CrimzonSamurai
Member
I think you missed the sarcasm.
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Moderators: the new ban on social and political discourse
- Thread starter GarthVaderUK
- Start date
I think you missed the sarcasm.
Trickster
Member
Literally just don't visit off topic was the solution
i_am_ben
running_here_and_there
I don't think you can have an off-topic section and not have 'political discourse'
People's lives are inherently political. The ban would prevent simple things like discussing the news of the day.
It's a real shame. I've posted on Neogaf for 9 years, and met a lot of good people here.
People's lives are inherently political. The ban would prevent simple things like discussing the news of the day.
It's a real shame. I've posted on Neogaf for 9 years, and met a lot of good people here.
eBay Huckster
Member
this is another cool hot take post claiming a thread that featured political opinions ranging from democratic socialism to non-racebaiting conservatism was a "toxic [hugbox]" from someone with 0.2 posts per day i've literally never seen before tonight
anyway, for any of you who want to keep up with the PoliGAF community in light of what's frankly a ridiculously kneejerk ban, feel free to DM me on the twitter link in my profile (or just PM me if you ain't got one)
Herr Schwarz
Banned
It's possible EL may have overreacted to politics in the OT?
Things need to be a dialogue not a this is how it is kind of nonsense.
There should be politics in OT. Just not so many threads about the consistency of donald trumps Tuesday turd.
Things need to be a dialogue not a this is how it is kind of nonsense.
There should be politics in OT. Just not so many threads about the consistency of donald trumps Tuesday turd.
Atom Heart Mother
Banned
please no threads about Palmer Luckey, JonTron or PewDiePie saying a bad word, too. Please.
Saucestin_Roast
Member
Thank you for this.
I think the forum could definitely go back to the way it was with Off Topic and could work.
If you don't want to read a thread then simply don't click on it. The same applies on any internet forum. As long as the topic isn't hate filled and wrongfully attacking someone/a group then simply don't enter it.
Time will tell.
PJV3
Member
I'd prefer the old system of large political threads returning to regular off topic, sadly there was too much Trump shit smeared across the forum.
kruis
Exposing the sinister cartel of retailers who allow companies to pay for advertising space.
Which is going to be an improvement upon the old NeoGAF where dissenting opinions on political subjects could easily lead to bans. Real discussions between people with absolutely different opinions was never possible because far too many mods banned everyone they disagreed with.
Except it happened all the time despite people saying this. I talked with all sorts of people with differing opinions and somehow never got banned for it. Hmmmm...
openrob
Member
The issue with OT was moderation. Someone could hurl intense abuse at someone based on their political opinion and would be celebrated, as long as they were on the extreme left. Others would be banned for making polite statements - but if the moderation team didn't agree POW! Banned.
There should be no issue with polite and reasoned discussion.
TheThreadsThatBindUs
Member
What is the value in discussion with people with far-right and alt-right ideologies? Most (if not all) aren't rational and it's highly unlikely you'll be able to influence them from their toxic position on current issues. By giving them a platform to spout their abhorrent views in the name of "open discourse" you're only serving to give them a platform.
In any case, I've seen much of the discussion in the OT section centered around people with differing opinions on matters. However, it's one thing to have a different opinion but are still willing to engage listen and potentially be willing to change your stance on an issue, but it's entirely another to be a raging racist/sexist/bigoted lunatic who only wants to spout their own toxic narrative and nothing else.
I can't even tell what is sarcasm anymore.
Hydrogen Bluebird
Member
Just sharing a personal rule of mine:
I prefer not to get into in-depth social and political discussions online. I mean it's hard enough to have these discussions in real world/in-person settings but taking it online with anonymity (and how it enables poor/rude behavior), and misinterpretation is a recipe for disaster in my opinion.
I understand why in-depth social and political discussions online are important and why they are desired by people, but prefer not to take part in them (especially when hostilities start because of dissenting opinions which in my mind is pointless mainly because there would be no clear winner especially if the goal was to change someone's mind).
I prefer not to get into in-depth social and political discussions online. I mean it's hard enough to have these discussions in real world/in-person settings but taking it online with anonymity (and how it enables poor/rude behavior), and misinterpretation is a recipe for disaster in my opinion.
I understand why in-depth social and political discussions online are important and why they are desired by people, but prefer not to take part in them (especially when hostilities start because of dissenting opinions which in my mind is pointless mainly because there would be no clear winner especially if the goal was to change someone's mind).
Thing is, some of us can't escape these issues even if we wanted to on gaming forums. As a queer female who loves all sorts of hardcore gaming genres, I rarely feel at easy on most gaming forums since most posters there seem to hope I wouldn't play games or wouldn't even exist. Right-wingy bigoted gamers have hundreds of forums to choose from because that's the default mode of gaming talk but some of us have harder times. Ban on political and social aspects here is just one more thing to silence and erase us. I don't know what's coming for GAF but I just feel sad.
Complistic
Member
Best change to OT ever. I had hoped they'd just make another forum for it, but out right banning it works great to. It was absolutely toxic to the community.
Hydrogen Bluebird
Member
Sorry if you are saddened and feel silenced by the direction of the OT forum once it returns.
I do feel that the majority of gaffers who will remain on the forums will prefer to keep the social and political discussion to a minimum, and hopefully, make the community more inclusive and tolerant. We'll see.
schwabdizzle
Banned
Perfect.
Majukun
Member
not really.
some people like to think that everything is a statement on something or must be interpreted as such,but it really isn't the case at all.
I don't know how to feel about this, banning social and political discussion is impossible because everything is social/political, especially in movies, games, anime, etc... but we need to stop the witch-hunt and the abuse that comes with it.
I learned a lot about social issues and myself by having great discussions with people here but sometimes, the very far alt left of the forum was unbearable, too much, everything needed to be an outrage, everything needed to be racist, sexist or whatever and if you disagree with them, you were instantly attacked by X people or banned.
In almost every thread, you always had people thinking and saying that they were a better person than you are, more feminist than you, more human than you, greater than you etc... which escalated the discussions every single time, those people are a problem.
Extremist from both sides are a problem, but in the end, there were a lot of people who took the time to explain things, explained how they feel, how they were living and what could be done to live a better life for everyone, I'm sure a lot of people feeled better by talking to people that had the same issues or social problem they were facing (me included) and it would be a shame if those topics were to be stopped...
Some people on Gaf cheers me up when I was broken, they also show me how wrong I was on many things and I'm a better person than I was few years ago for sure, my views on many things change, I've open my eyes about many things and I know myself better, I've a better understanding about minority as a all and I become more supportive of them ( especially towards LGBT people, minority representation in medias, feminism etc... )
I think it's very important for those topics to stay there, it would be a shame if they weren't, what we need is a better moderation of those subjects and listening to other people with an open mind, just my 2 cents.
I learned a lot about social issues and myself by having great discussions with people here but sometimes, the very far alt left of the forum was unbearable, too much, everything needed to be an outrage, everything needed to be racist, sexist or whatever and if you disagree with them, you were instantly attacked by X people or banned.
In almost every thread, you always had people thinking and saying that they were a better person than you are, more feminist than you, more human than you, greater than you etc... which escalated the discussions every single time, those people are a problem.
Extremist from both sides are a problem, but in the end, there were a lot of people who took the time to explain things, explained how they feel, how they were living and what could be done to live a better life for everyone, I'm sure a lot of people feeled better by talking to people that had the same issues or social problem they were facing (me included) and it would be a shame if those topics were to be stopped...
Some people on Gaf cheers me up when I was broken, they also show me how wrong I was on many things and I'm a better person than I was few years ago for sure, my views on many things change, I've open my eyes about many things and I know myself better, I've a better understanding about minority as a all and I become more supportive of them ( especially towards LGBT people, minority representation in medias, feminism etc... )
I think it's very important for those topics to stay there, it would be a shame if they weren't, what we need is a better moderation of those subjects and listening to other people with an open mind, just my 2 cents.
Ragnar Blackmane
Member
Absolutely this.
cpp_is_king
Member
Sounds amazing, TBH
Monocle
Member
Yeah I'm gonna go with this. Whether LGBT people should be treated like human beings is not a partisan issue.
Not partisan isn't the same as not political. Human rights is the quintessential political topic.
KarneeKarnay
Member
I'm with this. Most of the right would consider LGBTQ to be humans. It's just that they don't want them to enjoy the same rights as them.
KarneeKarnay
Member
That's how a lot of forums do it and I'd be ok with that.
I second this.
Imp the Dimp
Member
95% of all OT bans were warranted
No one's forced to enter the off-topic forum.
NHarmonic.
Member
Yeah, but we know vast majority of gamers don't give a fuck/ are the alt-right so yeah... For them everything about that, even in games, it's just politics. There was and there is a lot of people like this on gaf, mostly on the gaming side.
Cool that we are playing the "both sides". Far left lol, ok.
We really are in the darkest timeline, where people thing is valid to equate hateful, homophobe and misoginistic pos from those who try to fight for equality and the same rights for everyone, no discrimination and more inclusion in media. I don't get why i even bother anymore, is clear that since that damn election there was a massive shift in the way people think.
I used to enjoy games, now i'm not that sure. Too much bullshit in the community.
If GAF doesn't fullfill this role anymore I'm definitely out. I hope we can get some clarification on what the direction of this forum is going to be because right now it seems like a shocking amount of people are proclaiming for it to be something I don't want it to be at all. GAF OT was tech talk, politics and news all jumbled into one but it worked for me anyway. I think a lot of people learned from the discussion there and although I do agree moderation can be too harsh or quick to jump to conclusion I agree with the general place the mods wanted NeoGAF to be.
Laughing Banana
Weeping Pickle
Man... That's a huge step back from GAF as a progressive gaming forum. You're basically disallowing minorities from speaking up against issues important to them, as well as giving Gamer Gate people a huge victory by disallowing people from voicing their concerns about them and fighting back against them.
That would be such a huge loss of identity from GAF as many people loved it. A huge, massive loss.
I think they'll find a happy medium where dogpiling and tone policing isn't as prevalent. If the community can manage to handle that.
Elfotografoalocado
Banned
So that's the community where one can agree that sexual assault is bad without being banned?
Thank you, didn't make it to the Discord.
Interesting choice of things to ban, seems completely one sided and completely regressive.
i_am_ben
running_here_and_there
I don't think your logic makes sense. I mean, how can something be truly more inclusive and tolerant, if it means suppressing people from discussing essential components of their life?
This would be a decent solution. And if you don't want to talk about anything thought-provoking, just stay out of there.
It can't be.
D
Deleted member 325805
Unconfirmed Member
Sounds great to me, I think the forum will be better off honestly. I just hope the new mods aren't as ban happy as the old mods, it always felt like you were one differing opinion away from a ban.
I say this with the utmost respect. My main issue with this policy is that it will put many GAF communities out of the pasture (including LettersGAF, which I am a part of). Rather than a shift in direction to improve the atmosphere of the boards, it feels more like people are being silenced for an incident that they had no relation to whatsoever. Not to mention that discussion about said incident has already leaked into Gaming discussion en masse.
Barrel Cannon
Member
That was what separated gaf from other sites. It wasn't just a gaming focused site and that's what elevated it to a different standard. If I never discovered GAF I'd think gamers were in general just all a bunch of childish morons. Sure moderation is going harder in this new climate where eyes are on everyone around the world. It's honestly as horrible as it always was around the world it's just that with the rise of social media and people not being afraid to speak their minds that shit is going into the limelight. We should be embracing the progressiveness of it imo. Forums are always as good as their mods and this site is no different. We've always had a strong mod team here and it's sad seeing GAF crumbling due to one bad call and one bad policy change.
BibiMaghoo
Member
I look at this list...and cannot help but wonder what type of person that serves...
I'm not saying you are a shitbag, but that is certainly a list that works for a shitbag agenda. The problem with those threads is how they were moderated, not the discussion taking place. In all of them without exception you can find good points and discussion. You just have to wade through people being angry and believing they have every right to be because someones opinion is different. This devolved into "fuck you white man", "fuck you cis man", "fuck you republican" and other unworkable choke points for differing views. It was either you are one of us, or your opinion is wrong and we are all angry. That is a failure in moderation, not discussion. This was allowed to be the case to make it safe for the most fragile members of each community. The problem is that they are too fragile to accommodate reasonably. Those individuals cannot handle discussion unless it propagates their own position.
NHarmonic.
Member
Gee i wonder what different opinion. LGBTQ people shouldn't have the same rights at me?
Why can't i be racist? Who cares about women in videogames?
Yeah. Sounds fucking awful, there's a lot of forums where you can express those views if you want. Gaf was different.
theCalamity
Member
Sounds like a safe space
D
Deleted member 325805
Unconfirmed Member
And this is why the ban is good, you assume because I don't want every other thread to be about those things that I must hate black, gay people etc when I don't, it was just getting ridiculous how almost every thread was about politics and social issues, filled with people posting the same replies over and over.