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Ok GAF lets battle it out. Which franchise is better F-Zero or Wipeout
- Thread starter nin1000
- Start date
Don't get me wrong. I like Trackmania also. I wasn't suggesting it doesn't belong in this poll because its not good.
But, this is clearly contrasting two IPs the are often spoken in the same breath, and are seen to represent the pinnacle of a specific type of racer. There are arcade racers that a more like WipEout (quite a lot of them to be fair) than F-Zero, and there are arcade racers that are more prominent than either... but when a futuristic racer like FAST or Redout hits, the games are immediately and inevitable compared to both WipEout and F-Zero as a barometer. There are countless other racers that would fit a poll like this (such as Rollcage, Rush 2049, Extreme-G and others) that would make more sense to add to the poll before something like Trackmania which is effectively a purely time-trial based experiences with cars that don't even make contact, and lacks a futuristic aesthetic.
Trackmania may have things you would expect to see in a futuristic racer, but we're already not even considering the vast majority of actual futuristic racers... only the two that define the subgenre.
Version 3.0
Member
Inpired by this thread, I spent all weekend playing Wipeout and F-Zero. I played Wipeout HD (for hours), Wipeout 2048 (finally beat it), Wipeout XL, Wipeout 64, and Wipeout Pure.
Interspersed with all of that, I played F-Zero GX (for hours), F-Zero X, the original F-Zero, and F-Zero Climax.
And here's the conclusion that I came to: those of you viciously attacking one franchise to elevate the other don't know what you're talking about. At all. Both of these series are fucking ace, totally top-tier franchises. It was a real pleasure to re-visit such superb games again.
Also, they are SO different. Going from one franchise to the other is jarring as hell.
Interspersed with all of that, I played F-Zero GX (for hours), F-Zero X, the original F-Zero, and F-Zero Climax.
And here's the conclusion that I came to: those of you viciously attacking one franchise to elevate the other don't know what you're talking about. At all. Both of these series are fucking ace, totally top-tier franchises. It was a real pleasure to re-visit such superb games again.
Also, they are SO different. Going from one franchise to the other is jarring as hell.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
F-Zero X is the only reason I ever bothered playing Wipe3out in the first place. I generally hate racers, but X made me make allowances for hovercraft games.
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
Not that three remixes of old games really counts as living.
Truth. Preference for one over the other is guaranteed, and even a dislike of one makes sense (they have polar opposite approaches to both handling and course design)... but claims that either are bad games? That's just nonsense.
old manatee
Banned
Well, it looks like we are all in agreement.
Huge Succeeded
Banned
NoblesseOblige
Banned
Yeah but which is better?
Huge Succeeded
Banned
I played WipEout Omega Collection at an arcade in 1987 and it was called OutRun
Rodney McKay
Member
Better undead than full-dead.
This thread is such a shitpost magnet :/
Huge Succeeded
Banned
This thread is more fun than F-Zero GX ;P
But this thread has weapons! Yet somehow it was still influenced by F-Zero.
Huge Succeeded
Banned
I love F-Zero's aesthetic, and F-Zero GX's visuals and music hold up well even today. I believe there were a number of posts earlier in the thread that brought that up, earlier. I bring it back up because I feel like several WipEout games have aged just as well, or hold up just as well as F-Zero GX does when up-rezzed. I'd argue that applies to every game in the series starting with Pure for PSP and beyond.
This is a PSP game from 2007. It's almost hard to believe. I would hope that this video of a PSP game from 2007 also puts to bed notions in this thread that WipEout lacks a definitive, strong aesthetic, or that said asthetic is too 'complex' or 'busy' (an argument I wouldn't even lobby toward F-Zero GX despite being much more applicable there).
This is a PSP game from 2007. It's almost hard to believe. I would hope that this video of a PSP game from 2007 also puts to bed notions in this thread that WipEout lacks a definitive, strong aesthetic, or that said asthetic is too 'complex' or 'busy' (an argument I wouldn't even lobby toward F-Zero GX despite being much more applicable there).
Huge Succeeded
Banned
It takes a special kind of ignorance to consider WipEout a 'poor man's F-Zero'. The games share few commonalities beyond that you race in futuristic ships. 'Inferior in every possible way'... that's a joke not worth addressing seriously.
By the way, Freshmaker, this is exactly the kind of shit I was talking about, lmao.
Greatest Ever
Member
When does Redout get good
It is true though.
Points for Wipeout: Graphics.
Points for F-zero: Gameplay, track design, music, multiplayer, challenging gameplay, sense of speed.
Huge Succeeded
Banned
looool, I hope you don't actually think that's a salient argument. You're gonna have to do better than that. but, considering similar posts in this thread from both camps, I'm sure you won't. In fact, given that the sole nod you give to WipEout is for it's graphics, something tells me you're not even very familiar with the franchise outside of having spent a little time with HD/Fury.
I mean, shit, giving points to F-Zero over WipEout for multiplayer is extraordinarily telling in its own right.
This feels like Zelda vs. Horizon all over again. Console warriors projecting all their fanboyism in one game and going at it, throwing hyperbole around left and right. The amount of "It's not even close" posts in here is staggering.
It holds up pretty well imo. I would get it, especially for that price. Be prepared to give up on the single player campaign at some point tho lol.
Not when most of them are 30fps.
Yes i almost forgot. 30 FPS racing games are objectively inferior to 60 FPS racing games. Pick the best 30 FPS and 60 FPS racers, arcade fighters, shooters, and the 60 FPS ones win easily. Now some 30 FPS racing games can be good in spite of the handicap, but at the end of the day, they're still handicapped from their true potential.
funkystudent
Member
The heart says wipeout.
The brain says f-zero.
The brain says f-zero.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
I reject the notion of this being primarily a matter of fanboyism. Both games are so extremely different in their gameplay (and also their technical focus, considering the visual sacrifices F-Zero X made to obtain a performance of 60fps, whereas Wipeout on PSV is happy to be limited to 30) that, depending on which type of gameplay you like in principle, it is very likely you feel they are not even close. For instance, even though I am aware there are a lot of things people like in Wipeout and that the game does very well in achieving its goals, there is nothing that comes to mind where I prefer Wipeout over F-Zero, except minor points like texture resolution and screen resolution
- Speed: Clearly F-Zero (G)X
- Controls & Physics: Absolutely F-Zero (G)X, especially X
- Course design: F-Zero (G)X any day
- Music: Rock vs. trance? Not even a competition, F-Zero X
- Style: Goofy comic style or clean druggy club style? Of course I prefer F-Zero (G)X
- Combat: Having combat being an extension of the driving mechanics or being weapon based? Certainly F-Zero (G)X
- Graphics overall: Full priority to 60fps always, no matter the cost on all other visual components? Absolutely, F-Zero (G)X
I would be very, very hard pressed to find anything where Wipeout even remotely comes close to even being able to compete with F-Zero from my point of view. I am always pondering buying a 64DD with F-Zero X Expansion Pack, even though that would come at an insane cost (easily 1000) due to its two additional cups. I am not willing to pay the 10 or so euros it costs to purchase Wipeout 64 or the PS1 / 2 Wipeouts at all.
Now this could be because I am such a Nintendo fanboy and admittedly, I do love a lot of Nintendo games, but I claim it is not. E.g. if given the choice of Wave Race or Wipeout - and I would claim they play more similarly than F-Zero and Wipeout - I would prefer Wipeout. That F-Zero is my much preferred series is not because of it being a Nintendo developed game. In fact, the extreme arcade style of the game is not actually all too much typical for Nintendo, it is more typical for Sega I'd say.
i am sorry, but many of the posts are pure fanboyism. Even if one prefers one and considers the other a bad game, the way people express themselves is really 'low level' to say it politely. Trolling would be a better fit.
btw i find it interesting that most just use Fzero GX as a reference for the series and do not use Wipeout HD (or the upcoming remaster for PS4). I mean, if you are going to compare, use the best of each, GX vs WoHD for example: 60fps both etc etc...
crazy monkey
Banned
They look the same to me.
Wipeout 2097 and Wip3out are both better than HD imo.
aygomyownroad
Member
My man. That was a great racing game, I would have that followed by Wipeout then Rollcage then F Zero.
Nintendo need to make a new F Zero.
OfTheOverflow
Member
lol can't we just rename this thread to:
'Ok GAF lets battle it out. Which series has the more fans?'
Don't see anyone conceding to either side's arguments here because it's seemingly just WipEout fanboys (of which I'm unabashedly one) vs. F-Zero fanboys. I'm actually surprised there's this many people with strong feelings about either the franchise because they're both similarly niche. 20+ pages is a good effort!
'Ok GAF lets battle it out. Which series has the more fans?'
Don't see anyone conceding to either side's arguments here because it's seemingly just WipEout fanboys (of which I'm unabashedly one) vs. F-Zero fanboys. I'm actually surprised there's this many people with strong feelings about either the franchise because they're both similarly niche. 20+ pages is a good effort!
uncelestial
Member
The aesthetic is okay. Not as strong as F-Zero GX, but okay. But that video is pretty weak. There isn't much sense of speed. The weapon play barely matters. The gameplay looks on-rails as fuck and the track design is just terrible. It looks like what it is, which is a PSP game from 2007. I honestly enjoyed pretty throwaway racers like Full Auto more than Wipeout.
Meanwhile, F-Zero GX at full speed is mind-bending and it is very easy to fuck up. It's white knuckle shit. You can fly the hell off the track and land back on it, attach yourself to a magnetized track and race on any side of a structure, all kinds of stuff. Just look at this and compare it to the video you posted: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4adtE2_gC4
It's so fluid and weird and crazy playing something like that. I don't really get the pro-Wipeout arguments at all, but oh well.
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
F-Zero was my childhood. I never liked the old Wipeouts very much.
But the modern Wipeout games are just all around better games for me. Gameplay and visuals on point.
F-Zero has lost me, mainly because there hasn't been a new installment in ages.
But the modern Wipeout games are just all around better games for me. Gameplay and visuals on point.
F-Zero has lost me, mainly because there hasn't been a new installment in ages.
aren't some of the tracks and ships from those games included in WHD since it is like a compilation???
What makes Wipeout memorable is the teams, world, feeling like you are embodying X team in your racing. Even though it is 90s looking it is still awesome. F-Zero just feels soulless in comparison, like they are forgetting half the game.
I reject the notion of this being primarily a matter of fanboyism. Both games are so extremely different in their gameplay (and also their technical focus, considering the visual sacrifices F-Zero X made to obtain a performance of 60fps, whereas Wipeout on PSV is happy to be limited to 30) that, depending on which type of gameplay you like in principle, it is very likely you feel they are not even close. For instance, even though I am aware there are a lot of things people like in Wipeout and that the game does very well in achieving its goals, there is nothing that comes to mind where I prefer Wipeout over F-Zero, except minor points like texture resolution and screen resolution
- Speed: Clearly F-Zero (G)X
- Controls & Physics: Absolutely F-Zero (G)X, especially X
- Course design: F-Zero (G)X any day
- Music: Rock vs. trance? Not even a competition, F-Zero X
- Style: Goofy comic style or clean druggy club style? Of course I prefer F-Zero (G)X
- Combat: Having combat being an extension of the driving mechanics or being weapon based? Certainly F-Zero (G)X
- Graphics overall: Full priority to 60fps always, no matter the cost on all other visual components? Absolutely, F-Zero (G)X
I would be very, very hard pressed to find anything where Wipeout even remotely comes close to even being able to compete with F-Zero from my point of view. I am always pondering buying a 64DD with F-Zero X Expansion Pack, even though that would come at an insane cost (easily 1000€due to its two additional cups. I am not willing to pay the 10 or so euros it costs to purchase Wipeout 64 or the PS1 / 2 Wipeouts at all.
Now this could be because I am such a Nintendo fanboy and admittedly, I do love a lot of Nintendo games, but I claim it is not. E.g. if given the choice of Wave Race or Wipeout - and I would claim they play more similarly than F-Zero and Wipeout - I would prefer Wipeout. That F-Zero is my much preferred series is not because of it being a Nintendo developed game. In fact, the extreme arcade style of the game is not actually all too much typical for Nintendo, it is more typical for Sega I'd say.
This. The whole arguing thing sounds like Playstation All-star fans somehow trying to justify their purchases because their game isn't nearly as good as Smash Bros
Not only is it just as easy to fuck up in WipEout at high speeds, it's actually far more likely that the player will (constantly), as the handling is far more momentum-based than F-Zero's, which is why it's comparatively difficult to find flawless WipEout runs, than it is for F-Zero, where navigating the track is comparatively trivial and is more of a case of the player then daring themselves to push further. Hell, WipEout's often criticized because less adept players don't get a decent feeling of speed because they're too busy pinballing off every corner. On rails is a ridiculous way to describe WipEout, and basically just indicates that you have no idea how it plays... it's not like Ridge Racer by any means.
The video of Pulse was posted purely for aesthetic reasons. It's quite clearly not supposed to show WipEout played at the highest standard (as opposed to you posting a record run for F-Zero GX). Whilst the advanced techniques of WipEout differ from those of F-Zero, you can also fly off the track in WipEout and then land back on it. This is usually accomplished by using the tracks undulation rather than steering off the side though, as WipEout will typically have barriers on the sides of courses, and F-Zero generally lacks the same level of undulation in its track, or the nuanced control over your ship's pitch to utilize them in the same way. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gioV_OXpoQ8
Also in both games you're attached to a magnetized track, which is what allows for tracks like De Konstruct to exist, where the floor of one section of track is the ceiling for another.
You can't "race on any side of a structure" in F-Zero unless that is the specifically designed tube or corkscrew segments.
In regards to the games being fluid.. the sideshifting mechanic used to sharper turns at higher speeds, along with the techniques people use to gain air for a barrel roll cause newer WipEout games to be a lot more jittery, and less smooth than the earlier games. I certainly wouldn't award F-Zero any major points in this regards either with its super twitchy handling (snaking) and erratic mid-air physics. No other WipEout games - or any F-Zero games, period - come close to the fluidity and grace that you get from competent play in Wipeout 2097 or Wip3out, and that's in spite of them being 30 (or 25 for PAL) fps. It looks like a fucking ship doing ballet it's so beautiful, lol. The only other racer in existence that I'd say has a handling system as beautifully flawless is Daytona USA.
Other than Wip3out Special Edition having the previous games' tracks, only Wipeout Pure has any. It doesn't matter either way, because the gameplay feel is completely different, and those courses were designed for the smoother flowing gameplay of the earlier games. It'd be like porting Halo CE's maps into Halo 5.
No, it's more like Smash fans arguing that Virtua Fighter or Street Fighter are shit.
You think my preference for WipEout is because I'm a PlayStation fan that lacks F-Zero? My favourite console of the 32bit era was the Saturn, and my current gen console of choice is the Xbox One. I've owned every major console since the 8bit gen, and have played every mainline WipEout and F-Zero game extensively. Comments like yours come across as blatant fanboyism.
Plus, WipEout isn't an F-Zero clone at all... in fact, there are pretty much no F-Zero clones. WipEout IS the game other futuristic racers attempt to clone constantly.
Do you know that people have different tastes and preferences in gaming and all of them are legit and need no justification at all?
Oh thanks for the info, i am more of a (Snes) Fzero guy, mainly because i am bad at Wipeout, so i am not very much into it since i can't manage to progress past certain speeds, so it is interesting to know that WHD plays different from previous entries.
Yea, if you look at the two videos is posted for WipEout HD and WipEout 2097 in my previous post, you can pretty much just see the difference in philosophy for the newer games. Ever since WipEout Fusion the games have been a lot more "rough and tumble" than the gliding nature of the games before it.
I actually find it funny, because in Fusion, there's a statement from the Auricom team that says:
Auricom said:
... which pretty accurately sums up how the increased focus on weaponry and more aggressive jostling for position amongst the crafts has affect the gameplay of the later games.
I reject the notion of this being primarily a matter of fanboyism. Both games are so extremely different in their gameplay (and also their technical focus, considering the visual sacrifices F-Zero X made to obtain a performance of 60fps, whereas Wipeout on PSV is happy to be limited to 30) that, depending on which type of gameplay you like in principle, it is very likely you feel they are not even close. For instance, even though I am aware there are a lot of things people like in Wipeout and that the game does very well in achieving its goals, there is nothing that comes to mind where I prefer Wipeout over F-Zero, except minor points like texture resolution and screen resolution
- Speed: Clearly F-Zero (G)X
- Controls & Physics: Absolutely F-Zero (G)X, especially X
- Course design: F-Zero (G)X any day
- Music: Rock vs. trance? Not even a competition, F-Zero X
- Style: Goofy comic style or clean druggy club style? Of course I prefer F-Zero (G)X
- Combat: Having combat being an extension of the driving mechanics or being weapon based? Certainly F-Zero (G)X
- Graphics overall: Full priority to 60fps always, no matter the cost on all other visual components? Absolutely, F-Zero (G)X
I would be very, very hard pressed to find anything where Wipeout even remotely comes close to even being able to compete with F-Zero from my point of view. I am always pondering buying a 64DD with F-Zero X Expansion Pack, even though that would come at an insane cost (easily 1000€
Now this could be because I am such a Nintendo fanboy and admittedly, I do love a lot of Nintendo games, but I claim it is not. E.g. if given the choice of Wave Race or Wipeout - and I would claim they play more similarly than F-Zero and Wipeout - I would prefer Wipeout. That F-Zero is my much preferred series is not because of it being a Nintendo developed game. In fact, the extreme arcade style of the game is not actually all too much typical for Nintendo, it is more typical for Sega I'd say.
Maybe because you clearly have never played a Wipeout game? I mean, maybe, that could be a reason? Potentially? Who knows. It could be.
Yoshi
Headmaster of Console Warrior Jugendstrafanstalt
Reading comprehension, what is this?
Then, after a lengthy explanation of why I, personally, prefer F-Zero over Wipeout in every way imaginable, I say, clearly in the context of my opinion:
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