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[krypt0nian]

Just ask to see the core book, and ignore the rest. This can be as easy or complex as you make it really. I teach new people all the time, and it's no where near the way you describe. They sound like they have no clue how to being someone into the hobby.


They honestly sound insane. It's a shame you had such a negative experience, as PnP RPG gaming is superior to the video game "equivalent".

What you're asking for is quite possible. Hell I've played one night one-shots probably a hundred times that we've made up on the spot, without months of prep.

I feel terrible for you.

 

[EndcatOmega]

Exalted can be played with more western epic style ala Gilgamesh or Beowulf; however, it wouldn't be anyone's first option for a simple introduction to roleplaying. 30 books, though? To a new player? Assuming D&D, even the core book can be a little much. It sounds like you just had a group who had no idea how to introduce the hobby to someone.

 

[krypt0nian]

Yeah one of the groups I play in has been playing for ages and we only use the core set so it has a classic feel. It's very possible to have fun without all the idiotic levels of options that are possible, especially in 3.0/3.5 near the end.

Even in the scaled back in terms of options Pathfinder, we don't use everything. And again, no one is prepping for months.

It does sound like they have no life outside gaming.

 

[Amir0x]

Exalted can be played with more western epic style ala Gilgamesh or Beowulf; however, it wouldn't be anyone's first option for a simple introduction to roleplaying. 30 books, though? To a new player? Assuming D&D, even the core book can be a little much. It sounds like you just had a group who had no idea how to introduce the hobby to someone.

Yeah, I mean, I didn't count the exact number, but it was a dizzying amount. There was like a book for every class, various books to read up on different types of species, books on the history and timeline of D&D, books of rules, monster guides, strategy guides, player guides. I spent an hour alone reading through like 20 pages of the player guide and over 3 different species and classes I might have potentially wanted to play with; that was skimming through three types of books!

I mean, I was trying to wrap my head around all the little terms and set ups for the games, which was complex enough without trying to be "in character" for whatever one of the infinity species there are, and then picking fucking deities to worship and trying to account for how they impact your class, and then calculating experience and learning which dice to use and when and on and on and on. Every two minutes it felt like we were stopping to read the rules on something or another.

One small example was when a player had a move to "pull" someone toward them. Well, because there are "opportunity strikes", he thought maybe pulling some enemy passed an ally would give that ally a chance to strike. But no! There was first a heated dispute over this, then we had to reference the guidebook for the single line that said this wasn't possible at all. It's crazy!

Yeah one of the groups I play in has been playing for ages and we only use the core set so it has a classic feel. It's very possible to have fun without all the idiotic levels of options that are possible, especially in 3.0/3.5 near the end.

Even in the scaled back in terms of options Pathfinder, we don't use everything. And again, no one is prepping for months.

It does sound like they have no life outside gaming.

It looked like it. I mean he had this crazy Red Dragon that cost him like $250 and was like the size of a small safe, and apparently he uses this as a boss character? The fug.

Anyway, the concept is neat, but obviously if the only players I know are this insane, I doubt I can get into it even if there IS a simpler way...

 

[DiscoJer]

I'm a big fan of Basic Fantasy, myself

http://www.basicfantasy.org/main.html

Basically it's just D&D stripped down to the very basics.

Of course, that sort of thing doesn't make for a very good product, which is why I think RPGs these days are so complex - they can sell tons of player optimization books

 

[EndcatOmega]

Every two minutes it felt like we were stopping to read the rules on something or another.

Yeah, that... does sound like a bad group. Stupid debates over minutia can happen, but any DM worth his or her salt is going to go 'eh, I'm going to rule x happens' if the game's getting bogged down it.

 

[Keasar]

Yeah, I mean, I didn't count the exact number, but it was a dizzying amount. There was like a book for every class, various books to read up on different types of species, books on the history and timeline of D&D, books of rules, monster guides, strategy guides, player guides. I spent an hour alone reading through like 20 pages of the player guide and over 3 different species and classes I might have potentially wanted to play with; that was skimming through three types of books!

Well, books are fun.

That is on a personal note, I do love having access to a load of books to read up on (lore, rules and whatnot of interest), but during the few times we play, we dont use it all at once.

 

[krypt0nian]

Well, books are fun.

That is on a personal note, I do love having access to a load of books to read up on (lore, rules and whatnot of interest), but during the few times we play, we dont use it all at once.

I admit I love campaign setting books for the lore more than any rules baed info or crunch, but to drown a new player in all that is stunningly bad decision making.

 

[dude]

Eh, I feel vindicated by amir0x, because that's what I've been saying throughout this thread - again and again. D&D and Pathfinder are on the same page on this bullshit - There's no reason for anyone to read hundreds of pages to play something as simple as P&P RPGs! D&D cannot attract new players in its current form (and let me tell you something, as I said before, D&D 5 changed nothing in that regard.)

Amir0x, you really should give RPGs another chance though, RPGs systems are so different that looking at two ends of the spectrum you wouldn't even know it's the same hobby. If you want an easy way to try it out with a couple of friends, grab Bloodsword, it's series of cute game books you play in a group of up to 4 players, it's super light (you know, it's a game book) and me and my friends had a blast with it.
Or, find a group on White Wolf games, they're not as light or easy but they're much better than D&D (especially if the group knows the system well.) There are much better systems out there, but it's harder to find groups playing them.

It's not impossible for a beginner to get into D&D, but the group must help you a whole lot - First, ask them to build you your character, tell them what you want to play - like, you might say "I'm this guy who's some sort of law-enforcer but has no concept of morality so I'm just like an asshole who just arrest anyone who breaks the law without any moral processing", and then they might suggest you play a human Lawful Neutral Paladin. Basically, you need to get them to deal with as many of the rules for you as they can. That's what I did for every new player I've had - I never show them more than the one book, too (Just the player handbook, other than that they shouldn't know anything even exist.)
Also, the adventure should focus on the advantages of D&D, at least for the first sessions - Nothing that even requires much of the system rules - Just talking, role playing, you know. I think there shouldn't even be any battles.

You really shouldn't be intimidated, it's one of the least complicated hobbies on earth. You just need the right group and system to get it.

 

[ChiTownBuffalo]

Set up some stuff on roll20.net

This should go well. I hope

 

[EndcatOmega]

Or, find a group on White Wolf games, they're not as light or easy but they're much better than D&D (especially if the group knows the system well.)

I'm not so sure about this- my experience with White Wolf systems is that they tend to be as anti-newcomer as D&D, especially oWoD in all its terrible glory. Character creation using different rules than character advancement, multiple books in the case of nWoD by default, some extremely wonky mechanics (Exalted being the poster child), and abysmal book layout. I think the Pathfinder Beginner Box comes off extremely well in comparison. I'd be interested to know if they have a rules-light version of one of their rulesets and I just missed it, though, as I'd have thought it'd be perfect for them.

There's gotta be a group of at least some of the smaller RPGs, though, in Amri0x's area, assuming he doesn't live in the UAE or something. And there's always one page rpgs for real simplicity, but I'm not sure you really get continuous groups for something like 'Drunken Bear Fighter', as much as the world is made poorer for it.

 

[Riposte]

Eh, I feel vindicated by amir0x, because that's what I've been saying throughout this thread - again and again. D&D and Pathfinder are on the same page on this bullshit - There's no reason for anyone to read hundreds of pages to play something as simple as P&P RPGs! D&D cannot attract new players in its current form (and let me tell you something, as I said before, D&D 5 changed nothing in that regard.)

You shouldn't. It is not like every experience is going to be like Amirox's. Generally speaking looking to the books constantly is simply not a smart way to play DnD. If you can't remember the rules (and using aids such as those found behind a dungeon master's screen does help a lot) then you are not really ready to use them. The DM has the power to just brush over that which is the ultimate built-in safety device for the game getting too complicated. This is especially true when there is a new player at the table. If I can agree with you on any point it is that players need to be taught how to play RPGs instead of just absorbing it easily, much like an upper tier boardgame. People still don't have to read hundreds of pages to play their first game, though they might over time in their P&P career if they want to get more out of it.

DnD could do a lot of things better to be more accessible. However you just seem interested in a dumber set of rules. Actually, my problem is that you seem to ignore that people can get multiple things out of DnD. That's basic player psychology. You open any Dungeonmaster Manual you get told stuff like that right off the gate.

 

[dude]

I'm not so sure about this- my experience with White Wolf systems is that they tend to be as anti-newcomer as D&D, especially oWoD in all its terrible glory. Character creation using different rules than character advancement, multiple books in the case of nWoD by default, some extremely wonky mechanics (Exalted being the poster child), and abysmal book layout. I think the Pathfinder Beginner Box comes off extremely well in comparison. I'd be interested to know if they have a rules-light version of one of their rulesets and I just missed it, though, as I'd have thought it'd be perfect for them.

There's gotta be a group of at least some of the smaller RPGs, though, in Amri0x's area, assuming he doesn't live in the UAE or something. And there's always one page rpgs for real simplicity, but I'm not sure you really get continuous groups for something like 'Drunken Bear Fighter', as much as the world is made poorer for it.

You're right, actually. White Wolf game can be just as cumbersome as D&D if nor more so... I think the reason I believed they would make better beginner games is that people who play them are usually very well versed in the rules so these move very fast and also that they tend to focus on stuff that doesn't really require much of the system. I played nWoD Mage for the first time a couple of weeks back and we barely even used magic, the system was pretty full of bullshit, but it didn't feel intimidating all that much because most of what we did was talk and role play. I think WoD just usually make landing easier than D&D, I find, and from my experience most new players react better to WoD than to D&D... But YMMV obviously.
And I don't know about smaller games, maybe, it must be nice to live in an actual civilization I think something like Dread or Primetime Adventures would be much better ways to get into RPGs.

You shouldn't. It is not like every experience is going to be like Amirox's. Generally speaking looking to the books constantly is simply not a smart way to play DnD. If you can't remember the rules (and using aids such as those found behind a dungeon master's screen does help a lot) then you are not really ready to use them. The DM has the power to just brush over that which is the ultimate built-in safety device for the game getting too complicated. This is especially true when there is a new player at the table. If I can agree with you on any point it is that players need to be taught how to play RPGs instead of just absorbing it easily, much like an upper tier boardgame. People still don't have to read hundreds of pages to play their first game, though they might over time in their P&P career if they want to get more out of it.

DnD could do a lot of things better to be more accessible. However you just seem interested in a dumber set of rules. Actually, my problem is that you seem to ignore that people can get multiple things out of DnD. That's basic player psychology. You open any Dungeonmaster Manual you get told stuff like that right off the gate.

I said in my post that it's possible to make D&D accessible to new players, it's just pretty hard to do. And having less rules doesn't mean a dumber set of rules, simplified rules could be very, very smart (and they usually are.) D&D actually has some of the dumber rules I've seen (both from "simulation" and "game-design" perspective.)

D&D allows you, as any other RPG, an almost endless amount of experiences, I agree with you - I'm just saying that D&D requires is getting its legs in your path every step of the way. And don't tell me you don't have to read hundred of pages, because here amir0x was joining an existing group, but what if they were a couple of friends all trying it for the first time? At this point, what D&D needs to become more accessible is a complete rethinking for it's core - You know, what we were promised for 5e and didn't get.

 

[krypt0nian]

Well since I introduce new players to the supposedly hard Pathfinder, and they not only do fine but go on to DM themselves, it's all a load of shit.

They are not complex games if they are taught correctly. No new players needs to "read hundreds of pages to play"

Some people like rules and some hate them. There is no "right". Dude, you keep selling rules light system and that's fine, but there are those new players out there who look at them and say "that's it?" Try not to act like it's the only way for new players to enjoy RPGs as in my experience it's quite the opposite.

It never fails. Even in the smallest of community threads, there has to be someone who starts fights. No one needs to feel "vindicated" here. That you feel that way means that in your head there is some fight. There isn't and shouldn't be. I am not in the thread to fight but to share my love and help promote positive RPG ideas. I'll not continue this fight here.

 

[dude]

I'm not seeing this as a fight, and feeling vindicated doesn't mean I see it as such - If I said "won" or anything like that, maybe. The vindicated feeling comes solely from feeling alone in my wish for D&D to fundamentally change its ways. It has nothing to do with fights.
My claim all along was that D&D is not newcomer friendly. As I said before though - Yes, you can, in fact, get new players into D&D and they can actually have fun. I did it as well - Almost all new players I got into the hobby was through D&D. But it's harder and requires a lot more work from the introducing party than other, lighter and smoother, systems. I'm, for one, am sick of having to tell new players "Yeah, just ignore this for now" or going into long explanation once they finally ask me some rules questions and seeing the look of utter confusion in their faces. The fact people here, including me, managed to get people into RPGs through D&D or Pathfinder is just as relevant as how amir0x's group failed to get him into RPGs through D&D.
And if you don't have a good group to get you into the game, you do have to read hundred of pages. You have to. If you're just 4 friends, all new to RPGs, who want to play together? Good luck. And that's how most people get into the game, not through existing groups.

Also, I don't have a problem with rules or liking them. Sometimes, I'm quite fond of rules - Hell, I'm a huge 2e fan! But I keep selling rules light systems because they are rare in today's RPG landscape (though becoming less and less so, thankfully) - And it's maddening how much maintenance RPGs require of its players. Sure, rules can be cool and useful, they could also help get people into the game as you said, but I find that they cost much in term of play speed and friendliness. That's why I was excited about the fifth edition I thought we were getting - A simple, rules-light basics that you can expand with more rules as you wish? Best of both world.
Basically, I'm looking at it like this - In the age that everything around you is about intuitiveness and ease of use, RPGs have failed to keep up and make themselves accessible. Not just for new players, but old ones as well. In high school I could play 4 times a week, now I can barely afford one session a week and if a sixth, or even a tenth of it is spent on stuff that are not relevant, that time sink hurts.

 

[krypt0nian]

Really cool Kickstarter making a set of Resin tabletop Dwarves. Already backed and into the cool Epic stretch goals.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2087444096/dwarven-adventurers-box-set

 

[dude]

Oh, that reminds me I need to make some sort of kickstarters list for the OP... I'm still not sure about it, because new kickstarters pop up all the time and I'm afraid I'll be too busy to keep it up to date...

 

[Wiktor]

Oh, that reminds me I need to make some sort of kickstarters list for the OP... I'm still not sure about it, because new kickstarters pop up all the time and I'm afraid I'll be too busy to keep it up to date...

I've been partly following PnP RPG Kickstarters and damn, they're doing good. I don't think I've seen even one promsiing one that didn't met it's goal and often surpass it by like 500%-1000%. I'm sure there were some failures, but I haven't seen them.

WHat's more, many companies seem to made Kickstarter their regular funding source instead of making it one-shot.

 

[Keasar]

I've been partly following PnP RPG Kickstarters and damn, they're doing good. I don't think I've seen even one promsiing one that didn't met it's goal and often surpass it by like 500%-1000%. I'm sure there were some failures, but I haven't seen them.

WHat's more, many companies seem to made Kickstarter their regular funding source instead of making it one-shot.

Was really close to go for the Traveller 5th Edition kickstarter but decided against it for now, had already spent waaaaay to much on Sedition Wars (They had Firefly figures!), but it seems like a cool game, hopefully they will sell the book later too.

 

[Mystic Theurge]

On this tip, have any of you checked out roll20.net?

Would any of you guys be interested in testing this out and running a 4e, yes I know, game?

I'd be interested in playing a 4e game. You still looking for people?

 

[Mike M]

On this tip, have any of you checked out roll20.net?

Would any of you guys be interested in testing this out and running a 4e, yes I know, game?

I'm tentatively interested as well, if you have openings available still...

 

[Songbird]

I'm tentatively interested as well, if you have openings available still...

Likewise.

 

[EndcatOmega]

And I don't know about smaller games, maybe, it must be nice to live in an actual civilization

Sorry, I didn't mean to like, insult... wherever you live! Would've thought with its themes there was no way they'd be able to sell the books, but there you go.

Has anyone checked out the Only War beta? I like the move towards public playtesting RPGs, and I love most of the 40k line, but I'm not sure I love it enough to pay for a bloody beta test.

 

[ChiTownBuffalo]

OK. Let me fidlle with the Roll20 thing more.

So, the deal is, this is going to be a test with an Encounters campaign I ran sometime back. So level 1 characters, I don't have any class restrictions. I will post some background info here soon. I figure once a week we can run an encounter, a la, well, Encounters.

 

[Wiktor]

Was really close to go for the Traveller 5th Edition kickstarter but decided against it for now, had already spent waaaaay to much on Sedition Wars (They had Firefly figures!), but it seems like a cool game, hopefully they will sell the book later too.

Yeah, my reserves were also deepleeted by various Kickstarters, but damn...this image made me almost pledge so many times:

There's just something about thick RPG rulebooks that's so ridiculously appeaking

 

[Sullen]

Funny enough, after reading the earlier conversation on this thread about how to introduce people new to games, but I just got 2 new players in my group whose only experience was D&D. Threw them right into Exalted with the other half of my old group and they managed to do surprisingly well.

Debated a few days before whether to start a M&M game for them (since they were somewhat familiar with D20), a game of Unisystem Armageddon, Fading Suns, Deathwatch, or Exalted. Decided on Exalted even though I know the sometimes annoying mechanics and massive amounts of charms can be a headache for new players.

Hoping next weekend will go well. Our games tend to get over the top crazy pretty quick, but luckily my old players kept their madness in check for the session so that they wouldn't scare away the new players.

 

[krypt0nian]

Oh man, Sullen, I LOVE Mutants & Masterminds soooo much!

I picked up Marvel Heroic Roleplaying and I'm starting to grok it better. It's a huge mindfuck if you're used to more crunchy systems, but I'm interested in giving it a spin. Maybe at Gencon.


Any of you check out Vigilance Press' 3rd party stuff for M&M or Icons? It's run by a good friend and they do incredible work.
Www.vigilancepress.com

 

[BattleMonkey]

Some players just get and enjoy the D&D style of systems, while it is easier often to get people into the more narrative and rule light games. It's always been a toss up in what players would like when introducing games to new people. Some like the more structured rule based systems, while some really just want the open ended narrative game where they can concentrate on their story.

Ugh, and hated the Marvel roleplaying game. Nice concept, but the system is so slow for what is supposed to be light narrative based game. Read so much and got hyped on it but it was a huge failure with our group both times we tried it. The whole concept of creating opposed dice pools for every single roll in the game just is really cumbersome, simple fights against one villain no matter how powerful it should be, could take forever.

 

[krypt0nian]

Some players just get and enjoy the D&D style of systems, while it is easier often to get people into the more narrative and rule light games. It's always been a toss up in what players would like when introducing games to new people. Some like the more structured rule based systems, while some really just want the open ended narrative game where they can concentrate on their story.

Ugh, and hated the Marvel roleplaying game. Nice concept, but the system is so slow for what is supposed to be light narrative based game. Read so much and got hyped on it but it was a huge failure with our group both times we tried it. The whole concept of creating opposed dice pools for every single roll in the game just is really cumbersome, simple fights against one villain no matter how powerful it should be, could take forever.

Weird. My friends who are playing were bragging at how fast the fights were. The people behind it are buddies so I'm giving it a real chance.


Why would quickly selecting a some dice (one from this column, one from that, etc) and picking the two highest rolled be slow? Even reading it, it seemed pretty logical.

 

[BattleMonkey]

Did some Star Wars Saga again this weekend, really enjoy the game. Interested to see what FFG does with the license but after Deathwatch and their 40k stuff..... I'm not so sure. They have a ton of quality issues and are just really sloppy in their writing.

Weird. My friends who are playing were bragging at how fast the fights were. The people behind it are buddies so I'm giving it a real chance.


Why would quickly selecting a some dice (one from this column, one from that, etc) and picking the two highest rolled be slow? Even reading it, it seemed pretty logical.

Because you build a pool, which is logical, but then the gm has to do the same each time as well. Sounds simple and it is mechanic wise, but it plays out slow as dirt when it comes to combat. Just doing the intro adventure was a very boring experience as the system is very prone to having deadlocks with the fights going back and forth without any results. The damage system is a nice idea, but is also a major reason fights really drag out. The doom pool also creates a major random factor that can completely alter fights. You often get into situations where even with some success, your rolls are just powering up the villains which can make em harder to take down over time or they completely turn table on players. While players do not benefit from any similar game mechanic.

Compared to something like a D&D encounter, it is perhaps fast, but for what is a narrative game, this is the slowest I ever played.

I like alot of the concepts of the game and it's super easy to teach and get going, but it literally bored several players at the table with the two demos we did, which is a bad sign.

 

[krypt0nian]

Hmmm...maybe they weren't supers people? You are describing the exact opposite if what I've been hearing from this game. Even the Actual Play podcasts I've listened to are quick.

Oh well. Different people like different things I guess.

 

[BattleMonkey]

Hmmm...maybe they weren't supers people? You are describing the exact opposite if what I've been hearing from this game. Even the Actual Play podcasts I've listened to are quick.

Oh well. Different people like different things I guess.

It has the potential to be fast, but as with any rpg the dice will determine it. The game just has a higher factor of the chance of things getting dragged out. Our experiences with it were not the best, the random factor of dice could change the experience as usual.

As I mentioned its the notion of it being narritve game yet seeming to take a while to resolve things. Most narrative games, you will do one or two rolls in a combat and that is it, resolved. In our first fight, me as Spiderman and my GF playing Kitty Pride to take out the first simple b grade villain of the demo between us all took over 12 rolls to resolve. That just wasn't fast and alot of the following fights went similar.

Have seen the Civil War supplement and I think alot of the extra heroes they put in really open things up as players can also be very munchkiny with various hero team up combos.

 

[EndcatOmega]

Decided on Exalted even though I know the sometimes annoying mechanics and massive amounts of charms can be a headache for new players.

Not sure if you're playing with the (ridiculous amounts) of errata with new players, or if you have the books in PDF form instead of hardback, but just in case,
someone's done the errata as pdf 'comments' to be loaded into the PDF file.

 

[Sullen]

Oh man, Sullen, I LOVE Mutants & Masterminds soooo much!

It is quite an awesome game. You can really adapt the setting/characters of any game into it with little to no issues. A crazy buddy of mine wants to adapt Rifts into it, so that he can get around the crappy rules normal Rifts has. I just love the flexibility of M&M and it fixes a lot of issues I had with normal D20, like hitpoints.

Not sure if you're playing with the (ridiculous amounts) of errata with new players, or if you have the books in PDF form instead of hardback, but just in case,
someone's done the errata as pdf 'comments' to be loaded into the PDF file.

Holy crap that is awesome. I was getting so tired of having to scan through the scroll of errata (at a whopping 200 something pages) just to find stuff that was different. I think the errata for Exalted has been awesome, it has fixed a ton of issues I had with the game. The problem is there is just so fucking much of it that it was causing a huge headache. I run the games off my ipad so I primarily use pdfs, but we do have a decent amount of hardback books as well, so this solution should still help me run the games a bit smoother.

edit: ahh shit I just saw that the pdf comments are windows only. Sadness.

 

[EndcatOmega]

Foxit Mobile PDF Lite on ios reads them fine- it's (very slightly) slower than iBooks, but it's free and it does the job. The only problem is you have to load the comment files into the PDFs on windows/linux with the desktop Foxit Reader (or Mac, but I don't know what does PDF comments for that- Adobe reader should), before saving and transferring to the iPad.

 

[krypt0nian]

http://www.montecookgames.com/

Monte Cook just relaunched his web presence and has started talking about various systems in his upcoming game in the blog. Very hyped to see where this goes!

 

[Sullen]

Foxit Mobile PDF Lite on ios reads them fine- it's (very slightly) slower than iBooks, but it's free and it does the job. The only problem is you have to load the comment files into the PDFs on windows/linux with the desktop Foxit Reader (or Mac, but I don't know what does PDF comments for that- Adobe reader should), before saving and transferring to the iPad.

I was able to get it to work on my Goodreader app. Definitely makes all the errata much easier to deal with. Thanks.

http://www.montecookgames.com/

Monte Cook just relaunched his web presence and has started talking about various systems in his upcoming game in the blog. Very hyped to see where this goes!

I'm hyped now too. He has pretty much been my favorite since, well, Planescape. Which is still to this day one of my favorite settings of any game.

 

[Keasar]

Which day was it they would release the Rise of the Runelords Adventure Path book? The PDF is estimated 18th July, I take it the hardcover is somewhere around the same day?

 

[krypt0nian]

Which day was it they would release the Rise of the Runelords Adventure Path book? The PDF is estimated 18th July, I take it the hardcover is somewhere around the same day?

Not sure when they are shipping but they were selling it at PaizoCon this past weekend.

 

[Keasar]

Not sure when they are shipping but they were selling it at PaizoCon this past weekend.

Very soon then (hopefully).

 

[krypt0nian]

Very soon then (hopefully).

Have you seen the interior pics of it at Paizo.com? Book is bloody gorgeous and a shoe in for some ENnie awards. The limited edition proof they were showing off at PaizoCon with the metal and pleather case was jaw dropping.

 

[Wiktor]

http://www.montecookgames.com/

Monte Cook just relaunched his web presence and has started talking about various systems in his upcoming game in the blog. Very hyped to see where this goes!

It's a damn shame he dropped out of DnD5. I hope he might at least produce some sort of variant on those rules, the way he did the awesome Arcana Unearthed and Iron Heroes.

 

[Vagabundo]

It's a damn shame he dropped out of DnD5. I hope he might at least produce some sort of variant on those rules, the way he did the awesome Arcana Unearthed and Iron Heroes.

I think DND5 will be just fine without him.

In fact it might be the better for it. I like the way it is shaping up so far.

 

[Keasar]

Have you seen the interior pics of it at Paizo.com? Book is bloody gorgeous and a shoe in for some ENnie awards. The limited edition proof they were showing off at PaizoCon with the metal and pleather case was jaw dropping.

Okay, that is a really nice book. Sadly it costs like 3-4 times the price of the regular book, so I think I will do nicely with just that one.

 

[ChiTownBuffalo]

Okay, that is a really nice book. Sadly it costs like 3-4 times the price of the regular book, so I think I will do nicely with just that one.

Never have I seen such an aethetically pleasing book that screams "Nerd."

How much is it again?

 

[Vagabundo]

I agree with Dude that modern RPGs tend to be too complex for beginners. I think that comes from the group and the rules. My own group is fairly rules lite and casual - I'd rarely look up a rule in-game - but I'd say it would be confusing for someone new to rpgs to just sit at the table and participate, because we rarely get new people at the table.

I miss some of the simplicity of Basic DND and the speed of the games, where there was more focus on the silly stuff that my players did than the mechanics of the rules.

As an aside Castle Ravenloft has completely taken over my group for the past two sessions. A mix of RPG and board games. Highly recommended it.

 

[Keasar]

Never have I seen such an aethetically pleasing book that screams "Nerd."

How much is it again?

199 US Dollar.

 

[ChiTownBuffalo]

199 US Dollar.

Hot damn.

I'm just going to buy a Voltron Hockey sweater instead.

 

[krypt0nian]

It's a damn shame he dropped out of DnD5. I hope he might at least produce some sort of variant on those rules, the way he did the awesome Arcana Unearthed and Iron Heroes.

With the draconian policies WotC has since the amazing OGL 3.x, there's little chance. That and he's busy working on his own system currently. Good for him too. The kitchen sink 5.0 isn't heading anywhere, and I think he knew it. The prevalent rumor is that creative differences drove him out, and my guess would be no OGL which means no real third party support again, which to me says dead edition again.

I wish Hasbro would sell off WotC to people who care.

 

[kai3345]

Just played my first *real* dnd game last thursday, (as opposed to my friends trying and failing to figure out the rules as we play)

And my friends and I had a blast.