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PoliGAF 2017 |OT5| The Man In the High Chair

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G

Greigor The Fellhand

Member
cross posting from the Secret Service bankrupt thread

Then its time for the senate and congress to give secrete service the authority to authorize and decline vacation requests.

meaning they can tell the president NO, you cannot go on vacation for the third time this month it is not in the budget.
 
B

BlastProcessing

Member
Exclusive: Secret Service depletes funds to pay agents because of Trump's frequent travel, large family


WASHINGTON — The Secret Service can no longer pay hundreds of agents it needs to carry out an expanded protective mission – in large part due to the sheer size of President Trump's family and efforts necessary to secure their multiple residences up and down the East Coast.

Secret Service Director Randolph "Tex'' Alles, in an interview with USA TODAY, said more than 1,000 agents have already hit the federally mandated caps for salary and overtime allowances that were meant to last the entire year.

The agency has faced a crushing workload since the height of the contentious election season, and it has not relented in the first seven months of the administration. Agents must protect Trump – who has traveled almost every weekend to his properties in Florida, New Jersey and Virginia – and his adult children whose business trips and vacations have taken them across the country and overseas.

"The president has a large family, and our responsibility is required in law,'' Alles said. "I can't change that. I have no flexibility.''

Alles said the service is grappling with an unprecedented number of White House protectees. Under Trump, 42 people have protection, a number that includes 18 members of his family. That's up from 31 during the Obama administration.

Overwork and constant travel have also been driving a recent exodus from the Secret Service ranks, yet without congressional intervention to provide additional funding, Alles will not even be able to pay agents for the work they have already done.

The compensation crunch is so serious that the director has begun discussions with key lawmakers to raise the combined salary and overtime cap for agents, from $160,000 per year to $187,000 for at least the duration of Trump's first term.

But even if such a proposal was approved, about 130 veteran agents would not be fully compensated for hundreds of hours already amassed, according to the agency.

"I don't see this changing in the near term,'' Alles said.
Click to expand...

abdc.gif
 
A

AntraxSuicide

Banned
Aaron Strife said:
The liberal blog Blue Virginia (mind the bias) did race ratings for the Virginia House of Delegates elections this Fall.

http://bluevirginia.us/2017/08/virginia-house-of-delegates-race-ratings

In short, don't expect the Democrats to flip the chamber. If they won the 5 GOP-held seats they're favored in, the 5 GOP-held Tossups, and the 5 GOP-held Lean R seats, they'd still be two short of the 17 needed for an absolute majority. One more would tie the chamber, but in that case you'd either have a power-sharing agreement or a barely functional House with no Speaker as there is no tiebreaker.

The most optimistic outlook I've heard from the Democrats is a gain of 6-10 seats, and this would fit in neatly with that. Still, we can't afford not to try.
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Gotta keep up that state-level pressure though. I really want to be able to look at our state control in a few years and smile about it.

Greigor The Fellhand said:
cross posting from the Secret Service bankrupt thread

Then its time for the senate and congress to give secrete service the authority to authorize and decline vacation requests.

meaning they can tell the president NO, you cannot go on vacation for the third time this month it is not in the budget.
Click to expand...

I think this would be too much like a prison for the president. I'd just set a budget and tell the POTUS that if they want to go over that, then they can pay for it themselves. With the stipulation that they have to pay for the Secret Service and not some PMC security instead.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
Greigor The Fellhand said:
he's referencing the Twitter/Social Media army that became active to push Trump in the social media hemisphere and attack Hilary in addition to Pro Russian stances.
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Also on GAF there's a lot of burner accounts that exist only to driveby shitpost about GamerGate.

Then they go to their hives on Reddit and 4chan and brag about how cool they are for getting banned on NeoGAF, one of the hardest things to do.
 
G

Greigor The Fellhand

Member
AntraxSuicide said:
I think this would be too much like a prison for the president. I'd just set a budget and tell the POTUS that if they want to go over that, then they can pay for it themselves. With the stipulation that they have to pay for the Secret Service and not some PMC security instead.
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You're the president. If your taking so many vacations that you defund the Secret Service for the first time in history I'd consider that a Dereliction of Duty.

It should be well within the Secret Services authority to Decline a preisdential vacation if they Deem it (A. To big a security Risk. B. To big of a cost associated with it)

PMC's should be banned from the white house, and no the president should not have the option of paying for there services himself, because that means you just made the Secret Service Contractors, then it would open the question of allowing them to be "rented".

Yes the Presidency can be considered a form of prison for the Term. They chose to run for president and accepted all these risks/options.
 
A

AntraxSuicide

Banned
Greigor The Fellhand said:
You're the president. If your taking so many vacations that you defund the Secret Service for the first time in history I'd consider that a Dereliction of Duty.

It should be well within the Secret Services authority to Decline a preisdential vacation if they Deem it (A. To big a security Risk. B. To big of a cost associated with it)

PMC's should be banned from the white house, and no the president should not have the option of paying for there services himself, because that means you just made the Secret Service Contractors, then it would open the question of allowing them to be "rented".

Yes the Presidency can be considered a form of prison for the Term. They chose to run for president and accepted all these risks/options.
Click to expand...

I can see the argument about going to unsafe locations that can't be secured, but we already make the President pay for a variety of things out of their salary (now, they do fudge that a good bit, but still). I don't see the contractor angle either; it's more like a budget shift (we pay you 400K a year, but now we're going to redirect some of that every time you go over budget).
 
N

numble

Member
Greigor The Fellhand said:
You're the president. If your taking so many vacations that you defund the Secret Service for the first time in history I'd consider that a Dereliction of Duty.

It should be well within the Secret Services authority to Decline a preisdential vacation if they Deem it (A. To big a security Risk. B. To big of a cost associated with it)

PMC's should be banned from the white house, and no the president should not have the option of paying for there services himself, because that means you just made the Secret Service Contractors, then it would open the question of allowing them to be "rented".

Yes the Presidency can be considered a form of prison for the Term. They chose to run for president and accepted all these risks/options.
Click to expand...

Its not defunded it just doesn't have enough funding.

Under your scenario, a Republican Congress can limit the budget of the Secret Service so that a Democratic president cannot travel anywhere except within DC (and since the president can't personally fund it, he/she cannot travel to swing states to campaign for re-election).
 
G

Greigor The Fellhand

Member
power wouldnt be in the congress/senate hands would ultimately fall on the secret service. The secret service falls under the President, but I understand what your saying. If the senate/congress limit/defund the Secret service themselves it would directly effect it, I would just make it so there budget is fixed with a 3% increase each year for vacation expenses. so all presidents get the same vacation budget, while the budget for the secret service its self can vary
 
T

Tamanon

Banned
Eh, you can't really legislate your way around vacations. At the end of the day, the President is ALWAYS working.

Maybe the extended family.....
 
D

dramatis

Member
Since we means-test so many other things, why not means-test the President for security detail? If your financial assets total 100 million and above, then you have to finance the Secret Service rather than bumming off taxpayer money.
 
B

barber

Member
Wilsongt said:
If Jesus could see what Christianity in America has become today, he'd probably have jusr stayed in that tomb and said "screw it".
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"who is that white guy they worship?" would be a pretty normal question, taking into account where he was from. Also, he would have some questions about the sacred trinity and all the shit that has happened with catholicism in general.
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
barber said:
"who is that white guy they worship?" would be a pretty normal question, taking into account where he was from. Also, he would have some questions about the sacred trinity and all the shit that has happened with catholicism in general.
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He'd probably be super confused as to why people are celebrating a cheeto.
 
A

AntraxSuicide

Banned
Does the Secret Service (who should really have changed their name decades ago because I'd like to abbreviate it but those initials have a sliiiiiightly more common reference) have a political lean like government workers (Dem) or like law enforcement (Rep)? It'd be interesting if Trump was even costing his party votes when he's sitting at home.
 
W

Wilsongt

Member
AntraxSuicide said:
Does the Secret Service (who should really have changed their name decades ago because I'd like to abbreviate it but those initials have a sliiiiiightly more common reference) have a political lean like government workers (Dem) or like law enforcement (Rep)? It'd be interesting if Trump was even costing his party votes when he's sitting at home.
Click to expand...

I don't believe they do as a service, but I am sure individuals do.

But, you know.... SS...
 
D

dramatis

Member
AntraxSuicide said:
Does the Secret Service (who should really have changed their name decades ago because I'd like to abbreviate it but those initials have a sliiiiiightly more common reference) have a political lean like government workers (Dem) or like law enforcement (Rep)? It'd be interesting if Trump was even costing his party votes when he's sitting at home.
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If they live in DC, chances are they probably voted Dem last November, though their party affiliation is probably not as certain.
 
E

Ernest

Banned
My local rep (Mimi Walters), who is WAY far up inside Trump's ass, is finally having a town hall meeting this week... by telephone. The fucking COWARD!
 
A

Abinash117

Member
Trump wants a fight for the border wall in September. How likely will he get it? There might be a shutdown because of it, but I think if there's enough bipartisan support for the budget Trump won't veto. Since Steve Bannon isn't there most of the administration will cave under pressure.

http://thehill.com/policy/finance/347153-trump-poised-for-a-september-fight-over-border-wall

Trump is demanding funds for the wall that was the centerpiece of his successful presidential campaign, but Democrats have warned they will vote en masse against any legislation that includes money for the wall.

”I don't see Democrats going along with anything that funds the wall," said one senior House Democratic aide.

That's a huge problem, since Republicans will need Democratic votes to pass a bill to fund the government. In the Senate, Democrats can block legislation unless the GOP can get eight members of the minority to vote to end a filibuster.
While Trump and members of his administration have suggested that they might favor a ”good shutdown," congressional Republicans worry that it will fuel the notion that their party, which controls both chambers of Congress and the White House, is unable to govern.
Click to expand...

As a result, House Speaker Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) may have to rely on passing the measure with more Democratic votes than Republican ones, a tactic that helped lead the Republican conference to turn against his predecessor, John Boehner (R-Ohio).

The administration still hopes it can use the wall to get more Republican votes for the measure.
Click to expand...
 
V

Valhelm

contribute something
dramatis said:
Since we means-test so many other things, why not means-test the President for security detail? If your financial assets total 100 million and above, then you have to finance the Secret Service rather than bumming off taxpayer money.
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Making Trump pay for his own bullshit might be enough to make him resign!

I'm exaggerating, but if forces within the GOP decide they would rather have Pence in power during the 2018 elections, Trump might take a hint and retire if his job becomes unpleasant enough. Ending his free vacations would encourage this.
 
S

skullmuffins

Banned
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
While Trump and members of his administration have suggested that they might favor a “good shutdown,” congressional Republicans worry that it will fuel the notion that their party, which controls both chambers of Congress and the White House, is unable to govern.
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It's only Reason #3196, guys, you can swing it.
 
I

IggyChooChoo

Member
Plinko said:
I'm still somewhat surprised how bad they've actually been.
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Me too. I know it's hard to take away benefits, but I really thought they would've been able to clear that Obamacare repeal hurdle by pushing the pain off past the 2018 elections or some other gimmickry. Seems like a trivial problem, honestly. Hindsight is 2020 but it is still shocking to me they didn't get that done in the first 100 days along with a raft of other horrible bills. I was sure McConnell and Ryan would have been able to hammer that out.
 
B

BoogieWoogie

Banned
IggyChooChoo said:
Me too. I know it's hard to take away benefits, but I really thought they would've been able to clear that Obamacare repeal hurdle by pushing the pain off past the 2018 elections or some other gimmickry. Seems like a trivial problem, honestly. Hindsight is 2020 but it is still shocking to me they didn't get that done in the first 100 days along with a raft of other horrible bills. I was sure McConnell and Ryan would have been able to hammer that out.
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For all the bluster, Ryan and McConnell are fucking TERRIBLE at their jobs.

Telling people to say no to everything and actually getting legislation pushed through are two entirely different things. The fucking clownshoes of having the Senate at one point threatening the House because the House may pass the bill that they were approving was unbelievable.
 
V

Valhelm

contribute something
Do we know what segments of Trump's coalition are the ones affecting his approval ratings?
I assume it's either Obama/Trump crossover white guys or moderate professionals in blue states but that's nothing beyond a hunch.

This is pretty important information, because it allows us to predict how future Trump policies can affect his popularity. We can even guess which parts of his agenda he sticks with.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
BoogieWoogie said:
For all the bluster, Ryan and McConnell are fucking TERRIBLE at their jobs.

Telling people to say no to everything and actually getting legislation pushed through are two entirely different things. The fucking clownshoes of having the Senate at one point threatening the House because the House may pass the bill that they were approving was unbelievable.
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I kind of saw this coming with Ryan, as the House with the Freedom Caucus is basically ungovernable and he's too ideological to want to work with Democrats on anything.

McConnell though was talked up so much for his understanding of Senate rules and traditions, ability to keep his senators in line, etc. Which is great until you realize that he had the easy job for the last eight years. It says it all that for someone who's supposedly so well-versed in how the Senate works, his role as Majority Leader under a Republican president has been to go on this scorched earth war path on all the norms and traditions he abused under Obama, and he's gotten all of shit done for it.
 
D

dramatis

Member
Aaron Strife said:
McConnell though was talked up so much for his understanding of Senate rules and traditions, ability to keep his senators in line, etc. Which is great until you realize that he had the easy job for the last eight years. It says it all that for someone who's supposedly so well-versed in how the Senate works, his role as Majority Leader under a Republican president has been to go on this scorched earth war path on all the norms and traditions he abused under Obama, and he's gotten all of shit done for it.
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There was an article a while back that talked about McConnell's office in Kentucky, and how it was decorated with items that talked about how he was winning elections or helping Republicans win elections, rather than about any substantive policy victories at all.

I don't think it's all that surprising that a man who has placed so much worth on winning has, in the end, not been able to get important legislation done.
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
StopMakingSense said:
And gallup back down to 35.
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So here's my theory on Trump approval trends:

Step 1: Baseline established
Step 2: Trump says/does egregiously stupid thing
Step 3: Most of America responds extremely negatively to said stupid thing, driving down his approval ratings
Step 4: Small rally effect from base hillbillies who claim to love stupid thing, but only because Trump is the one who did it. This causes liberal/mainstream media freak-out about Trump being teflon until
Step 5: Rally effect recedes, leaving his approval ratings as of Step 3 as the new baseline. Wash, rinse, repeat. Note that the liberal anxiety from step 4 has not receded at all. I promise when his approval hits the 20s you will still see people on OT be like "Yeah, but his base still likes him! All hope is lost!" ignoring that his base has been continuously shrinking ever since he took office.

dramatis said:
There was an article a while back that talked about McConnell's office in Kentucky, and how it was decorated with items that talked about how he was winning elections or helping Republicans win elections, rather than about any substantive policy victories at all.

I don't think it's all that surprising that a man who has placed so much worth on winning has, in the end, not been able to get important legislation done.
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I know his biggest goal in life was to turn the Kentucky state government into a GOP trifecta, even though the Kentucky Democrats are conservative enough that they were basically enacting GOP policy anyway when they held the governor's seat and the House.

Speaking of, Bevin is a bit of a dumbass, I wonder if we can beat him in 2019.
 
S

studyguy

Member
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/08/20/trump-afghanistan-asia-war-241845
Trump is expected to approve sending at least 3,500 more troops to Afghanistan, according to two sources with knowledge of the discussions, though the White House appears to be keeping a tight hold on the details of exactly what the president will say. He is expected to deepen U.S. involvement in the region and indicate a more traditional approach to foreign policy than he promised on the campaign trail.
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Another year and the kids born at the start of the conflict can enlist iirc. zzzz
 
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