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[Xando]

One person has been stabbed to death in a Hamburg supermarket and six people have been injured after being attacked by a man wielding a knife.

German police said the suspected attacker fled the shop in the Barmbek district of the north German city and headed towards a metro station, but was followed by witnesses who tackled him to the ground. The man was then arrested by plainclothes police officers. He was slightly injured.

The suspect was a 26-year-old born in the United Arab Emirates, police said, though they were still working to establish his nationality. Hamburg’s mayor said the man had apparently sought shelter in Germany and that authorities had been unable to deport him because he had no papers.

The person who was killed was described by police as a customer of the shop and believed to be a 50-year-old German man. One of the six victims injured in the attack is in a serious condition.

Timo Zill, a spokesman for Hamburg police, said: “What we know at this stage is that the person was male, that he was armed with a knife, and entered the supermarket, and sought out his victims and started stabbing them randomly. He’s injured but not seriously.”

Zill said he had no information as to the man’s motive. “First reports about a possible robbery cannot be confirmed so far,” he said.

Police said they were confident he had been acting alone. One witness described his weapon as a kitchen knife.

Two witnesses to the attack said the man shouted “Allahu Akbar” but police said they were unable to confirm the reports. They declined to say whether the attack was being treated as a terrorist incident.

Bild newspaper reported late on Friday that armed police forces had searched the migrant housing centre where the attacker had lived.

A police spokeswoman said the motive for the attack was still under investigation. She said she had no information that the attacker was known to authorities as an Islamist, as reported by the newspaper Tagesspiegel.

Police said a 50-year-old woman and four men aged between 19 and 64 were injured in the attack, all of whom were German. A 35-year-old Turkish man was injured while trying to stop the attacker, they said. Media reports said he injured his shoulder while throwing a metal rod.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/jul/28/man-stabs-shopper-hamburg-supermarket-barmbek


Brave civilians attacked the attacker until police arrived to arrest him
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkcfKRBxt1Y

 

[ponpo]

Hamburg's mayor said the man had apparently sought shelter in Germany and that authorities had been unable to deport him because he had no papers.

So what do they do then? I guess you can't deport someone if you don't know where to send them, but then what?

And damn that video.

 

[Trojita]

My condolences to the victims and their families.

Hamburg’s mayor said the man had apparently sought shelter in Germany and that authorities had been unable to deport him because he had no papers.

That's a terrible fucking system.

 

[Shaanyboi]

Two witnesses to the attack said the man shouted “Allahu Akbar” but police said they were unable to confirm the reports. They declined to say whether the attack was being treated as a terrorist incident.

How would it be anything but?

 

[Miles Quaritch]

How would it be anything but?

Could be mental illness. Let's wait for all the facts to come out.

 

[M52B28]

Hamburg’s mayor said the man had apparently sought shelter in Germany and that authorities had been unable to deport him because he had no papers.

I'm all for immigration, but Germany, you are seriously fucking up with this right here. This will allow for obvious terrorists to take advantage of this 'loophole' or whatever you'd like to call it.

As much as I hate parts of immigration system of the US, they would have sent this man to the moon before he could even attempt to step foot here without papers.

 

[Xando]

So what do they do then? I guess you can't deport someone if you don't know where to send them, but then what?

And damn that video.

IIRC they get a 'tolerated' status until papers arrive.

According to some german media he was known to intelligence agencys for salafist links but they didn't arrest him just like the berlin attacker last year

 

[BreezyLimbo]

My condolences to the victims and their families.


That's a terrible fucking system.

Thats what Im thinking.

So theoretically if I go to Germany, "lose" all my papers and make a fake name, I could just live there? Thats a ridiculous system.

I get the optics but...ya really gotta do something.

 

[Xando]

Thats what Im thinking.

So theoretically if I go to Germany, "lose" all my papers and make a fake name, I could just live there? Thats a ridiculous system.

I get the optics but...ya really gotta do something.

What you gonna do? Sit them on some random plane just so they get send back to germany?

It's middle eastern states that don't want their people back and fail to provide papers (in this case UAE, with the Berlin attacker the same shit happened because tunisia didn't provide the papers after germany requested them).


They need to arrest all people supposed to be deported with terrorist links and waiting for papers

 

[ClosingADoor]

Could be mental illness. Let's wait for all the facts to come out.

Aren't all terrorist mentally ill. Brain washed to do this stuff.

I'm all for immigration, but Germany, you are seriously fucking up with this right here. This will allow for obvious terrorists to take advantage of this 'loophole' or whatever you'd like to call it.

As much as I hate parts of immigration system of the US, they would have sent this man to the moon before he could even attempt to step foot here without papers.

This is a major problem in Europe. People arrive without papers and then we need to figure out if they are actually from where they claim they are from. They even have people that will check accents to try and determine where these immigrants are from. Same thing with people claiming they are underage so deportation is harder. How do you check someone is 20 or 16...

Even better, when they figure out where they are from, countries like Tunisia, Morocco, etc, will not work with the EU to take them back.

The system is broken, has been for years.

IIRC they get a 'tolerated' status until papers arrive.

According to some german media he was known to intelligence agencys for salafist links but they didn't arrest him just like the berlin attacker last year

And every time these guys are "known". How about we don't let them walk around free then.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

What you gonna do? Sit them on some random plane just so they get send back to germany?

It's middle eastern states that don't want their people back and fail to provide papers (in this case UAE, with the Berlin attacker the same shit happened because tunisia didn't provide the papers after germany requested them).

If they know hes from UAE just no documentation, just fly him there and drop him off? Germany cant just take in everyone without papers either.

 

[Xando]

If they know hes from UAE just no documentation, just fly him there and drop him off? Germany cant just take in everyone without papers either.

You do realize UAE would just not let him into the country and send him straight back to germany?

The problem is these countries just don't take their citizens back

 

[Trojita]

What you gonna do? Sit them on some random plane just so they get send back to germany?

It's middle eastern states that don't want their people back and fail to provide papers (in this case UAE, with the Berlin attacker the same shit happened because tunisia didn't provide the papers after germany requested them).


They need to arrest all people supposed to be deported with terrorist links and waiting for papers

Should it be like

1. Do you have any papers? No. Okay bye.

2. You said we need to get papers from Tunisia/U.A.E., well they aren't on the refugee/asylum list.

The only problem with the latter is if they say a country that isn't their original one. Not sure how you could setup a fast system to check if a person was really from Syria.

 

[deo]

Scary situation :/ Hope anyone nearby that area is safe

 

[Xando]

Should it be like

1. Do you have any papers? No. Okay bye.

2. You said we need to get papers from Tunisia/U.A.E., well they aren't on the refugee/asylum list.

The only problem with the latter is if they say a country that isn't their original one. Not sure how you could setup a fast system to check if a person was really from Syria.

The problem is that 90% of these people say they're from Syria and immigration office have to proof otherwise.

Even if you gonna tell them Okay bye where do you send them? To austria?

 

[Trojita]

The problem is that 90% of these people say they're from Syria and immigration office have to proof otherwise

In this case they had to have known something if they knew his affiliation. At that point it is negligence.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

You do realize UAE would just not let him into the country and send him straight back to germany?

The problem is these countries just don't take their citizens back

Sucks for Germany then. Sure they could probably indefinitely detain these people without papers...or ship them to another country like Turkey, Syria, or Saudi Arabia. Places where they would fit in and probably not go on a stabbing spree.

 

[Xando]

In this case they had to have known something if they knew his affiliation. At that point it is negligence.

So you sit them on a plane to UAE which declines entry because no papers and sends him back to germany.

Then what?

Do you drop him off over UAE in a parachute?

 

[Trojita]

What are the specifics on how the U.A.E can prevent Germany from sending their own citizen back to them?

 

[Xando]

What are the specifics on how the U.A.E can prevent Germany from sending their own citizen back to them?

What do you mean? They'll just decline entry due to no papers

 

[MistakenMobius]

What are the specifics on how the U.A.E can prevent Germany from sending their own citizen back to them?

Don't know him, please keep him.

That's why refugee system needs to be setup to get people in and not decide once they are here.
The lack of paper should disqualify us from being a refugee and should drive u to jail

 

[Trojita]

Yeah I was about to reply with.

If there is no papers and an order to leave the country within a week isn't followed, some punishment is needed.

 

[ClosingADoor]

What are the specifics on how the U.A.E can prevent Germany from sending their own citizen back to them?

Same way you won't get into your country without papers. And then a government that doesn't want to proof you are their citizen, and you don't want to either, because you want to be in Europe.

The EU needs to throw its weight around to get these countries to take back their people, but they haven't yet for some reason.

 

[Mohonky]

Germany has seriously just fucked up with this immigration policy. Surely they anticipate events like this?

 

[Trojita]

Same way you won't get into your country without papers. And then a government that doesn't want to proof you are their citizen, and you don't want to either, because you want to be in Europe.

The EU needs to throw its weight around to get these countries to take back their people, but they haven't yet for some reason.

So it is more the EU has done jackshit to force origin countries to comply. It's not like Germany and the whole fricking EU doesn't have a lot of clout.

 

[Erevador]

That's a terrible fucking system.

There is no system. That's the terrible truth underlying all of this. There was never any realistic plan for vetting or dealing with the (predictable) results of the decisions that have been made.

The results of that truth will continue to play out for years to come.

 

[Xando]

So it is more the EU has done jackshit to force origin countries to comply. It's not like Germany and the whole fricking EU doesn't have a lot of clout.

The EU has been useless AF on these immigration issues.

Merkel has been going at it alone (primarily in africa) and is making some small progress.

 

[makingmusic476]

What are the specifics on how the U.A.E can prevent Germany from sending their own citizen back to them?

Have you ever flown internationally?

 

[Shiggy]

There's little we can do now that idiots like this are here. The countries where they come from don't want to take them back either.

Germany has seriously just fucked up with this immigration policy. Surely they anticipate events like this?

But...but Merkel said "Wir schaffen das".

 

[ClosingADoor]

So it is more the EU has done jackshit to force origin countries to comply. It's not like Germany and the whole fricking EU doesn't have a lot of clout.

Its one of the things I really don't get. They really just need to go: You don't want to take back your citizens? Ok, then yours can't travel here and we slap some tarrifs on your export products. Enjoy!

For some reason they let these countries walk all over them and try to play nice. It doesn't work.

The EU has been useless AF on these immigration issues.

Merkel has been going at it alone (primarily in africa) and is making some small progress.

Macron is trying to get refugee centers in Libya off the ground finally. So they can apply there and after checking either allowed or denied.

 

[darkinstinct]

My condolences to the victims and their families.


That's a terrible fucking system.

That's how it works in every country.

 

[Trojita]

Have you ever flown internationally?

I just think it is dumb as fuck by this point to not have some system in place to send people back without papers, after detained and found out where they are from. You are telling me they have no clout to force these countries to take back their own? This isn't a normal flight I'm talking about.

 

[| Praxis |]

I see the Germans are using chairs to fight terrorism like we did in London.

 

[Kyoufu]

What's a "potential terrorist"?

 

[dragonelite]

Germany has seriously just fucked up with this immigration policy. Surely they anticipate events like this?

Off course they did, they probably traded the occasional terrorist attack for a big rejuvenation of their potential workforce and get a nice pr bonus in the global space.

 

[Trojita]

Off course they did, they probably traded the occasional terrorist attack for a big rejuvenation of their potential workforce and get a nice pr bonus in the global space.

I don't think the stats actually back this up. Last year only around 13% of economic migrants in Germany are working/found work.

 

[MisterFalcon]

I see the Germans are using chairs to fight terrorism like we did in London.

And that they don't follow the Government Official What To Do Advice which involves running away, hiding and telling The Authorities. Because heavens forbid people would fight back, that's vigilantism.

 

[Jumeira]

How would it be anything but?

Is that all it takes? Seems unhelpful to make assumptions just because he screams that. We've seen people resentful of a country because they're rejected asylum, not because they want to spread ISIS message, they use phoney Terror tactics due to the significant psychological impact on locals, who in thier mind are all complicit in thier denial, which is exactly the angle they want to take. A nobody suddenly becomes worldwide news. They take revenge against a populace they'll never be part of.

 

[Shiggy]

Off course they did, they probably traded the occasional terrorist attack for a big rejuvenation of their potential workforce and get a nice pr bonus in the global space.

The vast majority is unfit for the German labour market due to a lack of qualifications. Even if they find a job, it's often just unskilled and low-paid labour.

 

[Trojita]

Is that all it takes? Seems unhelpful to make assumptions just because he screams that. We've seen people resentful of a country because they're rejected asylum, not because they want to spread ISIS message, they use phoney Terror tactics due to the significant psychological impact on locals, who in thier mind are all complicit in thier denial, which is exactly the angle they want to take. A nobody suddenly becomes worldwide news. They take revenge against a populace they'll never be part of.

I'd guess this guy should be called a terrorist like Dylann Roof being a terrorist.

 

[jelly]

I'm not sure how you actually solve it, not just a German issue.

I can only think be extremely tough like horribly so to deter people but that's not really feasible as has been talked about, what do you do with them.

A partial solution is sorting the places they actually come from or coastal areas where they make the leap over to Europe. That's tough too. I just don't know how you can do anything without it being worse than letting them in. A safe haven in Libya by the UN or something? Stop people risking their lives travelling in dodgy boats, take in some refugees over to Europe.

 

[Occam]

Could be mental illness. Let's wait for all the facts to come out.

What's the difference? A sane person doesn't try to kill people in the name of deities.

 

[Xando]

What's a "potential terrorist"?

Media claims he's a terrorist but police hasn't confirmed it yet.


Press conference will be in 1 hour 20 minutes where we'll presumably will hear it.

I don't think the stats actually back this up. Last year only around 13% of economic migrants in Germany are working/found work.

Do you really think people would be at 100% employment after moving to a completely unknown country without knowing the language or having proper education within a year?

 

[Kinyou]

Damn, the guys in the video are brave as hell

 

[abracadaver]

I live in the same street. The store is 300m away from me. Crazy that it was so close. I was at work while it happened though.

 

[Trojita]

Do you really think people would be at 100% employment after moving to a completely unknown country without knowing the language or having proper education within a year?

Of course not. You are explaining the cause of the observation in the statement, the statement still stands.

 

[RoyalFool]

The problem isn't immigration, unless you are an island you cannot possibly prevent someone with enough determination from getting in without having any papers.

The problem is what drives folks to do shit like this, extremist religious beliefs, propagated by a religion that is incompatible in many ways with western culture. I don't think it's possible to have religious freedom without occurrences like this considering some religions are still stuck in the middle ages.

 

[Trojita]

The problem isn't immigration, unless you are an island you cannot possibly prevent someone with enough determination from getting in without having any papers.

The problem is what drives folks to do shit like this, extremist religious beliefs, propagated by a religion that is incompatible in many ways with western culture. I don't think it's possible to have religious freedom without occurrences like this considering some religions are still stuck in the middle ages.

I'm pretty sure it is because of having no way currently preventing economic migrant from poor countries with an uneducated backgrounds.

 

[RoyalFool]

I'm pretty sure it is because of having no way currently preventing economic migrant from poor countries with an uneducated backgrounds.

You'll just end up with a situation like the UK where you get home-grown terrorists going off to do training then coming home and doing the same shit.

Region is the problem, not border controls.

 

[MisterFalcon]

I'm pretty sure it is because of having no way currently preventing economic migrant from poor countries with an uneducated backgrounds.

The Gulf states have millions of economic migrants from uneducated backgrounds and yet do not suffer constant terrorist attacks from them.