Gordon Shumway
Banned
Heh..It'd be some crazy looking saber shit..that's for sure.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Justice League - Official Trailer 1
- Thread starter Kenzodielocke
- Start date
- Status
Heh..It'd be some crazy looking saber shit..that's for sure.
Killing_Joke
Member
Don't get the criticism about too much CG. It's a Justice League movie. Do you want a grounded realistic action movie or see the JL kick ass in the way we've been wanting since forever? That's why i enjoy Snyderverse for what it is. Even something small like Batman gliding with his grapple gun in real Batman fashion warms my heart so much.
Just_myles
Member
Look.At the end of the day, my metric on the quality of the suit will depend on at some point in the future, that Flash will be able to stuff that thing in a ring.
Going by what I know so far, this is not going to happen. Even if they managed to do this by some weird plot device, I wouldn't be able to suspend my disbelief. At least you can explain the "low-rent TV costume".
Not really a star wars guy, but, I would love to see some EU stuff. Maybe go with dark empire. At least I know the action will be good.
Discotheque
Banned
Yeah I'd take a snyder star wars over Trevorrow any day (would have preferred snyder's Jedi spinoff over rogue one too)
Anyways yeah the Cgi double does let batman do some cool shit but we gotta have something with a stuntman like that warehouse fight again. Fights like that are way more exciting than a barrage of effects although I get you can only really do that with a few characters in these comic movies
Anyways yeah the Cgi double does let batman do some cool shit but we gotta have something with a stuntman like that warehouse fight again. Fights like that are way more exciting than a barrage of effects although I get you can only really do that with a few characters in these comic movies
Yep, I was saying yesterday that if people saw how these shots started their jaws would drop at the great progress. some stellar work so far and plenty more to do before this thing goes into final delivery.
CassidyIzABeast
Member
I just pictured a slow mo shot of Rey and Kylo swinging their sabers in a shower of sparks.
Snyder Wars would be incredible.
Star Wars and a Remember the Titans remake make it happen Disney.
I think the criticism comes because it looks too much like a videogame even if people don't know how to express it. That dark rainy setting, blue filter, colorful explosions, etc. You know what i mean.
MegaManTrigger
Banned
First of all, are you trying to communicate a director's personality, or a character's personality? It's pointless to care about a director's personality when you're developing the movie, and focusing on bringing these mythological characters to life. If you're still going to argue that, consider the following: so you're basically saying that story problems, editing issues, and visual oddities (to name a few) are reflections of Snyder's personality. You do realize how silly that sounds (which is why I bolded the phrase in your post)? Furthermore, saying what you said assumes Zack Snyder acts a certain way when you and I have absolutely no idea what his personality is like.
b&jy77VjiKn$#F
Member
I agree.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
The FUCK?! With Dash_Riprock?! Imma play the lottery..
More_Badass
Member
Well yeah, directors tend to channel their styles in their film, styles defined by their experiences, preferences, likes and dislikes, and so on. At least that's what I assume when you start talking about a director's personality
thehypocrite
Member
Me too. I don't know why he started going in that direction 🤔.
He better not its cool for the movie unnecessary for the comic and unwanted
FunkyMunkey
Banned
i wouldn't be able to handle a star wars movie that was written and edited by competent/skilled people and directed by snyder
*drools*
it'd be like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjG61DoDzN8 but live action
To a very minor extent. At best, it is an illustration of their interests. The most we can say is that Snyder is interested in superheroes, how they cope with and express the violence of their lives, negative emotions, and...well, that's it. It's very vague and something you can say about many people. And even then, there is a stark difference between what a person will engage with in a hypothetical mental space and who they are in real life. Especially since there are plenty of cases where the writer explores a theme or concept specifically because it is not possible to do so anywhere else. Like, Dexter is a fun way to explore the idea of a sympathetic serial killer, but it's unlikely that people writing/watching have genuine desire to see a real life serial killer whose sympathetic enough to forgive his crimes.
It's true that we put a part of ourselves in the fiction we create. But I am very against the idea that we can get to know people by their fiction. How many people do we actually, truly know that we see every day? In my experience, not that much. Even people I've known for years can still surprise me. And fiction is specifically designed to be a distortion of reality, to varying degree's, by it's very definition. The idea that we have any strong sense of who Snyder is as a person just because we watch his movies is silly to me.
thehypocrite
Member
Sure I agree with that. However the original point I think​ is getting lost here. Do you think that Snyder's films are mundane and void of personality? That was the core point being discussed. I disagreed with that premise and pointed to examples on how critics point him personally when engaging with his work, additionally a lot of posters do the same in this thread multiple times. So be precise, are his films mundane and void of personality in your opinion?
MegaManTrigger
Banned
This is why I asked "are you communicating a director's personality or a character's personality?" Because the post I quoted seems to assume that when people are complaining about a movie lacking personality, that it means director's personality when that isn't the case. I mean, I have yet to see complaints about BvS that referred to personality in terms of Zack Snyder's directorial style.
Thank you.
thehypocrite
Member
🤔🤔🤔
Well, selective reading does that to you. If you cared you would find examples here.
MegaManTrigger
Banned
I'm not the one who made the claim, so burden of proof isn't on me. When I see criticisms of BvS, personality is usually meant in terms of actor charisma in relation to the role he/she's playing, as well as how distinguishable characters are from one another (which is why people complained, almost everyone is cynical and depressed with no balance in dynamics). Director style is always separated.
thehypocrite
Member
Here you go, from the previous page.
Gordon Shumway
Banned
Jack The Nipper
Banned
jeez are they trying to marvel hard enough
I closed it half way through, forget it. After the music and slow mo after all those over the top effects to boot.
I closed it half way through, forget it. After the music and slow mo after all those over the top effects to boot.
pixelation
Member
Aquaman is the coolest thing in this trailer BY FAR...
GravityInsanity
Member
Aquaman and Flash*
Snyder will direct Episode X and Michael Bay Episode XI.
Yeah, I've had a bit too much coffee and my mind got ahead of itself, so I may have gone a bit further than what was intended. To your original point:
"Devoid of personality" has always been a oxymoronic saying to me. How can one or something truly have no personality? Because to say something is always to express something (as well as not saying something, depending on the context). To me, the saying is typically shorthand for someone not creating a unique identity for themselves. You know, just using cliches and going with the crowd rather than making any kind of distinction for themselves and who they are. Does Snyder do that? Eh....well...I honestly don't know. There are a lot of factors here.
On one hand, Marvel has become THE identity of superhero movies in the current cultural sphere, and they're generally thought of as upbeat, inspirational, and overall positive. People oversell the "comedy" of the Marvel movies as though they don't have their dark moments, but thematically, yeah, they're pretty positive. For Snyder to make a film about heroes being decisively plagued by negative emotions and an emphasis on struggling with personal darkness and demons is a straight up distinction. In comparison to Marvel, it's a definite deviation, and in comparison to movies from most other studio's. I'd say Logan is the only other superhero movie that emphasized it's darkness to be comparable to how Synder did it.
On the other hand, if you're more familiar with comics, it seems (to me) Snyder tries replicate the themes of stories like TDKR and Watchmen, and Doomsday. I personally have this as a criticism of his general filming/storytelling style. He replicates the motions of these stories, but doesn't convey the more nuanced storytelling those motions are meant to carry. I think this is best seen in his Watchmen movie, where he replicates the action of these scenes (For example, Rorschach breaking in and discovering the Comedian's suit), but not the meaning (In the comic, Rorschach deduces the hidden compartment in the closet by checking the depth of the closet compared to the space it takes up on the outside. In the movie, he just spots the button while rummaging in it. Snyder seems to understand the purpose of that scene is for Rorschach to discover the suit, but not that it characterizes him as an intelligent detective in doing so.) And yeah, that's an adaptation, but I also see a lot of the motions of TDKR and Doomsday in BvS.
So, if the question is "Are Snyder's films typical?"....well, that's the toss up. I think it's accurate to say that his movies have an identity very distinct from what Marvel puts out. So perhaps, in the space of Superhero movies, yes Snyder is a very distinct beast...but I HAVE seen his pattern of storytelling before this as well. Both in 90's comics where anger and violence and bitterness were the flavor of the day, as well as a dozen action movies from various decades that feature angry and depressed action heroes struggling with dark pasts and shit. Batman being a bitter hardass who has a chip on his shoulder against isn't new to me, even for the character of Batman...but a cinematic batman, yeah, that hasn't really happened as far as I can remember.
It should be noted that everyone is influenced by others. No matter the artist, if you break their work down into basic components, there is nothing unique about them. So I don't want to put Snyder to an unfair standard by implying he can't be try to replicate what he sees in his favorite comics. It's how one combines their influences in a different form that determines how one is unique. So even if you see similarities with 90's comics, does Snyder add something unique in his vision? That seems very subjective.
Furthermore, while we can't say for sure, the trailer of JL implies that it actually is going to be more like a marvel movie. Atleast, that's how I read it. It feels more upbeat, the music feels fun, there's jokes, it focus' on stopping a world threat instead of angsty introspection, it's very tagline is about uniting the team - people coming together to perform a great work is typically taken to be a positive theme. So, if you view Snyder's previous work as having his own identity, does that mean JL seemingly incorperating more Marvel techniques mean it's a loss of identity? Or does it make his identity MORE unique because few works, even in comics, have had superheroes start in such a dark place and move to something brighter?
Sorry if that's not a satisfying answer, but yeah, "Does this movie have personality" is just a difficult question to answer because it's determined by the experience of the audience rather than the movie itself. I remember reading about how many western audiences loved japanese anime that were extremely stereotypical to them, but very unique to the west. With Snyder's films, it's a question largely about whether you come from a comics background, or just a movie background, and how much uniqueness you ascribe to how Snyder puts his vision on screen.
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
Episode X: Slow-Mo shots, Well framed Religiously "Iconic" moments ripped from source material (yet nothing to push the story along)
Episode XI: EXPLOSIONS!
Episode XII: Return to Ivalice... hey wait a minute!
scoobs
Member
Jesus this whole movie is one big green screen isn't it? Or should I say grey screen... why does everything have to be so dark/grey/boring in this universe? I hate the artistic choices they've made with all of these movies so far.
I'm still going to go see it, because I'm stupidly holding out hope that maybe it'll be better than the last one.
I'm still going to go see it, because I'm stupidly holding out hope that maybe it'll be better than the last one.
thehypocrite
Member
I appreciate the nuanced approach of your response. I agree with several of your points, JL trailer does seem to have a different dynamic than BvS. I also agree that we associate personality with distinction from the usual. Snyder has volunteered his influences multiple times and yes, he has an eclectic range of things from reading heavy metal to Birdy the mighty, which he said influenced the fights on MoS. He does "take" a lot from other mediums but translating that to a film does carry an imprint or "style" that not many directors share in my opinion. I'm not going to disagree with you in regards to how Snyder has adapted watchmen or imagery from comics, I think adaptations need no defense, they are adaptations because they aren't the source material. The source material remains unchanged for those that considered it superior and from interviews I've read Snyder would actually prefer that people also engage with them and not only his adaptations.
I also think that criticism like devoid of personality are a shorthand for an underlying issue that's not articulated properly. In conclusion I'm satisfied with your answer and agree with most of it. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Uh no I dont want a mother fucker smiling at me after my space shuttle just exploded or my Oil Tanker Flipped
"I know you could've just died right now, but dont forget to smile"
Kenzodielocke
Banned
BvS and this trailer aren't Snyder trailers, not sure about the CC JL trailer.
MoS also had a nearly complete score by the time trailer 3 came out so they could pull from that. This film comes out in November so I don't think they've recorded much yet.
Inferno313
Banned
sure, Batman's superpower IS, in fact, that he's rich.
but you don't actually have HIM be the one to make that joke.
warner, you dolts.
you dumbasses.
but you don't actually have HIM be the one to make that joke.
warner, you dolts.
you dumbasses.
Movie ruined. Fucking Snyder. NotMuhBatman.
Count Dookkake
Member
God, it would be great if this film, or one of its follow-ups, contains a retcon that makes Watchmen part of the DCEU.
Isn't something like that happening in the comic books right now?
It must be neat for Moore to see his work given such renewed relevance.
Isn't something like that happening in the comic books right now?
It must be neat for Moore to see his work given such renewed relevance.
I really wish Green Lantern was already in this film so we could get a variant of this exchange instead of the one in the trailer:
Ah well, maybe the trailer quip doesn't make it into the final cut and we get this in JL2.
This has reminded me that at one point Justice League featured Ryan Reynolds' Green Lantern crossing over with Snyder's Superman.
Now THAT would have been something to see.
Surely this is sarcasm.... Right? You know Batman makes puns and jokes in the source material right? Assuming you're being serious, why is it such a big deal that Batman makes a joke about being rich?
EdibleKnife
Member
Wouldn't it actually more likely piss him off? It seems like big budget movies, shared universes and multimedia franchises go directly against the thesis of and state of mind Moore seemed to be in in regards to Watchmen. Money wise he'd of course probably enjoy though.
I really think the movie looks very cold. Like Scoobs said:
Even though I like MoS, I stayed away from BvS (watched it later on video. Won't see it again) because Snyder's output on these movies in regards to humanizing these characters and worlds has been flaccid. It's really not inviting nor tangible at all. Hell, I'd say SS did a better job at creating a world that didn't feel like a set at least which made it easier to draw into. The human side of these movies is really lacking. Like BvS, I'm gonna catch this one on video instead.
As a massive JLU fan, I understand a lot of people's frustration with having Snyder helm these films, he lacks the skill set to really bring out those deep and nuanced character moments that are key to ensemble casts. It is why Marvel's tapping up of Joss Whedon was a masterstroke, that dude knows group dynamic and why they work.
I hate to belabour the whole Marvel thing again, but I wouldn't expect the type of conflicted exchange between Tony and Steve - in Snyder's films.
I hate to belabour the whole Marvel thing again, but I wouldn't expect the type of conflicted exchange between Tony and Steve - in Snyder's films.
Sgt. Kabukiman
Banned
I heard that Moore actually called DC and asked them to put his name in the credits of Justice League. He's such a fanboy.
Nolan's Batman made plenty of jokes. Same thing in the comics. Come on, of all the things to criticize...
BlackGoku03
Member
IDK... Civil War was mostly CG for a lot of the sets and characters themselves. And the CG was polished up until the last possible second.
I think a lot of these CG comments are petty. I forget I'm on NeoGAF sometimes.
I think a lot of these CG comments are petty. I forget I'm on NeoGAF sometimes.
Crimsonlink
Member
A "Justice League" without Superman..... Right DC, keep burning down that boat.
I can't wait to see the dumb Trailer 2 where evil Superman shows up so they can move on to part 2 which will be the real Justice League movie.
- Status