I burst out laughing here at work at the これはペンです part... Daaamn
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Learning Japanese |OT| ..honor and shame are huge parts of it. Let's!
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I burst out laughing here at work at the これはペンです part... Daaamn
Turn off your brain, memorization is not a skill that requires the brain, it is a skill that requires muscle memory (this is my theory anyway). Read the words and sentences, read them aloud, read them lots of times, imagine what you are reading, and do it over again. When you forget, repeat.
That is not to say you don't ever need to use your brain, however at the start, I'd say that simply the practice of moving your mouth and lips saying Japanese words and phrases thousands of times will serve you greatly. (and if it is reading/writing, grab a pencil and write the kanji until your hand can write them in your sleep)
Good luck.
Eien1no1Yami
Member
Thanks I know, that's why posted here in the first place.
@Porcile even again being a little bit harsh with your posts I will consider it a compliment, because 2/5 is not much and you even really don't like Sakura Wars for some reason.
Anyway I think that my summary covered some of the things you guys kept mentioning.
I don't have anything more to add to it.
Just keep in mind, I never said she's an asshole, nor did I say she's wrong.
Quite the opposite I tried to find my own fault in order not to do it again.
Maybe some of you are disappointed because you wanted something more dramatic.
But I think that your expectations were high because of other threads that I keep seeing on neogaf where the OP says his experience about something and then suddenly there is a turn over because of the more things he adds.
So I think we're getting really off topic so as I said I will not anything else to it.
Back to Japanese language questions.
@Alanae
I used the phrase "話し過ぎなかって分かった" because
I wanted to say "I know that I didn't talk much" that's what I had in my mind
and the only way I could think of was by using the negative form of 話し過ぎる.
So I was wrong about the wakaru part right?
I will keep that in mind
Porcile
Member
I really wish you could see my JPN Sega Saturn collection.
I have never thought of memorization like that, honestly. When I think of memorization I think of my brain and trying to hammering information into it. I'll give it a go later today before bed and see how it goes.
Reading through all this, to me it sounds like she has no interest in teaching Japanese and no interest in learning English herself, tried to communicate that in a very Japanese way, then got frustrated that you didn't get the message, all the while you're making things worse by confronting her directly with it which really is not how Japanese people want to deal with things (generally speaking). It's good that she's actually honest with her feedback instead of doing the usual 日本語上手ですね, but that might also just be her way of saying "don't bother me with this shit again" by scaring you off with harsh words. Honestly, all the things she says about foreigners commenting on Japanese streams and stuff, seems code language for "please don't", but what do I know. If I were in your shoes, I'd either just break off contact with her and look for people who are actually interested in tandem language learning on dedicated language learning websites, or follow her advice and just try to interact with her in a "normal" way appropriate for whatever media you're using (since this is Twitter, just Like/RT stuff and occasionally reply?).
話過ぎなかって分かった means "I know I didn't talk your ears off" (as in, didn't go overboard with talking), so this would sound really weird to the other person. You only use すぎる in a "way too much/going overboard" kinda way but generally you don't really use it negatively. If you want to say you didn't talk much/you hardly talked, you could use あまり with a negative sentence. あまり話さない for example is "not talk much".
話過ぎなかって分かった means "I know I didn't talk your ears off" (as in, didn't go overboard with talking), so this would sound really weird to the other person. You only use すぎる in a "way too much/going overboard" kinda way but generally you don't really use it negatively. If you want to say you didn't talk much/you hardly talked, you could use あまり with a negative sentence. あまり話さない for example is "not talk much".
you laughed at the pen thing so you're just as much of a troll as the rest of us. also monster hunter is for squares, weeb boy.
linko9
Member
OK class, here's your useful phrase for today:
https://translate.google.com/#ja/en/ふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふ
https://translate.google.com/#ja/en/ふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふふ
How does this happen?
I haven't checked in here for a while.... the last page and a half was fun to read.
This just made me burst out laughing though. Hahaha.
Side note: I tried playing some Sakura Wars. It was fun though I didn't play too much (Only wanted to play it because of Project x Zone >_> )
This just made me burst out laughing though. Hahaha.
Side note: I tried playing some Sakura Wars. It was fun though I didn't play too much (Only wanted to play it because of Project x Zone >_> )
Porcile
Member
I think we can agree that engaging with native speakers as soon as you can is obviously a good way to practice, but to go straight to DM'ing someone on the Twitter using basic grammar patterns is probably a step too far. There are more appropriate places to go in order to practice this kind of stuff where people would be much willing to donate their time to help you.
Anyway,the story was interesting and it brightened up our day. Let's keep learning from our senpais. Ganbare!
Anyway,the story was interesting and it brightened up our day. Let's keep learning from our senpais. Ganbare!
I always recommend Lang8 because that way, you get 1. Several Japanese Natives correcting and just like with EN speakers, JP speakers may have different feelings on grammar/words that should be used, etc. and 2. You get people that actually want to correct you instead of you asking them and them doing it to not be rude (until they snap at you when it gets to be too annoying)
Also see plenty of people recommending Italki but I've not used it so I can't say much about it.
Asking someone on twitter is not the best way to go about this unless you've already 'made friends' with someone properly and they are alright with it.
Also see plenty of people recommending Italki but I've not used it so I can't say much about it.
Asking someone on twitter is not the best way to go about this unless you've already 'made friends' with someone properly and they are alright with it.
]
Basically, 話し過ぎなかった = did not talk too much
and 話さなすぎった = talked too little
the placement of the negative changes things.
the て form here implies causation or a sequence of events, so this would mean something like "from not talking too much, I understood"
I agree with あまり話さない being a better way of wording this though.
if you want to understand something involving a verb one has to nominalize the clause its in, for example: 「あまり話さなかったってわかる。」/「あまり話さなかったのはわかる」/etc
Wow I missed a lot of posts since I last visited this thread. Time to soak up all that sweet knowledge.................oh
Somewhat related, I use HelloTalk and still talk to a couple of people regularly from there. I try to ask them no more than 1, 2 questions max per week about stuff I'm confused about.
Somewhat related, I use HelloTalk and still talk to a couple of people regularly from there. I try to ask them no more than 1, 2 questions max per week about stuff I'm confused about.
Porcile
Member
Without context it's hard to tell you. Maybe you just don't listen to enough natural Japanese? A lot of of these complexities of everyday language become easier and almost trivial to understand when you listen to real people speaking. You can begin to make connections with what they are saying and the way people respond to get a feel for why something is used in a certain way.
TheSporkWithin
Member
It's basically letting a sentence trail off rather than ending it... that way you can easily append more information.
You could also think of it as similar to the way people don't use periods when texting with friends
I thought it was something like that.
Eien1no1Yami
Member
Ok guys question time.
I was solving some exercises for N4 and there was a question that requires finding a synonym.
The question was:かれはピアノの練習をつづけています
and the 4 possible answers were :
1.かれはピアノの練習をやめました
2.かれはピアノの練習をまいにちしています
3.かれはピアノの練習をきらいです
4.かれはピアノの練習をきょうみがあります
So 1 and 3 are obviously wrong
and the correct answer was
but why was 4 wrong?The only thing I can think of is that 興味 is used when you are
interested in starting something and by saying つづけています in the question it means that he already does some lessons and wants to continue.
Am i right or is there something else that I missed?
Another question I have involves a phrase I couldn't understand, from one of the conversations I mentioned yesterday and although I googled it, I couldn't find anything.
The phrase is: ただ私がそれを受け止める器を持っていないのです
I think it literally means "I don't have a vessel to catch/grasp it"
but it doesn't make sense to me especially the "受け止める器" part.
Is this a Japanese expression or something?
I was solving some exercises for N4 and there was a question that requires finding a synonym.
The question was:かれはピアノの練習をつづけています
and the 4 possible answers were :
1.かれはピアノの練習をやめました
2.かれはピアノの練習をまいにちしています
3.かれはピアノの練習をきらいです
4.かれはピアノの練習をきょうみがあります
So 1 and 3 are obviously wrong
and the correct answer was
2
interested in starting something and by saying つづけています in the question it means that he already does some lessons and wants to continue.
Am i right or is there something else that I missed?
Another question I have involves a phrase I couldn't understand, from one of the conversations I mentioned yesterday and although I googled it, I couldn't find anything.
The phrase is: ただ私がそれを受け止める器を持っていないのです
I think it literally means "I don't have a vessel to catch/grasp it"
but it doesn't make sense to me especially the "受け止める器" part.
Is this a Japanese expression or something?
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
For the first one, just because he continues to practice does not mean he is necessarily interested playing the piano. For all we know, he could hate every second of it and is only practicing at gunpoint.
Therefore, 2 is the closest in meaning, but I don't think you can call it a synonym since it doesn't technically mean the same thing (練習を続けています doesn't really imply any specific frequency of practice).
For the second one, 器 is not always a physical vessel/container. It can refer to a person's ability, caliber, capacity, etc.
Therefore, 2 is the closest in meaning, but I don't think you can call it a synonym since it doesn't technically mean the same thing (練習を続けています doesn't really imply any specific frequency of practice).
For the second one, 器 is not always a physical vessel/container. It can refer to a person's ability, caliber, capacity, etc.
Eien1no1Yami
Member
I know what you mean about the first question.
But someone can also say about answer 2 that it doesn't necessarily mean that he will practice every day.He may practice only once a week for all we know
.This whole section on the test book required either finding synonym words or phrases with similar meaning.
Thanks for the 器, I finally get it.
Zoe
Member
No, they're looking for similarity in meaning. The example and the answer both show that he is already practicing. Having an interest in practicing implies that he hasn't even started.
Eien1no1Yami
Member
You're right, the correct particle is に and not を.
It was a copy/paste mistake sorry
Something that might be worth trying is to try to replace as many of your hobbies as you can with their japanese variants.
for example,
replacing playing games with playing japanese.
replacing checking up on videogame news with reading your videogame news in japanese.
replacing watching anime with watching them without subs.
replacing a fully english twitter feed with (ry
The main thing I haven't been able to find a replacement for is browsing neogaf (if anybody knows a place please share).
once you get to the point where it's not much of a struggle to do anymore, you'll be able to enjoy the realization that you've ended up studying japanese as a break from studying (japanese).
without a few examples of the sentences you mean all you'll be able to get is a list of possible things it could be, and not which particular one is being used in a particular sentence
scotcheggz
Member
Does anyone have any experience with android Japanese dictionaries? I'm looking at jumping from iOS to android, but Midori on iOS is absolute KILLER and I use it every goddam day. I need an app that's on par with that at least. If anyone has any experience with midori and an android equivalent, even better, but any thoughts on a GOOD android dictionary. If it's hot shit, I don't mind paying. I think midori was the best part of £10 but it's essential so it's been great value.
It's just what TheSporkWithin said I think. I see it in manga all the time. If I find an example, I'll post it.
sackboy2197
Member
I use Akebi and I think it's great. I'm not familiar with the iOS app, so I can't compare the two, but Akebi has a good dictionary, with some conjugations, and an integrated flashcard-thingy to practice a bit, where you can add the words you look up. There's also a nice section to practice writing kanji.
I use DroidWing with a bunch of epwing dictionaries I imported into it.
Along with kanji recognizer for the times I need to handwrite a kanji
Lunarwhale
Member
Just going to be blunt: this aspect literally never gets easier. After college, it's work that gets in the way, and it absolutely will drain you and leave you in a similar state. I've been in that situation both with a mindless hourly job and my current salaried position (complete with being on-call 24/7 and regularly getting contacted after work and in the dead of night). In neither position have I consistently been excited to go home and grind out some more vocab or kanji, or pop open another textbook. The hard part is building up the mental stamina and resilience to do it anyways, regardless of how tired you are. Maybe do smaller sessions on busy days, but make sure to carve out a bit of time for it every day, because otherwise you will fall out of it.
Little tip, but consider doing it towards the very end of your day. Take some time to relax after your obligatory responsibilities before hopping in. Try to think of Japanese leaning as a low-stakes hobby more than anything else. Engage in it the same way you would read, play a game, watch a movie etc. The only way for you to fail at it is to stop doing it.
Don't want to sound too bullshitty, but change your attitude towards studying Japanese. College and work are draining because failure has a direct impact on your livelihood (rather, it seems to). Japanese self-study absolutely won't.
No, it's okay! It's not bullshit at all. I definitely do not see Japanese as a fun, relaxing activity but maybe I should try to see it differently. I just keep telling myself that at some point the learning might be more fun... (hopefully I can incorporate more reading soon! my vocab and grammar are still ~n4 so I have a long way to go before reading will be a little enjoyable)
darkside31337
Tomodachi wa Mahou
Been catching up in the last couple months on this thread. Been feeling motivated again to try to learn Japanese. Took a year of Japanese when I was in college, still remember all my hiragana and katakana and now am going through the process of studying Genki again and its been coming back to me. I honestly forgot how much fun it was learning something new since its been a while since I've done it.
Basically I was having a great time learning the language through class and on my own but hit the wall of trying to learn Kanji. Wasted an eternity going through RTK and didn't get a ton out of it other than learning stroke order for a bunch of kanji and a vague understanding of what some kanji are but I don't actually know the meanings or readings of basically any other than maybe a 100 or so.
Is Wanikani still the best way to go for actually learning Kanji? I tried it for a little while and preferred it over Anki. I guess I'm wondering if there is a more fun and immersive way of learning them other than going through the SRS grind.
Basically I was having a great time learning the language through class and on my own but hit the wall of trying to learn Kanji. Wasted an eternity going through RTK and didn't get a ton out of it other than learning stroke order for a bunch of kanji and a vague understanding of what some kanji are but I don't actually know the meanings or readings of basically any other than maybe a 100 or so.
Is Wanikani still the best way to go for actually learning Kanji? I tried it for a little while and preferred it over Anki. I guess I'm wondering if there is a more fun and immersive way of learning them other than going through the SRS grind.
I like to use memrise for learning vocabulary, as I find it quite fun. The interface is nice and it includes audio and writing practice for each word too. Maybe you could find a deck on memrise you like?
sackboy2197
Member
If you'd like an alternative, you could try JalupNext. It's structured differently, but it's pretty nice. It has some cards free from each deck, so you can try it easily. Unlike WK, it's easier to set your own schedule (you can do as many cards as you like whenever you want), but it doesn't have any "output" per se.
darkside31337
Tomodachi wa Mahou
Thanks for the recs guys. Jalup seems neat... but damn its kinda expensive compared to wanikani
Found some useful stuff on Memrise so I'll use some of that.
Found some useful stuff on Memrise so I'll use some of that.
sackboy2197
Member
Well, the difference is that WK is "timed". You have a sub that runs out and the website paces you (which is a good thing). On Jalup you buy the deck and you can use it however you prefer. I think the decks are quite expensive singularly, but the pack with everything is actually pretty decently priced.
WK does have a lifetime sub if you see yourself using it for a long time. Expensive but not timed as well then.
sackboy2197
Member
Right, I forgot about that. It wasn't there when I started using it, in my defence
it's an awful defence
Hey guys!
I have a problem: I lost my JLPT certificate ages ago (N2, took in Japan, around 2010-ish, I don't live in Japan anymore).
But now I suddenly need it.
According to this site http://info.jees-jlpt.jp/certificate/?lang=english I can ask for for a reissue of the "Japanese-Language Proficiency Test Certificate of Result and Scores".
Unfortunately I'm not sure about:
I'd like to ask them if they can help me but everything is done by physical mail and they don't take inquiries via email. There is a phone number but I doubt they speak much English.
Anybody has any experience with something like this?
Thanks!
I have a problem: I lost my JLPT certificate ages ago (N2, took in Japan, around 2010-ish, I don't live in Japan anymore).
But now I suddenly need it.
According to this site http://info.jees-jlpt.jp/certificate/?lang=english I can ask for for a reissue of the "Japanese-Language Proficiency Test Certificate of Result and Scores".
Unfortunately I'm not sure about:
- The year and month you took the JLPT.
- Test site.
- Registration number.
I'd like to ask them if they can help me but everything is done by physical mail and they don't take inquiries via email. There is a phone number but I doubt they speak much English.
Anybody has any experience with something like this?
Thanks!
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Try searching one of your email accounts for your registration confirmation, etc.?
Calling them would probably be the quickest route. Did you forget all of your Japanese since then? They may even speak English just fine...
Calling them would probably be the quickest route. Did you forget all of your Japanese since then? They may even speak English just fine...
So I've always wanted to attempt learning another language, and Japanese has always been my number one choice
A decade back I at least brute forced myself to learn Katakana so I could read the menus in KH2FM... For the most part that worked, except I was always mixing up such and such characters, because I only did it through visual memorization. I never taught myself the stroke order of how to write said kana so it never really stuck.
Now I'm 30 and I decided I want to be more serious. I've looked through this thread, as well as the Learning Japanese subreddit. I don't really have access to formal education, but I still want to try my best. As such I spent the last week practicing and learning Hiragana, of which I can now at least easily write and identify each character (albeit I still stumble sometimes, and I'm slow to read), and am now at least refreshing myself with Katakana (and actually learning how to properly write).
I have Genki I textbook and workbook on the way (should arrive this week) and will start educating myself through that. Ultimately I was looking up different suggestions for pacing myself as I do it, as:
1. I don't want to rush, lest I feel I will just be cheating myself and I doubt any of the gained knowledge would stick
2. I don't want to go too slowly, as I'm committed to adhering to a schedule.
From what I've read online, if I'm grasping the content, then ideally I should be aiming to get through one chapter every two weeks? In addition to that I plan to use Anki to help myself study the per chapter vocabulary.
Also I'm using other resources such as japanesepod101 for extra auditory education.
I guess I just wanted to post here to say... wish me luck on this long journey.
German #2.
Now I'm 30 and I decided I want to be more serious. I've looked through this thread, as well as the Learning Japanese subreddit. I don't really have access to formal education, but I still want to try my best. As such I spent the last week practicing and learning Hiragana, of which I can now at least easily write and identify each character (albeit I still stumble sometimes, and I'm slow to read), and am now at least refreshing myself with Katakana (and actually learning how to properly write).
I have Genki I textbook and workbook on the way (should arrive this week) and will start educating myself through that. Ultimately I was looking up different suggestions for pacing myself as I do it, as:
1. I don't want to rush, lest I feel I will just be cheating myself and I doubt any of the gained knowledge would stick
2. I don't want to go too slowly, as I'm committed to adhering to a schedule.
From what I've read online, if I'm grasping the content, then ideally I should be aiming to get through one chapter every two weeks? In addition to that I plan to use Anki to help myself study the per chapter vocabulary.
Also I'm using other resources such as japanesepod101 for extra auditory education.
I guess I just wanted to post here to say... wish me luck on this long journey.
Spoiled Milk
Banned
i dunno any vocab but im gonna get some literature and just pound through it with a dictionary until i know japanese, anyone have any recs?