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New Pokémon Sun & Moon trailer revealing the final starter evolutions & more

B

brinstar

Member
Watch Da Birdie said:
Outside of Red and Blue part of me wonders if Game Freak will be lazy with the Battle Tree and we'll mainly see characters from Gen VI who already have more or less workable models somewhat (with minor alterations) and of course Cynthia, who will probably be re-used for the Diamond and Pearl remakes.

I do recall The Riddler posting a picture of Anabel, most people assumed it wasn't meant to literally signal her return and was a, well, riddle---popular theories include being able to talk to Pokemon, since she had that power, and an Alola Alakazam that was Physical, since her Alakazam focused on the Elemental Punches which are no longer viable post-Gen IV, but those don't seem to be the case so I wonder if Game Freak will "make up" for the lack of the Battle Frontier by having the Frontier Brains appear in the Battle Tree.
Click to expand...

I really hope they go crazy with it BW2-style but I'm not getting my hopes up.... the Frontier Brains would be a great inclusion.
 
Y

Ydelnae

Member
I actually thought we were going to get the Battle Frontier back in these games, but with the Battle Tree announcement I think it's gone for good. And I'm sure there won't be a huge variety of old trainers, and none from Johto and Unova.
 
M

MegaManTrigger

Banned
brinstar said:
I really hope they go crazy with it BW2-style but I'm not getting my hopes up.... the Frontier Brains would be a great inclusion.
Click to expand...

Kristen-Bell-Laughing-to-Crying.gif


I wish...
 
F

Forceatowulf

G***n S**n*bi
Yeah, it's over, I'm done trying to decide between Litten and Rowlet. I'm getting both.

These are legit amongst the best starting trios ever.

There's something really awesome about seeing Red and Blue all grown up now. I was 10 when I started playing these games back in 97, so seeing them aged as I have aged is pretty fucking sweet.
 
O

Otakumegane

Member
I imagine Hoot's HA to be Sniper and his gimmick will be stacking crits with STAB Leaf Blade and Shadow Claw with Scope Lens or another set with that new move leaked that guarantees a crit the turn after.

But at the same time acting as a potential trapper/pivot. With access to U-turn and his signature move.
 
D

DNAbro

Member
I'm kind of fine with only the Battle Tree if it means getting interesting bosses every once in awhile like Cynthia or Wally. Much better than Châtelaines or whatever they were called. So boring visually. I just wonder if it is going to just be like the Battle Tower or if there is a proper ending to it.
 
U

unknownstranger

Member
Otakumegane said:
I imagine Hoot's HA to be Sniper and his gimmick will be stacking crits with STAB Leaf Blade and Shadow Claw with Scope Lens or another set with that new move leaked that guarantees a crit the turn after.

But at the same time acting as a potential trapper/pivot. With access to U-turn and his signature move.
Click to expand...

I guessed Rowlet's hidden ability would be Sniper when his final form first leaked. Primarina's will be I think either Cute Charm or Serene Grace. Inceniroar's I have the most trouble with. Competitively the best I think he could have are Intimidate and Justified. Justified especially if he can learn Acrobatics to bait Knock Off from Fighting types.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
Otakumegane said:
I imagine Hoot's HA to be Sniper and his gimmick will be stacking crits with STAB Leaf Blade and Shadow Claw with Scope Lens or another set with that new move leaked that guarantees a crit the turn after.

But at the same time acting as a potential trapper/pivot. With access to U-turn and his signature move.
Click to expand...

That's just not reliable enough at 50%. I'd rather he had Super Luck than Sniper.

If I was designing Decidueye to be as useful as possible, and we're thinking he's going to be a trapper with mostly physical build, I'm wanting at least 125 base speed to make Weavile think twice. If Weavile reliably outspeeds, then Decidueye isn't going to be OU; it's basically a free KO. Decent defense and HP; something like 94 / 115 / 90 / 55 / 55 / 125 fits within the usual BST for starters and allows it to take Band'd Pursuits from Ttar (not on switch, but then you get the mindgame of stay in vs switch) if necessary, allows it to 50/50 Weavile and make that not an obvious option, and enough attack at the end to still hit hard. 55 / 55 might be a bit too obvious insofar as: this is really minmaxed for competitive purposes, but then, Grass/Ghost is not a good enough typing combo you can really avoid that if you want it to be good.
 
M

MegaManTrigger

Banned
Crab said:
That's just not reliable enough at 50%. I'd rather he had Super Luck than Sniper.

If I was designing Decidueye to be as useful as possible, and we're thinking he's going to be a trapper with mostly physical build, I'm wanting at least 125 base speed to make Weavile think twice. If Weavile reliably outspeeds, then Decidueye isn't going to be OU; it's basically a free KO. Decent defense and HP; something like 94 / 115 / 90 / 55 / 55 / 125 fits within the usual BST for starters and allows it to take Band'd Pursuits from Ttar (not on switch, but then you get the mindgame of stay in vs switch) if necessary, allows it to 50/50 Weavile and make that not an obvious option, and enough attack at the end to still hit hard. 55 / 55 might be a bit too obvious insofar as: this is really minmaxed for competitive purposes, but then, Grass/Ghost is not a good enough typing combo you can really avoid that if you want it to be good.
Click to expand...

Weavile can already outspeed with priority through Ice Shard (assuming priority didn't get nerfed). I played around with stats using your number and I got this:

With an Adamant Banded Weavile
252+ Atk Choice Band Weavile Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Trevenant: 222-264 (67.4 - 80.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

With a Jolly LO Weavile
252 Atk Life Orb Weavile Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Trevenant: 174-211 (52.8 - 64.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

(Trevenant is edited to have 94 base HP and 90 base DEF as per your stat).

With Knock Off being a thing, it also gets even worse as it can OHKO no matter what nature or item. Either way, Decidueye with 90 base DEF is not going to be able to handle Weavile even if it outspeeds. I don't think Weavile is a good barometer in determining how viable Decidueye would be in OU. Not to mention, even if you had given it Super Luck, it isn't reliable enough to faint Weavile considering the RNG as well as probabilities.
 
A

AnathemicOne

Banned
Titanoboa said:
Blue is featured in the trailer in the OP
Click to expand...

Japanese Blue which is a girl. The Blue we know in the West is known as Green in Japan (which makes sense as he's wearing fucking green and Red is wearing fucking Red). To avoid confusion in translation most people refer to Japanese Blue as Leaf (due to her being introduced as playable character in Leaf Green/Fire Red).
 
E

Espada

Member
Delaney said:
I actually thought we were going to get the Battle Frontier back in these games, but with the Battle Tree announcement I think it's gone for good. And I'm sure there won't be a huge variety of old trainers, and none from Johto and Unova.
Click to expand...

Man, if the Battle Frontier is completely gone they're going to have to come up with something really substantial for the post-game island in Sinnoh, since that was a major element of it. Now that I think about it, even the Pal Park stuff just south of the Twinleaf would have to be replaced with something else.
 
D

Delio

Member
Only starter that will be OU is Primarina. Bank on it!

On HA I think

Decidueye - Sniper
Incineroar - Tough Claws
Primarina - Pixilate
 
U

unknownstranger

Member
Crab said:
That's just not reliable enough at 50%. I'd rather he had Super Luck than Sniper.

If I was designing Decidueye to be as useful as possible, and we're thinking he's going to be a trapper with mostly physical build, I'm wanting at least 125 base speed to make Weavile think twice. If Weavile reliably outspeeds, then Decidueye isn't going to be OU; it's basically a free KO. Decent defense and HP; something like 94 / 115 / 90 / 55 / 55 / 125 fits within the usual BST for starters and allows it to take Band'd Pursuits from Ttar (not on switch, but then you get the mindgame of stay in vs switch) if necessary, allows it to 50/50 Weavile and make that not an obvious option, and enough attack at the end to still hit hard. 55 / 55 might be a bit too obvious insofar as: this is really minmaxed for competitive purposes, but then, Grass/Ghost is not a good enough typing combo you can really avoid that if you want it to be good.
Click to expand...

I don't think Game Freak designs starters with competitive play in mind. I'm still going with a mixed attacker with similar stats to Greninja. Plus even if Decidueye outspeeds Weavile it can still use Ice Shard to do a ton of damage to it. Decidueye could learn Focus Blast to be able to one shot it though.
 
NeonZ

NeonZ

Member
AnathemicOne said:
Japanese Blue which is a girl. The Blue we know in the West is known as Green in Japan (which makes sense as he's wearing fucking green and Red is wearing fucking Red). To avoid confusion in translation most people refer to Japanese Blue as Leaf (due to her being introduced as playable character in Leaf Green/Fire Red).
Click to expand...

Technically, she's referenced as Leaf since it was an unused default name in the rom for the female trainer. Even in Japan, sometimes she's called Fuguri (From Leaf Green) to differentiate her from the manga character Blue.
 
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
NeonZ said:
Technically, she's referenced as Leaf since it was an unused default name in the rom for the female trainer. Even in Japan, sometimes she's called Fuguri (From Leaf Green) to differentiate her from the manga character Blue.
Click to expand...

I don't know why they bother. Blue's design is based on the female character design that went unused for the first generation but appears in the concept art and one piece of promotional art; that same design is used as the basis for "Leaf" later on, so they're both takes on the same base design and in the FRLG chapters of Special, Blue is adapted to look more like Leaf anyway. I dislike the use of the term Leaf, she should just be Blue in JPN and Green elsewhere. Nobody calls ingame Red something different to make him stand out form Special Red.
 
S

Seil

Member
Crab said:
I don't know why they bother. Blue's design is based on the female character design that went unused for the first generation but appears in the concept art and one piece of promotional art; that same design is used as the basis for "Leaf" later on, so they're both takes on the same base design and in the FRLG chapters of Special, Blue is adapted to look more like Leaf anyway. I dislike the use of the term Leaf, she should just be Blue in JPN and Green elsewhere. Nobody calls ingame Red something different to make him stand out form Special Red.
Click to expand...

Kris takes on Lyra's clothes too, but she's still Kris and distinct from Lyra. I consider Leaf a recreation/replacement of the unused character (Blue) in the same vein as Lyra, personally.
 
B

Brawly Likes to Brawl

Member
Kyzer said:
I'm pretty sure the battle frontier will be back since Oras hinted at it
Click to expand...

I would love to see that happen, but I wouldn't hold out hope. I feel GF would've mentioned it since so many people were upset about it being gone.

Crimson_Echidna said:
Wish Leaf wasn't snubbed.
Click to expand...

She was one of my favorite protag designs. Seeing so many fans show love for her these past few days makes it sting less, though.
 
S

Seil

Member
Kyzer said:
I'm pretty sure the battle frontier will be back since Oras hinted at it
Click to expand...

I feel it's unlikely in Sun and Moon with the Battle Tree's existence. Whenever we've had a Frontier, the Tower became a facility within it rather than its own thing. The Battle Tree appears to be another Tower clone but with the twist of being able to battle/recruit old characters. And we can see what's most likely the Battle Tree on the world map, clearly not a part of a Frontier.

I *really* want a Frontier and personally find the Battle Tower and its clones boring as sin, but sadly I don't see it happening in Sun and Moon =/ If we get it I'll be extremely happy but I'm going in with no expectations, especially after they pulled that with ORAS.
 
M

MegaManTrigger

Banned
Kyzer said:
I'm pretty sure the battle frontier will be back since Oras hinted at it
Click to expand...

Never going to happen.

Q:Why wasn't the Battle Frontier in the remakes?
A:This question is connected with my previous answer. We didn't put the BF in ORAS for this very reason. Interviewer's note: In short he means that they didn't include the BF because only a very small part of the players would have fully appreciated and made use of this feature; nowadays players get bored and frustrated more easily and they aren't interested in things that are so demanding/challenging.
Click to expand...

Also, it wouldn't make sense. Why wait until SuMo, when Hoenn was the reason why we even had Frontiers in the first place? It'd be a missed opportunity of epic proportions.
 
K

Kyzer

Banned
MegaManTrigger said:
Never going to happen.



Also, it wouldn't make sense. Why wait until SuMo, when Hoenn was the reason why we even had Frontiers in the first place? It'd be a missed opportunity of epic proportions.
Click to expand...

The whole thing doesn't make sense there's plenty of things they put into the games that players don't use or appreciate, far more so than BF. I think it was a bs answer and they didn't have time or whatever. It was a missed opportunity of epic proportions regardless...if anything them putting a sign saying battle frontier construction has begun implies that there were actual plans to include it or in a future title. Why even mention it ?
 
W

Watch Da Birdie

I buy cakes for myself on my birthday it's not weird lots of people do it I bet
I'd like to see Incineroar get a Hidden Ability that simply gives him a third STAB in Fighting-type moves.
 
R

RagnarokX

Member
Geeze. I just watched this video where this guy tries to explain why "Decide-you-eye" is grass/ghost and he's going on about how Mexican folklore has an evil owl witch ghost and the goddess of the dead uses owls as messengers. Its design and description has absolutely nothing to do with these cultural references.

My thoughts are it's ghost type because it's figuratively a ghost. It's a sniper assassin that can mask its presence. Like how assassins and snipers irl can be called ghosts. This one is so good at it that it's ingrained in its being.
 
K

Kyzon

Member
RagnarokX said:
Geeze. I just watched this video where this guy tries to explain why "Decide-you-eye" is grass/ghost and he's going on about how Mexican folklore has an evil owl witch ghost and the goddess of the dead uses owls as messengers. Its design and description has absolutely nothing to do with these cultural references.

My thoughts are it's ghost type because it's figuratively a ghost. It's a sniper assassin that can mask its presence. Like how assassins and snipers irl can be called ghosts. This one is so good at it that it's ingrained in its being.
Click to expand...

Also the owl it's based off of is extinct ;)

"The stilt-owls (Grallistrix) are a genus of true owls which contains four species, all of which lived on the Hawaiian Islands but are now extinct."
 
Boss Doggie

Boss Doggie

all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Honestly I just pronounce him Deh-See-Die. And people try to complicate things. It's just the line is extinct and they are also called ghost owls.

Joe's right though, the names need some changing. The French name of Incineroar is much better for instance. Felinferno makes a good wrestler name too.
 
G

Geminosity

Member
RagnarokX said:
Geeze. I just watched this video where this guy tries to explain why "Decide-you-eye" is grass/ghost and he's going on about how Mexican folklore has an evil owl witch ghost and the goddess of the dead uses owls as messengers. Its design and description has absolutely nothing to do with these cultural references.

My thoughts are it's ghost type because it's figuratively a ghost. It's a sniper assassin that can mask its presence. Like how assassins and snipers irl can be called ghosts. This one is so good at it that it's ingrained in its being.
Click to expand...
It's a ghost because it died along with its parents in that tragic safari accident and now it is a vengeful spirit, chasing down those who have failed this city :p
 
R

RagnarokX

Member
Boss Doggie said:
Honestly I just pronounce him Deh-See-Die. And people try to complicate things. It's just the line is extinct and they are also called ghost owls.

Joe's right though, the names need some changing. The French name of Incineroar is much better for instance. Felinferno makes a good wrestler name too.
Click to expand...

It's most likely deh-sid-you-eye. As in deciduous trees; trees that shed leaves annually.
 
Shadow Broker

Shadow Broker

Banned
Crab said:
That's just not reliable enough at 50%. I'd rather he had Super Luck than Sniper.

If I was designing Decidueye to be as useful as possible, and we're thinking he's going to be a trapper with mostly physical build, I'm wanting at least 125 base speed to make Weavile think twice. If Weavile reliably outspeeds, then Decidueye isn't going to be OU; it's basically a free KO. Decent defense and HP; something like 94 / 115 / 90 / 55 / 55 / 125 fits within the usual BST for starters and allows it to take Band'd Pursuits from Ttar (not on switch, but then you get the mindgame of stay in vs switch) if necessary, allows it to 50/50 Weavile and make that not an obvious option, and enough attack at the end to still hit hard. 55 / 55 might be a bit too obvious insofar as: this is really minmaxed for competitive purposes, but then, Grass/Ghost is not a good enough typing combo you can really avoid that if you want it to be good.
Click to expand...


A couple of years ago before I started seeing opposing Weavile's being used I did some research and asked questions. All I got back was Mach Punch. Mach Puch this, Mach Punch that, and Mach Punch everything! I also got some Bullet Punches here and there. I said fuck it and made my Weavile build. In the two years since I started using my Weavile he has not fainted to a Mach Punch or even steel type move. Now quite a few use Weavile. Point is that I have learn to not put stock into one paticular Pokémon or move being used against him/her.

On the other hand.... Fuck TalonFlame! >.>
I hate Gale Wings.
 
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