3DS doesnt have the lineup DS had. No Brain Age or Nintendogs like megahit for a new audience. No huge hype over a new 2D Mario like NSMB had. So no, I wouldnt say the lineup is stronger.
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Japanese mobile game sales are now bigger than regular Japanese game + hardware sales
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
3DS doesnt have the lineup DS had. No Brain Age or Nintendogs like megahit for a new audience. No huge hype over a new 2D Mario like NSMB had. So no, I wouldnt say the lineup is stronger.
Devilgunman
Member
This is where gaming is going. Phone will keep getting better and more games will keep coming. It's reality that we have to live with.
Bigmac1910
Member
I don't know if Valve can win, as long as smartphones are evolving at this rate for the next five years, I think smartphones might just win at the end of the decade.
Technically I can already hook up my Galaxy Note II, through an HDMI adapter, and I could buy a MOGA controller which has native support for over a hundred Android games. It's just not seamless out of the box, and that's what is needed before mobile gaming can truly challenge the console market. iOS 7 is going to support controllers natively so it will be interesting to see how the market will evolve.
It's funny but BoF 6 will probably be the most profitable BoF game by a mile. Mobile for those core popular franchises that never had huge sales especially from big publishers like Capcom, SE etc is the way to use the IP and profit from it. Making a new game for home console or handheld at this point is just too risky and overall profit is most likely going to be lower when you take development costs in to account if you even make a profit...
Ban Puncher
Member
Triggerhappytel
Member
Except that due to no buttons we'll never see games as slick and complex as Gravity Rush or Uncharted: GA on a touch screen. In almost every 'big' mobile game review I've read - Deus Ex: The Fall as a recent example - awkward, poor or compromised controls are always listed as a caveat preventing enjoyment. I honestly cannot see a satisfactory resolution without add-on buttons.
Add-on buttons isn't satisfactory either. Nobody wants tech tumors awkwardly bolted to their devices, that's exactly counter to the sleekness and usability of smartphones.
If Smartphones evolve to that degree, they'll be hooked up to a TV, and folks will be able to play serious games on the smartphone hooked to a TV. In which case it won't drastically change things. You may need a more open platform- I suspect the strat game folks who put up fierce resistance to a walled garden (that's what I think would keep traditional PC gaming alive- many Civ IV players refused to buy CIv V due to Steam- grognards gonna grognard)
Also folks are going to want to play their backlogs. Only thing that would force that to change is Microsoft suiciding Windows. Valve isn't stupid, they'll adjust if needbe.
Stone Ocean
Member
Not to mention the games will be mostly tailored to touch/motion controls, so even with a decent add-on they'll feel like shit because the game was made with simpler controls in mind.
There's simply no middle ground here. It's either a console mobile game - like a handheld - or a touchy mobile game, we're never having a compromise between each one because each game's target audience wants different things on their games.
2011: Nobody wants to play games on their smartphones.
2012: Nobody will pay more than 69p for a mobile game.
2013: Nobody will use the standardised controllers.
2014: Nobody will buy the TV docking station.
etc etc..
I don't think it's wise to make sweeping proclamations about such a huge and dynamic market. For all we know, a games-focused iPhone with built in buttons is just a year away. For all we know, smartphones might lose their lustre and be replaced by Google Glasses or the like within 5 years.
Modern Combat 4. Deus Ex: The Fall. Max Payne. GTA3. I could go on, but they prove the concept perfectly.
These games are already out there and use touch controls. Adding pad functionality would be totally trivial and open them up to a new set of people. It'll be the same going forward. Use the pad or the touchscreen, according to your preference.
sixteen-bit
Member
not enough salty reactions
Stone Ocean
Member
I'm talking game balance here. These games are built with touch in mind, so you take something like Deus Ex that has lock-on aiming or Modern Combat with it's simpler hip firing and put it on a controller it will feel like shit because those games weren't made assuming you had more precise inputs. That's not to say that they are bad or anything, but while they are good touch titles if you shove a controller on them they'll feel like a horrible console game.
Max Payne 3 and GTA3? Those are console games, come on.
If they introduced an official gamepad add-on, similar to the bladepad, and they dropped the requirement that all games be playable with touchscreen controls, then I'd be perfectly fine with mobile gaming being the go-to handheld device. As it is right now, I'm perfectly fine with my VITA.
How is that any different from balancing games for controller and keyboard and mouse though? Just disable / enable all the auto aim stuff when a controller is plugged in.
Edit: I'm well aware that Max Payne and GTA are console games, my point is that these games already exist even before controller support hits.
It's not a dynamic market, in fact it already a pretty stale market. Phone growth has slowed and the initial innovation burst has moved to spec-porn or just cheaper models that do the same thing. You might might find these things unpredictable but there's plenty from which to formulate. In 2005 it was also unthinkable to have a touch screen without and stylus and a phone without a keyboard. The crux of the modern smartphone were exactly the rejection of those 2 ideas. It wasn't just merging PDAs and phones. If you understand why people enjoy smartphones then you will naturally understand the limitations.
This isn't to say smartphones won't be replaced by something newer, I'm already expecting that but it seems unlikely they will evolve with buttons shells simply because a company making a smartphone needs to have a good smartphone first because that's the audience. They are buying an essential communication tool that just so happens to do a lot of other stuff (and that's how they justify it). Otherwise you get something like the xperia play.
Stone Ocean
Member
You're assuming devs will even bother.
EDIT - It's not the same as controller/keyboard. Both have very similar mediums - analogs/mouse, buttons/keys - that can be rearranged and shortcut easily. Making a game that usually uses two analogs, the D-pad and all 10 buttons work on touch alone is not the bloody same, specially when working with a small screen, you only have so much space to clutter shit with before making stuff automatic or being forced to drop systems.
Well, people aren't going to stop purchasing smartphones. If there *is* a crash - and I'm in two minds about whether that might happen - it'll come from saturation; people being perfectly content with the products they have that there's simply little scope for a new entry to make significant headway.
It's too early to say if that will happen; it's certainly concievable, but the market is so much larger than on current consoles that there may always be a reasonable-sized audience for new content.
Really, the news is less about total dollars (yen) and more about time allotted. Every hour someone is playing a mobile device is one less hour they are playing a handheld/console. That means less demand, which means less product(s) to play in the end.
From a value perspective, mobile is crushing traditional gaming and I don't see that paradigm changing any time soon. People can get thier gaming 'fix' for pennies and it's just enough to where they don't need to go elsewhere to scratch that itch. Similar to what consoles did to arcades back in the late 80's. Arcades were far superior, but console gaming was just good enough to keep people at home.
It's not outrageous to think that 2004-2008 will be seen as the high-water mark for console gaming. That doesn't mean it will die, just that it will never hit that apex again.
From a value perspective, mobile is crushing traditional gaming and I don't see that paradigm changing any time soon. People can get thier gaming 'fix' for pennies and it's just enough to where they don't need to go elsewhere to scratch that itch. Similar to what consoles did to arcades back in the late 80's. Arcades were far superior, but console gaming was just good enough to keep people at home.
It's not outrageous to think that 2004-2008 will be seen as the high-water mark for console gaming. That doesn't mean it will die, just that it will never hit that apex again.
Didn't we already have online Persona mobile games? I think they should develop that instead of jumping the main series into the bandwagon.
Dr. Kitty Muffins
Member
So I guess the japanese love subpar easy games more?
Seriously though, its a life style thing for them. And if I didn't have the time to console game, I just wouldn't game at all. I keep coming back to mobile gaming only to walk away disappointed everytime.
Seriously though, its a life style thing for them. And if I didn't have the time to console game, I just wouldn't game at all. I keep coming back to mobile gaming only to walk away disappointed everytime.
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
Could say the same about the US with the farmville zynga facebook bullshit craze when it was going down.
You forget the easiest common answer. Theres more folks who are not "core" gamers and they make up the numbers in force when something hits a right note with the general public. Gamers are out numbered, so you better get used to it.
Palette Swap
Member
Yeah, according to Wikipedia, they've released 9 mobile Persona games since 2006. I've said it before but mobile gaming isn't anything new for a lot of Japanese publishers. Although it's been accelerating with the mobile market growth.
Source
Edit: I'll never get the notion of "time killer" games because I really can't see gaming as anything incredibly more meaningful than time killing.
This is hardly the most surprising news. We already knew that Japan transitioned heavily over to games on the go. They simply switched platforms. They went from the traditional portable consoles to the smartphones. It's the logical progression in terms of accessibility and availability.
The ideal outcome would be better mobile games as the market increases.
I mean there's kind of a limit to have many developers can make social mobile "card" games and actually have success.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
I have to keep that post around for the next time, someone says 3DS software sales are fine...
This is when I don't have any problem with mobile games: developer create a different IPs or spin-off of a popular series and still develop the mainline game alongside of it instead of jumping the main game into mobile bandwagon.
For me, I take video game quite seriously as I tend to see them on writing perspective. So for me games must have redeeming quality besides a very entertaining gameplay that will make me easily remembered it. I want to cherished every time I've spent with the game. The least I can get from a game is a sense of achievement of progression, not a false sense of them.
SatelliteOfLove
Member
Exactly, that temptation to throw shit-in-coding-form at the wall to see what sticks is the kind of hypertemptation the stumblebums running most Big Six Japanese 3rd party pubs this generation who are desperate to not look like the completely destructive morons their track records for this generation illuminates. This is also in the face of the crackdown on near-gambling games.
What's really sad thing about this is seeing so many luminary geniuses having to slum it on stuff like this until/if deeper games ever get over the hump (who have been under constant disincintivization or orders not to soar majestically this generation already). It doesn't take a Titian to paint a house, ya know?
This is why I think the Kindle Box or Apple TV + controller are probably necessary. I think that phones are naturally holding back their own software, not enough focus on fundamentals, way too much on business tactics because nobody gives a shit: devs, customers, device manufacturers and platform holders. It's an afterthought to everyone. But if there were some higher quality games utilizing the tech then phones could at least share them inferior play-styles as they might have. But we'd all feel better about it because it's not just phones and not just shit.
Magicpaint
Member
Because it's behind the DS which overperformed?
It is the most obvious solution to let people play console like games on these devices that seem to get made regardless of whether buttons exist or not.
Let me see if this time i can be more clear:
Who buys smart phones? Everyone.
Why do people buy smart phones? Because they NEED a phone and smart phones are marketed as cool.
How much do they cost? Prices vary, but they are a necessity, you buy one of them ANYWAY(if you don't want to save money with an almost extincted normal phone model obviously)
How much do games cost? few dollars, everyone can buy one without too much thinking directly from the smart phone itself and without many remorses in case of a bad purchase.
Who buys consoles/handhelds? Gamers, a very limited target in comparison
Why? Well we already know right?
How much do they cost? Prices vary, but a console is a luxury, it's absolutely not necesary, you need to ADD the cost of the console to the cost of the smart phone(because no one has a console but not a mobile phone right?)
How much do games cost? A lot, gamers read magazines/sites/forums to know what is good and what is not, to buy a game they need to go to a retailer or on internet, a bad purchase is a big regret.
Now, do you really think that the target market of smart phones and consoles are the same? Do you think that for people that manage lots of money and take decisions these differences don't count?
If you, and gamers in general, can't see the huge difference in the target i don't know in what other ways i could tell you, i can only tell you that you are being fooled by a really manifest smart phones marketing campaign.
About handhelds vs home consoles, their markets are not the exactly the same but they have a really big part in common.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
Becuse is selling almost half of the DS software in the same time, that's a decrease of 50% in just a gen, as now, it can be worst and will be, if things dosn't change, at the end of the gen.
And how DS overperformed? Did PS2 overperformed too? it was the result of a bubble? I think is clear that 3DS wasn't gonna reach DS numbers because a number of reasons, like mobile raising, but those numbers are way worst that most people thought in terms of software.
If you can't see this is a big problem for Nintendo and it's handhelds in a few years, I can't help you.
GloomyHitsuji
Member
Anyone play Chain Chronicle? (from Sega)
The game is pretty fun so far (operates in a similar way to PAD), I wish we have a thread to talk about this game
The game is pretty fun so far (operates in a similar way to PAD), I wish we have a thread to talk about this game
noonespecial
Member
Let me see if this time i can be more clear:
Who buys smart phones? Everyone.
Why do people buy smart phones? Because they NEED a phone and smart phones are marketed as cool.
How much do they cost? Prices vary, but they are a necessity, you buy one of them ANYWAY(if you don't want to save money with an almost extincted normal phone model obviously)
How much do games cost? few dollars, everyone can buy one without too much thinking directly from the smart phone itself and without many remorses in case of a bad purchase.
Who buys consoles/handhelds? Gamers, a very limited target in comparison
Why? Well we already know right?
How much do they cost? Prices vary, but a console is a luxury, it's absolutely not necesary, you need to ADD the cost of the console to the cost of the smart phone(because no one has a console but not a mobile phone right?)
How much do games cost? A lot, gamers read magazines/sites/forums to know what is good and what is not, to buy a game they need to go to a retailer or on internet, a bad purchase is a big regret.
Now, do you really think that the target market of smart phones and consoles are the same? Do you think that for people that manage lots of money and take decisions these differences don't count?
If you, and gamers in general, can't see the huge difference in the target i don't know in what other ways i could tell you, i can only tell you that you are being fooled by a really manifest smart phones marketing campaign.
About handhelds vs home consoles, their markets are not the exactly the same but they have a really big part in common.
Pretty much sums up my feelings as well. I think there will always be a market for console and PC games and that although the smart phone gaming market may "eclipse" the traditional console/PC market to a degree, I personally don't think gaming on consoles/PC will go away. There are simply too many people who want to game on a console or PC for that market to go away.
A contraction in the console/PC market would mean less money being spent on games but to be honest I don't think that bothers me like it would have a decade ago. If it means more attention spent on gameplay and not on graphics or other expensive "AAA" costs then that is fine with me.
I have absolutely no facts or statistics to base these opinions on - these are just my thoughts. I am 42 years old so I've lived through the '80s video game bust, the 2000's "PC is doomed" crap, the Facebook gaming craze, etc.
So I don't think console or PC gaming is going away.
Google trying to play catch up with iOS.
http://allthingsd.com/20130821/goog...and-sonys-handhelds/?reflink=ATD_yahoo_ticker
http://allthingsd.com/20130821/goog...and-sonys-handhelds/?reflink=ATD_yahoo_ticker