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LG promises HDR gaming input lag patch for 2016 OLED sets
- Thread starter Futurevoid
- Start date
Great. Downloading for my E6.
Death Metalist
Member
Damn good stuff, now I wonder what's the best calibration settings for HDR gaming besides turning off the BS effects. UK set here.
First thing I changed was the colour temperature from cool to warm. W30 to be exact.
Death Metalist
Member
Same, I don't know what looks good to me W40 or W30. I think W40 is Warm 2 but I'm not that sure. Settled for that though.
I'm on W44. Read somewhere that it's the closest to Warm 2. Looks good to me.
Extended is the correct colour space to use, right?
Omnistalgic
Member
So with the frame rate on OLED getting improved, is this the (More or Less) unanimous best 4K TV to buy for gaming? Especially if you have a monitor to play your twitch based games on?
Death Metalist
Member
Normal is. Extended/Wide is exaggerated if I'm not mistaken.
You sure? I could easily tell that Wide is saturated, and hate that it's locked to Wide in normal Game Mode. But for HDR, shouldn't it be Extended (I know that Normal should be used for SDR)? I used Normal for several days, thought it looked a bit bland at times and tried Extended, and thought immediately; "of course!" Doesn't look over saturated to me.
I'd say so.
Personally with this update I consider it the most well-rounded package. It's still not the best in terms of input lag, but taking everything into consideration it's my pick if one can afford it.
I also have a similar set-up to what you're suggesting. I actually do all of my gaming on my LG except for Street Fighter, which I play on my monitor so as to avoid unnecessary input lag.
All that being said, wait to see what comes out of CES in January.
Death Metalist
Member
Well, I did say if I'm not mistaken so I may very well be but I'm not sure. I just set it to normal because it's labeled normal haha.
Omnistalgic
Member
Hey! I play SF too, pretty much why I got my monitor, because even stuff like Destiny feels good enough on the big screen.
Cool, yeah, I was definitely waiting for CES, just narrowing down my options. If Sony doesn't come up with an answer to OLED this year, I'll save up for the LG 2017 model. Hopefully I can get one for about $1000, that's the goal.
@Kyoufu Tks buddy
Normal is definitely the one to use with SDR content.
I'm no expert, but I thought HDR uses a different colour space than SDR, and maybe Extended is meant for HDR content?
I played the last level of Uncharted 4 (in the ship, with all the gold), thought it looked a bit bland. IMO it looks a lot better with Extended than with Normal.
I believe the correct settings for LG OLED HDR gaming are Normal color gamut and W44 temperature with all additional post processing disabled.
When an HDR signal is detected, the tv will enable wide color gamut automatically. The settings that are controllable such as Extended and Wide are artificial.
Remember, HDR is supposed to look more realistic, not necessarily more saturated. Once you get used to the normal setting, the other ones will look garish by comparison.
When an HDR signal is detected, the tv will enable wide color gamut automatically. The settings that are controllable such as Extended and Wide are artificial.
Remember, HDR is supposed to look more realistic, not necessarily more saturated. Once you get used to the normal setting, the other ones will look garish by comparison.
Thanks for your input.
I agree that Wide looks garish, but Extended actually looked good. Will have to test more.
TheGuardian
Member
Yeah, you can tell on something like the witness that SDR and HDR modes are in completely diferente colour spaces even with both on normal, and I've seen professional measurements that anything beyond normal basically over saturated color to make it artificially punchy.
How did that impact you, on the 70ms set? I find some games it really bothers me, others I never noticed it.
honestly I had no clue, until I looked for comparison sake when I decided on the B6. I play alot of Halo and Battlefield, and do well at that - I honestly never felt disadvantaged. However it is probably explains why I unknowingly started playing more on my 1ms monitor lol.
There's a clear difference in wide/normal in FF:XV. Very noticeable change in color. Normal/Extended look identical. Of course this in ISF Dark Room (using warm 2) as I don't have the right firmware for HDR game mode so maybe that is not true in HDR game mode.
Can you point me to where they found that normal was the correct color setting in HDR? Every review I can find that actually posted settings (like AVForums) indicated that Wide was appropriate for HDR. For me Wide looks fine in uncharted 4, ratchet, infamous, TLG, and TLOU. HDR in general looks awful to me in FF15. Everything is over saturated and light output is seriously amped up on everything. It's very uncomfortable to even look at the screen unless I turn OLED light down to 50-60. This is not an issue on any other game I've tried or any movies even with OLED light at the default 100 in HDR standard. B6 here, so no game mode yet.
Weird. FFXV for me is by far the best use of HDR in a game to date. I tried playing with it off and couldn't because it looked like a completely different and inferior looking game. HDR Standard with Normal colour gamut.
I haven't tried normal color gamut on that game, but that wouldn't get to the crux of my issue with that game. I don't feel it's a good implementation since it seems to amp light output like crazy on seemingly everything on screen. It seems to lack the nuance of other games and HDR movies. Even night in the game the screen is obnoxiously bright and just doesn't look natural (the flashlights and light around the chocobos look particularly bad). I feel like the game takes on a very harsh appearance in HDR. It's the first game with HDR support that I've disabled.
Again, very weird. It's not like that for me at all, or any impressions I've read from other HDR TV owners. Even Digital Foundry praises its HDR implementation.
What are your settings? Curious why it's so bad for you.
Robobandit
Member
Question.. in the in-game brightness menu, can you see both Cactuars when you have HDR enabled? I felt the same way and I couldn't see the cactuar on the white square. what fixed it for me was setting my PS4 Pro to "automatic" on the video output, I had it set to YUV420 before due to the HDCP 2.2 issue w/ the LG OLEDs. Once the output was set to RGB, I could see t he cactuar on both white and black and the brightness wasn't overblown anymore
HDR standard, warm 2, 100 OLED light, 100 contrast, 50 brightness, zero sharpness, color wide, any extra processing turned off. My professional calibration isn't scheduled until early next year, but every tv I've used in the last 8 years has been professionally calibrated so I'm very used to an accurate screen.
When comparing side by side with my previous Samsung 65HU9000 in SDR (which is calibrated with the backlight at 10/50%) normal color on the LG in HDR looked completedly desaturated in Ratchet and Uncharted unless Wide color was enabled in HDR mode on the LG (then it closely matched color saturation on the Samsung in SDR). Overall light output was only slightly higher on the LG in HDR vs SDR on the Samsung with highlights being way brighter due to HDR along with the other benefits.
In FF15 color is disgustingly blown out and light output is so high that it's downright uncomfortable. Since this doesn't happen in any UHD blu-ray or any other game in HDR I have trouble believing that only FF15 does HDR right. But I could be wrong. Don't have a lot of experience with HDR just comparing it to my professionally calibrated SDR tv.
I'm not far enough in the game to see if the cactuar is visible. I don't know how to throw up test patterns in HDR, but with it enabled in uncharted every step on their black to white brightness bar is clearly visible. Using YUV420 for HDR and RGB for SDR.
Robobandit
Member
I'm not talking about the creature in-game. I'm talking about the brightness setting.. it has 2 pictures.. both cactuars.
In the game menu.. there's a brightness setting. If things are set up correctly, you should see a black square and a white square each one should have a cactuar character visible. If you see one on the black and not on the white, then something isn't configured right for FF XV on your setup.
go to options>brightness and see if you see both cactuars.
Well, I don't use YUV 420 or have my Colour setting cranked to 100. It's at 65 on RGB 2160p. Try that and see how it looks.
Thanks, I'll try it out later. But unless the implementation is broken it shouldn't require specific configuration. I remember back in the day Arkham Asylum on the 360 had messed up brightness that didn't effect any other game. Haven't had to touch a setting for a specific game since.
Color is default 55 for HDR standard. Not 100. HDR is designed for YUV420 if you have RGB set it just converts it to YUV422 which can introduce banding.
Robobandit
Member
Just set your PS4 Pro to Automatic and it should be fine. I had mine set to 2160p YUV420 and HDR looked like you describe in FF XV. It looks great in RGB.
I tried automatic. That outputs YUV422 when HDR is enabled which I noticed introduced extra banding artifacts but no change in picture quality otherwise. Automatic swaps to RGB when HDR is disabled. I do that manually due to the banding I noticed. HDR10 is 10bit YUV420 due to the limitations of HDMI bandwidth. RGB would be the standard 8bit SDR output though.
Silent Hill
Banned
Whats the best setting for the color gamut on non HDR setting? Normal, Extended or Wide?
For SDR gaming it's definitely Normal.
Robobandit
Member
FF XV looks wrong to me in YUV420. Maybe that's an issue with how they implemented HDR in that game, but everything is blown out in YUV 420. For me, it looked far better w/ my PS4 set to automatic. I also have my color gamut set to 'normal' on HDR standard, as that was what my pro calibrator recommended it be set to.
Regardless of color setting Wide vs normal, it's so interesting to me how automatic looks so different than YUV420 in HDR for you vs me. The two settings are close to identical for me except for YUV422 causing slightly more banding in gradients for me. Just bizarre.
HDR Doesn't operate in RGB (If you're using auto it will move to YUV 422) and his color isn't cranked to 100 his contrast is (Which is considered normal on this set).
Doesn't really matter what DF says about the HDR in FF he's actually right, it seems poorly calibrated and fight with the games implementation of dynamic luminance (just a term I'm using for what we used to call 'HDR lighting' in games) resulting in large loss of detail in dark and bright areas as they simply get crushed in darks and bloom out in brights, a good example is to go to an indoor location like say the Diner at Hammerhead and look out the window with HDR on and off and you'll notice the brightness is just absurdly high with HDR on, or yeah things like the lights at night or the characters black clothes in dark areas.
The HDR in FFXV can look glorious at times but it's definitely a poor implementation overall that fights with the games art and tech design, it feels like a late stage dev implementation. Even with HDR off the game has a very distinct 'harsh' lighting contrast by design but with HDR on things are almost broken at times.
Silent Hill
Banned
Thank you. What are Extended and Wide used for? Thanks.
Robobandit
Member
All I can say for sure is that when the output was set to YUV420, no settings adjustment I did to my set or the in-game brightness let me see the cactuar on the white square and everything looked very blown out and the brightness was almost painful to look at.
When I changed to automatic and engaged HDR mode in the game, both cactuars were visible and while the game was still much brighter and more vibrant color wise than it was w/ HDR turned off, it was no longer painful to look at.
It's also worth noting that I've had my set professionally calibrated (including the HDR standard mode that I'm using w/ FF XV and other games), so probably that plus natural differences in opinion would likely account for the differences we see or don't see.
edit - ok. I just re-tested.. and they do look the same to me now. I think they must have made some adjustments in 1.02.. I had an early copy of the game and was playing before it was officially released.. either that or LG's firmware update changed something. Before, everything was absolutely blinding when i had it set to YUV420.
On my Australian LG set (pre HDCP 2 fix let alone HDR game fix, fuck LG Australia and fuck LG in general) I did notice an occasional bug where HDR would activate with insane brightness so it might have been that, seemed related to running things and changing the settings in the XMB. But my HDR sometimes activates in such a way that I need to turn off/on the TV or unplug/replug the cable too just to get the picture back so who knows, maybe LG will one day give us any of the fixes we need to use our televisions properly here.
LG support just confirmed for me that in Australia we won't get the update til some time next year: https://twitter.com/LG_Australia/status/809222520603693057
Unbelievable to me that it might be 2-5 months after the PS4 Pro launches before my TV can handle HDCP properly, but at least it'll seemingly come with the game mode update too.
I had no idea that Australia/NZ basically had their own model of this TV when I bought it, just assumed we got an EU-like model the way we do with all our other electronics, wonder if it's moddable in some way to use the EU E6V firmware instead of the E6T stuff...
Unbelievable to me that it might be 2-5 months after the PS4 Pro launches before my TV can handle HDCP properly, but at least it'll seemingly come with the game mode update too.
I had no idea that Australia/NZ basically had their own model of this TV when I bought it, just assumed we got an EU-like model the way we do with all our other electronics, wonder if it's moddable in some way to use the EU E6V firmware instead of the E6T stuff...
Yeah, wide looks terrible. I just tried Extended in Forza Horizon 3 HDR and it looks good. Not saying it's the most accurate setting, but the increased vibrancy suits the game.
Can you show me who is setting color gamut to wide for gaming?
You can test it yourself if you have Forza Horizon 3 that it is definitely wrong because you can compare the in game models to real world factory paint jobs on cars.
The new Mercedes AMG GTR has a very unique green paint job. On normal and Extended, it looks like all the marketing pictures and video released so far. When color gamut is set to wide, it turns into a weird flat mint green.
Normal is also the best for HDR movies. Just tried a UHD blu ray and Wide makes people's skin tones look super strange.
lowhighkang_LHK
Member
Hm, a 4k HDR enabled OLED TV. How expensive do those fuckers start at? If it's sub- 1,300 dollars I can do it. Looking for a TV for the entertainment room. I have the x800D Bravia for my room.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
I got my 55" for $1,800 in November, although the prices seem to have gone back up since.