If so that only applies to MGS4 and MGSV. His characterization in the original trilogy (+Portable Ops) is relatively consistent, barring some of his gimmicks in 3 such as the weird salute.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Ocelot in MGSV is so god damn boring.
- Thread starter Two Words
- Start date
If so that only applies to MGS4 and MGSV. His characterization in the original trilogy (+Portable Ops) is relatively consistent, barring some of his gimmicks in 3 such as the weird salute.
Sounds like an excuse.
He can be a different character and not be boring
You first. So far you have not provided any subjective proof of your arguments.
I haven't claimed what I said wasn't subjective. You did.
Prove empirically that what you said is correct.
What I said is an opinion, so that's not necessary. Your statement however claimed that my opinon was null and void. Prove that it is.
No. You are wrong if you stated that as subjective.
Lord Error
Insane For Sony
Seriously, the whole game is so god damn boring so much of the time, I can't believe I'm always on the verge of just giving up on it. Even the gameplay is boring about 50% of the time while you're moving around, or retrying lengthy sections. If it wasn't for the fact that playing it the other 50% of the time is pretty awesome, I'd for sure given up on it long time ago. As it is, I'm trudging through it at a snails pace always just hoping that something interesting will happen after stretches of boredom. Thankfully, at times it does.
It's also the most boring looking mainline MGS game, which is some kind of a feat considering how good the engine can clearly be. I just remember other MGS games so vividly, how striking art stile and execution they have. MGSV is all drab and pale somehow. Everything is in pale shades of brown and green. Also, I can't stand how joyless, bored, and often times flat out drunk, Sutherland sounds in this game.
It's also the most boring looking mainline MGS game, which is some kind of a feat considering how good the engine can clearly be. I just remember other MGS games so vividly, how striking art stile and execution they have. MGSV is all drab and pale somehow. Everything is in pale shades of brown and green. Also, I can't stand how joyless, bored, and often times flat out drunk, Sutherland sounds in this game.
Astral Dog
Member
But i only answered one tiny question in that strange Bloodborne thread? about an HD port
But ok, yes Ocelot was awful, in fact almost everything was godawful you could see it coming miles away from the early trailers (clearly, darker western look with more "realistic" characters, a villain named SkullFace, Open World, Big Boss again, ) it looked, a bit uninspired like Kojima was drained and wanted to work on something else but was forced to make the most appealing big production MGS possible for the company.
News Bot, I appreciate that you're fighting the good fight. You're doing god's work. But...
I've gotta agree with Chinner here. It's just not worth it.
Dick Justice
Banned
Of course. Any fanboy of MGS4 (of all games) isn't worth the stress of arguing with.
wild wild rice
Member
All the characters in that game are so god damn boring. Except maybe that kid with 'never be game over' on his vest because he's a ridiculous child sociopath, but I bailed on the game before finding out who he is.
The game is just written lazily overall. Even the best parts, like the idea of a virus transmitted by talking and activated by language, is a decent idea handled poorly.
If Ocelot wasn't a character who already existed in the MGS lore nobody would be talking about him. If he was just some dude wearing a balaclava he wouldn't seem out of place.
Good.
If Ocelot wasn't a character who already existed in the MGS lore nobody would be talking about him. If he was just some dude wearing a balaclava he wouldn't seem out of place.
Good.
Spring-Loaded
Member
so That's So Raven territory
yeah well, most of (all?) the characters are either poorly written/pointless/annoying or wasted opportunities.
OP clearly didn't witness the best part of the game.
akidnamededdy
Banned
MGSV is so bad it MADE me an MGS4 fanboy.
brandonh83
Banned
I already loved MGS4 despite having some real problems with it, but yeah it definitely made me miss it and more than a little bit.
I actually went back to play the previous games in the franchise in order to get the bad stink of MGSV out of me. It worked, thank goodness.
Kinda the same, MGS4 was so bad it made me appreciate MGS3.
~
Holy shit.
you wrote the perfect response to your first post by yourself, kudos.
Actually, I agree. That was my reaction to Liquid Ocelot's antics during that scene.
SkylineRKR
Member
I bought 2 on Vita right after I beat V. The mystery, the charm.. even the endless banter... its much better.
Excellent speech my friend! Gift of the silver tongue, they say its the mark of a good officer... and of a liar!
SHALASHASKA!
Thats my Ocelot.
And then V ruins even this. He wasn't a sadist at all, no, he all did it for Boss.
brandonh83
Banned
The best thing about MGSV apart from it apparently leading to Kojima parting ways with Konami is that it's absolutely dispensable from a story perspective and can be effortlessly ignored. While I'm not a fan of every story decision in MGS4 let alone the weird act structure and the Scooby Doo-like intermissions that went on for-fucking-ever (didn't like globetrotting, I like more focused storytelling), it did wrap things up and had a story to tell, and none of the characters were boring or useless.
JumpCancel
Banned
MGSV Kaz is nothing compared to PW Kaz.
Jangowuzhere
Banned
Kaz was barely a character in PW. He was really just the radio man telling you what to do. The guy barely has any involvement in the actual story.
Kaz was fine imo. Mostly angry all the time, but at least it's something. Snake, Ocelot and Quiet, 3 of the most principal characters in the game, exhibit little to no emotion at all. It's kind of crazy when you think about it. Ocelot is an encyclopedia, while Snake and Quiet are these two mute, passive weirdos who share an awkward, one-sided romance of sorts. It's really weird, and reminds me of the Star Wars prequels tbh.
SkylineRKR
Member
Yes this is because Skull Face was invented for V, and worked in the shadows but was never seen or mentioned despite looking rather... distinct. The same goes for Code Talker, Quiet and others. It doesn't explain Mantis at all, hell, the game doesn't even confirm its him.
Zero was already going down and completed his patriots plan regardless.
BB himself, he wasn't even part of the game so nothing really changed. Well, Snake fought Venom in MG1, but big deal who the fuck cares as I thought the old games were removed from the canon anyway? In the end, nothing happened. Patriots went on, Snake went to defeat BB and set everything in motion. I'd rather remove MGS4 too though, because I hated Old Snake and other choices they made. But its the very end, it was never a bridge between say, MGS3 and 2.
The only thing you get from V is that some characters were brieflly ruined, but Ocelot was awesome in the games that took place after this abortion.
Marty-esque
Member
Are you saying he was much better in PW?
I'd say he was. A lot better.
SkylineRKR
Member
Yeah I replayed it and even Kiefer was far better, and had more lines. Also was interested in the people he interacted with and talked more during the mission in general. I know Venom is a different character altogether, but damn you have to endure that lifeless, oblivious looking doll for like 40 hours. If anything it was apparent from the outset that there was a hack at play.
brandonh83
Banned
I love villains that are in a handful of scenes and only really show up at the end to spout 30 minutes of bullshit while slowly following him through a base and then listening as the bullshit continues in the back of a jeep for one approximate eternity; and a main character that lacks conflict with said villain so much to the point that he doesn't say one fucking thing back to him the entire time during his ridiculous spiel.
Makes for truly riveting storytelling. Especially the part where the jeep ride goes on for so long that Skullface runs out of dialogue (whew!) and the open world being so needlessly large that they decided it was the best place to stick the game's theme song as they just stare at each other for another five minutes.
This fucking game.
The jeep scene takes my award for Absolute Worst Scene in a Metal Gear Solid game.
brandonh83
Banned
It's one of the worst scenes in any major game like this bar none and pretty much sums up the entire game, both design and story-wise -- boring, repetitive, emotionless. Game of the year contender.
SkylineRKR
Member
'You said there were 3, where is the other' is literally the only thing Venom says to Skull Face in the entirety of V.
It really was. The missions felt really varied, even though they took place in the same environment. There's a lot of secrets in every mission, and more of a story to them. Like if you extract Glaz and Palitz instead of killing them, you get to know more about their backstory. TPP is just GZ, but spread more thinly over two massive open worlds, and with a disappointing story.
Marty-esque
Member
He was decent in both I guess. The rest of the characters in V were just so awful. The cast in PW was equally terrible. Hayter was atrocious.
Easily the worst scene in the franchise. Struggling to think of anything that matches it.
brandonh83
Banned
Seriously? I don't remember much as its all mostly a blur due to the game design being a broken record with a fleeting story mostly locked into the cassette tapes -- because it's fun to listen through a hundred cassette tapes to understand a story and difficult to pay attention if you go the route of listening while doing missions -- but that sounds about right.
I get that there's tons of ridiculous scenes in the series, but they were always fun and served a contextual purpose and most fans enjoyed that and were on for the ride. Nobody looked at it as great writing, just enjoyable storytelling with cool themes and characters. But most of MGSV was the polar opposite and the scenic tour is like the prime example of everything wrong with the game.
RyanardoDaVinci
Member
I remember when I thought all the Main Missions in MGSV were going to be like GZ; a 1-2hr infiltration of a new place, bookended by important cutscenes and they would be pivotal to the story at large. The Side-Ops would also be like GZ; varied, engaging, sometimes unique but hardly repetitive.
Then MGSV came out and of the 30+ Main Missions, less than 10 were similar to the GZ mission and the rest were GZ-caliber Side-Ops in disguise...
Even though I love the gameplay I can't stand to replay it because of all the play-halting shit like the unskippable helo rides and the constant barrage of "THERE IS FOB THINGS FOR YOU TO BUY, REMEMBER? PLEASE BUY THINGS WHILE WE HOLD YOUR RESOURCES HOSTAGE!"
I'd argue Quiet's rain scene is worse.
SkylineRKR
Member
I never replayed V. In fact I rushed through Act 2 because I was fed up with it. I knew it would be one I would never restart, unlike even 4.
The rain scene was terrible as well, but a better fit for the main theme honestly.
The rain scene was terrible as well, but a better fit for the main theme honestly.
Sheriff_Battlesnake
Banned
I think I've finally figured out how I feel about it, because for the longest time Ocelot was my favorite part of the game
I like the aesthetic and portrayal of Ocelot, but don't feel like he was written to do anything. In this case I think it's the writer/director instead of the actor/designer
outside of Zero.
brandonh83
Banned
I won't argue that it isn't relentlessly stupid and indulgent, but it isn't what should be an intense, emotionally-charged climax so while you're not wrong from a point of view, I'd say the truck ride thing is worse in that it was actually supposed to be important. The Quiet scene is dumb but not some major story progression sequence.