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Hideki Kamiya speaks out on Okami Wii missing staff roll

S

stewacide

Member
BTW can someone just like to the original end sequence on YouTube or whatever so I can watch it after I finish the game? ...bonus points if it's not horribly compressed :D

edit -- above poster beat me to it, thanx
 
P

Prime Blue

Member
I uploaded the consolation prize for the owners of the Wii version. It's the original 512x448 cutscene from the PlayStation 2 version. Of course it's not as if it was in the game, but it's better than nothing.

Take that, copyright infringement!
 
Flakster99

Flakster99

Member
I haven't played Okami on the PS2, but have purchased it on the Wii. It is not a terribly big deal for me, but whatever the reasons are, it's lame.
 
D

Danielsan

Member
Prime Blue said:
I uploaded the consolation prize for the owners of the Wii version. It's the original 512x448 cutscene from the PlayStation 2 version. Of course it's not as if it was in the game, but it's better than nothing.

Take that, copyright infringement!
Click to expand...
Awsome. The youtube video really doesn't do it justice.
 
M

Mefisutoferesu

Member
I'm guessing it's because this was a Capcom USA project that they didn't own the rights to Ookami, though you would think they could very easily ask Capcom Japan. Otherwise, Inafune is one heck of a grudge keeper...
 
J

jarrod

Banned
Maybe it's a.... uh... Japanese thing? Actually, I remember Sega's old Capcom and Falcom ports didn't credit the original creators either... what about other ported games? What's standard practice for crediting on conversions?
 
R

rollingstart

Banned
John Dunbar said:
people actually read credits?
Click to expand...

I leave them running while I use my computer, but usually I do watch bits of it.

Worst is shit like Halo 3 where if you accidently skip the credits, you miss the scene after them.
 
D

Dot50Cal

Banned
jarrod said:
Maybe it's a.... uh... Japanese thing? Actually, I remember Sega's old Capcom and Falcom ports didn't credit the original creators either... what about other ported games? What's standard practice for crediting on conversions?
Click to expand...

The RE4 port has the original credits intact, and the Wii Edition credits aren't even displayed at the end of the game. You specifically have to go into EXTRAS and then "Wii Credits".
 
J

jarrod

Banned
Dot50Cal said:
The RE4 port has the original credits intact, and the Wii Edition credits aren't even displayed at the end of the game. You specifically have to go into EXTRAS and then "Wii Credits".
Click to expand...
Okay, but that was convered by the same studio. I'm guessing the PS2 version keeps the same credits too.

I'm more asking about when a different studio reprogrammes or converts a title. Actually, did Crawfish credit the SFA3 arcade team individually when they ported it to GBA? That might be a good comparison as it's somewhat similar (western team, JP game, Capcom IP)?
 
Y

Yaweee

Member
John Dunbar said:
people actually read credits?
Click to expand...

It isn't about reading who made the game, it is just one of the best ending/credit animations that's ever been in a videogame.
 
L

LiK

Member
guys who say that losing the ending credits doesn't matter obviously never watched it. it's not one of those throwaway credits like in FPS games. it's like losing those awesome endings in paper mario and FFVI.
 
S

Segata Sanshiro

Member
LiK said:
guys who say that losing the ending credits doesn't matter obviously never watched it. it's not one of those throwaway credits like in FPS games. it's like losing those awesome endings in paper mario and FFVI.
Click to expand...
Wow, what an unbelievably ignorant comment to make. I'm sure you've played every fucking FPS to completion and viewed the credits to cast aside the entire genre so easily.

You know, creative people don't just come from Japan.
 
Â

∀ Narayan

Member
Holy Hell. This fills me with disgust.

I will never purchase the Wii version. I mean, it's not like it was the better version to begin with anyway.

Not trying to start a flame war. I would advise you to withhold your negative opinions towards the above message.
 
L

LiK

Member
Segata Sanshiro said:
Wow, what an unbelievably ignorant comment to make. I'm sure you've played every fucking FPS to completion and viewed the credits to cast aside the entire genre so easily.

You know, creative people don't just come from Japan.
Click to expand...

show me a FPS game that has an ending credit sequence that mattered. i played a ton of FPS games and there is rarely an ending staff roll that added to the experience. and i never said creative people only came from japan. don't put words in my mouth.

i'm sure you played every FPS game in existence to back up your argument eh? right...
 
jts

jts

...hate me...
Prime Blue said:
I uploaded the consolation prize for the owners of the Wii version. It's the original 512x448 cutscene from the PlayStation 2 version. Of course it's not as if it was in the game, but it's better than nothing.

Take that, copyright infringement!
Click to expand...
Kudos. I'll be watching this after finishing the Wii version :D
 
S

Segata Sanshiro

Member
LiK said:
show me a FPS game that has an ending credit sequence that mattered. i played a ton of FPS games and there is rarely an ending staff roll that added to the experience. and i never said creative people only came from japan. don't put words in my mouth.

i'm sure you played every FPs game in existence to back up your argument eh? right...
Click to expand...
Logically speaking, I don't have to have played every FPS game in existence to back my argument up. I only need to provide *one* with a creative credits sequence. You're the one who has to have played them all.

And hmmm, I think I'll choose Doom 2.

I think Okami's ending sequence is beautiful too, and it's a fucking mockery that they removed it, but your comment about FPSs is just plain wrong.
 
S

Struct09

Member
LiK said:
show me a FPS game that has an ending credit sequence that mattered. i played a ton of FPS games and there is rarely an ending staff roll that added to the experience. and i never said creative people only came from japan. don't put words in my mouth.

i'm sure you played every FPS game in existence to back up your argument eh? right...
Click to expand...

Portal
 
L

LiK

Member
Segata Sanshiro said:
Logically speaking, I don't have to have played every FPS game in existence to back my argument up. I only need to provide *one* with a creative credits sequence. You're the one who has to have played them all.

And hmmm, I think I'll choose Doom 2.

I think Okami's ending sequence is beautiful too, and it's a fucking mockery that they removed it, but your comment about FPSs is just plain wrong.
Click to expand...

it's a broad general example not meant to be taken literally. and i'm not talking about which credits are more creative. it's about the experience and Okami's ending added so much to the overall experience. i don't get that from any FPS game credits which are usually throwaway cuz you can even watch them straight from the menu most of the time.. that's my opinion from my experience. i don't see anything "wrong" with what i said.

Struct09 said:
Portal
Click to expand...

that is not a shooter, which was what i was referring to.
 
M

MassiveAttack

Banned
Cosmonaut X said:
If you read the link above, you'll see it was intentional. The ending sequence was a pre-rendered movie that included the Clover logo. Capcom apparently don't have the right to use that in a game Clover weren't involved with - the port of Okami qualifies - and they didn't have the source for the movie to simply remove the logo, so they dropped it.

Frankly, the more I read about the port, the more surprised I am that RAD got anything up and running in the time they had - it seems like there was little to no cooperation from Clover and the team had to scrounge together what they could off of old hard disks and the asset dumps from Capcom.
Click to expand...

Sorry, but this utter shite. Nothing you've said here is true.
 
S

Segata Sanshiro

Member
MassiveAttack said:
Sorry, but this utter shite. Nothing you've said here is true.
Click to expand...
Well, to be fair, he's just repeating Capcom's story.

Which really smells like shit to me, too. If they can throw a black bar up to cover up boobies on a live feed of television with a 2 second delay, surely Capcom could've "whited out" Clover's logo, assuming there's even a legal problem with the logo to begin with, which itself seems like an awfully dubious claim.
 
L

LiK

Member
Danielsan said:
You said FPS. Portal is a game where you shoot portals in first person is it not?
Click to expand...

it's true that it's in FP mode, but it's considered a puzzle game. but hey, i agree that that ending was amazing. but it's not what i was referring to. add *most* FPS games to my comment if you are truly offended for some reason.
 
M

MassiveAttack

Banned
Segata Sanshiro said:
Well, to be fair, he's just repeating Capcom's story.

Which really smells like shit to me, too. If they can throw a black bar up to cover up boobies on a live feed of television with a 2 second delay, surely Capcom could've "whited out" Clover's logo, assuming there's even a legal problem with the logo to begin with, which itself seems like an awfully dubious claim.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Guess I was a little too incensed over this story. And yes, there's no excuse for this. After all, Capcom owned Clover and their IPs so any legal nonsense is simply nonsense.
 
J

jarrod

Banned
MassiveAttack said:
Sorry, but this utter shite. Nothing you've said here is true.
Click to expand...
Not according to RAD, Clover's code was in shambles and arriving piecemeal weekly. And what code they did have was supposedly a bloated mess also... honestly, I think had Capcom Japan been in charge and done the port internally, we'd have seen a much better effort from their end... but as is, it seems like they didn't care and RAD/Capcom USA were scrambling to even get this thing off the ground.
 
E

ethelred

Member
Capcom owned Clover, and Capcom owned the game, but Capcom didn't own Clover's logo in the game.

Makes perfect sense to me.
 
L

LiK

Member
jarrod said:
Not according to RAD, Clover's code was in shambles and arriving piecemeal weekly. And what code they did have was supposedly a bloated mess also... honestly, I think had Capcom Japan been in charge and done the port internally, we'd have seen a much better effort from their end... but as is, it seems like they didn't care and RAD/Capcom USA were scrambling to even get this thing off the ground.
Click to expand...

wow, that's kinda sad. but not surprising considering how poorly it sold. i would've preferred a HD PS3 port with analog controls....
 
N

Narag

Member
Mefisutoferesu said:
I'm guessing it's because this was a Capcom USA project that they didn't own the rights to Ookami, though you would think they could very easily ask Capcom Japan. Otherwise, Inafune is one heck of a grudge keeper...
Click to expand...

This sounds sensible. Do NA branches of companies have to license stuff from parent JP companies? That'd explain this somewhat better if so.



Another thought, did Capcom let the trademark on the Clover logo lapse or kill it off? Everything I'm looking at on the USPTO search has a amall image except for Clover. Not sure if its too relevant but I'm curious.
 
B

Blader

Member
Dammit...this thread is bringing back great memories of playing Okami. I'd replay it if it weren't 30 hours long.
 
J

jarrod

Banned
Mefisutoferesu said:
Otherwise, Inafune is one heck of a grudge keeper...
Click to expand...
This honestly wouldn't surprise me... I don't think it's a coincidence that as soon as Inafune rose to power, Production Studio 3 (who'd violated Inafune's precious Rockman X series for years) was systematically dismantled. Inafune was also behind the Clover and Flagship shutdowns too.

Honestly, something tells me there more politics in play on Japan side than we've been led to believe...
 
C

C- Warrior

Banned
I remember DMC1's ending credits, thought it was badass how they saved the best CG work to be displayed during the credits. First time I felt a developer had 'balls' to do what he wants, whereas most would say "show the best cg in the first 30 seconds of the game."

Kamiya = favorite game director, easily. It's like he exists soley to make games that I love.
 
M

monkeylite

Member
Who cares if the video was pre rendered? Even a simple credit scroll would have suffice, though I rather have the beautiful PS2 credit sequence. There is no excuse why people who work on the game are not being credited.

Edit: So the epilogue has been removed too?
 
T

Terrell

Member
ethelred said:
I'm no lawyer, but I have a hard time with this one. Capcom couldn't use the Clover logo, even though Clover was a subsidiary of Capcom? So Capcom has the ability to dissolve the company, but can't use its logo? Hmm...
Click to expand...
The key word is "was". Rare WAS a 2nd-party subsidiary of Nintendo, and we all know THAT situation isn't so cut-and-dry either. Corporate law will be the death of mankind, I'm sure of it.
 
T

Terrell

Member
stewacide said:
Not having the source files for a lot of the cut scenes is really puzzling: you'd think a big corporation like Capcom would want to keep that sort of stuff around?!?!?
Click to expand...
Well, keep in mind, according to Square Enix, they lost most of the original code for most of their NES and SNES games which is preventing a Virtual Console release of their classics.

I know, I don't believe it either, but given the state of the code Ready At Dawn was sent, it wouldn't shock me.
 
E

ethelred

Member
Terrell said:
The key word is "was". Rare WAS a 2nd-party subsidiary of Nintendo, and we all know THAT situation isn't so cut-and-dry either. Corporate law will be the death of mankind, I'm sure of it.
Click to expand...

But Capcom didn't sell their subsidiary to another party. They absorbed it back into the larger company. The analogy is absurd.
 
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