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[Dorrin]

$150.00

 

[TheExecutive]

GameStop.com

Arcade + Kinect = $299
Elite + Kinect = $399

If they are trying to broaden their market with this thing to the casual gamer it is going to fail on their intent. Buy a wii for $100 less or buy an arcade and kinect for $100 more? Hmmmm......

 

[miserabile visu]

I hope this motion shit flops big time. Because its fucking useless.


95% of the time a standard controller is vastly supperior. And that other 5% you are probably better of with an old school pepherial like a wheel or light gun.

This gen has been an disaster. Its either samo-bald space fps or its this causal shite.

 

[longdi]

If this is true, Microsoft has turned too arrogant verging on stupidity towards our feelings! So because Kinect got some positive coverage with the mainstream news, and microsoft will spend $gazillion more getting biggest coverage ever, the actual thing has not even seem to fulfill its promises. So as long time gamers, we have a duty to stop this threat, to stop spreading positive word of mouth and help fuel Microsoft arrogance!

Spoiler

i still think they will do $99, they are not that spastic!

 

[FunkyPajamas]

So the Z precision is there, but the Z precision is effected by distance in Z. Humm....

It's Schrödinger's Kinect! :lol

Just a question. Was the Ubisoft presentation also faked like others during MS conference (taped) or was it live.

Maybe the live one during Ubisoft conference was the updated and more precise softwre version.

I honestly don't know, but my spider sense went off when the girl took off her sweater in the same way twice while demoing. Exact movements. It seemed too choregraphed to me.

 

[~Devil Trigger~]

Old?

 

[derFeef]

I honestly don't know, but my spider sense went off when the girl took off her sweater in the same way twice while demoing. Exact movements. It seemed too choregraphed to me.

So we see pictures where we saw the game giving different results of the heigth of this woman, and then people still say it was staged? :lol

 

[Tormentoso]

Really? I mean it has gotten that bad to where people are nitpicking memory size now?

If you don't have an HDD, you have a Memory Card, if you have neither then I'm not sure what to say.

Holy shit GAF is in full force with Kinect. I wasn't around during Wii launch, was it the same thing? This is pathetic.




It was $169.99 I think. But they didn't 'need' you to buy that. They don't 'need' you to buy Memory Cards, HDD's, WiFi adapters either ... with Kinect ... they 'need' you to buy it ... so I just can't imagine the price at this point. If it is looks like we'll be playing Wii and WiiHD for the next decade.

There is a key difference,every wii came pack in with the same tech on day 1,is standard Kinect is an ad on,introduce when the generation of the 360 is more than half way already.

 

[FunkyPajamas]

So we see pictures where we saw the game giving different results of the heigth of this woman, and then people still say it was staged? :lol

they have two videos? :lol Come on, I honestly don't know if it was real or not. I'm just saying that it struck me as funny that she was making the exact same movements when taking her clothes off. That's all. Neither is enough evidence to support a theory, in my opinion.

 

[beast786]

Old?

Holy crap. No sun glasses

 

[gcubed]

Price of entry to a non console owner. $300 for Kinect vs $500 you would need another DS or 2 navigation controllers.

If the price is so high why is there interest on Amazon?

seriously? didn't we get enough of the Amazon sales talk from the guy defending the ps3? Now we need it to defend Kinect?

 

[Alx]

So the Z precision is there, but the Z precision is effected by distance in Z. Humm....

Actually I was talking about the vertical precision (measuring the user's height). But Z precision (depth measurement) will most probably depend on distance, too... Like for all measurements systems, the further you are, the more degraded is the signal, and the more little errors in measurements can be translated to big errors in estimation.

 

[Foxix Von]

Finally! Took me forever but I found the song that MS if using for their product launch of Kinect!

 

[semiconscious]

Though it can be taken with a grain of salt since the device is still being tinkered with (software wise) and isnt coming until November.

while i'd've accepted this observation if it'd been made after last year's e3, at this point, with less than 6 months to go, i think it's the concept that they can still fix some of this stuff that needs to be taken with a grain of salt...

kinect'll be released as is, no matter whatever state it's in, on schedule, just like the original 360 was. the only difference, & the big difference, will be that, unlike with rrod, any flaws will be apparent almost immediately, as will feedback...

Old?

'this demo does little but show that in its present state (remember, it doesn't launch until November, so there's time for fixes), Kinect is twitchy and, even worse, laggy...'

seriously - that this's become the kinect battlecry less than 6 months from release is pretty damn mind-boggling, & a huge tribute to the belief ms's instilled in people that it can, as a software developer, basically over-ride reality (or, failing that, at least make it up to everyone at some point down the road )...

 

[Vinci]

I know for a fact that mainstream audience users often pre-order hardware and software on Amazon. Like, all the time. It's true: They're really up on this whole pre-order stuff.

 

[Tormentoso]

I'm not saying Kinect is gonna fail because the games or bad or because the tech is crap. Casual consumers don't give a shit about any technical jargon. They just want something that can kill time, easy to use, and above all, fun.But when they see that $150 price tag this holiday, people are gonna say, "Fuck that, I'm getting a Wii".

In 2005, the 360 Premium and Arcade launched with $400 and $300 price tags respectively. Five years later, MS is raising the prices back to what they were originally. Some will argue that the the intrinsic value of the console has increased, thus justifying the increased price. That's bullshit. Again, people will simply pass when they see the price. They don't give a shit what it comes with. Think about it:

MS is attempting to sell a $150 accessory, to an existing user base that doesn't want it, while at the same time, attempting to sell a product, that is the same price it was five years ago, to a market that has been dominated by the competition for the passed four years.

I don't know about you, but that is one steep as hill to climb. If you can't see why Kinect is pretty much destined to fail, then you have your head way up your ass. Unless they lower that price and do a massive marketing push, Kinect isn't going to be a lucrative investment for them.

I bet all i have that those same hardcore that don't want it are the ones that will jump on it as soon as it launch,with a mighty excuse to justify it,they had complain for many things,hell didn't they run to buy MW2 $15 dollar rape maps.? $3 dollars per maps i still remember how they complain about the Oblivion Armour when this is probably the same at $3 dollar per thing.

And the Ghost Recon add on that was $15 which many complained,then bough it any way.

I think this say it all.

 

[Tormentoso]

Look at the racing experiences shown: by comparison, Mario Kart is more hardcore. These Kinect racers are games without brakes or acceleration, for Chrissakes. There have been demos in the past that featured acceleration and braking by shifting your foot forward and backward on the floor, but such demos were not in evidence at E3 this year, and they're not important for this discussion anyway. These are heavily abstracted experiences, by the standards of those who love this medium, and abstractions are generally seen (again, by us) as dilutions of purpose. Is that notion true for the people they want to buy this thing? If you identify the fun part of an interaction, and distill it, is that enough? Do those people - them, the usurpers - care that they are not being given an accurate simulation, so long as they may drive a Ferrari?

This whole notion is ash in my mouth.

http://www.penny-arcade.com/

Also there is quite a rant on Penny Arcade page don't know if it was posted yet.

 

[fizzelopeguss]

Thinking too small for us UK folk.

£129

Yup, no chance it's gonna be a straight exchange, gotta take the uk rape tax into account.

 

[fizzelopeguss]

If the price is so high why is there interest on Amazon?

Are you really pulling a snah on us here?

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

http://www.penny-arcade.com/

Also there is quite a rant on Penny Arcade page don't know if it was posted yet.

:lol :lol

How do you not post the comic, dude?

 

[A Twisty Fluken]

 

[w3stfa11]

I'm more concerned about the games and the experience than the price, which is actually comparable to the buying two Move and Navi controllers. I'm simply not been impressed with the gaming experience on Kinect and I think Microsoft will have a hard time selling this to the casual crowd when many already have the Wii.

MS is attempting to sell a $150 accessory, to an existing user base that doesn't want it, while at the same time, attempting to sell a product, that is the same price it was five years ago, to a market that has been dominated by the competition for the passed four years.

Couldn't the same thing be said about Sony with Move?

 

[mckmas8808]

The Move looks like a dildo crossed with a tootsie roll pop. Kinect looks like a chunky web cam.
Why can't we just use controllers?

Because you can use controllers already? Like right now without the MOVE or Kinect.

 

[Snuggles]

So it's the price that we already knew it was.

Gah, so sick of Kinetic threads. Damn this thing.

 

[Ponn]

The only thing i'm surprised at is the people that are STILL to this day surprised about Microsofts pricing of peripherals and accessories:lol :lol Seriously, my god people I have a bridge to sell you if you're interested.

And whats mind boggling is its listed on MS website and there are still a few people in here saying they are skeptical still? Really? REALLY? Keep the faith you all, i'm sure they will drop the price of it once Dreamcast 2 is released.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Tycho's "rant" pretty much mirrors what I've been saying for months about Natal:

Much of the Kinect dialogue is taking place at a level of sophistication that doesn't intersect at all with its intended audience. The population at large doesn't talk about experiences in terms of their framerate, their refresh, or milliseconds. Asking "how will you play the Halos on Kinect" is like asking how you could make ice cream in a bird's nest. People who play the (ahem) "Halos" seem pretty happy with controllers as a method of player interaction, and in a genre that trades on fractions of a second, it's a proven mechanism. I don't want to say it's a stupid question, but it's certainly the wrong question - that is to say, it's not a question about the Kinect as an input methodology. The Kinect would be profoundly and uniquely bad as a primary controller for an FPS. That isn't what it is designed to do.

You cannot - in all seriousness - make the claim that the problem with the Xbox 360 is its dearth of shooters.

Look at the racing experiences shown: by comparison, Mario Kart is more hardcore. These Kinect racers are games without brakes or acceleration, for Chrissakes. There have been demos in the past that featured acceleration and braking by shifting your foot forward and backward on the floor, but such demos were not in evidence at E3 this year, and they're not important for this discussion anyway. These are heavily abstracted experiences, by the standards of those who love this medium, and abstractions are generally seen (again, by us) as dilutions of purpose. Is that notion true for the people they want to buy this thing? If you identify the fun part of an interaction, and distill it, is that enough? Do those people - them, the usurpers - care that they are not being given an accurate simulation, so long as they may drive a Ferrari?

This whole notion is ash in my mouth.

People who identify deeply with this pastime would never in a million years have foreseen the rise of the Wii, and of this new type of player, whose mysterious predilections and coherent purchasing beam now grip the rudder of an industry. I'd say that enthusiast gamers are singularly bad at predicting broad market success. If we don't like something, collectively, if our hatred for it throbs like an abscess beneath every thread, does that mean that they're doing something right?

Kinect isn't something that's aimed (primarily) at existing Xbox 360 users. MS' pricing scheme (if it holds at $150 standalone, $299 Arcade, $399 Elite) pretty much confirms that they're not overwhelmingly concerned about getting this into the houses of people who are already content playing Halo/Madden/GTA.

It's about attracting new users to gaming. So for people who are completely uninterested in the Wii's breakaway hits, it probably won't have much to offer.

 

[KernelPanic]

I'm not really buying the "Hard-core gamers hate Kinect (just like they hated the Wii) so Microsoft is on the right track and it will sell like hotcakes".

 

[DMeisterJ]

I'm not really buying the "Hard-core gamers hate Kinect (just like they hated the Wii) so Microsoft is on the right track and it will sell like hotcakes".

.

There's so many differences between this and the Wii that people who are making that statement look like idiots.

Edit:

Natal has more in common with how the PS3 was pre-launch than the Wii. (i.e.: Promised features not implemented, straight up lying videos, exorbiant price (compared to competitors), garbage launch titles, etc.)

 

[Tormentoso]

I'm more concerned about the games and the experience than the price, which is actually comparable to the buying two Move and Navi controllers. I'm simply not been impressed with the gaming experience on Kinect and I think Microsoft will have a hard time selling this to the casual crowd when many already have the Wii.



Couldn't the same thing be said about Sony with Move?

No...


In fact i actually hated the wii and move,but after seeing Socom 4,and knowing Killzone 3 will use move and that move is more precise than the wii controller with wii motion plus,it start to change my mind about Move.

The main difference is sony is selling something that the hardcore may use as well as the casuals,is the software that drives the hardware any 360 fan knows that,Kinect just doesn't have the software,and on a user base were shooter are the most played games not having one to back your tech is just a bad move.

Is not about the hardware is about the software if MS showed Halo and gears working well with Kinect i bet every one would be cheering for them,but FPS is something that will probably not work well with Kinect,but with move it does at least from what i have read.

 

[A Twisty Fluken]

I'm not really buying the "Hard-core gamers hate Kinect (just like they hated the Wii) so Microsoft is on the right track and it will sell like hotcakes".

That's because it's a common fallacy that would be easily detectable by anyone who has taken a single course in logic or argument.

 

[140.85]

Trial balloon, misdirection, etc.

I'll eat a delicious sandwich if it's not $99 at launch.

 

[mckmas8808]

Tycho's "rant" pretty much mirrors what I've been saying for months about Natal:
Kinect isn't something that's aimed (primarily) at existing Xbox 360 users. MS' pricing scheme (if it holds at $150 standalone, $299 Arcade, $399 Elite) pretty much confirms that they're not overwhelmingly concerned about getting this into the houses of people who are already content playing Halo/Madden/GTA.
It's about attracting new users to gaming. So for people who are completely uninterested in the Wii's breakaway hits, it probably won't have much to offer.

Dude if Kinect isn't made to sell to MS's user base then that's a problem. Nintendo is selling the Wii to casuals and their hardcore user base. MS should have done the same thing too.

 

[Tom Penny]

I'm not really buying the "Hard-core gamers hate Kinect (just like they hated the Wii) so Microsoft is on the right track and it will sell like hotcakes".

Yep. People don't want to see the truth. When MS bombards people by marketing it with all the morning shows, late night shows and TV ads people are going to buy the console bundles. It will not do great as a periperal to "hard-core" gamers. It's going to push consoles this holiday. No doubt about it. Especially when they will be showing the dance and work out stuff which is pretty much the only good thing they have anyway.

 

[Y2Kev]

Tycho's "rant" pretty much mirrors what I've been saying for months about Natal:



Kinect isn't something that's aimed (primarily) at existing Xbox 360 users. MS' pricing scheme (if it holds at $150 standalone, $299 Arcade, $399 Elite) pretty much confirms that they're not overwhelmingly concerned about getting this into the houses of people who are already content playing Halo/Madden/GTA.

It's about attracting new users to gaming. So for people who are completely uninterested in the Wii's breakaway hits, it probably won't have much to offer.

It's so ridiculous (and, I think, lazy) to talk about "collective" gamers. I'm getting so tired of seeing this garbage meme.

 

[Tormentoso]

I'm not really buying the "Hard-core gamers hate Kinect (just like they hated the Wii) so Microsoft is on the right track and it will sell like hotcakes".

Dude Nintendo doesn't need anything hardcore,look at the best selling Wii games almost all are Nintendo branded stuff,MS is not nintendo.

Hell i consider my self a hardcore gamer,and i would prefer to play Super Mario galaxy 100 times than anything MS showed for Kinect and that includes Forza.

They had nothing Nintendo had their long time love franchises,hell like i already say if they would have Halo and Gears working good,every 360 fan would be sheering,they are just lacking game wise big time.

 

[lowlylowlycook]

Tycho's "rant" pretty much mirrors what I've been saying for months about Natal:



Kinect isn't something that's aimed (primarily) at existing Xbox 360 users. MS' pricing scheme (if it holds at $150 standalone, $299 Arcade, $399 Elite) pretty much confirms that they're not overwhelmingly concerned about getting this into the houses of people who are already content playing Halo/Madden/GTA.

It's about attracting new users to gaming. So for people who are completely uninterested in the Wii's breakaway hits, it probably won't have much to offer.

But isn't this the craziest business plan for releasing a peripheral in the history of gaming?

 

[levious]

Trial balloon, misdirection, etc.

I'll eat a delicious sandwich if it's not $99 at launch.

WITHOUT your condiment of choice!

 

[Darklord]

Tycho's "rant" pretty much mirrors what I've been saying for months about Natal:



Kinect isn't something that's aimed (primarily) at existing Xbox 360 users. MS' pricing scheme (if it holds at $150 standalone, $299 Arcade, $399 Elite) pretty much confirms that they're not overwhelmingly concerned about getting this into the houses of people who are already content playing Halo/Madden/GTA.

It's about attracting new users to gaming. So for people who are completely uninterested in the Wii's breakaway hits, it probably won't have much to offer.

Problem is those new gamers have already got a Wii. They see it as motion control with a stick, or motion control hands free. You really think they'll be flocking to Kinect and paying $300 for what looks like the same shit to them? Fitness game, mini-game collection, kart racing, it's all the same shit to them and they currently have it.

The other thing is the Wii is the cool toy to own. It's like how people buy an ipod when they could buy a whatever, creative MP3 player with all the trimmings for $50 cheaper. No, they want the MP3 player with the "designer brand" name.

The mass market will always go for something more stylish that's worse, than something that's better and less stylish. MS simply doesn't have the "cool factor" to get past Nintendo.

 

[rollingstart]

It's so ridiculous (and, I think, lazy) to talk about "collective" gamers. I'm getting so tired of seeing this garbage meme.

I do hate it when people say things like "but kinect isn't for you! it's for The Casuals!"

why isn't it for me? I had fun with eyetoy, the wii party games, etc. last year when looking at the tech I thought natal looked cool. they aren't providing anything that looks interesting, whether that means these party games they showed off or any traditional style games (that weren't there)

 

[Tormentoso]

Yep. People don't want to see the truth. When MS bombards people by marketing it with all the morning shows, late night shows and TV ads people are going to buy the console bundles. It will not do great as a periperal to "hard-core" gamers. It's going to push consoles this holiday. No doubt about it. Especially when they will be showing the dance and work out stuff which is pretty much the only good thing they have anyway.

They have bombard us with 360 adds and launch a full year before any one else,yet the wining one is Nintendo now by a long shot,the fact that they advertise something doesn't mean it will sell,even more when you could buy a wii and 2 wii games for $300 dollars for $400 you can buy 2 wii's,which all come pack with wii sport.

 

[mckmas8808]

But isn't this the craziest business plan for releasing a peripheral in the history of gaming?

Yes it is. But some here would say that not targeting their main user base is the best thing MS is doing with Kinect. Many people would say games like Halo and Gears shouldn't be the focus for Kinect, while dancing games should be the focus.

I think it's crazy but whatever. Plain and simple Kinect should be in Halo Reach and Gears 3. Nobody should even deny that.

 

[KernelPanic]

Why would anyone buy Kinect when they can get a Wii ? Microsoft is years too late and too expensive with what's essentially a souped-up eyetoy.

THis didn't so well so I don't see how Kinect will do much better:

Only difference this time is a huge marketing push.

 

[jluedtke]

Tycho's "rant" pretty much mirrors what I've been saying for months about Natal:



Kinect isn't something that's aimed (primarily) at existing Xbox 360 users. MS' pricing scheme (if it holds at $150 standalone, $299 Arcade, $399 Elite) pretty much confirms that they're not overwhelmingly concerned about getting this into the houses of people who are already content playing Halo/Madden/GTA.

It's about attracting new users to gaming. So for people who are completely uninterested in the Wii's breakaway hits, it probably won't have much to offer.

So...let me get this straight. Microsoft is aiming at the people who hadn't bought a console in years - if ever - and wound up buying a Wii. And now, in order to get them to buy their second console in under five years, they're releasing a $150 peripheral that allows them to have nearly the exact same gaming experiences that they had on the Wii. Minus the controller, of course. Unless, of course, they're aiming at the half-dozen remaining casual/lapsed gamers who haven't yet purchased a Wii. In that case, they ought to be modestly successful.

I'm not trying to hate on Kinect here. I just have no idea what they hell they're thinking with it.

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

Old?

Even if they don't iron out any of the technical issues and it really is at $150 I think this thing is going to sell like crazy.

 

[Vdragoon]

No...


In fact i actually hated the wii and move,but after seeing Socom 4,and knowing Killzone 3 will use move and that move is more precise than the wii controller with wii motion plus,it start to change my mind about Move.

The main difference is sony is selling something that the hardcore may use as well as the casuals,is the software that drives the hardware any 360 fan knows that,Kinect just doesn't have the software,and on a user base were shooter are the most played games not having one to back your tech is just a bad move.

Is not about the hardware is about the software if MS showed Halo and gears working well with Kinect i bet every one would be cheering for them,but FPS is something that will probably not work well with Kinect,but with move it does at least from what i have read.

you have no idea how the wii remote works do you. so, because ps3 has the games you like all of a sudden you like motion control? even though what you are really talking about is the pointing feature, which the wii remote does minus these games you like, which has nothing to do with making motions.

 

[KernelPanic]

I'm not trying to hate on Kinect here. I just have no idea what they hell they're thinking with it.

That's my question, exactly WHO will be buying this at this price ?

Unless potential Wii buyers are turned off by the fact that you have to use a controller of some sort.

This thing seems born out of some marketing pipe dream.

- Come up with a gimmick "YOU are the controller"
- Create carbon copies of successful casual games (Wii Sports, Just Dance, Wii Fit etc.)
- Create a massive advertising campaign and hope it sticks

This ship sailed years ago.

 

[beast786]

That's my question, exactly WHO will be buying this at this price ?

Unless potential Wii buyers are turned off by the fact that you have to use a controller of some sort.

This thing seems born out of some marketing pipe dream.

- Come up with a gimmick "YOU are the controller"
- Create carbon copies of successful casual games (Wii Sports, Just Dance, Wii Fit etc.)
- Create a massive advertising campaign and hope it sticks

This ship sailed years ago.

There is no way its going to be 150 bucks. NO WAY

 

[echoshifting]

That's because it's a common fallacy that would be easily detectable by anyone who has taken a single course in logic or argument.

This bears repeating

 

[mckmas8808]

There is no way its going to be 150 bucks. NO WAY

Why not? It's on MS's own website you know.

 

[Levi]

I'm interested in Dance Central, but not $210 interested. Fix this shit, Microsoft.