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Is "The Winds of Winter" ever coming out?
- Thread starter SpaceWolf
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Booker Dewitt
Member
I kind of don't care at this point. I gave up on Dance halfway through with the intent of going through it in the lead up to the sixth book, that was two years ago at this point iirc.
I think in a couple years I'll reread the first book, and I'll probably watch the series when it's completed. But the fifth season and the slog that was Dance killed my interest in the series future.
I think in a couple years I'll reread the first book, and I'll probably watch the series when it's completed. But the fifth season and the slog that was Dance killed my interest in the series future.
hahaha dude probably doesn't even know what a laptop is
echoshifting
Banned
He's deathly allergic to modern technology I'm afraid
And by modern I mean anything from the last twenty years
It isn't Gendry but the character who escapes ritual sacrifice on Dragonstone is never seen again.
andythinkpad
Member
I had completely forgotten the "book alternate universe" exist that it took me a few seconds to remember this is the book 6 not the book 7.
Right now, the only thing that matters to me is try to avoid s7 spoilers while navigating GAF.
Right now, the only thing that matters to me is try to avoid s7 spoilers while navigating GAF.
CrichtonKicks
Member
Wait, what?
AngmarsKing701
Member
When the show and the books crossed streams, the books died.
We might get Winds but never Spring.
Shift your attention to Tad Williams (Osten Ard) or Brandon Sanderson (Stormlight Archive). At least those authors know how to work at completing something.
We might get Winds but never Spring.
Shift your attention to Tad Williams (Osten Ard) or Brandon Sanderson (Stormlight Archive). At least those authors know how to work at completing something.
Is that the Storm kid?
Is it true that he types with just two fingers? lol
There's just no endgame in sight. I'll give D&D props for at least taking us there.
There's just no endgame in sight. I'll give D&D props for at least taking us there.
Yeah Edric Storm... there was also none of that weird Melisandre sex scene thing
Sometimes I like to remind myself that this was supposed to be a trilogy. And then the book after Storm was supposed to skip some time and pick up events, but he decided to write a book to fill in that blank. Then he couldn't figure out how to move a plot ahead in the filler and so he split it into two books.
The kid who plays Bran was less than a year old when Storm of Swords came out. I wouldn't be surprised if he turns 18 before we find out what GRRM originally planned to do before the Mereen situation caused books of stalling, or whatever happened.
RoninChaos
Member
The problem is caused by the fact that he's an exploratory writer. He doesn't use an outline and just sees where the story goes. That's why the 4th and 5th books just kind of meander about with no end or goal in sight. That's why he's saying he can do an 8th book. And at this point he's just wasting everyone's time and I think most people don't give a shit anymore. Why should they when it appears the author doesn't?
I honestly think if the books do finish up the story is going to be wildly different from how the show does. Maybe a couple key moments will match up but everything in between them and even who lives and dies will be totally different.
I'd actually love if Martin kept Jon Snow dead in the books but I don't think he'll go that far.
Edit: Whoops sorry about the spoiler.
John Dunbar
correct about everything
winds, maybe.
dream, no.
time for wolves, hahahaha
dream, no.
time for wolves, hahahaha
Bounceounce
Member
It's a different, younger bastard (which means none of that seducing stuff) named Edric Storm who Davos saves.
"Edric was conceived by Robert and Delena on the wedding night of Stannis Baratheon and Selyse Florent (Delena's cousin), in the couple's wedding bed. Stannis saw this as an insult to his honor, so he sent Edric to Storm's End to foster with his other uncle, Renly Baratheon.[6] As Delena was a noblewoman, Edric was acknowledged by his father.[7][2] He was raised in relative comfort at Storm's End under the guardianship of Cortnay Penrose, Renly's castellan, who is very fond of him.[8]
Edric has been sent a gift from his father every year on his name day. These have included a pony, a sable cloak, and a child-sized warhammer similar to his father's weapon. Edric would write to King's Landing to thank his father for the gifts, but upon receiving the letters Robert would laugh and ask Varys what he had sent that year."
after having discovered Gendry, Lord Eddard Stark thinks about all of King Robert I Baratheon's bastards that he knows about, Edric included.[7]
A Clash of Kings
When Stannis besieges Storm's End, Ser Cortnay Penrose resists in fear of what Stannis would do to Edric. Ultimately Stannis takes the castle and ships Edric to Dragonstone, where he spends time with Stannis's daughter, Princess Shireen.[3]
A Storm of Swords
Melisandre pressures Stannis to sacrifice Edric, as she believes that his royal blood would wake dragons from stone to help Stannis. Conversely, Ser Davos Seaworth pressures Stannis to spare him.[4] Edric is leeched and his blood is used in a ritual to curse the three rival kings, Joffrey Baratheon, Balon Greyjoy, and Robb Stark.[5]
Subsequently, Balon falls at Pyke,[9] Robb is killed in the Red Wedding,[10] and Joffrey is poisoned at his royal wedding.[11] Concerned that Stannis will burn Edric, Davos, with the help of Pylos and a small group of king's men, has Edric secretly shipped away to the Free Cities aboard the Mad Prendos.[12] Davos appoints Andrew Estermont, Edric's cousin, to act as his guardian. Gerald Gower, Triston of Tally Hill, Lewys the Fishwife, and Omer Blackberry also accompany Edric, to be his guards and protectors.[13]
A Feast for Crows
Edric is sailing across the narrow sea to Essos on the Mad Prendos with Andrew and other protectors.[14]
A Dance with Dragons
Edric is in hiding in Lys with his guardian and protectors.[13"
Book Gendry actually had a falling out with Arya and joined the brotherhood without banners in book 3 and then the brotherhood lead by Lady Stoneheart, he saves Briennes life in her second to last book 4 chapter (and she actually recognized who he was but didn't get a chance to tell him).
"Edric was conceived by Robert and Delena on the wedding night of Stannis Baratheon and Selyse Florent (Delena's cousin), in the couple's wedding bed. Stannis saw this as an insult to his honor, so he sent Edric to Storm's End to foster with his other uncle, Renly Baratheon.[6] As Delena was a noblewoman, Edric was acknowledged by his father.[7][2] He was raised in relative comfort at Storm's End under the guardianship of Cortnay Penrose, Renly's castellan, who is very fond of him.[8]
Edric has been sent a gift from his father every year on his name day. These have included a pony, a sable cloak, and a child-sized warhammer similar to his father's weapon. Edric would write to King's Landing to thank his father for the gifts, but upon receiving the letters Robert would laugh and ask Varys what he had sent that year."
after having discovered Gendry, Lord Eddard Stark thinks about all of King Robert I Baratheon's bastards that he knows about, Edric included.[7]
A Clash of Kings
When Stannis besieges Storm's End, Ser Cortnay Penrose resists in fear of what Stannis would do to Edric. Ultimately Stannis takes the castle and ships Edric to Dragonstone, where he spends time with Stannis's daughter, Princess Shireen.[3]
A Storm of Swords
Melisandre pressures Stannis to sacrifice Edric, as she believes that his royal blood would wake dragons from stone to help Stannis. Conversely, Ser Davos Seaworth pressures Stannis to spare him.[4] Edric is leeched and his blood is used in a ritual to curse the three rival kings, Joffrey Baratheon, Balon Greyjoy, and Robb Stark.[5]
Subsequently, Balon falls at Pyke,[9] Robb is killed in the Red Wedding,[10] and Joffrey is poisoned at his royal wedding.[11] Concerned that Stannis will burn Edric, Davos, with the help of Pylos and a small group of king's men, has Edric secretly shipped away to the Free Cities aboard the Mad Prendos.[12] Davos appoints Andrew Estermont, Edric's cousin, to act as his guardian. Gerald Gower, Triston of Tally Hill, Lewys the Fishwife, and Omer Blackberry also accompany Edric, to be his guards and protectors.[13]
A Feast for Crows
Edric is sailing across the narrow sea to Essos on the Mad Prendos with Andrew and other protectors.[14]
A Dance with Dragons
Edric is in hiding in Lys with his guardian and protectors.[13"
Book Gendry actually had a falling out with Arya and joined the brotherhood without banners in book 3 and then the brotherhood lead by Lady Stoneheart, he saves Briennes life in her second to last book 4 chapter (and she actually recognized who he was but didn't get a chance to tell him).
I'm pretty sure most people give a shit, just not the angry ones like you.
Book 4 doesn't meander, he puts everything in place where it needs to be.
Don't bring show spoilers into a thread on the books. What the fuck
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Gross
Ganzlinger
Member
The Last Guardian will come out first
I mean that's a pretty easy claim to make at this point. If you want to keep it interesting you have to put up something like Half Life 3 or maybe Star Citizen.
scorcher59
Member
You know what If I was GRRM, who is currently swimming in monies, I'd do exactly the same, I might get around some time to getting it done but then again there's no rush at all
Game of Thrones the show will have started, run a full course, and have finished in less time than it took George RR Martin to write one book.
lol
John Dunbar
correct about everything
so what will be the rules for the show spoilers going forward? people posting book spoilers have been getting banned for years now, so are show watchers expected to return the favour to those who are holding out for the books?
That's honestly an unbelievable prospect.
I don't think it matters much. The show has greatly deviated from the events of the books.
Bounceounce
Member
Look what he had to say on that:
https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/51bbv5/spoilers_main_brandon_sanderson_shared_his/
It wasn't unreasonable to assume the show would flop. To publish the book in July 2011, immediately after season 1, A Dance With Dragons would need to be finished up in March with final editing into April since it takes at least 3 months for a book to get printed and shipped.
So everything for ADWD was done before the show hit the air and before it HBO immediately renewed it for season 2. Season 1 started on 17 April 2011, renewed on 19th April an according to this forum post detailing the history of ADWD George finished all writing on 27th April (warning huge image) http://i.imgur.com/dyCxm7m.png
The TV show had a troubled birth, they basically had to fully reshoot the pilot episode, re-cast Dany and a load of other issues. David and Dan talked about it on a podcast a while ago. It was also a really expensive show with a huge cast and both costs would rise as the story went on. It was a risky venture into a niche genre and HBO could have easily pulled the plug if the viewer numbers weren't there.
He already had 6 years since Feast so the publishers weren't going to miss out on a chance to strike while they had the chance. Look how they have released a new* Game of Thrones book every year, this year it is the 20th Anniversary Edition of A Game of Thrones.
Well tbf, ADwD came out after season 1
Business
Member
Doesn't matter unless TWOW is released within a couple months of the series finale. Which might be this season - is anyone sure about that? Presumably HBO are going to split it in half like every other network
What did he say? Reddit threads are hard to follow. Couldn't find it in there.
Every time I think about how long this book is taking to come out, I get very sad. And then I get even sadder when I think about how there is still ANOTHER FUCKING BOOK after this one.
Maybe ol' Georgie will pull a fast one on all of us and release both books at the same time. A man can dream (of spring).
Maybe ol' Georgie will pull a fast one on all of us and release both books at the same time. A man can dream (of spring).
Bounceounce
Member
(Sanderson is a Reddit poster so these are replies to posts)
"Censor? Strange word to use, but perhaps appropriate here. I don't censor my own writing--I just write what I feel is right, and what fits. But if I were writing on this series, and didn't include it...hmm, yes perhaps that would be the right term.
But the point is moot, as I wouldn't say yes to finishing ASOIAF, if asked. (And I don't think they'd ask me.) I'd respectfully decline. I wouldn't be right for the job for many reasons. I wouldn't want to put in the content that the series has, and part of that is due to my religious faith, part of it is just who I am. I don't shy away from difficult material, but I prefer not to get explicit. Honestly, when I read it in George's work, I often just cringe. I don't think it fits in prose; I think it looks tacky. But that's almost 100% due to the my religious leanings. I realize that others don't read such scenes in the same way as I do.
However, I'd suggest that this is actually a minor reason why I'd be a bad writer on this series, despite having enormous respect for GRRM and his talent as a storyteller.
The primary reason has to do with fundamental optimism vs pessimism. I write darkness into my books, but it is darkness as contrast to light, and there is always a spark of hope. George's work seems fundamentally pessimistic--which I don't say as a slam. One of my favorite short stories is Harrison Bergeron, which is also fundamentally pessimistic. Saying George's work is pessimistic doesn't mean that HE is pessimistic, only that he creates a work of art that evokes emotion and discussion through pessimistic themes.
As a comparison, I'm glad that Silver Age science fiction produced both Harrison Bergeron and Star Trek--but I'm Star Trek, not Harrison Bergeron. Calling me in to work on this piece would be like calling in Spielberg to finish a Tarantino film. (Not to imply I deserve to be ranked with either one.) Sure, he could do it, but wouldn't you want someone who themselves makes films with Tarantino-like themes?
My work is also fundamentally different from George's in our use of magic. We've talked about books, and he points out (rightly) that I often use a heavily magical component in my stories--particularly the endings. This is because I'm writing science/magic hybrids, and the idea of magic as progress is fascinating to me. George, however, prefers his magic to be arcane, unknown, and dark--not a tool, but a force you can sometimes (with great danger) apply. This is a small issue, as I'm fond of books that use magic differently, I've just made a stylistic choice in how I do what I do.
Anyway, hope that helps. I get this question (or ones like it) enough that I thought I should give a more in-depth answer."
"I'll admit, I haven't read the entire ASOIF. I read the first book, and while I though the writing was excellent (I've enjoyed a lot of George's short fiction) I found the experience too much for me. It didn't feel realistic so much as, "Look how much I can build someone up before I destroy them." Which is an absolute art--it's using emotion in a very powerful and clever way. But I feel that he's often doing things to shock and surprise, precisely because they'd be too pessimistic for an ordinary fantasy series. (Indeed, his series feels like distinct reaction and contrast to the cozy fantasy stories of the eighties.)
That said, I realize that my friends who love ASOIAF point out that part of the strengths of the series is how he takes people you thought were irredeemable, and then makes you root for them--which does indeed have an optimism to it. And since I haven't read the entire series, I can't speak from a position of authority. Indeed, it may be too early to judge for any of us (as you point out) because we haven't seen where the journey takes the characters.
I'd say on your second point is a valid one. I considered talking more about magic out in my original post, but felt I'd gone too long already. I'd say it's not the divine nature of magic in mine, so much as the reliable, tool-based nature of the magic. In both, you can use it for good or for evil--but in George's books, he often takes a more classic "Wonder" style approach to magic. Meaning, you never know exactly what the ramifications of using it will be, and you can't ever truly control it. In a way, most magic in his books is akin to the One Ring, while my magic tends to be an unexplored science that--if understood--can indeed by used reliably. Strangely, in this, he's more Tolkien, and I'm more Asimov. (Though Asimov would likely hate a fantasy writer comparing themselves to him.)
Thanks for poking at me. You make some very interesting points."
"As I said, I read the first one, which is not uncommon for me. There are a TON of series where I read only the first, even if I like them. Because there are a lot of people writing great fiction, and I feel that it's important to keep tabs on what everyone is doing, so that I can learn from them. Recently, I read the first of the Expanse, and despite enjoying it a lot, I don't know when/if I'll have the time to get the second.
With Ice and Fire, I specifically found Daenerys's plot too brutal. I'm all for putting characters into terrible situations, and letting horrible things happen. But her plot crossed the line for me. I did not want to read a series where teenage girls have their brothers brutally murdered before them, are raped into submission, finally fall into a kind of stockholm syndrome love with their captor, then get betrayed for showing a little kindness. There's a kind of brilliance to the way that plot played out, but when I was done with it, I just felt sick.
It's not a value judgement for anyone else. I decided from that, however, that series was not for me. I've kept tabs on the plot and worldbuilding, however, because it would be foolish not to be aware of what the top of one's field is doing."
The chain of quotes makes GRRM seem like a pathological liar.
You know it's true. Not only is GOT the only ending we're going to get, but it'll be completely free of the dozens of side characters and itemized grocery lists that bog down Martin's narrative.
They will come out because there's too much money in them. I have to believe the publisher already had a contingency and another author lined up. I wouldn't be surpsied if they commissioned ideas from other authors either on the sly or with GRRMs knowledge to get a choice picked out.
The smart thing for GRRM to do would be to let them be "ghost" written now, so they can pull that Tom Clancy deal where GRRMs name still takes up half the page woth the real author at the bottom.
The writing had deteriorated so badly in ADwD that someone else finishing wpuld be preferred.
I cant take another 1000 instances of words are wind and little and less.
The smart thing for GRRM to do would be to let them be "ghost" written now, so they can pull that Tom Clancy deal where GRRMs name still takes up half the page woth the real author at the bottom.
The writing had deteriorated so badly in ADwD that someone else finishing wpuld be preferred.
I cant take another 1000 instances of words are wind and little and less.
I was gonna say - by the time it comes out, we'll no longer have winters.
Bounceounce
Member
Are you serious?
You'd really prefer someone else writing this series (it wouldn't be this series if that was the case).
Absolutely absurd.
Look above.
Given how Feast and especially Dance compare to the first three? Yes. In a total vacuum, I wouldnt believe the same author wrote both the trilogy and the two followups
Frozenprince
Banned
Yeah people forget Sanderson wears strange underwear (he's a Mormon) so him finishing a book with copious amounts of polygamy and incest might seem like a natural fit but.
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