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[Schnozberry]

But its also a stationary console, not just a handheld.

Also beholden to the laws of thermodynamics.

 

[AzaK]

I couldn't ask for much more from a handheld.

But the kicker is it's a home console......according to Nintendo.

 

[Übermatik]

But its also a stationary console, not just a handheld.

But more importantly, it's also a handheld.

 

[Malus]

But its also a stationary console, not just a handheld.

Well their last two home consoles weren't up to spec either, at least we get a beefy handheld outta the deal. Couldn't be happier to see 3DS hardware fade out. I'll miss the 3D though.

 

[pswii60]

Nice so we could be looking at something quite close to XB1 which is 1.3TF right?

Third party games won't be using FP16, not if they're multi-platform. First party games will make use of the advantage though I'd expect.

 

[Gamer79]

Nvidia has been trying to get a piece of the console business for a long time. I know they want to put an impressive chip out there. I expect it to be competitive. As a Nvidia Shield tv owner I can attest the x1 is powerful. I expect pascal technology in this chip. They said custom made so it is 100% not an X1 chip.

 

[frankie_baby]

Third party games won't be using FP16, not if they're multi-platform. First party games will make use of the advantage though I'd expect.

Unreal engine 4 can apparently use fp16 so we may see some third party games using it

 

[nynt9]

Unreal engine 4 can apparently use fp16 so we may see some third party games using it

That depends on whether third parties porting the game would be willing to go through the effort to make the switch. Just because the engine supports something doesn't make it trivial to change your entire arithmetic architecture. It's not as simple as flipping a switch.

 

[frankie_baby]

That depends on whether third parties porting the game would be willing to go through the effort to make the switch. Just because the engine supports something doesn't make it trivial to change your entire arithmetic architecture. It's not as simple as flipping a switch.

Obviously not but its not an impossibility that some third party games will make at least some effort

 

[Doctre81]

I think it will be fully custom and probably better than parker to be honest. With some of the things they learned building Xavier.

 

[Thraktor]

That depends on whether third parties porting the game would be willing to go through the effort to make the switch. Just because the engine supports something doesn't make it trivial to change your entire arithmetic architecture. It's not as simple as flipping a switch.

For UE4 it should be trivial. I obviously can't speak for Switch development, but on mobile UE4 will use FP16 for all pixel shader arithmetic by default, and you have to go out of your way to get it to run in FP32.

 

[antonz]

For UE4 it should be trivial. I obviously can't speak for Switch development, but on mobile UE4 will use FP16 for all pixel shader arithmetic by default, and you have to go out of your way to get it to run in FP32.

Yeah I suspect Unreal will be a big benefit for Nintendo this time around especially with how prevalent it is becoming in Japan for devs to use. Unreal has worked hard to ensure maximum performance even for mobile.

Here is slides from a GDC talk in 2014
https://cdn2.unrealengine.com/Resou...xt_Generation_Mobile_Rendering-2033767592.pdf

 

[shouamabane]

I really hope Nintendo goes aggressive on bang-for-your-buck power with Switch.

Gamecube is still one of my favorite hardware designs.

 

[Speely]

I am still a bit taken aback by and really happy about this partnership. They just seem, on paper, to fit together. Their strengths and weaknesses sort of balance out when considering them together.

Sort of like yin and yang.

Ninception.

 

[Nerrel]

I am still a bit taken aback by and really happy about this partnership. They just seem, on paper, to fit together. Their strengths and weaknesses sort of balance out when considering them together.

Sort of like yin and yang.

Ninception.

It's true. Getting a company that knows what they're doing with hardware possibly better than anyone else to do all the technical work for them was the best possible choice Nintendo could have made. Not only in terms of getting a competent and developer friendly system, but also inspiring confidence in their system to fans. And Nintendo does seem to have a much better grasp on what makes a portable system practical and appealing than Nividia did.

 

[ShadowFox08]

Something tells me in power

Switch = Perfect Cell
XBone1 = Super Perfect Cell
PS4 = SSJ2 Gohan.

Yeah, I went there. ._.

 

[TLZ]

So this fp16 is the new thing for gaming that hdr is for tvs?

So if all devs were somehow forced to use fp16 on all machines then we get the significant double the flops right? That's a breakthrough. This would also put the PS4 pro on 8.4tf and Scorpio on 12tf. Shit!

Sorry for the slight OT and yes I somehow hyped myself up a little bit.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

That depends on whether third parties porting the game would be willing to go through the effort to make the switch. Just because the engine supports something doesn't make it trivial to change your entire arithmetic architecture. It's not as simple as flipping a switch.

If it becomes a doable thing for PC hardware, I imagine multiplatform games would start to use it or fall behind in the Bulletpoint Wars.

 

[Speely]

So this fp16 is the new thing for gaming that hdr is for tvs?

So if all devs were somehow forced to use fp16 on all machines then we get the significant double the flops right? That's a breakthrough. This would also put the PS4 pro on 8.4tf and Scorpio on 12tf. Shit!

Sorry for the slight OT and yes I somehow hyped myself up a little bit.

I almost replied to this seriously.

 

[Schnozberry]

It's true. Getting a company that knows what they're doing with hardware possibly better than anyone else to do all the technical work for them was the best possible choice Nintendo could have made. Not only in terms of getting a competent and developer friendly system, but also inspiring confidence in their system to fans. And Nintendo does seem to have a much better grasp on what makes a portable system practical and appealing than Nividia did.

Nvidia seems like a company filled with, and I use this term with endearment, nerds. They are wonderful at things that land in their wheelhouse, and designing SOCs is definitely in their wheelhouse, but their effort at building devices has always been something of a mixed bag. I think their problem with the Shield line of products is that they clearly staked out a niche from the beginning, and one they had to know would be difficult to satisfy, and released a series of half baked ideas. Gaming on Android is something of a chore with it's various software quirks, and Nvidia's game streaming always had frame timing and hitching problems that made it something of a difficult sell to the hardcore niche they were aiming for. It also doesn't help that they had issues with industrial design and faulty batteries, but nobody ever questioned whether or not the guts of the product were solid. They just weren't setup to succeed.

Nintendo, despite their flaws, is a good partner for Nvidia. They generally have great hardware QA and industrial design. They were willing to work closely with Nvidia to avoid the OS level problems with Android that rob mobile hardware of it's performance potential, with low level API's and custom software for system integration. Nvidia was able to take a step back for the thing they struggled with, which is finding games that could actually drive people to the platform. The more general audience Nintendo aims for won't have same psychotic OCD about hardware specs and graphics dick swinging contests, so the Tegra line offers enough punch to do the job. The timing worked out great. Nintendo was looking to resurrect it's dedicated hardware business at the same time Nvidia was realizing that they had serious issues penetrating the tablet market. The deal allowed both companies to do what they do best, and fill in the gaps for the other. It really seems like it worked out for both sides, considering the response outside the Neogaf bubble has been great for The Switch, and Nvidia was able to secure their biggest Tegra customer ever and cancel their doomed Shield line to pursue other big fish like the automotive industry.

 

[Roo]

I really hope Nintendo goes aggressive on bang-for-your-buck power with Switch.

Gamecube is still one of my favorite hardware designs.

I'm on the same boat, really.
I wouldn't mind paying some premium money for Nintendo consoles if the tech behind them justified the price.

Not saying they should charge $500. They could still go $250-300 but I would like to be sure they got the best specs and components said price could afford.

 

[Malakai]

Nvidia seems like a company filled with, and I use this term with endearment, nerds. They are wonderful at things that land in their wheelhouse, and designing SOCs is definitely in their wheelhouse, but their effort at building devices has always been something of a mixed bag. I think their problem with the Shield line of products is that they clearly staked out a niche from the beginning, and one they had to know would be difficult to satisfy, and released a series of half baked ideas. Gaming on Android is something of a chore with it's various software quirks, and Nvidia's game streaming always had frame timing and hitching problems that made it something of a difficult sell to the hardcore niche they were aiming for. It also doesn't help that they had issues with industrial design and faulty batteries, but nobody ever questioned whether or not the guts of the product were solid. They just weren't setup to succeed.

Nintendo, despite their flaws, is a good partner for Nvidia. They generally have great hardware QA and industrial design. They were willing to work closely with Nvidia to avoid the OS level problems with Android that rob mobile hardware of it's performance potential, with low level API's and custom software for system integration. Nvidia was able to take a step back for the thing they struggled with, which is finding games that could actually drive people to the platform. The more general audience Nintendo aims for won't have same psychotic OCD about hardware specs and graphics dick swinging contests, so the Tegra line offers enough punch to do the job. The timing worked out great. Nintendo was looking to resurrect it's dedicated hardware business at the same time Nvidia was realizing that they had serious issues penetrating the tablet market. The deal allowed both companies to do what they do best, and fill in the gaps for the other. It really seems like it worked out for both sides, considering the response outside the Neogaf bubble has been great for The Switch, and Nvidia was able to secure their biggest Tegra customer ever and cancel their doomed Shield line to pursue other big fish like the automotive industry.

Just to add on to this, we don't have to have developers/publishers and engine creators that have some type of working relationship with Nvidia dissing/wishing it to fail like during the Wii U.

 

[Hermii]

I'm on the same boat, really.
I wouldn't mind paying some premium money for Nintendo consoles if the tech behind them justified the price.

Not saying they should charge $500. They could still go $250-300 but I would like to be sure they got the best specs and components said price could afford.

The design (no camera, mic, cheap controllers, single regular screen, nothing super fancy) would indicate most of the budget went into the internals.

That being said there might be unleaked functionality we don't know about.

 

[Dagobert Duck]

Nvidia seems like a company filled with, and I use this term with endearment, nerds. They are wonderful at things that land in their wheelhouse, and designing SOCs is definitely in their wheelhouse, but their effort at building devices has always been something of a mixed bag. I think their problem with the Shield line of products is that they clearly staked out a niche from the beginning, and one they had to know would be difficult to satisfy, and released a series of half baked ideas. Gaming on Android is something of a chore with it's various software quirks, and Nvidia's game streaming always had frame timing and hitching problems that made it something of a difficult sell to the hardcore niche they were aiming for. It also doesn't help that they had issues with industrial design and faulty batteries, but nobody ever questioned whether or not the guts of the product were solid. They just weren't setup to succeed.

Nintendo, despite their flaws, is a good partner for Nvidia. They generally have great hardware QA and industrial design. They were willing to work closely with Nvidia to avoid the OS level problems with Android that rob mobile hardware of it's performance potential, with low level API's and custom software for system integration. Nvidia was able to take a step back for the thing they struggled with, which is finding games that could actually drive people to the platform. The more general audience Nintendo aims for won't have same psychotic OCD about hardware specs and graphics dick swinging contests, so the Tegra line offers enough punch to do the job. The timing worked out great. Nintendo was looking to resurrect it's dedicated hardware business at the same time Nvidia was realizing that they had serious issues penetrating the tablet market. The deal allowed both companies to do what they do best, and fill in the gaps for the other. It really seems like it worked out for both sides, considering the response outside the Neogaf bubble has been great for The Switch, and Nvidia was able to secure their biggest Tegra customer ever and cancel their doomed Shield line to pursue other big fish like the automotive industry.

Sorry for a noob question maybe, but the Shield was "bad" at streaming its signal to somewhere else (e.g. a PC) so it really seems like a perfect combination, cause Nintendo got that streaming tech on point with the streaming in the Wii U. With Kimishima saying they showed just the core, I think we will see somekind of streaming too, they wont drop that nearly perfect streaming they got with Wii U, even if they just add an USB-dongle for a TV...

 

[rockyt]

What is this X2 I've been hearing about that suppose to be in the NX now? I heard the old kit was using the overclocked X1 as a placemat for another chip but not sure what the X2 could be.

 

[KingSnake]

What is this X2 I've been hearing about that suppose to be in the NX now? I heard the old kit was using the overclocked X1 as a placemat for another chip but not sure what the X2 could be.

When people talk about X2 they actually want to say Parker. A custom Soc based on Parker to be more precise.

 

[dr_rus]

"Based on" doesn't mean much really. Pascal isn't that much different from Maxwell so unless we're talking about more units / wider bus / higher clocks - there's not much difference between a SoC based on X1 or a SoC based on Parker. Parker itself should be faster than X1 by some 50% but there's no indication that Switch uses Parker itself and not some custom Parker SoC which may be faster or slower than Parker.

 

[tesla246]

What a ride, I remember reading a year ago the K1 would be the most plausible and that X1 was the most positive scenario. Really excited for NX, nintendo has been tocking all the right boxes, also rumoured to have USB-C, so they may be pushing technology a bit in the mobile space.

So that 750 Gflops fp32 and 1500 Gflops fp16...
Could that have some meaning with Emily Roger's hint on the power of NX?
She said it is closer to XBOXone than PS4, even though that might be stretching it...
Might that only be true when taking into account fp16? That sure does stretch it, as it is only true for certain situations. I do not know if she has any knowledge in that field, but she may have quickly glanced looked at specs, coming to that conslusion. Now that line does make sense though.

 

[KingBroly]

In pure flops? No, that would be unlikely. It's possible in this type of form factor but it's likely too expensive for what Nintendo wants to charge.

But Nvidia typically has better tools and software that end up getting better performance out of their hardware, at least on PC (which is apparently where we get the whole "Nvidia flops are better than AMD flops). We don't know if that will be the case on a console though.

So we really don't know what the real world performance will be, but it's likely much closer to XB1 than Wii U.

I've very interested in the reality that Nintendo is going to reveal the specs of Switch, something they didn't do for Wii or Wii U. They probably want to impress people who give a shit about that kind of thing.

 

[Metal B]

Something tells me in power

Switch = Perfect Cell
XBone1 = Super Perfect Cell
PS4 = SSJ2 Gohan.

Yeah, I went there. ._.

If anything the Switch is Gotenks. It's a fusion, powerful, has a funny attitude and it only last 30 minutes.

 

[ozfunghi]

"Based on" doesn't mean much really. Pascal isn't that much different from Maxwell so unless we're talking about more units / wider bus / higher clocks - there's not much difference between a SoC based on X1 or a SoC based on Parker. Parker itself should be faster than X1 by some 50% but there's no indication that Switch uses Parker itself and not some custom Parker SoC which may be faster or slower than Parker.

Well, it has been rumored and it would make perfect sense, given the fact that Nvidia claims the Pascal chip to be either 40% faster than the Maxwell chip at the same power draw (which would be very interesting for Nintendo in docked mode), or 60% more power efficient than the Maxwell chip while delivering the same performance (which would be very interesting for Nintendo in portable mode).

So that 750 Gflops fp32 and 1500 Gflops fp16...

So if all devs were somehow forced to use fp16 on all machines then we get the significant double the flops right? That's a breakthrough. This would also put the PS4 pro on 8.4tf and Scorpio on 12tf. Shit!

You can't use fp16 for everything. In fact, if you can use it for half the computations, that 'd be a succes. So you will never "double the flops" like that.

 

[tesla246]

You can't use fp16 for everything. In fact, if you can use it for half the computations, that 'd be a succes. So you will never "double the flops" like that.

Yes, but I was talking about Emily Roger's hint saying it was closer to Xone than PS4 even though that might be stretching it. That comment, if it is indeed Parker, makes perfect sense.

 

[KingSnake]

"Based on" doesn't mean much really. Pascal isn't that much different from Maxwell so unless we're talking about more units / wider bus / higher clocks - there's not much difference between a SoC based on X1 or a SoC based on Parker. Parker itself should be faster than X1 by some 50% but there's no indication that Switch uses Parker itself and not some custom Parker SoC which may be faster or slower than Parker.

The main difference that could concern Switch is the memory controller. So it matters a bit.

 

[Dagobert Duck]

If anything the Switch is Gotenks. It's a fusion, powerful, has a funny attitude and it only last 30 minutes.

This is a console thread and not "what anime characters desribes your sex life the best" thread... though it seems like a good idea for a thread

 

[klier]

It's actually named Parker after Peter Parker. The X1 was Erista (Wolverine) and the next one will be called Xavier.

Nvidia have been using superhero codenames since Tegra 3/Kal-El.

Wow, that's........pretty freaking pathetic.

 

[TLZ]

I almost replied to this seriously.

You can't use fp16 for everything. In fact, if you can use it for half the computations, that 'd be a succes. So you will never "double the flops" like that.

I've no idea what it is tbw. All I've been reading lately is fp16 this and double the flops that.

 

[blu]

Wow, that's........pretty freaking pathetic.

A reaction to some inoffensive codenames? Sarcasm? One never knows.

 

[Skittzo0413]

I've very interested in the reality that Nintendo is going to reveal the specs of Switch, something they didn't do for Wii or Wii U. They probably want to impress people who give a shit about that kind of thing.

I have a feeling they're gonna let Jen Hsun Huang talk about it for a while, since he can hype anything. I don't think the old rules apply to Nintendo anymore- I can definitely see them talking about the specs of this since they'll be basically unprecedented for the form factor.

 

[klier]

A reaction to some inoffensive codenames? Sarcasm? One never knows.

Not sarcasm. Now you know.

This superhero stuff is getting more pathetic by the day. Time to get over it.

A shame I now know 'Parker' comes from Peter Parker. Wish I didn't know that. Childish, sad and pathetic.

 

[Painguy]

I feel like a lot of you guys are doing sum heavy mental gymnastics to make fp16 do more than it actually can. Im expecting 60- 75% of XB1 graphical fidelity. Its probs a 16nm chip that is a customized version of a newer Maxwell architecture. Maybe a wider mem bus but im not even expecting that. UE4 seems to run decently on mobile devices with limited bandwidth.

 

[Cerium]

Not sarcasm. Now you know.

This superhero stuff is getting more pathetic by the day. Time to get over it.

A shame I now know 'Parker' comes from Peter Parker. Wish I didn't know that. Childish, sad and pathetic.

Go outside and get some fresh air. Maybe run a lap around the block.

 

[tesla246]

Not sarcasm. Now you know.

This superhero stuff is getting more pathetic by the day. Time to get over it.

A shame I now know 'Parker' comes from Peter Parker. Wish I didn't know that. Childish, sad and pathetic.

It is time for the internet to take a break from you.

 

[KingSnake]

I feel like a lot of you guys are doing sum heavy mental gymnastics to make fp16 do more than it actually can. Im expecting 60- 75% of XB1 graphical fidelity. Its probs a 16nm chip that is a customized version of a newer Maxwell architecture. Maybe a wider mem bus but im not even expecting that. UE4 seems to run decently on mobile devices with limited bandwidth.

Why did you feel the need to make it personal ("you guys" part)? I noticed this trend. How does it help with anything?

 

[blu]

I feel like a lot of you guys are doing sum heavy mental gymnastics to make fp16 do more than it actually can. Im expecting 60- 75% of XB1 graphical fidelity. Its probs a 16nm chip that is a customized version of a newer Maxwell architecture. Maybe a wider mem bus but im not even expecting that. UE4 seems to run decently on mobile devices with limited bandwidth.

Educate us.

 

[Painguy]

Why did you feel the need to make it personal ("you guys" part)? I noticed this trend. How does it help with anything?

Ummmm...I didnt mean any harm by it homie. :/ How else would I address the people talking in this thread?

Educate us.

Not much I can say other than the likelyhood of the NX matching (or exceeding) XB1's 1.3TF performance cuz of fp16 is kinda...idk out there.

 

[MacTag]

I feel like a lot of you guys are doing sum heavy mental gymnastics to make fp16 do more than it actually can. Im expecting 60- 75% of XB1 graphical fidelity. Its probs a 16nm chip that is a customized version of a newer Maxwell architecture. Maybe a wider mem bus but im not even expecting that. UE4 seems to run decently on mobile devices with limited bandwidth.

It's going to be 16nm, Pascal based and with a 128-bit bus. All signs are pointing this way.

 

[blu]

Not sarcasm. Now you know.

This superhero stuff is getting more pathetic by the day. Time to get over it.

A shame I now know 'Parker' comes from Peter Parker. Wish I didn't know that. Childish, sad and pathetic.

Well, apparently our minds produce completely different associations, 'cause when I hear 'Tegra Erista' I envision this:

 

[Skittzo0413]

Ummmm...I didnt mean any harm by it homie. :/ How else would I address the people talking in this thread?


Not much I can say other than the likelyhood of the NX matching (or exceeding) XB1's 1.3TF performance cuz of fp16 is kinda...idk out there.

I don't think it'll match XB1 performance in terms of flops or raw power, but that's sorta the purpose of discussing the different architecture and different means of optimization. It's possible that the Switch (NX is much easier to say, I'm still not used to Switch) will outperform XB1 in certain tasks (especially if it has a more powerful CPU), and that's where FP16 performance comes in.

 

[Peltz]

It is time for the internet to take a break from you.

Lol. I'm going to use this line some day.

 

[Sheroking]

Not sarcasm. Now you know.

This superhero stuff is getting more pathetic by the day. Time to get over it.

A shame I now know 'Parker' comes from Peter Parker. Wish I didn't know that. Childish, sad and pathetic.

You have 1500 posts on a videogame message board. You're in a thread that essentially is about geeking out over computer technology in a game console.

Maybe you should go read a novel or something, and you can feel good about how grown up you are. Just not CS Lewis. He thought the real childish people were the ones who were desperate to see people get over childish things.