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[abstract alien]

The concept of "new IP" is overrated to begin with imo

I honestly feel like this a lot of the time. The mechanics of a game are all I ultimately care about, which is why most new IP titles don't excite me at all. A new character doing the same things I've already been doing does nothing for me.

 

[eddfromtheriver]

I think the problem is less about "no new IP" and more about "no new flagship IP" - that is, new IP that really can serve as the face of their platform. The Wii series was probably the only new IP that would qualify as a "flagship IP" that they introduced last generation. Splatoon might turn out to be pretty big on Wii U, but I'm not betting heavily on it.

I agree with your post... except for that Splatoon part, i think it will sell well but only to the Nintendo fan base, the art style is not that appealing to reach a wider demographic. it kind of looks like an ad for that Fanta softdrink brand.

 

[Platy]

If Bit generations counts than Art Style is an spin off IP I guess ?

You should totaly count the Streetpass games as New Ip ... specialy the DLC ones.


And Excitebots as an spin of Ip maybe

Considering how big you want spin of Ip to be you can count Mario Sport Mix

 

[thepotatoman]

He's pointing out that you said a lot was riding on w101. It even got revealed on an after show during e3 '12. Nintendo barely even advertised it. A lot wasnt riding on it in terms of expectations.

btw, the game is awesome.

Ah, I guess I was more talking about my personal view on the state of new Nintendo IPs. Obviously no new IP will reach the sales of old IPs which had decades of building up a fanbase.

 

[Buddha Beam]

I think the problem is less about "no new IP" and more about "no new flagship IP" - that is, new IP that really can serve as the face of their platform. The Wii series was probably the only new IP that would qualify as a "flagship IP" that they introduced last generation. Splatoon might turn out to be pretty big on Wii U, but I'm not betting heavily on it.

Usually things don't start out as flagship IP until they've blown up and become popular. Miis would be on the same level as something like Dylan's Rolling Western had the Wii not become so popular and been written off.

Nintendo is really, really good at creating mascot characters. Any number of them has what it takes to be a flagship IP or mascot but for numerous reasons... aren't.

 

[Entryhazard]

A change of theme, characters and setting can make a HUGE difference to a game though, so your argument is kind of odd to me. The atmosphere and tone can change drastically, whilst still maintaining the base mechanics, and lead to further inspiration for new ones. I'd personally love to see Nintendo make a mario clone, introducing brand new characters, a fresh new setting and a change of artstyle. I don't see anything wrong with using similar gameplay in a new franchise.

Yet again Nintendo is getting shit because apparently all their innumerable Mario games are all identical

I prefer a Game in the same setting in a new genre or with new mechanics rather than a clone with a different "coat of paint" like I see many new games to be

 

[786110]

Was Sakura Samurai intended as some sort of spiritual continuation of The Mysterious Murasame Castle? I remember reading some conflicting things on the matter when the game came out. Either way I had a blast playing it.

 

[Famassu]

They are new IPs. Thats the point. As much as Splatoon, Xenoblade X, Wonderful 101. They are as much new IPs aa Steel Diver, Tearaway, Flower and Pushmo. Deal with it.

Yes, but Sony in comparison has their Pushmos as well as plenty of new IPs that are of the caliber of their biggest old IPs. Instead of Wonderful 101 being an exception in a sea of Mario games and other decades old IPs getting their sequels, Sony has their Pushmos (Resogun, Rain, Journey, Rime), Wonderful 101s (Puppeteer, Tearaway, Gravity Rush, Beyond, The Last of Us, Knack) and older franchises (Gran Turismo, Hot Shots Golf, Wipeout). Even if not all of those Sony games are better than the 30th Mario game in 4 years, it's still more interesting to own Sony devices for those fresher experiences for a lot of people than to be too excited about getting a console that had 4 Mario themed games in 1,5 years (while suffering from extremely severe droughts) and will have 3 more in 2015 (while still suffering from droughts).

I don't see what's so hard to understand about this. It's not that the new smaller IPs don't count, but they just don't weight as much to a lot of people as new IPs on the scale & quality of Zelda or Metroid Prime would.

 

[rouken]

I think the problem is less about "no new IP" and more about "no new flagship IP" - that is, new IP that really can serve as the face of their platform. The Wii series was probably the only new IP that would qualify as a "flagship IP" that they introduced last generation. Splatoon might turn out to be pretty big on Wii U, but I'm not betting heavily on it.

What? How can the small new IPs not count? Sony releases a bunch of new IPs that they don't particularly consider as flagship but people count it when they hail sony for their countless new IPs.

Thus when really comparing both companies, give or take, they have almost the same amount of sequels to established franchises and new IPs.

 

[Stallion Dan]

When all the IPs combined don't add up to one Mario, Zelda, Metroid etc, are they worth mentioning?

Ok, Xenoblade was great and good enough to stand by itself (though not if you ask Nintendo the way they treated it). But the rest of that list...

 

[pinkurocket]

Nintendo should do something with Another Code/Trace Memory.
Also hotel Dusk, but Room 215 + the prequel feel quite complete as a story.

RIP Cing.

 

[TheSpaceBetween]

I honestly feel like this a lot of the time. The mechanics of a game are all I ultimately care about, which is why most new IP titles don't excite me at all. A new character doing the same things I've already been doing does nothing for me.

I'm kind of in the middle... Different worlds and characters can be appealing, but for the most part this gen all of these "new IP" just have the player doing the same things we've done over and over before.

There have been some really unique new IP though like TW101 and games like Splatoon and Sunset Overdrive look great.

 

[random25]

I think the problem is less about "no new IP" and more about "no new flagship IP" - that is, new IP that really can serve as the face of their platform. The Wii series was probably the only new IP that would qualify as a "flagship IP" that they introduced last generation. Splatoon might turn out to be pretty big on Wii U, but I'm not betting heavily on it.

I think they really have. Gameboy popularized Tetris and Pokemon, DS had Brain Age and Nintendogs, Gamecube introduced Pikmin as well as re-imagine a Metroid game, Wii Had Wii Sports and Wii stuff, 3DS also had big releases that wasn't Mario or Zelda (Kid Icarus: Uprising, Fire Emblem: Awakening and Animal Crossing: New Leaf). It does not necessarily be "brand new", it's just all about putting up an IP that was not big before into an elite status other than Mario or Zelda.

 

[Fantastical]

What? How can the small new IPs not count? Sony releases a bunch of new IPs that they don't particularly consider as flagship but people count it when they hail sony for their countless new IPs.

Thus when really comparing both companies, give or take, they have almost the same amount of sequels to established franchises and new IPs.

It's funny you want to mention Sony and Nintendo in the same sentence when it comes to new IP's. Many of Sony's flagship titles last generation were new IP. Need a reminder?

Uncharted
Heavy Rain
Heavenly Sword
LittleBigPlanet
White Knight Chronicles
Folklore
Resistance
Infamous
Motorstorm
Beyond: Two Souls
Journey
The Last of Us

Sony was MILES ahead of Nintendo in actually giving a shit about their new IP's last generation. Look at those names... they defined the PS3.

 

[Coffee Dog]

It's funny you want to mention Sony and Nintendo in the same sentence when it comes to new IP's. Many of Sony's flagship titles last generation were new IP. Need a reminder?

Uncharted
Heavy Rain
Heavenly Sword
LittleBigPlanet
White Knight Chronicles
Folklore
Resistance
Infamous
Motorstorm
Beyond: Two Souls
Journey
The Last of Us

Sony was MILES ahead of Nintendo in actually giving a shit about their new IP's last generation. Look at those names... they defined the PS3.

All of the bolded are (relatively) low budget or niche. All of the underlined are open world titles or shooters ie incredibly safe sellers.

See how this works? Sony doesn't push new IPs hard either unless they're easy sells.

 

[RurouniZel]

Nintendo should do something with Another Code/Trace Memory.
Also hotel Dusk, but Room 215 + the prequel feel quite complete as a story.

RIP Cing.

Losing Cing really hurt.

 

[Laughing Banana]

It's funny you want to mention Sony and Nintendo in the same sentence when it comes to new IP's. Many of Sony's flagship titles last generation were new IP. Need a reminder?

Uncharted
Heavy Rain
Heavenly Sword
LittleBigPlanet
White Knight Chronicles
Folklore
Resistance
Infamous
Motorstorm
Beyond: Two Souls
Journey
The Last of Us

Sony was MILES ahead of Nintendo in actually giving a shit about their new IP's last generation. Look at those names... they defined the PS3.

People champions the term "New IP" too much, whereas nowadays "New IP" most times translates into "same old stuff with new coat of paint."

Case in point ^

 

[Fantastical]

All of the bolded are (relatively) low budget or niche. All of the underlined are open world titles or shooters ie incredibly safe sellers.

See how this works?

Not at all. That's a terrible way to break down this list. Please put up new IP's that were available on the Wii from Nintendo last generation. Look at how little of a shit Nintendo gave about them. Count the number of times new IP's appeared at E3 for Wii.

 

[Coffee Dog]

Not at all. That's a terrible way to break down this list. Please put up new IP's that were available on the Wii from Nintendo last generation.

LIST WARZZZZ

My point was that when you rebut a list of new nintendo IP and say "But it doesn't have the mario and zelda budget!" you have to realize that nobody else does that either. Did sony give Puppeteer or Folklore a killzone budget? Of course they didn't. It would lose a ton. because making new IPs loses money.

 

[Fantastical]

LIST WARZZZZ

My point was that when you rebut a list of new nintendo IP and say "But it doesn't have the mario and zelda budget!" you have to realize that nobody else does that either Did sony give Puppeteer a killzone budget? Of course they didn't. It would lose a ton. because making new IPs loses money.

Did Sony give Uncharted a Killzone budget? Probably not but relatively close I'd say. Last of Us, almost positive it's above what they give to Killzone. Resistance had to have a large budget too. Infamous as well. Same with Heavy Rain and Beyond. The argument is not good. Of course Pupeteer didn't get as big of a budget as Killzone.

We're making a direct comparison between Sony and Nintendo on their new IPs, and more specifically, the confidence the companies have in exploring new IP. There is no comparison to the list of games I made for PS3 on the Wii. The problem is that I don't think any of the new IP's even came close to the budget they put into Mario and Zelda.

And again, it's weird to bring up budget. Nintendo absolutely should have been nailing it with new IP's during the Wii. The budget for their games vs HD development was significantly less and they were selling millions upon millions of hardware units. Where were the new IP?

EDIT: On a more positive note for Nintendo, I think Splatoon is great. I love that they actually gave it some time in their E3 video. It seems like they are really wanting it to be big, and hopefully the fan outcry will intensify their marketing. I WANT Nintendo to explore new worlds, characters, and gameplay ideas.

 

[Soul_Pie]

I actually think Nintendo have done an alright job in terms of coming up with some new IPs, it's just how they manage them that seems to be the issue. They have the same problem with a whole host of long dormant IPs that are pretty much neglected at this point. They are also in something of a unique situation of having to carry a platform by themselves in terms of software so naturally expectations are going to be much higher in terms of offering the diversity and new experiences that a console owner might want.

I guess the thing about Nintendo is how they treat a lot of their new IPs, it's like they're not willing to bank on them being a success or supporting them properly. In that aspect it does actually feel like lip service. A lot of these games had such limited releases; gamers had to practically beg to get Xenoblade to get a worldwide release, and even then you could barely find a copy. Disaster: Day of Crisis never even got a North American release. A few other games in that list never made it past Japanese shores either so we can't even comment on their quality.

I think it's more about Nintendo's attitude towards its new IPs that is the issue here, writing up a list of games that fit the very basic requirements of being a new IP doesn't really quell the concerns that Nintendo aren't really all that committed. How many of those new games have actually flourished as series over the course of a decade? How is Nintendo going to foster the next generation of "evergreen" titles if they're only going to offer the bare minimum in support?

 

[Coffee Dog]

Did Sony give Uncharted a Killzone budget? Probably not but relatively close I'd say. Last of Us, almost positive it's above what they give to Killzone. Resistance had to have a large budget too. Infamous as well.

all of those are open world games or shooters. Very, very safe titles to make money with.

Same with Heavy Rain and Beyond. The argument is not good. Of course Pupeteer didn't get as big of a budget as Killzone.

Heavy Rain and Beyond actually had decently small budgets.

We're making a direct comparison between Sony and Nintendo on their new IPs, and more specifically, the confidence the companies have in exploring new IP. There is no comparison to the list of games I made for PS3 on the Wii. The problem is that I don't think any of the new IP's even came close to the budget they put into Mario and Zelda.

And again, it's weird to bring up budget. Nintendo absolutely should have been nailing it with new IP's during the Wii. The budget for their games vs HD development was significantly less and they were selling millions upon millions of hardware units. Where were the new IP?

Sigh. Look back at any of the lists posted in this thread. Nintendo has had a lot of new IP. They just aren't given huge budgets because they aren't shooters or open world games.

EDIT: On a more positive note for Nintendo, I think Splatoon is great. I love that they actually gave it some time in their E3 video. It seems like they are really wanting it to be big, and hopefully the fan outcry will intensify their marketing. I WANT Nintendo to explore new worlds, characters, and gameplay ideas.

They have been. Don't blame Nintendo for your ignorance.

Edit:

I think it's more about Nintendo's attitude towards its new IPs that is the issue here, writing up a list of games that fit the very basic requirements of being a new IP doesn't really quell the concerns that Nintendo aren't really all that committed. How many of those new games have actually flourished as series over the course of a decade? How is Nintendo going to foster the next generation of "evergreen" titles if they're only going to offer the bare minimum in support?

How many have sold enough to justify that? Because while there are several series that fit that criteria (animal crossing, Pikmin, hell even the Wii ___ line of titles) I'm assuming you're meaning very regular sequels, which only Nintendo megasellers like Mario, Zelda, and Smash get.

 

[boiled goose]

Nintendo could spend 100 million advertising Pushmo and it wouldn't sell. There are some games you don't put that much advertising money into. Pushmo is a niche game for a niche audience.

I was responding to the claim it was a system seller. Niche and no advertising means not a mainline ip.

 

[Mik317]

It is a strage catch 22 of sorts tho.

They create a new IP, market it like they would one of their "big guns", and it bombs anyway...then what? Should have used Mario, right?

But you keep using Mario and he gets stale and all of a sudden that crutch is gone.

It's more about creating the right IP and those type of games just aren't Nintendo's strenght (shooters) right now and if they do, it would feel real "fake" or trying too hard to me.

Idk what they can do lol

It seems like they have begun to figure it out (just make all the games you can and hope one of them is a revival of it's respective genre) but that "figuring out" phase still is off the back of Mario.

It will be interesting to see what they do

 

[Phil S.]

People champions the term "New IP" too much, whereas nowadays "New IP" most times translates into "same old stuff with new coat of paint."

Case in point ^

I think Journey and LittleBigPlanet for starters don't fit the "same old stuff with new coat of paint", but I agree with others. I believe in the definition that you stated regarding new IPs definitely. Most of the time that's just what it is.

 

[foxuzamaki]

Did Sony give Uncharted a Killzone budget? Probably not but relatively close I'd say. Last of Us, almost positive it's above what they give to Killzone. Resistance had to have a large budget too. Infamous as well. Same with Heavy Rain and Beyond. The argument is not good. Of course Pupeteer didn't get as big of a budget as Killzone.

We're making a direct comparison between Sony and Nintendo on their new IPs, and more specifically, the confidence the companies have in exploring new IP. There is no comparison to the list of games I made for PS3 on the Wii. The problem is that I don't think any of the new IP's even came close to the budget they put into Mario and Zelda.

And again, it's weird to bring up budget. Nintendo absolutely should have been nailing it with new IP's during the Wii. The budget for their games vs HD development was significantly less and they were selling millions upon millions of hardware units. Where were the new IP?

EDIT: On a more positive note for Nintendo, I think Splatoon is great. I love that they actually gave it some time in their E3 video. It seems like they are really wanting it to be big, and hopefully the fan outcry will intensify their marketing. I WANT Nintendo to explore new worlds, characters, and gameplay ideas.

Both uncharted and the last of us had only a 20 million+ budget which is average