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[lunchwithyuzo]

Is Ichigo leaving neogaf or only handing over the prediction league to someone else?

Hopefully the latter, and his newfound free time means more posting.

 

[Phoenician_Viking]

You aren't suggesting in your "also this" link that those statements suggest the hardware is profitable are you? Also, I'd say taking Andrews statements from a couple weeks ago in December should be given more weight than statements from June.

Yes, they are selling at a profit.

Andrew House: I think as a business it will definitely be profitable from day one. In terms of hardware specifically, it's really not something we tend to comment on, but I would say it will be a significantly better situation than for example, the PlayStation 3. This is in a much, much healthier place from a profitability stand point

 

[walking fiend]

And so my job here is done, someone else will have to take the reins from now on, farewell.

What do you mean?

 

[slaughterking]

Don't you dare to leave GAF, Ichigo.

Yes, they are selling at a profit.

That actually sounds like they are not making a profit on the hardware itself.

 

[Chris1964]

Yes, they are selling at a profit.

You list articles that indicate the opposite, Sony doesn't have the luxury for a drastic Vita price cut

 

[Dalthien]

Wasn't there also more in one of the investor meetings talking about costs coming down with increased production?

Yeah, this was my understanding of the situation at the time.

From how I took it, the shitty summer for the 3DS meant Nintendo had to cut back significantly on their 3DS production numbers. With these scaled-back production numbers, their costs obviously went up per unit. The price-cut, when combined with these current manufacturing costs would result in a small loss per unit for Nintendo. However, the price cut would allow (they were hoping) them to ramp up production enough that once they reached their production goals, the 3DS costs would come down again, and the 3DS itself would be back to break-even or even a small profit again.

Just my memory of how I understood things at the time, and I'm too lazy to try digging up any old articles - so take it for what it's worth.

 

[NavNucST3]

Yes, they are selling at a profit.

Do you not recognize the nuance between "...as a business..." and the very same Andrew House saying the speed at which they can turn the hardware profitable depends on currency rates. Are you unable to open the reuters link?

 

[test_account]

From what I've played, there were problems with the pacing of the dungeons (they seem to be long and didn't have any variety). Basically that's from what I've played.

Oh and the story isn't really on par with Team Symphonia games.

Ah ok, i see, thanks

I think the ToIR hate isn't because ToI is a decidedly average game or the fact that it looks like ass, it's because Namco could have remade Symphonia and released a game that people would buy systems for.

That might be one factor indeed. But i have seen people say specifically that ToI isnt a good game.

On PSP yes, and that's due to the current state of the PSP marketplace. Freedom Unite got a big push in 2009 (complete with tv ads) but failed to hit targets, so that probably didn't help.

On PS3 though, Sven pretty much said Capcom tried to get the game out but SCEA and SCEE wouldn't approve it as is (they wanted trophies) and wouldn't support them at all with Ad-Hoc Party (meaning Capcom would need to completely redo the online infrastructure). Maybe if Sony's western divisions were more accommodating with Monster Hunter, Vita wouldn't have lost it's rumored 3rd HD port (and the franchise at large)?

Makes a bit more sense why they did port over MHP3rd then, if the previous game "flopped" in 2009.

If the HD Vita port was just a rumor, then nothing was really lost.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

Makes a bit more sense why they did port over MHP3rd then, if the previous game "flopped" in 2009.

If the HD Vita port was just a rumor, then nothing was really lost.

I wouldn't say Freedom Unite "flopped", it did ship an impressive 450k in the west. It just didn't hit targets, and really it's not like the PSP market in 2011 at large looked as good as 2009 either. Can't really blame Capcom USA/Europe for passing all things considered.

It's really a shame 3rd HD couldn't work out on PS3 though, as it seemed like they were counting on releasing that version. Looks like we'll get Tri G though.

 

[Chris1964]

Famitsu 2011 Market Report
Top 10 Software:

 1  [3DS] Mario Kart 7             (Nintendo)     1,082,391 / 1,082,391 {2011-12-01}
 2  [3DS] Super Mario 3D Land      (Nintendo)     1,042,511 / 1,042,511 {2011-11-03}
 3  [PSP] Monster Hunter Freedom 3 (Capcom)       1,021,457 / 4,502,446 {2010-12-01}
 4  [3DS] Monster Hunter Tri G     (Capcom)         809,322 /   809,322 {2011-12-10}
 5  [PS3] Final Fantasy XIII-2     (Square Enix)    697,146 /   697,146 {2011-12-15}
 6  [PSP] Final Fantasy Type-0     (Square Enix)    696,428 /   696,428 {2011-10-27}
 7  [WII] Rhythm Heaven Fever      (Nintendo)       633,429 /   633,429 {2011-07-21}
 8  [PS3] Tales of Xillia          (Bandai Namco)   632,151 /   632,151 {2011-09-08}
 9  [WII] Wii Sports Resort        (Nintendo)       612,807 / 2,732,655 {2009-06-25}
10  [WII] Wii Party                (Nintendo)       584,545 / 2,123,773 {2010-07-08}

I don't know what's the biggest bomb: Type-0 or XIII-2

 

[Spiegel]

MHP3 crossed the 5M mark last week (probably sooner because the HD number is outdated)

MHP3 - 4,502,446
MHP3 best - 123,085
MHP3 HD Ver. - 387,359

 

[perfectchaos007]

Are we expecting to get the long list of 2011 totals later today?

 

[Chris1964]

MHP3 crossed the 5M mark last week (probably sooner because the HD number is outdated)

MHP3 - 4,502,446
MHP3 best - 123,085
MHP3 HD Ver. - 387,359

It was at 5.001.000 the week before that.

Are we expecting to get the long list of 2011 totals later today?

At one of the 2 following Famitsu Weekly.

 

[Sammy Samusu]

From the other thread...

Surely Sony already knew about MH3G when Capcom tried to release MHP3HD outside of Japan and maybe that's why they did not give a fuck about the western release of a psp game in high res for the PS3.

What lunchwithyuzo is trying to say is: Capcom was in need of help, and Sony decided to not support their request.

We can speculate the reasons for such an action, but the outcome remains the same.

And even if Sony knew about MH3G, we gamers, did not. They had good eight months to release MHP3. It game could even damage MH3G hype because both have virtually the same content.

 

[DCharlie]

MHP3 crossed the 5M mark last week (probably sooner because the HD number is outdated)

MHP3 - 4,502,446
MHP3 best - 123,085
MHP3 HD Ver. - 387,359

i wonder how many downloads it took in as well.

And even if Sony knew about MH3G, we gamers, did not. They had good eight months to release MHP3

we're still in -exactly- the same point though. For all we know Sony did know about MH3G and were talking to Capcom and came up with something that worked for Capcom -and- for Sony. We simply don't know.

I'm not implying some hidden MH game for Vita or whatever, i'm just saying that i'm sure a whole ton of communication has been going on behind the scenes and we are allowed to know what we know at any given time -for a reason-

 

[AceBandage]

From the other thread...


What lunchwithyuzo is trying to say is: Capcom was in need of help, and Sony decided to not support their request.

We can speculate the reasons for such an action, but the outcome remains the same.

And even if Sony knew about MH3G, we gamers, did not. They had good eight months to release MHP3. It game could even damage MH3G hype because both have virtually the same content.

Sony obviously knew about it.
Either they got something that they think can replace it or just don't give enough of a fuck to fight Nintendo for it.

 

[Orgen]

I don't know what's the biggest bomb: Type-0 or XIII-2

It won't be bigger a bomb than Dissidia: Duodecim ;D (regarding Type-0).

Either way, with a Best release I think it'll sell in line with the other S-E PSP titles (Dissidia, Crisis Core and Kingdom Hearts).

 

[Anzan]

Great numbers for MH3G. Guess that fanbase travels pretty well. Capcom only predicted 1.2 million shipped by the end of March but they've already sold through 1 million. They've likely already shipped more than their end of march prediction.

 

[AceBandage]

Great numbers for MH3G. Guess that fanbase travels pretty well. Capcom only predicted 1.2 million shipped by the end of March but they've already sold through 1 million. They've likely already shipped more than their end of march prediction.

Well, as of two weeks ago, they had shipped a million.

They might have shipped another 200K since then, possibly.

 

[Spiegel]

From the other thread...


What lunchwithyuzo is trying to say is: Capcom was in need of help, and Sony decided to not support their request.

We can speculate the reasons for such an action, but the outcome remains the same.

And even if Sony knew about MH3G, we gamers, did not. They had good eight months to release MHP3. It game could even damage MH3G hype because both have virtually the same content.

Let's see:
- MHFU missed expectations in 2009 with a good marketing campaign. Two years later the psp was even more dead and MHP3 wouldn't have sold any better.
- MHP3HD is a psp game on PS3. It was going to bomb.

The release of those games would have been useless for both Capcom and Sony.

To put things on perspective, Nintendo is willing to help with:
a) MHTri - Original great-looking Wii game
b) MH3G - Original great-looking 3DS game

 

[Alrus]

MH3G will slow down a bit in the coming week but it should be past 1.2 mil by february no? Unless it drops like a rock of course.

 

[JJConrad]

I don't know what's the biggest bomb: Type-0 or XIII-2

Announced in 2006 and as part of the original Fabula Nova Crystallis announcement, I'd say Type-0 was the biggest disappointment for SE. But even then, its done okay when compared to other spin offs in the series. Compared to XIII, XIII-2 did poorly... compared to everything else on the PS3 it's doing great.

 

[AceBandage]

Here's an interesting thought...
We always talk about how developers complain about Nintendo games stealing the spotlight and sales.
But what if the opposite happens?
What if the legs of say a MK7 and SM3DL help keep selling games like MH3G? The first two sell systems, and those new systems need new games.
Just something I thought of.

 

[[Nintex]]

I don't know what's the biggest bomb: Type-0 or XIII-2

In the end Type-0, XIII-2 will at least sell a few copies in the US and Europe.

 

[Chris1964]

I would list Type-0 at the same category with Peace Walker, Birth by Sleep and DDD. It's not just another spin-off.

 

[hardcastlemccormick]

MH3G will slow down a bit in the coming week but it should be past 1.2 mil by february no? Unless it drops like a rock of course.

The game has been positioned as Capcom throwing their support into the 3DS ring, and along with the price drop, many fans of the series may start migrating across still, even outside of the holiday weeks. Not as many, but I don't see sales dropping like a rock anytime soon. Maybe after February.

Plus when it comes to ad-hoc multiplayer games, inertia matters. And Mario Kart plus Monster Hunter is some pretty powerful inertia.

 

[waicol]

Here's an interesting thought...
We always talk about how developers complain about Nintendo games stealing the spotlight and sales.
But what if the opposite happens?
What if the legs of say a MK7 and SM3DL help keep selling games like MH3G? The first two sell systems, and those new systems need new games.
Just something I thought of.

It clearly happened with DS, if it wasn't for the juggernauts some third party games (hell even first party games) wouldn't even had the exposure and sales they managed.

So it's sane to expect the same with the 3DS.

 

[Spiegel]

I would list Type-0 at the same category with Peace Walker, Birth by Sleep and DDD. It's not just another spin-off.

You can put it alongside Kingdom Hearts (the original release). Adding PSN sales and the higher price (6800 vs 7700) and it probably shouldn't be far off.

Not knowing anything about the possible western release makes it harder to know if it has met expectations in Japan or not.

 

[Shikoro]

- Vita sales increased 100% yoy

You can't get a 100% increase if the share for the previous year is 0%. Whether you multiply 0 with bazillion or increase zero's percentage by 1000%, you still get 0.

Just saying...

 

[Labadal]

You can put it alongside Kingdom Hearts (the original release). Adding PSN sales and the higher price (6800 vs 7700) and it probably shouldn't be far off.

Not knowing anything about the possible western release makes it harder to know if it has met expectations in Japan or not.

Baseless here but I think SE are pleased with sales for Type-0. If it gets a western release on VITA, could we not guess that Japan would get a VITA version too?

 

[Takao]

I think Type-0 has done more good than bad for Final Fantasy, which is more than what we can say about XIII.

 

[AceBandage]

Square should just drop FF for a while and make Threads of Fate sequels.
I mean, it's already an action RPG.

 

[Chris1964]

You can't get a 100% increase if the share for the previous year is 0%. Whether you multiply 0 with bazillion or increase zero's percentage by 1000%, you still get 0.

Just saying...

X/0 = infinite

 

[Alexios]

Can you read Japanese? Andriasang says this story confirms the 3DS was selling at a loss, but I can't read the source article to confirm the translation.

Edit: This may be the sentence in question (but I'm using google translate to try to find it, so big grain of salt):

値下げ後の価格ではハードの販売だけでは赤字になるとした上で「いま手を打っておかないと来年以降の業績に明るいものが見えてこない」と強調した。

Yeah, that's what I was referring to as third parties' guesses rather than any actual confirmation...

At least what I gathered was that Iwata was just speaking justifying the price cut there, not specifically selling at a loss.

And bloomberg then came and suggested that they're most likely now selling at a loss.

Or vice versa in the timing, but still no actual confirmation.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

Let's see:
- MHFU missed expectations in 2009 with a good marketing campaign. Two years later the psp was even more dead and MHP3 wouldn't have sold any better.
- MHP3HD is a psp game on PS3. It was going to bomb.

The release of those games would have been useless for both Capcom and Sony.

To put things on perspective, Nintendo is willing to help with:
a) MHTri - Original great-looking Wii game
b) MH3G - Original great-looking 3DS game

I'm not saying Sony should've thrown a bunch of advertising dollars and a western distrubtion at 3rd (though if they had maybe they'd be getting 3rd G about now). What I'm saying is that, at the least, Sony shouldn't be putting up any roadblocks to any western MH release. I mean, it's not like they're doing Capcom a favor by blocking 3rd HD. If Capcom actually wants to put it out (and they do) Sony making making that an undesirable proposition is unquestionably the wrong approach and I'm a little surprised people are going to such lengths to actually defend it.

 

[Shikoro]

X/0 = infinite

If you turn it the other way around, yes. But I'm talking about increase. Anything times 0 = 0. Doesn't matter, move on...

 

[Sammy Samusu]

Let's see:
- MHFU missed expectations in 2009 with a good marketing campaign. Two years later the psp was even more dead and MHP3 wouldn't have sold any better.
- MHP3HD is a psp game on PS3. It was going to bomb.

The release of those games would have been useless for both Capcom and Sony.

Nintendo is willing to help with:
a) MHTri - Original great-looking Wii game
b) MH3G - Original great-looking 3DS game

Capcom did want to release MHP3HD here in the west, so I'll let them decide if that was a smart or dumb idea. I think Sony should've supported them.

And sure, Nintendo got the better deal as far as recent MH games go, but it's not like Wii is a heaven for hardcore third-party games, and that's what we are talking about, giving support when someone needs it most.

 

[test_account]

I wouldn't say Freedom Unite "flopped", it did ship an impressive 450k in the west. It just didn't hit targets, and really it's not like the PSP market in 2011 at large looked as good as 2009 either. Can't really blame Capcom USA/Europe for passing all things considered.

It's really a shame 3rd HD couldn't work out on PS3 though, as it seemed like they were counting on releasing that version. Looks like we'll get Tri G though.

Ah ok, i see. I didnt know how much it sold, and i couldnt find a better word than "flopped" for not meeting the targets Are there any words on a EU/US release of TriG?


Where did the MHP3rd HD for Vita rumor come from by the way? Was it just the logo from that TGS trailer?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=uuga_ksIEH0#t=58s

There is a circle in the background, looks like the back of a PSP.

 

[Sammy Samusu]

Where did the MHP3rd HD for Vita rumor come from by the way?

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=442135

 

[creid]

Yeah, that's what I was referring to as third parties' guesses rather than any actual confirmation...

Translation: After the price cut the new price will yield red numbers if only looking at the hardware sales (I guess that means without taking software sales into account), so he stressed that "we need to act now or our business outlook for next year and beyond will be gloomy/lacking perspective."

"Yielding red numbers" sounds like selling at a loss to me.

 

[airmangataosenai]

Ah ok, i see. I didnt know how much it sold, and i couldnt find a better word than "flopped" for not meeting the targets Are there any words on a EU/US release of TriG?


Where did the MHP3rd HD for Vita rumor come from by the way? Was it just the logo from that TGS trailer?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=uuga_ksIEH0#t=58s

There is a circle in the background, looks like the back of a PSP.

Do you mean the western release? Yeah, nothing was confirmed.

If you mean it coming to Vita then it was demoed when the system was first unveiled.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scD0gsGDxcU

 

[Spiegel]

Capcom did want to release MHP3HD here in the west, so I'll let them decide if that was a smart or dumb idea. I think Sony should've supported them.
And sure, Nintendo got the better deal as far as recent MH games go, but it's not like Wii is a heaven for hardcore third-party games, and that's what we are talking about, giving support when someone needs it most.

It's not the same, Nintendo got a former PS3 exclusive from a growing franchise. This was 2007 and we hardly knew if Wii was a heaven for third party games or not.

Sony makes a lot of bad decisions but I can't blame them for not giving a fuck about MHP3HD. They gave MHP3 a lot of support and even created a way to give Capcom more free money with the HD remaster. Publishing MHP3HD wasn't going to change anything.

 

[test_account]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=442135

Thanks for the link. I see that it mentioned in the OP, but where did it originate from?

Do you mean the western release? Yeah, nothing was confirmed.

If you mean it coming to Vita then it was demoed when the system was first unveiled.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scD0gsGDxcU

Western release of TriG for 3DS yes, not MHP3rd

Thanks for the link, but he does mention emulation at the end though. I dont know what was said before or after that, so maybe it wasnt 100% clear.

 

[Alrus]

Do you mean the western release? Yeah, nothing was confirmed.

If you mean it coming to Vita then it was demoed when the system was first unveiled.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scD0gsGDxcU

That's not MHP3rd HD on Vita, that's just showing how emulating PSP games on Vita works and how MHP3rd can make use of the second stick. (by the way, the second analog stick in all MH games that use it is pretty much a second d-pad, not true analog)

 

[airmangataosenai]

That's not MHP3rd HD on Vita, that's just showing how emulating PSP games on Vita works and how MHP3rd can make use of the second stick. (by the way, the second analog stick in all MH games that use it is pretty much a second d-pad, not true analog)

Wait, can you actually map the camera controls to that analog stick like in the video with the PSP version running on the Vita?

 

[Thoraxes]

At what point do you have to sacrifice selling something for a profit in order to increase market penetration? I'm sure it varies from company to company, but is there a textbook ratio or percentage in which you know you need to change things?

Wait, can you actually map the camera controls to that analog stick like in the video with the PSP version running on the Vita?

Yes, the system PSP emulation allows for that. You should see Vita videos of Peace Walker too.

 

[A Twisty Fluken]

At what point do you have to sacrifice selling something for a profit in order to increase market penetration? I'm sure it varies from company to company, but is there a textbook ratio or percentage in which you know you need to change things?


Yes, the system PSP emulation allows for that. You should see Vita videos of Peace Walker too.

It's different than many other areas with video game platforms, as the long term success of a platform typically hinges on the willingness of developers to create games for your platform. If the installed base is not there, the confidence that the platform will deliver a good ROI for their project is not there, then your platform is not going to have a healthy life. In that way, a system like the Vita (and most other dedicated game platforms) is significantly more dependent on marketshare than many other products.

 

[Erethian]

MH3G will slow down a bit in the coming week but it should be past 1.2 mil by february no? Unless it drops like a rock of course.

As has been mentioned before week 01 tends to see a rise in hardware, but also software. Mario Kart 7 will most definitely get a bump, but 3D Land and MH3G could as well. So we could see MH3G at about 1.1 million.

 

[Sammy Samusu]

It's not the same, Nintendo got a former PS3 exclusive from a growing franchise. This was 2007 and we hardly knew if Wii was a heaven for third party games or not.

Sony makes a lot of bad decisions but I can't blame them for not giving a fuck about MHP3HD. They gave MHP3 a lot of support and even created a way to give Capcom more free money with the HD remaster. Publishing MHP3HD wasn't going to change anything.

From a profit perspective, I don't either, but Nintendo and Microsoft are going for the kill, so maybe Sony should start doing the same.

Thanks for the link. I see that it mentioned in the OP, but where did it originate from?

I remember reading something about "a magazine editor", not sure if true though.

 

[Thoraxes]

It's different than many other areas with video game platforms, as the long term success of a platform typically hinges on the willingness of developers to create games for your platform. If the installed base is not there, the confidence that the platform will deliver a good ROI for their project is not there, then your platform is not going to have a healthy life. In that way, a system like the Vita (and most other dedicated game platforms) is significantly more dependent on marketshare than many other products.

Ah, ok. Thanks!