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[BigDug13]

You don't need a stream of video from a device like the Kinect. You can send snapshots of which accountholders are within the Kinect's detection range, their position and attitude in relative space, heart rate and possible key words or terms or even objects, if one was so inclined.

If you can remotely update the logic used by Kinect to interpret its audio/visual data, you can add new terms or objects that Kinect can seek, and can have the device return small metadata related to any hits on that search criteria.

In short, when you have a device that's a freakin tricorder with an internet connection that is always on, the possibilities are almost endless, and all without a perpetual stream of audio or video.

The future of gaming is here? Holy crap at the potential...

 

[Lynn616]

You can't be this naive.

Go buy Xbox One and be happy with it. No one's stopping you. I'm just baffled by how idiotic people can be at times.

Me too.

 

[Arkam]

XBONE = telescreen from 1984

Any networked device is now able to be tapped. Its a brave new world we live in. Only your thoughts are safe... for now

 

[Madness]

Wow Outlook.com encryption not even applied before giving them the data, allowing them to monitor Skype calls. Fuck that, kiss my ass US government.

 

[ari]

You don't need a stream of video from a device like the Kinect. You can send snapshots of which accountholders are within the Kinect's detection range, their position, and attitude and heart rate and possible key words or terms or even objects, if one was so inclined.

If you can remotely update the logic used by Kinect to interpret its audio/visual data, you can add new terms or objects that Kinect can seek, and can have the device return small metadata related to any hits on that search criteria.

In short, when you have a device that's a freakin tricorder with an internet connection, the possibilities are almost endless, and all without a perpetual stream of audio or video.

MS stated that surveillance have no access to there servers, but through use of users actual usage i e skype and outlook, etc...I also think that MS won't be spying on my kinect. Just saying, it would be utterly pointless.

 

[SEGAvangelist]

None of these companies (or any other for that matter) will be allowed to place an always on and always connected camera in my living or bed room...

Technically, you could just unplug it if disabling it doesn't make you happy.

 

[Kelthink]

Apologies if it's been posted, but this advert has been discussed, aye?

I saw it last week. I watched it a bit slack-jawed myself. Nothing says 'damage control' with ads like that, eh.

 

[IslandHead]

Technically, you could just unplug it if disabling it doesn't make you happy.

Or you could just buy a PS4 which doesn't have a mandatory spy camera built into it.

 

[Philthy]

Tape over laptop's webcam crew checking in.

I'm not even a conspiracy nut, but it only took that hilarious photo of that doofus sitting at his computer with his half naked girlfriend in the background and someone texting him saying he should be paying attention to her and not the computer.

First thing I did with my laptop is put tape on the camera.

 

[Freki]

Technically, you could just unplug it if disabling it doesn't make you happy.

But then the xbone won't work... I'll guess when the time comes and I'll get my bone I'll just leave it offline permanently...

 

[BigDug13]

Technically, you could just unplug it if disabling it doesn't make you happy.

You can't use your XBO while the camera is disconnect. People are not only concerned when their Xbox is off. If everything you do in your living room is through your Xbox, it won't be off that often at all.

 

[SPDIF]

I'll be boycotting having a living room camera from those companies, yes.

None of these companies (or any other for that matter) will be allowed to place an always on and always connected camera in my living or bed room...

So it's just the ability for them to (theoretically) see and hear you that you don't like? You don't care about other personal information (theoretically) being shared? Private photos from Facebook, your Google search history, videos you watched on YouTube etc...?

 

[Gemüsepizza]

It ain't just Microsoft, dude. You probably use devices and software from many other companies on that list. I suppose you'll be boycotting Microsoft as well as Facebook, Google, Apple, and Youtube as well?

I already cleaned up my Facebook and Google/Youtube profiles to a degree I find comfortable in the light of these uncoverings. I will soon request information from both these companies to inform me about what additional data they have stored about me, and will demand deletion, if necessary. Since this was revealed I have also switched from Windows 7 to Linux on my desktop computer, and flashed my cell phone with CM (without Google apps) as a start. I will also think about a more secure eMail solution for myself and other improvements to protect my privacy. They can go to hell.

 

[NullPointer]

Technically, you could just unplug it if disabling it doesn't make you happy.

You can't use the Xbox One when the Kinect is unplugged.

Why do you think that is?

MS stated that surveillance have no access to there servers, but through use of users actual usage i e skype and outlook, etc...I also think that MS won't be spying on my kinect. Just saying, it would be utterly pointless.

I'm aware of what they've stated so far. I was discussing potential, and I think that potential is important if the possibility exists, no matter how slight, for it to be compromised and exploited.

 

[dragonflys545]

Let people have the ability to unplug that piece of junk off their Xbone.

 

[IslandHead]

Apologies if it's been posted, but this advert has been discussed, aye?

I saw it last week. I watched it a bit slack-jawed myself. Nothing says 'damage control' with ads like that, eh.

It is moot. With Chrome and Firefox you can already turn off a lot of things tracking your internet movement but then websites will stop working until you turn those feature on again.

 

[StudioTan]

So tell me, were the parties whose informations were "requested" made privy to this court order?

"Dear suspected terrorists,

We are writing this letter to inform you that we are now monitoring your communications. However, please don't mind us and continue with whatever it was you were doing. Just pretend we're not listening and watching.

PS, a little less nudity wouldn't hurt.

Sincerely,
The NSA"

You can't use the Xbox One when the Kinect is unplugged.

Why do you think that is?

Same reason my computers used to be unable to boot unless the keyboard was plugged in?

 

[Philthy]

MS stated that surveillance have no access to there servers, but through use of users actual usage i e skype and outlook, etc...I also think that MS won't be spying on my kinect. Just saying, it would be utterly pointless.

If they found out the Boston bombers had an XBox One, you would bet they'd be forcing Microsoft to open up a stream to their system whether they wanted to do it or not. Hell, it would make perfect sense to check the list of owners before doing a no knock search warrant for somewhere. You could get a glimpse into what you might expect.

And then you get the Snowdens who say random pubbie contractors have access to do ALL of this with or without warrants and checks. It's a bad road to go down.

 

[BigDug13]

So it's just the ability for them to (theoretically) see and hear you that you don't like? You don't care about other personal information (theoretically) being shared? Private photos from Facebook, your Google search history, videos you watched on YouTube etc...?

No, those are things I willingly did on the Internet or uploaded to the Internet. Having the ability to see what I'm doing in my living room is a whole different animal.

 

[ari]

You can't use the Xbox when the Kinect is unplugged.

Why do you think that is?

So they can spy on us? Right?

Not because they want to intergrate voice commands and motion control for the console, nope. That can't be it.

 

[SPDIF]

I already cleaned up my Facebook and Google/Youtube profiles to a degree I find comfortable in the light of these uncoverings. I will soon request information from both these firms about what data they have stored about me, and will demand deletion. Since this was revealed I have also switched from Windows 7 to Linux on my desktop computer, and flashed my cell phone with CM as a start. I will also think about a more secure eMail solution and other improvements to protect my privacy. They can go to hell.

You honestly think they'll give you everything they have on you? They could always lie about it. Who says they actually delete the information just because you tell them to?

 

[IslandHead]

MS stated that surveillance have no access to there servers, but through use of users actual usage i e skype and outlook, etc...I also think that MS won't be spying on my kinect. Just saying, it would be utterly pointless.

Look at my post on page 6. The NSA doesn't need access to any company's servers to get your communications or information. It is most likely that they are splitting fibre optic cable that make up the backbone of the internet. No one knows for sure if this is how PRISM works but it the most likely way.

 

[NullPointer]

So they can spy on us? Right?

Not because they want to intergrate voice commands and motion control for the console, nope. That can't be it.

The current Xbox has integrated voice and motion.

 

[Freki]

So it's just the ability for them to (theoretically) see and hear you that you don't like? You don't care about other personal information (theoretically) being shared? Private photos from Facebook, your Google search history, videos you watched on YouTube etc...?

Of course I care for every single bit of private information - that's why I don't share it.

-Facebook? Barebones - only used to stay in contact with friends I don't see regulary (I know - metadata it is bad enough that way...)
-Private photos on the internet? - nope - they are all stored on an encrypted hdd...
-Google search and youtube? Ghostery addon prevents all the trackers from identifying me + I am not logged in when I use these services + new ip every 24h

I am very well aware of the fact that there is no such thing as 100% privacy or security - but there's no reason to voluntarily open up new vectors of attack without any benefit what so ever....

 

[charsace]

But the PS4 isn't the device which has to be connected to a mandatory camera/microphone.

The PS4 is a device that does connect to a network and the purpose of PRISM is to monitor networks.

MS stated that surveillance have no access to there servers, but through use of users actual usage i e skype and outlook, etc...I also think that MS won't be spying on my kinect. Just saying, it would be utterly pointless.

You're being naive if you think the government isn't monitoring everything all the time. They have the power to do so so why wouldn't they?

 

[MIMIC]

Did DF just looking this thread
https://twitter.com/digitalfoundry/status/355416198575423490

That's just as bad as Microsoft defending their DRM nonsense by saying that "you're always online anyway".

 

[Omni]

brb making tinfoil hat and taping all my devices that have microphones and video cameras

 

[ari]

If they found out the Boston bombers had an XBox One, you would bet they'd be forcing Microsoft to open up a stream to their system whether they wanted to do it or not. Hell, it would make perfect sense to check the list of owners before doing a no knock search warrant for somewhere. You could get a glimpse into what you might expect.

And then you get the Snowdens who say random pubbie contractors have access to do ALL of this with or without warrants and checks. It's a bad road to go down.

Sooo ms will give the NSA access to the Boston bombers Xbox one....then what? Wait until he comes home and turn it on? Same if he had a 360 or ps3/ps4? Come on now.

 

[ari]

Look at my post on page 6. The NSA doesn't need access to any company's servers to get your communications or information. It is most likely that they are splitting fibre optic cable that make up the backbone of the internet. No one knows for sure if this is how PRISM works but it the most likely way.

So why would they need access to the Xbox one? I had yet to hear a reasonable explanation when they can just access your PC or phone.

 

[IslandHead]

So why would they need access to the Xbox one? I had yet to hear a reasonable explanation when they can just access your PC or phone.

They could want to see what you're doing or talking about in your living room.

 

[BigDug13]

So why would they need access to the Xbox one? I had yet to hear a reasonable explanation when they can just access your PC or phone.

Because your PC and phone cameras don't have the same capabilities. This zooms in on faces, reads pulses, has varying other camera modes to detect the presence of people in the dark, and it is always pointed at you from your entertainment center.

 

[Freki]

So why would they need access to the Xbox one? I had yet to hear a reasonable explanation when they can just access your PC or phone.

2 attack vectors > 1 attack vector - is that so hard to understand?
Additonally a phone is most of the time stored away in your trousers (at least mine is) which makes the camera worthless for surveillance.
Kinect on the other hand will be directly aimed at your living- or bedroom 24/7...

 

[SwiftDeath]

So why would they need access to the Xbox one? I had yet to hear a reasonable explanation when they can just access your PC or phone.

I plan all my most worthy criminal activities on my couch of course

Have to move planning to the basement then I guess.....

 

[Krakn3Dfx]

Because your PC and phone cameras don't have the same capabilities. This zooms in on faces, reads pulses, has varying other camera modes to detect the presence of people in the dark, and it is always pointed at you from your entertainment center.

"Please allow 6-8 feet of space in front of the Kinect in order for the NSA to adequately gauge your guilt level."

 

[dragonelite]

The PS4 is a device that does connect to a network and the purpose of PRISM is to monitor networks.


You're being naive if you think the government isn't monitoring everything all the time. They have the power to do so so why wouldn't they?

NSA has access to the internet backbone hubs where data enters and leaves the us.
They probably have people working at SCEA that can easily access the data if its needed.

 

[B.O.O.M]

"Dear suspected terrorists,



Same reason my computers used to be unable to boot unless the keyboard was plugged in?

You can't see the difference between something that is essential by nature for the primary hardware to function vs Kinect...?

 

[Freki]

I plan all my most worthy criminal activities on my couch of course

Have to move planning to the basement then I guess.....

If you have anything critical to say about the government I'd do that in the basement as well...

 

[ari]

Because your PC and phone cameras don't have the same capabilities. This zooms in on faces, reads pulses, has varying other camera modes to detect the presence of people in the dark, and it is always pointed at you from your entertainment center.

Oh, OK, its like ms made it strictly for spying for the NSA. Makes sense. Wonder how many criminals they will catch.

 

[ari]

They could want to see what you're doing or talking about in your living room.

Doing? Watching something or playing a game.

Talking about? Cod or madden or how someone beat/lost online.

There will hardly ever ever ever be enough intel EVER to warrant such a surveillance on the xbox one.....EVER!

Even if ms/FBI wanted to survey a console, I don't see a judge granting a warrant. Seriously? What can they grab from a suspect while using kinect? when they can bug the fuck out of the house instead?

 

[StudioTan]

You can't see the difference between something that is essential by nature for the primary hardware to function vs Kinect...?

MS considers Kinect essential to function. I could use my computer with just a mouse, I didn't need a keyboard.

The point is, I think the implication that the Kinect must be plugged in because they want to be able to spy on you is ludicrous.

Because your PC and phone cameras don't have the same capabilities. This zooms in on faces, reads pulses, has varying other camera modes to detect the presence of people in the dark, and it is always pointed at you from your entertainment center.

Put tape on it or turn it around.

 

[Freki]

MS considers Kinect essential to function. I could use my computer with just a mouse, I didn't need a keyboard.

The point is, I think the implication that the Kinect must be plugged in because they want to be able to spy on you is ludicrous.

Microsoft doesn't want to "spy" on you - at least not in the traditional sense, that's correct.
Microsoft wants to analyze your behaviour (automatically) in order to improve targeted advertising.
These "noble" intentions however do not prevent the goverment from using these capabilities for other means if deemed neccessary...

 

[Cipherr]

It's always listening if you want it to be. You can disable it, or outright shut it down when you're not using it.

I would have it disabled 24/7. Never turning it on. Why would I want that thing recording/listening in my living room?

I wouldn't, so I would disable it all the time, which begs the question "Why the fuck would I pay a $100 premium on this console for this device that I will never use?"

At which point I would buy a PS4 instead.

The point is, I think the implication that the Kinect must be plugged in because they want to be able to spy on you is ludicrous.

Of course MS doesn't want to spy on you. The NSA can and will though, and there's nothing MS can do legally to not turn over that info if the NSA or any other agency wants it. Noone is arguing MS's intent. MS gets the short end of the stick here, and its not even entirely their fault. I feel for them, but I'm not going to have that thing in our living room..... sorry.

Put tape on it or turn it around.

Or save $100 and buy the competing console and never BOTHER taping or turning around anything.

 

[RedNumberFive]

Put tape on it or turn it around.

Even easier. Just don't buy it.

 

[NullPointer]

The point is, I think the implication that the Kinect must be plugged in because they want to be able to spy on you is ludicrous.

The implication is that they have no need to require it. So they shouldn't.

If MS wants it to be mandatory, then they'll have to deal with any Kinect/Prism fallout.

 

[StudioTan]

The implication is that they have no need to require it. So they shouldn't.

They consider it a part of their console. If they could have built it into the box they would have but the reality is it needs to sit above or below the TV whereas most people don't keep their consoles there. So it's part of the box, just separated from the main unit but no less essential to how it's designed to operate.

 

[ari]

The implication is that they have no need to require it. So they shouldn't.

I really don't want a couple of paranoid gamers hindering my experience with the one, or the future of gaming in general because they think a camera is used to spy on them.

 

[Septimius]

1) MS is American
2) All my data goes through American servers
3) America is crazy, and say they have the right to view ANY data passing through their land
4) MS gives NSA free access
5) NSA can freely access any data MS has on me
6) MS might collect kinect data on me
7) I am staying the fuck away from this shit.

I am not OK with the way the way surveillance is in the US. This is how a lot of scary shit starts.

 

[Freki]

I really don't want a couple of paranoid gamers hindering my experience with the one, or the future of gaming in general because they think a camera is used to spy on them.

Yeah - Fuck those lunatics who want to live in caves - there's not one single reason anyone should be afraid of being spied on...

 

[ari]

Yeah - Fuck those lunatics who want to live in caves - there's not one single reason anyone should be afraid of being spied on...

Fuck yea, thats totally what I meant.

 

[Freki]

Fuck yea, thats totally what I meant.

I really don't want a couple of paranoid gamers hindering my experience with the one, or the future of gaming in general because they think a camera is used to spy on them.

paranoid - check
hindering the future - check
afraid of being spied on - check

Yes that is totally what you meant.