Support NeoGAF

[StevieP]

Well at least during PS3 era. Now gaming division is looking to make its best result ever while launching a new console (making actually some money instead of losing it). If PS4 sales continue like they do it should become division with decent margin.

The gaming division is a drop in the bucket compared to divisions that actually make money, like the credit dept

They laid off staff at NOA, too, but for whatever reason that wasn't really reported.

NOC lost a few people as well iirc. Nobody involved in game dev obviously

 

[Aostia]

Any idea on numbers?

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=832024

 

[DizzyCrow]

Anything from R&D numbers?

 

[Pie and Beans]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=832024

Thats the EU one I mentioned before.

 

[AcademicSaucer]

Wow at 3ds software

 

[TheDarkTriforce]

Awesome

 

[iamvin22]

Yes, all unit numbers in OP [HW/SW] are shipped

if these are shipped numbers what are we guessing at hw/ sw sold to consumers numbers?

 

[jblank83]

Nintendo made a profit? That's terr... great news.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

if these are shipped numbers what are we guessing at hw/ sw sold to consumers numbers?

Ideally HW vendors would be selling each one they put on shelves but a healthy in stock/sold would be selling at least 90% of stock put on shelves, so that's what I go off of mentally when glancing at numbers. We know the NPD and Media Create/Famitsu totals for Wii U for this period at least

Either way, Nintendo's already counted the profit from each of these 7.5M machines as they've already been purchased by stores

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

Those hardware numbers are beyond anemic...

I had really hoped that their growing software libraries on 3DS and Wii U would have turned things around.

Definitely interesting. Glad they could turn a profit, even if it's nothing to write home about. Nintendo has some serious issues to address in the coming years, but at least for now they're turning out excellent software and keeping themselves going financially.

I would definitely like to see them wade into the holiday battle with some strong reduced pricing offerings, but maybe they don't feel they have a lot of wiggle room for a push.

They also had to lay off 8% of their work force this year (the 300 employees at NoE in Germany). Not a good sign. Why does it not surprise me that non-Japanese employees were the first to go in large numbers?

 

[Atram]

They also had to lay off 8% of their work force this year (the 300 employees at NoE in Germany). Not a good sign. Why does it not surprise me that non-Japanese employees were the first to go in large numbers?

The lay-off was because they moved NoE completley to Frankfurt and didn´t need all the stuff from Großostheim to move over.

 

[Inferno313]

They also had to lay off 8% of their work force this year (the 300 employees at NoE in Germany). Not a good sign. Why does it not surprise me that non-Japanese employees were the first to go in large numbers?

Isn't Europe Nintendo's weakest market? Better to shed what isn't working and double down on what is.

 

[jcm]

A couple of updates to things I've been tracking:

The Powerhouse™ 3DS vs NDS at the same point in their lifespan:

This quarter
TTM after 15 quarters on sale:

3DS Hardware:  10.44
NDS Hardware:  30.28

3DS Software:  63.81 *
NDS Software: 187.95 **


Last Quarter
TTM after 14 quarters on sale:

3DS Hardware:  11.66
NDS Hardware:  30.31

3DS Software:  65.45 *
NDS Software: 185.62 **

* Software sales units and the number of new titles for Nintendo 3DS 
are those of Nintendo 3DS card software (packaged and downloadable versions).
** This does not include DSiWare

And the Yamauchi buyback:

Buyback price:      12,025 JPY  
Yesterday's price:  11,120 JPY

 

[velvet_nitemare]

A couple of updates to things I've been tracking:

The Powerhouse™ 3DS vs NDS at the same point in their lifespan:

This quarter
TTM after 15 quarters on sale:

3DS Hardware:  10.44
NDS Hardware:  30.28

3DS Software:  63.81 *
NDS Software: 187.95 **


Last Quarter
TTM after 14 quarters on sale:

3DS Hardware:  11.66
NDS Hardware:  30.31

3DS Software:  65.45 *
NDS Software: 185.62 **

* Software sales units and the number of new titles for Nintendo 3DS 
are those of Nintendo 3DS card software (packaged and downloadable versions).
** This does not include DSiWare

And the Yamauchi buyback:

Buyback price:      12,025 JPY  
Yesterday's price:  11,120 JPY

You were also tracking 3DS vs PSP as i recall.

Any updates?

 

[zroid]

back in the black finally? grats Ninty

 

[Exile20]

That is awesome and they didn't have to do massive layoffs or selloff many buildings. I guess they focused on profitability even if the Wii U isn't selling close to PS4 numbers.

They also had to lay off 8% of their work force this year (the 300 employees at NoE in Germany). Not a good sign. Why does it not surprise me that non-Japanese employees were the first to go in large numbers?

Well the full story is

Around 320 employees at Nintendo of Europe will lose their jobs this week, the company confirmed to Kotaku today.

That number includes around 130 full-time Nintendo of Europe employees—as was reported in June—and an additional 190 who worked for the company's Germany-based localization department by way of a leasing agency. Though technically those 190 people were temporary employees, in practice, they all worked exclusively for Nintendo, and many of them had been working there for years, some have told Kotaku.

It sucks for those people tho. The industry is tough. Stop instigating that Nintendo was being bias. It was the localization team.

 

[Crayolan]

Wow that 3DS drop. We need the New 3DS and some big game announcements yesterday.

Wii U is looking better though. Hopefully Q3 will be good for them and they can continue the upward trend through 2015.

 

[stuminus3]

Train kept a-rollin', all night long...

 

[Letterbomb]

Scoring a profit is always good. I just hope they can continue the momentum. We have holidays coming up, so they should be more than fine for this next quarter, but 2015 as a whole sort of worries me. I can't think of very many high profile titles coming out for either Wii U or N/3DS. Hope to hear about them soon.

Amiibos though. money money money money come

 

[jcm]

You were also tracking 3DS vs PSP as i recall.

Any updates?

I don't have shipment numbers for them handy. This is the NPD sellthrough for the comparable year:

      3DS 2014   PSP 2008   NDS 2008
January     97        230        251
February   153        243        587
March      159        297        698
April      106        193        415
May         97        182        452
June       152        337        783
July       108        222        608
August      91        253        518
September  141        238        537
October               193        491
November              421       1570
December             1020       3040

Through 
September 1104       2195       4849

Total     1104       3829       9950

Maybe tonight I can put together some PSP/3DS TTM comps.

 

[Van Owen]

Reminds me of the Gamecube years where the line would always be "even though they're in last place at least they're making a profit."

 

[TheSpaceBetween]

Wow those 3DS and Wii U sales are bad. But hey, they're profitable at least.

 

[velvet_nitemare]

I don't have shipment numbers for them handy. This is the NPD sellthrough for the comparable year:

      3DS 2014   PSP 2008   NDS 2008
January     97        230        251
February   153        243        587
March      159        297        698
April      106        193        415
May         97        182        452
June       152        337        783
July       108        222        608
August      91        253        518
September  141        238        537
October               193        491
November              421       1570
December             1020       3040

Through 
September 1104       2195       4849

Total     1104       3829       9950

Maybe tonight I can put together some PSP/3DS TTM comps.

Thanks

 

[shinra-bansho]

I don't have shipment numbers for them handy. This is the NPD sellthrough for the comparable year.

It's actually tracking under 2009 PSP as well, although the holiday may pull it over.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

Isn't Europe Nintendo's weakest market? Better to shed what isn't working and double down on what is.

Abandoning markets sounds like a terrible idea to me. You don't just hand your competitors uncontested dominance of regions.

 

[BengaBenga]

If the WiiU YoY shipment improvements hold, Nintendo could be shipping close to 4 million units in Q3, bringing it to over 11 million by end 2014. While obviously not great, that does provide a reasonable userbase for first and second party software and especially indie games.

 

[RurouniZel]

Abandoning markets sounds like a terrible idea to me. You don't just hand your competitors uncontested dominance of regions.

If you don't have a product that's going to make a dent in the competition, it's a waste of time/money.

See also: Xbox One in Japan.

 

[Atram]

If you don't have a product that's going to make a dent in the competition, it's a waste of time/money.

See also: Xbox One in Japan.

Sure but WiiU is far away in Europe from One Levels in Japan.

 

[Exile20]

If you don't have a product that's going to make a dent in the competition, it's a waste of time/money.

See also: Xbox One in Japan.

The problem with that line of thinking is that it is harder to re-enter the market.

 

[Kill3r7]

The problem with that line of thinking is that it is harder to re-enter the market.

This.

There are a lot of costs/resources associated with entering a market. Once you are there it is easier to keep the "machine" running rather than to start anew down the road.

 

[Guevara]

It seems Nintendo has hit rock bottom, at least as far as Q2 (jul, aug, sep) operating income is concerned:

fy2011: +30.9 billion
fy2012: -19.6 billion
fy2013: -18.8 billion
fy2014: -18.3 billion
fy2015: +9.3 billion

It's been a fun couple of years.

 

[watershed]

Abandoning markets sounds like a terrible idea to me. You don't just hand your competitors uncontested dominance of regions.

Do you honestly think that Nintendo is abandoning Europe?

 

[Exile20]

It seems Nintendo has hit rock bottom, at least as far as Q2 (jul, aug, sep) operating income is concerned:

fy2011: +30.9 billion
fy2012: -19.6 billion
fy2013: -18.8 billion
fy2014: -18.3 billion
fy2015: +9.3 billion

Every company struggles at some point, no matter how big or profitable you are, you will struggle. It is the what goes up must come down situation. What every company must learn is how to survive the down.

Many companies don't survive when shit is bad.

 

[Sir Abacus]

Nintendo have something like $10 billion cash on hand and the Wii U has some real system sellers now. I'm pretty sure they aren't going anywhere.

 

[Gbpackers31]

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but didn't Nintendo write off their Wii U losses last year? Wouldn't one reason for profitability be just that? If so, it doesn't seem all that rosy because come next year, they'll be down once again.

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

That is awesome and they didn't have to do massive layoffs or selloff many buildings. I guess they focused on profitability even if the Wii U isn't selling close to PS4 numbers.



Well the full story is



It sucks for those people tho. The industry is tough. Stop instigating that Nintendo was being bias. It was the localization team.

First of all, I'm not "instigating" (do you mean insinuating?) that Nintendo was being biased, but rather stated that, because they are extremely Japan-centric (detrimentally so), it would not surprise me if they "trimmed the fat" off of every other branch but NCL until absolutely necessary.

What Nintendo needs to do is divert its resources to focus on what has always been its largest market: North America. In other words, they should be laying off employees in Japan, if anywhere, and rehiring in the US for the cultivation of new Western development studios and partnerships with other Western development houses. How much would you wager, however, that they will not do this?

Second of all, I am aware of the full story. Are you aware that a 5,000-employee company letting go eight percent of its work force all at once is no small matter? A once-profitable company that is now in contraction with tremendous financial losses for three consecutive years is obviously not on the right path.

 

[LeleSocho]

Those 3ds number are pretty bad aren't they?

 

[RurouniZel]

The problem with that line of thinking is that it is harder to re-enter the market.

Point taken.

 

[Atram]

First of all, I'm not "instigating" (do you mean insinuating?) that Nintendo was being biased, but rather stated that, because they are extremely Japan-centric (detrimentally so), it would not surprise me if they "trimmed the fat" off of every other branch but NCL until absolutely necessary.

What Nintendo needs to do is divert its resources to focus on what has always been its largest market: North America. In other words, they should be laying off employees in Japan, if anywhere, and rehiring in the US for the cultivation of new Western development studios and partnerships with other Western development houses. How much would you wager, however, that they will not do this?

Second of all, I am aware of the full story. Are you aware that a 5,000-employee company letting go eight percent of its work force all at once is no small matter? A once-profitable company that is now in contraction with tremendous financial losses for three consecutive years is obviously not on the right path.

 

[vinnygambini]

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but didn't Nintendo write off their Wii U losses last year? Wouldn't one reason for profitability be just that? If so, it doesn't seem all that rosy because come next year, they'll be down once again.

You are correct they wrote off the loses pertaining to the production of Wii U and the write-down (50$ price cut) in FY14.

What they accomplished in FY15 is costs reductions (promotional activities, employees being laid off) among many factors and a bigger contribution of software sales - higher margins.

 

[DXB-KNIGHT]

Making profits without selling HQs is great if you ask me.

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

Nintendo have something like $10 billion cash on hand and the Wii U has some real system sellers now. I'm pretty sure they aren't going anywhere.

This is unfortunately far from the truth. Nintendo is currently sitting on about 4.7 billion in raw cash on hand. Their total assets are in the range of 11 billion.

 

[RMI]

Profit is good. Here's to hoping they have a killer holiday. I think they deserve it.

 

[vinnygambini]

This is unfortunately far from the truth. Nintendo is currently sitting on about 4.7 billion in raw cash on hand. Their total assets are in the range of 11 billion.

Uh + Short Term Investments Securities

Total is 8 Billion US$ approximately Cash on Hand.

No Debt

 

[Seik]

Glad to see they're finally making profit.

Hope they'll have a good holiday season.

 

[Exile20]

First of all, I'm not "instigating" (do you mean insinuating?) that Nintendo was being biased, but rather stated that, because they are extremely Japan-centric (detrimentally so), it would not surprise me if they "trimmed the fat" off of every other branch but NCL until absolutely necessary.

What Nintendo needs to do is divert its resources to focus on what has always been its largest market: North America. In other words, they should be laying off employees in Japan, if anywhere, and rehiring in the US for the cultivation of new Western development studios and partnerships with other Western development houses. How much would you wager, however, that they will not do this?

Second of all, I am aware of the full story. Are you aware that a 5,000-employee company letting go eight percent of its work force all at once is no small matter? A once-profitable company that is now in contraction with tremendous financial losses for three consecutive years is obviously not on the right path.

I meant instigating. First things first percentages mean shit. If i have a company with one a person and me and I laid him off, then 50% of the work force was laid off. Huge number right, even if it was one person.

Sony laid off 3.8% of its workforce in one fell swoop but guess what, it was 5400. 5400 5400. Which is worst? The actually number or the percentage? Stop focusing on the percentage.

I fucking hate layoff, shit sucks.

Anyway, the problem with your first post was that it didn't say what department or that more than half were temps even if some worked there for years.

You are also comparing two different things, there weren't devs, so building a team in the west has nothing to do with the localization team, layoff.

Outsourcing is also standard for companies, it sucks but it is cheaper labor. Most companies outsource.

Plus Nintendo posted a profit today.

 

[kswiston]

Making profits without selling HQs is great if you ask me.

Not sure how this is comparable since Nintendo is a game company and the other two are conglomerates.

 

[AirBrian]

A few observations:

• YOY Sales are down 12.8%, but SGA is only down 4.7%. There is always some variable SGA that follows Sales, but overall I would say they have not yet fully realized the restructuring savings. They are still spending money on R&D, marketing, sales force, etc.
• Gross Profit last year was 31.6% while it's 47.3% this year. This is the good news - they are much more profitable making their products. I'm assuming they're getting better pricing on parts now. There might be some product mix driving this as well. EDIT: SW/HW splits are 53.3%/46.7% of sales for last year and 53.4%/46.6% of sales this year, so any mix is most likely hardware mix.
• The restructuring happened during this 6 month period, so depending on the timing it is only partially reflected in these numbers.
• Inventory is down from last year and Trade Payables is up. They're either getting more efficient turning product (partially, I think) and/or getting favorable terms from suppliers. Probably both.

 

[Exile20]

Not sure how this is comparable since Nintendo is a game company and the other two are conglomerates.

So Nintendo doesn't own buildings around the world that they can sell for extra cash?

 

[What The Forest Taught Me]

Uh + Short Term Investments Securities

Total is 8 Billion US$ approximately Cash on Hand.

No Debt

"Uh," wrong. Securities do not equal raw cash and deposits on hand in the bank. Did I write "cash and cash equivalents?" No, I did not.

You can lose the backhanded snippy Nintendo Defense Force "uh" sarcasm any time.