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[scoobs]

Stealthies don't need fixing and Zeratul has decent waveclear too.
At most they should look at unrevealable as Samuro and Valeera can nearly always escape due to being truly invisible.

I'm constantly amazed how easy hikes are with Valeera. Once you get smokebomb you're almost impossible to be punished.

You kidding? No stealthy is ever played in competitive outside of Zeratul. If he didn't have the best ult in the game he wouldn't be played either. There's definitely reason to look at the stealth heroes.

Being yelled at for even hovering them in draft modes isn't fine. Blizz acknowledged this on their forums, so it's on their radar, we will see if anything comes of it.

 

[Dahbomb]

Zeratul is an awful hero to play in Hero league unless you are like Diamond or above ranked. I have never seen a good Zeratul player in matches, I am probably among the best Zeratul that I have seen out there in my own skill division and I am still hesitant to bring him out. His win rate in pubs must be among the bottom tier.

Zeratul is definitely far above the other invisible heroes though. Here's why:

*A heroic that can actually win team fights and can't really be played around that well.

*Can actually clear waves and soak a lane. Valeera and Nova just sit there auto attacking waves if there is a big push meaning they are awful at it.

*Has mobility and escapes plus re-engages in addition to having stealth. Valeera has some escape too and can chase. Meanwhile Nova has none and once she is caught that's it for her.

*Large power spike at lvl20 that allows him to OTK.

The only times I could consider picking Valeera or Nova over Zeratul is if I really need a silence/disable for a particular hero like Genji, then I might consider Valeera. Nova I only pick on Hanamura and that's it.

That last part of his is actually nerfed, his OTK combo got nerfed substantially with the recent change to Marked for Death. He has effectively lost 20% damage on that combo which means he can't OTK squishies. It's a substantial nerf to him.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Valeera saw play, and still does occassionally, until they nerfed her into the ground.

Nova should never be good.

Samuro is finally starting to be picked where he's good.

So what if Zeratul is being picked for VP?

 

[scoobs]

Valeera saw play, and still does occassionally, until they nerfed her into the ground.

Nova should never be good.

Samuro is finally starting to be picked where he's good.

So what if Zeratul is being picked for VP?

I mean we can argue all day if stealth is fine, but Blizzard doesn't think so so what does it matter?

 

[Alur]

I've always wondered what would happen when an immovable object met an unstoppable force. Now we know. Grid lock.

 

[scoobs]

I've always wondered what would happen when an immovable object met an unstoppable force. Now we know. Grid lock.

 

[Alur]

winky face

So no Garrosh til August 8th on live? Full 4 week cycle again. The last two years worth or so updated:

Stukov --- Garrosh: 4 weeks
Malthael --- Stukov: 4 weeks
Dva --- Malthael: 4 weeks
Genji --- Dva: 3 weeks
Cassia --- Genji: 4 weeks
Probius --- Cassia: 3 weeks
Lucio --- Probius: 4 weeks
Valeera --- Lucio: 3 weeks
Zul'jin --- Valeera: 3 weeks
Ragnaros --- Zul'jin: 3 weeks
Varian --- Ragnaros: 4 weeks
Samuro --- Varian: 4 weeks
Zarya --- Samuro: 3 weeks
Alarak --- Zarya: 2 weeks
Auriel --- Alarak: 5 weeks
Gul'dan --- Auriel: 4 weeks
Medivh --- Gul'dan: 4 weeks
Chromie --- Medivh: 4 weeks
Tracer --- Chromie: 3 weeks
Dehaka --- Tracer: 4 weeks
Xul --- Dehaka: 4 weeks
Li-Ming --- Xul: 4 weeks
Greymane --- Li-Ming: 3 weeks
Lunara --- Greymane: 4 weeks

 

[scoobs]

I'm fine with it. Gives us more time to enjoy the "new" hero (Stukov in this case), and builds more anticipation for the next new hero. Cassia felt like she was forgotten immediately once Genji hit the Nexus, she never got her time in the spotlight which sucks.

 

[kirblar]

Likely adjusted to make Blizzcon sync up. If they keep doing 7 week cycles for this and the leak list is correct, Junkrat will release immediately after Blizzcon. (And likely be announced well in advance of it.) With Alexstraza coming next.

 

[Rizzi]

I bought Probius. Really like that little robot.

 

[Karsticles]

It really impresses me how fluid Blizzard is with their design approach to HotS. Nothing feels sacred.

I'm fine with it. Gives us more time to enjoy the "new" hero (Stukov in this case), and builds more anticipation for the next new hero. Cassia felt like she was forgotten immediately once Genji hit the Nexus, she never got her time in the spotlight which sucks.

I like the fast hero dev cycle because it means that if one hero is uninteresting, it isn't long until I have something else to be interested in. Genji is not my kind of character, but Stukov is, and so is Garrosh. If the next character isn't interesting to me, I'll be fine with it because I got two "for me".

 

[brian!]

I mean we can argue all day if stealth is fine, but Blizzard doesn't think so so what does it matter?

https://youtu.be/409Pjtq7jzY

 

[scoobs]

W build Ragnaros is amazing. Fuck Q build and the hammer ult, im back on that lava wave lifestyle. XP for daaaaaays

 

[Ketch]

I think we are really underestimating how good zeratul is.

One of the best heroes in the game

he would be a good hero without stealth.

 

[Rizzi]

W build Ragnaros is amazing. Fuck Q build and the hammer ult, im back on that lava wave lifestyle. XP for daaaaaays

I like you.

 

[Prelude.]

Mewn's Genji salt is starting to seep into Pally's channel.

 

[Orochinagis]

Hey, I am getting two dailies per day, why

winky face

So no Garrosh til August 8th on live? Full 4 week cycle again. The last two years worth or so updated:

Thats a lot of trash between supports release...like five heroes per support

 

[Dahbomb]

I think we are really underestimating how good zeratul is.

One of the best heroes in the game

he would be a good hero without stealth.

Zeratul is a great hero but this particular meta is not great for him. With Genji being the best hero in the game, people shy away from picking squishy heroes and are picking beefier heroes. Less Mages in general as well. This makes it harder to draft Zeratul and even then your team needs to be somewhat of a kill comp as well to properly utilize him.

 

[kirblar]

Zeratul, Genji and Tracer all compete for the same niche- they're harass/sweeper heroes who bounce in, do some damage, then bounce out.

 

[Ketch]

I think this is a pretty good meta for zera. He's pretty weak vs tassadar. But he can fit into genji's spot really nicely.

I feel like he does get picked fairly often in hgc.

I bet the problem with zera in HL is that people try to play seeker in the dark thinking they're good when actually it's too hard for them. But wormhole build still exists and I think even comes online sooner.

 

[Dahbomb]

Seeker in the Dark is still most optimum. Extends the time that Singularity is on the target giving you more value from Marked for Death.

 

[brian!]

Rule is seeker for dmg and wormhole for quicker burst. Usually seeker lik 95% of the time

Zera's pretty good with falstad reemerging and abathur being very valuable on his maps. If you can deny aba/illi or aba/genji and get zera/aba that's pretty valuable, and that combo is good against both illi and genji. Even w/ his nerf he still does really high single target burst. But a lot of stuff hurts him atm (single target mitigation from tass/uther, lots of fatties, etc.), he's pretty niche atm id say, good for a second wave pick if he has comp synergy

Def would be a good hero without stealth but in general stealth heroes should be considered and played as if they arent in stealth

Id put him chen tier atm

 

[Milly79]

EiD vs. NvT on now. The battle for last. Go EiD even though you're trash.

 

[kirblar]

Cursed Bullet is really dumb.

Conceptually it's fine, but the "delete a third of your lifebar" on a 30s CD is ridiculous.

 

[Ketch]

EiD vs. NvT on now. The battle for last. Go EiD even though you're trash.

Who won?

 

[Milly79]

I think NvT but I'm not sure...

 

[kirblar]

Tempo Storm locked the third clash spot.

 

[Ketch]

I think NvT but I'm not sure...

they probably tied 0-0

 

[Karsticles]

Sorry about leaving, Dahbomb. My son woke up screaming for me so I had to go.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Tempo Storm locked the third clash spot.

welp so much for that event.

Funny that Fnatic lost.

 

[Prelude.]

I've been playing a bit of Tracer recently, what's the deal with untouchable? It's a quest, but, even if I complete it, I lose the bonus on death. It doesn't even have a reward, why is it a quest?
Snipe Master works similarly, but it's not a quest.

 

[brian!]

There used to be this talent called gathering power that upped skill dmg when you got a kill, itd always reset to 0 on death. Greymane has one too

 

[Prelude.]

They should fix those, that's not how quests work in the game. If the "completion" is only a cap with no rewards there's no reason for that to be a quest, with the fancy quest complete sound on top of it. Are these gathering power-like talents the only ones that are like this?

 

[brian!]

I think there might be talents like that that arent about getting straight up dmg like a reward but i cant think of any off the top of my head

Regardless tho get the bombs at lvl4 lol

 

[Prelude.]

I don't know, they don't seem to do much most of the times.

 

[brian!]

It's prtty integral to her playstyle and actually chunks really nicely, like essentially the phys dmg talent is a snowball talent that lets you win harder (plus you can get aoe shoot dmg value if their team is bad and clumps a lot and u think you can get away away with licking the talent), whereas parting gift enables her to one shot squishies in the backline, give some value to rewind since u are usually out when you use it, plus it never becomes obsolete because it scales.

But ofc go whatever works for you, none of the talents at that tier are bad

 

[Dahbomb]

Zeratul has a talent like that too where he gets spell damage for each takedown but then resets when you die. The talent that gives you bonus damage after every ability is just much better because it works with Seeker in the Dark too so you can get 4 mini crits in a row. That works out to be better than the snowball talent in most cases.

That talent row needs a rework or talents moved around. In fact a lot of Zeratul needs changes, there is like one build on him and everything else is subpar.

 

[Karsticles]

I really dislike it when a hero talent level offers multiple talents for the same skill.

I double dislike it when two of those talents do similar things.

 

[brian!]

Zeratul has a talent like that too where he gets spell damage for each takedown but then resets when you die. The talent that gives you bonus damage after every ability is just much better because it works with Seeker in the Dark too so you can get 4 mini crits in a row. That works out to be better than the snowball talent in most cases.

That talent row needs a rework or talents moved around. In fact a lot of Zeratul needs changes, there is like one build on him and everything else is subpar.

yeah he was a gathering power taker back in the day when wormhole was the only option, he'd constantly get the dot dmg talent on his q too.

im one of those ppl that are fine taking the same talent every game,but itd be cool if they gave him some crazy stuff. my fanfiction ult to replace void slash or whatever it's called would be an aoe strike that hits heroes in an aoe and then marks them w/ it's own version of vorpal blade w/ 5 diff hotkeys for each one hit, that shit would be sick

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

mageatul was fun. I love his rework but I ended up enjoying every single iteration of him.

First hero bought and most played since.

 

[Dahbomb]

I really dislike it when a hero talent level offers multiple talents for the same skill.

I double dislike it when two of those talents do similar things.

The lvl1 talent of Azmodan is the worst if you are going for Dunk build.

 

[Ketch]

yeah he was a gathering power taker back in the day when wormhole was the only option, he'd constantly get the dot dmg talent on his q too.

im one of those ppl that are fine taking the same talent every game,but itd be cool if they gave him some crazy stuff. my fanfiction ult to replace void slash or whatever it's called would be an aoe strike that hits heroes in an aoe and then marks them w/ it's own version of vorpal blade w/ 5 diff hotkeys for each one hit, that shit would be sick

I always thought a cool heroic for zeratul would be for him to take a hero back with him through wormhole. Like blink in behind somebody kidnap them and blink out. But it doesn't make sense cus wormhole is a talent and it's basically just hook.

 

[natethegreat409]

Finally finished my ranked placement matches. 4-6. Bronze 1 baby.

 

[scoobs]

Finally finished my ranked placement matches. 4-6. Bronze 1 baby.

The dream

 

[Orochinagis]

Still not getting a gift , thanks blizzard

 

[Vimes]

Got a surfboard from a chest last night, and swimsuit Tracer the night before, so this game is no longer garbage.

Gonna grind a few more chests in the hope of getting a board that doesn't have a sharkbite, but I might settle because riding around on your own personal wave as pretty much any character is the best I've felt playing this game in a while.

 

[Karsticles]

When does the event end?

 

[Vimes]

When does the event end?

I think tomorrow is the last day.

 

[scoobs]

Still not getting a gift , thanks blizzard

You winning a game every day of the week?

 

[Ketch]

Im catching up in hgc. Wtf happened at the end of tf vs tempo on towers? Genji dies off screen for no reason and then tempo just stands mid doing nothing while they loose the game bottom? Can anyone explain this?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PLJ8pSmKMLG00uqagMMaS9gTLnVKuz8HMX&v=DivFfj85q1A

Time stamp is 25:00