy system? I am curious how the new dodge feels. It sounds more like Vindictus now.

edit: Wait if energy is entirely gone then i would seem dodging is based on some sort of tiny energy bar that regens like GW1.

I am still curious if dodging feels as good now. I kind of don't like it on a hotbar.

As for HA, I can say that in my prime PVP playing days that I had no trouble getting groups, but when I came back after just a few months it was much harder getting groups. Part of it was that I didn't want to pug with people I didn't know, but there was still even some bias about rank or how you got rank or whatever. The "MUST BE RANK" kept going higher. I was rank 6 when I had quit so it wasn't a big problem coming back, but people started getting snobby if they thought you cheesed your rank through some build. The funny part is that all people and guilds farmed HA with some build, be it spirit spam, smite, IWAY, ranger spike or Air spike or whatever. Everyone farmed a lot of fame from farmable builds.
 

Orayn

Member
The energy change is HUGE. Combat just went from being a snappier version of standard MMO fare to Vindictus-lite. If there's an option to manually aim my attacks instead of locking onto targets, it really will feel just like an action game.
 

Jira

Member
Yeah I'd been playing Vindictus again and man I love the combat system. If ANet can mimic that then combat will NEVER get boring.
 

etiolate

Banned
Since I am a critical fan, I do worry this removes one more point of choice and tactics. If nothing costs energy then a player will have one less decision to make. Things will be hit every CD.
 

Wag

Member
Bahaha! Will this game ever come out? I still have my pre-order in @ Amazon back from 2009- only cost me $42.:p
 

Fishious

Member
Huh. I wonder if the removal of energy will change things. In the videos I've watched energy never seemed to be a big issue (although I never saw any really long battles) so maybe this won't change much. I have to say the thing that's hyped me the most about this update is FIVE SLIDERS FOR YOUR NOSE!
 

Jira

Member
etiolate said:
Since I am a critical fan, I do worry this removes one more point of choice and tactics. If nothing costs energy then a player will have one less decision to make. Things will be hit every CD.

Something has to cost energy otherwise why is the energy bar in the game?
 

Jira

Member
Nirolak said:
Dodge.

"Dodging is limited by energy, which regenerates over time."

Right, for whatever reason I was under the impression he was saying that dodging didn't cost energy now. Miscommunication is all. If you look at say the Thief video from GDC you can see that dodging isn't cheap and will be a choice and part of tactics. You won't be able to just spam dodge all the time, you'll need to pick and choose when you use it based on when it will be most beneficial to your survival.
 

Complistic

Member
A really bold move to get rid of energy. Will be very interested to see how caster heavy professions play since melee still has adrenaline.
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Mikey Jr. said:
Wait, so no energy?

So how do you prevent skill spamming?
Cooldowns?

I would hate to see GW2 turn into cooldown watching though.

Another option would be to make them so varied that each skill is tailored for a specific situation. So you'll use one or two for dps, another for crowd control, etc etc. Kind of like bloodline champions.
 

Mikey Jr.

Member
Halycon said:
Cooldowns?

I would hate to see GW2 turn into cooldown watching though.

Another option would be to make them so varied that each skill is tailored for a specific situation. So you'll use one or two for dps, another for crowd control, etc etc. Kind of like bloodline champions.

Ehhh, but in GW1, as a monk, I would always take cheap and quick heal spells that I could cast quickly to heal someone. The recharge rate was low, energy was low as well, but spamming it would kill your energy quickly.

With no energy, how could those skills exist? With a high cooldown, whats the point of crappy heal skills? With low cool down though, whats stopping a monk from spamming a heal spell, or just spamming 3 cheap heal spells while the others recharge?
 

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
Well you could have something like Flare. No cooldown, highly spammable. Then some other stuff with cooldowns that provide stronger effects.
 

Grayman

Member
I did dislike the idea of having 2342341234 energy like the screenshots, but not having it at all seems tactically weaker. GW1 had an amazing energy system full of possibilities while being simple.
 

Mikey Jr.

Member
Woah, just saw a video that said there are no monks/no dedicated healers.

ANet is really rocking the boat here, ehhh?
 
My interest in this game continually rises as more and more news comes out.

I hope ANet is successful with GW2 and leads the way in changing MMO's for the better.
 

Morkins

Banned
Mikey Jr. said:
Woah, just saw a video that said there are no monks/no dedicated healers.

ANet is really rocking the boat here, ehhh?
Did you even read the OP?

Edit - Not accusing, just saying that most of this was covered in the OP.
 

Morkins

Banned
gunbo13 said:
I'm trying to think of the positives from no energy...and I'm coming up empty. This can be huge.
It will certainly make the combat more active. Energy was causing problems with the combat. It was breaking up the tactical/strategic play and was tearing the game away from it's core combat mechanics... It wasn't beneficial and it wasn't working. And for the people worried about the game becoming a "cooldown" oriented game, it already was kind of but with the caveat of an EXTREME level of importance on timing and positioning. In a way, using skills wisely is the "energy" resource of the game.

It may not seem obvious if you consider it in the context of other games, but for GW2, this change doesn't have a huge effect on normal combat other than making it less frustrating...
 

r4z4

Member
Wow pretty interesting changes, I like the fact that there is no more energy bar for skills, I hope recharge alone can balance things out.

I hope there is an option to double-tap for dodging, seems more intuitive (and easier to pull off) for me than a dedicated button for it.

My main positive from the post is this however:

Jira said:
Elementalist earth attunement – The heavy-duty elementalist attunement with Earthquake, Sandstorm, and a host of good defensive abilities.

Makes it sound like Elementalists will enable a different strategy for each attunement (fire-aoe, air-single target, water-support, earth-control) which is exactly what I want, rather than all attunements being the 'same' and just skinned differently. I want to be switching attunements in accordance with what is happening in battle.

I never played GW1, is the new weapon skill learning method similar to what was in that game? If so, can anyone expand on how it worked? I am assuming that weapon skills will also be tied to my level and not just 'spam flares 1 million times to unlock the 5th skill' etc...
 
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