blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
2.26GHz dual core.
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Intel: future CPUs to be slower but more efficient
- Thread starter Renekton
- Start date
lightchris
Member
Developing a game for 4K means there is less power left for more advanced rendering techniques and assets (the latter being the most cost-intensive), so it could actually be cheaper.
The reason why most next gen games probably won't be 4K is because the hardware won't have advanced enough by then. If all the extra GPU power is spent for increasing the resolution and won't allow for other substantial improvements, people will be disappointed.
CPU doesn't have any influence on rendering resolution. Meaning, if it can run a game at 60 fps in 1080p, it can run the same game at 60 fps in 4K. It's the GPU that has to keep up when increasing the resolution.
DonMigs85
Member
Huh? You've got it wrong - the higher the resolution, the less CPU-bound you are. It's the GPU doing all the pixel pushing.
Well that's something new I've learnt today. Completely misread the benchmarks I was double-checking lol.
There's good and bad to be taken from this.
Bad: We won't be getting massive jumps in CPUs for a while.
Good: The 2600K I bought when released and still use today even at stock speeds is probably one of the best purchases I've ever made gaming wise, god-tier status.
Guess I'll just be getting some more RAM and a new videocard instead of building a new rig. Fine with me. Will put that saved money to a new monitor or something instead.
Bad: We won't be getting massive jumps in CPUs for a while.
Good: The 2600K I bought when released and still use today even at stock speeds is probably one of the best purchases I've ever made gaming wise, god-tier status.
Guess I'll just be getting some more RAM and a new videocard instead of building a new rig. Fine with me. Will put that saved money to a new monitor or something instead.
longdi
Banned
I dont know if problems with manufacturing at smaller node is troubling Intel, but imo Skylake launch is messy and not what one should expect from Intel.
As an early adopter of 6700HQ and 6600K, i find Intel getting lazy in even ensuring a good launch.
Dropping AVX3, downgrading performance
https://linustechtips.com/main/topi...e-cpus-for-pcs-wont-support-avx-512-aka-avx3/
and then gets bugged, because there are some AVX3 traces leftover which caused programs that initiate it, to crash
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016...auses-pcs-to-freeze-during-complex-workloads/
First batch of consumer Skylake missing a security feature, fml
http://techreport.com/news/29146/intel-to-begin-shipping-skylake-cpus-with-sgx-enabled
Half ass feature added in later, Win10 only,
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9751/examining-intel-skylake-speed-shift-more-responsive-processors
but not all manufacturers wants or have yet to include it in their bios
https://rog.asus.com/forum/showthre...el-Speed-Shift&p=564458&viewfull=1#post564458
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...oftware-problems.784691/page-12#post-10170924
CPU bendgate
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015...-bent-and-broken-by-some-third-party-coolers/
FCLK fail at launch, affecting graphics performance
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9607/skylake-discrete-graphics-performance-pcie-optimizations
Flickering iGPU bug
http://www.windowscentral.com/dec-6th-generation-intel-core-beta-graphics-driver-windows-10
Sleep bug on mobile
http://tech.firstpost.com/news-anal...issue-bug-will-be-fixed-next-year-290497.html
My 6600K was performing lower than expected on Asus Gene at launch, and only with the latest bios released last month, things are where i expect it to be.
As an early adopter of 6700HQ and 6600K, i find Intel getting lazy in even ensuring a good launch.
Dropping AVX3, downgrading performance
https://linustechtips.com/main/topi...e-cpus-for-pcs-wont-support-avx-512-aka-avx3/
and then gets bugged, because there are some AVX3 traces leftover which caused programs that initiate it, to crash
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016...auses-pcs-to-freeze-during-complex-workloads/
First batch of consumer Skylake missing a security feature, fml
http://techreport.com/news/29146/intel-to-begin-shipping-skylake-cpus-with-sgx-enabled
Half ass feature added in later, Win10 only,
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9751/examining-intel-skylake-speed-shift-more-responsive-processors
but not all manufacturers wants or have yet to include it in their bios
https://rog.asus.com/forum/showthre...el-Speed-Shift&p=564458&viewfull=1#post564458
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...oftware-problems.784691/page-12#post-10170924
CPU bendgate
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2015...-bent-and-broken-by-some-third-party-coolers/
FCLK fail at launch, affecting graphics performance
http://www.anandtech.com/show/9607/skylake-discrete-graphics-performance-pcie-optimizations
Flickering iGPU bug
http://www.windowscentral.com/dec-6th-generation-intel-core-beta-graphics-driver-windows-10
Sleep bug on mobile
http://tech.firstpost.com/news-anal...issue-bug-will-be-fixed-next-year-290497.html
My 6600K was performing lower than expected on Asus Gene at launch, and only with the latest bios released last month, things are where i expect it to be.
DonMigs85
Member
All those are reasons why I'm skipping Skylake and planning to upgrade to a Core i5-4590 and a cheap mobo later this year. Then I'll upgrade again in 2020 to whatever's good then.
Actually anyone who's already on Sandy, Ivy, Haswell or Broadwell should probably just wait until Intel releases a consumer processor with the full complement of AVX-512 instructions. It'll be much more future-proof.
There is also fresh uncertainty about Skylake TSX.
longdi
Banned
WTF! I found my 6700HQ does not have TSX!
While the similarly priced 6820HQ and 6820HK do!
http://ark.intel.com/products/family/88392/6th-Generation-Intel-Core-i7-Processors#@Mobile
And then the newest 6770HQ with the big bad Iris Pro does not have TSX too!
I would thought TSX bug is fixed by now, and all processors should come with it and everyone can start writing software for TSX!
What a mess.
DonMigs85
Member
I honestly wonder why they still pushed Skylake out the door in this state, since TSX was touted quite a bit but hasn't been a working instruction in most of their processors since 2013.
Also, I read that their heatspreader TIM is still rather lousy in most Skylake units. Ivy Bridge was the last generation they used good TIM on everything. Maybe they'll release another Devil's Canyon-like version of Skylake. Imagine... charging more for fancier TIM which likely costs them a few cents more at most.
That was me pretty much.
I didn't even bother over clocking mine while I had it. Before I had it I was constantly dropping new CPUs in, over clocking, tweaking etc.
Bought the Q6600 and it stayed untouched for 4 years or so, before I bought a 2600k, which was then another 3 years.
I bought a 5820k last March, set it to 4ghz, and that will be it for, well, until something major happens I guess.
arent 5775C / 5675C better for games, or did that change?
Yes, in 2025.
longdi
Banned
Skylake mobile 45W processors actually performed worse than their Broadwell equivalent, while not offering any noticeable power savings!
No idea why Intel had to decrease Skylake turbo clocks lower than Broadwell.
F-Intel.
Anandtech speculate it was because Skylake initial FCLK bug that caused lower gaming performance rather than the eDRAM.
SolarMystic
Member
I was getting ready to upgrade my 920 to a 6600k system. You guys got me thinking differently now.
DonMigs85
Member
Cannonlake should hopefully iron out most of the bugs, but it might still lack some AVX-512 instructions. I would still stick with your 920 at least another year or two.
Did you do any benchmarks to show what the performance difference was like? I've had my 6700K/Asus Maximus Hero for 5 months now, and I'm still on a BIOS from October I think. While my performance has been excellent so far, if there have been performance improvements I might update my BIOS... as much as I hate doing it. If it ain't broke don't fix it etc.
Locuza
Member
Cannonlake or Cannonlake-E, because I don't believe the consumer-space will get AVX-512 soon.
DonMigs85
Member
BIOS updates aren't such a problem on modern motherboards now thanks to redundancy. There's always a backup just in case.
anothertech
Member
I feel like liquid cooled solutions will become more prevalent and less expensive. I run my liquid cooled cpu oc'd at 4.6 ghz and it's just a matter of time until it becomes the norm.
My Asus mobo has a 'Flashback' procedure, I just hope I never have to use it
It really was easy updating my Bios back in October, and that was the first time I'd updated a Bios since back in the days of the Abit NF7-S mobo and AMD XP2500+
thekiddfran
Member
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
Intel stated AVX-512 is Xeon only, with no plants to bring it to consumer.
Negotiator
Member
Does Intel have any plans for a 14nm variant of 5820K (22nm)?
Also, what's the equivalent Intel CPU to the upcoming Zen processor (40% IPC increase)?
Also, what's the equivalent Intel CPU to the upcoming Zen processor (40% IPC increase)?
Kudo
Member
On the same boat, Z170-A here and just checked that there's already 9 BIOS updates for it.
Looking at the article seems like the better GPU you have the less you get from the update(3.29% increase at max, 0.08% minimum), I'm planning to go for Pascal so I don't really want to risk bricking my mobo.
cyen
Member
They will be probably be on Haswell IPC performance level, but only time will tell.
Negotiator
Member
I guess Haswell IPC performance level is good enough for most games, isn't it?
boredandlazy
Member
Wonder if dual socket motherboards will become more commonplace?
Theonik
Member
It's been lousy since Ivy Bridge launch unless you either forked for the enthusiast chips or bought a Devil's Canyon chip for which the better TIM was a major selling point. A Skylake refresh like Devil's Canyon might be welcome considering I expect the next generation to be delayed, but it's not as essential as it was with Haswell since Intel moved the voltage regulation out of the CPU package again.
Unlikely. It is still very likely to be a niche enthusiast or server configuration.
Mac@NeoGAF
Banned
Currently running a 4690K (4.5Ghz) 8GB of DDR3 (2600Mhz) and dual 970's.
Going to get a 4790K, add another 8GB, sell my 970's and buy one of the new Pascal cards in the summer.
Selling on the 4690K and 970's, it won't even cost me that much either and I think that will keep me going for the next 3yrs or so without too much difficulty.
Going to get a 4790K, add another 8GB, sell my 970's and buy one of the new Pascal cards in the summer.
Selling on the 4690K and 970's, it won't even cost me that much either and I think that will keep me going for the next 3yrs or so without too much difficulty.
clem84
Gold Member
Is this a big deal?
I hear people in this thread claiming that their 2500K still enables them to play recent games at high settings, provided they have a recent GPU of course. So if GPU performance keeps going up, then this doesn't really matter does it?
Now, if this is happening in the CPU space then it's a matter of time before GPUs suffer the same fate, one could argue they're already starting to, but CPUs won't be the reason PC performance won't increase as much?
I hear people in this thread claiming that their 2500K still enables them to play recent games at high settings, provided they have a recent GPU of course. So if GPU performance keeps going up, then this doesn't really matter does it?
Now, if this is happening in the CPU space then it's a matter of time before GPUs suffer the same fate, one could argue they're already starting to, but CPUs won't be the reason PC performance won't increase as much?
longdi
Banned
I did not do any extensive tests and no games were tested too (since it was not meant to be a gaming PC).
I only ran some benchmarks and stress tests and comparing to the results on-line, it was slower than Haswell 4690K. My guess is the turbo or the voltage back then was still buggy.
Here i am now, the performance results are better. IIRC, Cinebench R15 scores were around 600 then, but now i can get to 700 with the latest bios.
Besides better performance, i am able to get a more stable overclock, faster boot/shutdown time, fix the audio popping issues, generally W10 felt more snappy.
You should update bios.
You'd get a good boost there. Haswell and beyond was a significant step up.
Broadwell-E will be 14nm IIRC
Locuza
Member
Yes and very likely the same will be true for Cannonlake.
It would be fantastic for AMD, but in many cases they will not reach Haswell IPC.
BossDarkseid
Member
5820k for life...does not feel like a joke anymore.
longdi
Banned
Intel stopping base clock overclocking on Skylake now
http://techreport.com/news/29686/asrock-kills-its-skyoc-bclk-overclocking-feature
Just 5 years ago with Sandy Bridge, Intel allowed limited over-clocking for non-K cpu...
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4083/...-core-i7-2600k-i5-2500k-core-i3-2100-tested/3
http://techreport.com/news/29686/asrock-kills-its-skyoc-bclk-overclocking-feature
Just 5 years ago with Sandy Bridge, Intel allowed limited over-clocking for non-K cpu...
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4083/...-core-i7-2600k-i5-2500k-core-i3-2100-tested/3
Insane Metal
Member
It doesn't... at least for a good few years. It's been a HELL of a challenge to isolate the compound and make it work properly (closing/opening gates). So the number of errors they get is still huge.
Skyfireblaze
Member
In the light of this thread I'm thinking if I should maybe sell my 3570k and try to ebay a 3770k for under 200, hmm.
Cheeseman Battitude
Member
I feel my i5 3450 is still good for a couple of years. But it's coming up to 4 years old and Windows 10 was still a twinkle in Microsoft's eye when my motherboard was new, so a new system would be nice even if the CPU side of it wouldn't be a massive leap. That's assuming Zen is just hype.
Locuza
Member
Locuza
Member
Of course not (SoC APU) but it would be a Enthusiast APU.
It's still declared under AMD's APU term:
http://www.3dcenter.org/dateien/abbildungen/AMD-Product-Roadmap-Januar-2016-Slide7.jpg
It's still declared under AMD's APU term:
http://www.3dcenter.org/dateien/abbildungen/AMD-Product-Roadmap-Januar-2016-Slide7.jpg