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Rime: Microsoft rejected Tequila Works’ game before it became PS4 exclusive

quite shocked to read this, RIME is one of the games i got the most excited about during the PS4 Press Conference when they first introduced it
how can one abandon a kid between ICO and Journey?
 
[...]Then the Xbox One plans were announced and everything changed. The people at Microsoft say that the game doesn't fit in the strategy of the new console, that they are looking for "connected experiences" and the social factor. Rime didn't fit because it was a single-player game, a very traditional game experience. [...]

Oh wow. Glad I didn't purchase an Xbox One at launch.
 

Crateman

Member
This might be old news, but there's a very interesting piece of information in the interview posted earlier with Tequila Works founder regarding Mercury Steam (Also founded by him):

A Konami le gustaba nuestro trabajo y nos ofreció trabajar con una de sus IPs clásicas. En resumidas cuentas, nos ofrecieron trabajar con Castlevania o con Contra, más o menos. Llegaron a preguntarnos qué IP preferíamos. Adivina qué contestamos.

Translation

Konami liked our work and offered us to work with one of their classic IPs. To make things short, they offered us to work with Castlevania or Contra, more less. They asked us what IP we preferred. Guess what was our answer.

Basically, instead of Castlevania Lords of Shadow we would have Contra.

Is this related to the teased Contra a while back, never to be heard of?
 
Yep. Sony ditched Remember me from dontnod.

Dontnod filed for bankruptcy last month.

love-indies-ps4.jpg

What? I think a better example would be Sony passing on State of Decay or Super Meat Boy.
 
Typical Microsoft!
No surprises here!

Typical of them to produce Tequila Works very first game?

Microsoft takes plenty of risks in terms of working with new developers with ambitious projects. I mean, take a look at State of Decay.

Ignoring the fact that the game contains zombies, it was an single-player only, open world survival role playing game by a brand new developer. It sold like hotcakes and Microsoft inked them to another deal.

Microsoft produced Deadlight, which was a story driven 2D platformer set in another zombie apocalypse setting that turned out to be a game with really frustrating controls and it didn't sell at all. Thus Microsoft didn't choose to ink them to another deal.

This may work out for Sony if Rime turns out to be great but it could just be their Deadlight, a really good looking game with crappy controls that fails to light the world on fire. And this is coming from someone who liked Deadlight enough to finish it.
 

LuchaShaq

Banned
This reminds of when Microsoft rejected Heavy Rain because they didn't like the child kidnapping aspect. Sony's been taking a lot of risks and for the most part I feel like Microsoft is playing it safe when it comes to which games they back.

One of Sony's worst decisions was giving cage funding.
 
Well I'm glad they passed on it, it's one of the more interesting games coming up and I'm not getting an XB1 anytime soon. Their reasons for passing up on this and Heavy Rain definitely highlights their rigid green-light process and why their exclusive portfolio historically hasn't been as interesting as the other console makers.
One of Sony's worst decisions was giving cage funding.
David Cage games makes money, and diversifies their lineup.
 
MS' loss I guess. I also remember them rejecting MM and QD. Probably in favor of churning out more of the same over and over.

I'm kinda glad in a way, saved them from certain "doom" (I know, a bit hyperbolic)
 
They were an independent studio

Sony doesn't own Dontnod and they didn't fund "Remember Me," Capcom was the publisher.

Indies don't need a publisher in order to publish on PS4, they are in control of their creations and are also in control of when they want to release games and how much those games cost on PSN.

One of Sony's worst decisions was giving cage funding.

Heavy Rain sold 3+ million copies

Beyond Two Souls sold a million in 3 months.

There is clearly an audience for Quantic Dream's games.
 
Ryme is my most anticipated and hyped game for the PS4 as of now. Simply one of the most beautiful games I've seen in my near 30 years of gaming.
 
MS' loss I guess. I also remember them rejecting MM and QD. Probably in favor of churning out more of the same over and over.

I'm kinda glad in a way, saved them from certain "doom" (I know, a bit hyperbolic)

I wouldn't say that they are churning out more of the same over and over.
 
I suppose it might have been a big mistake on MS's part, but that involves a lot of assumptions. It assumes the game they offered MS was substantially the same game that's going to come out on the PS4. It assumes that 3 million+ would have been the end of the costs, which we won't know until it actually comes out and someone lets us know how much it cost. It assumes the game will be good -- which is a fairly big assumption given the history of the dev (Deadlight) and what we've seen so far. Rime LOOKS gorgeous, but there's minimal indication of gameplay in the media I've seen.

And finally, the big one, it assumes that Rime is going to be a financial success, which is anyone's guess at this point.

Assuming that RIME is a good game, and looks as gorgeous as the trailer, it wouldn't surprise me to see the game selling huge numbers, in league with Journey - I think Sony have a good audience for that kind of game.
 

noobasuar

Banned
The developer is straight up trash.

I love how people get excited as fuck over their imaginary visions of what a game is going to be without any gameplay footage.
 
Not enough cars, dudebro, space marine or guns and killing. It's obvious.
Rime is a tower defense game, you can bet there will be killing.

Also, that "dudebro space marine" point you bring up is old and simply not true.
Let me refer you to Sunset Overdrive and Quantum Break.
 

meanspartan

Member
Then the Xbox One plans were announced and everything changed. The people at Microsoft say that the game doesn't fit in the strategy of the new console, that they are looking for "connected experiences" and the social factor. Rime didn't fit because it was a single-player game, a very traditional game experience.

I'll admit that I will probably buy an Xbox One at some point in the future once it has a handful of exclusives I really want and the price comes down.

However, that "strategy" makes me want to hurl. Connected experiences are fine, but not if you are going to turn down any game that doesn't have that "social factor".

I am not regretting my decision so far to go PC/Ps4 (and 3DS). At all. Especially since Ps4 will still have most of those "connected experiences" right alongside unique games like Rime.

The Xbox One is truly the dudebro console. If it were a person, it'd be one of those guys you want to punch in the face.

Like I admitted, I'll probably wind up still getting it if it gets a great library going in a couple years. But that sort of corporate marketing mumbo jumbo forcing them to turn down amazing looking games is gross.
 

sn00zer

Member
To be fair the game was pitched as an isometric survival tower defense game....which is pretty much Dont Starve....unless the game had some really strong concept art at that point I can see why it was rejected
 
Design pillar 1 makes me very excited for this, more so than I was before.

Hope it really has deep survival gameplay.

Yep, personally I hope they ditch all of the castle-defense stuff but keep all of the rest of the design, I love the idea of hunting for food, gathering berries and fruit to survive, and then this greater narrative of Guardians and stuff could have some epic SotC bits in. Combine that with a dynamic day night cycle and gorgeous art and OST and you've got my money.
 
MS' loss I guess. I also remember them rejecting MM and QD. Probably in favor of churning out more of the same over and over.

I'm kinda glad in a way, saved them from certain "doom" (I know, a bit hyperbolic)

MM being Media Molecule? The same MM that said they didn't even talk to Microsoft?

"We didn't get around to speaking to Microsoft."

Source

Also, considering how many God of War, Killzone, Uncharted, LittleBigPlanet, Resistance, Ratchet & Clank games there are, I think its a bit rich to say MS are the ones that churn games out "over and over", all publishers do it with their main franchises.
 
I wouldn't say that they are churning out more of the same over and over.

What exactly are MS' studios doing? Another Halo, more Forza, another Fable, and now Black Tusk is on Gears. Rare is pretty much Kinect bound. The only thing that comes to mind is Project Spark team, and the smaller devs like Press Play. Every major MS first party is pretty much a dedicated factory for a specific franchise.

Lionhead say they're working on a new IP, but I'll believe it when I see it (Black Tusk were also working on a new IP, yet here we are).

MM being Media Molecule? The same MM that said they didn't even talk to Microsoft?



Source

Also, considering how many God of War, Killzone, Uncharted, LittleBigPlanet, Resistance, Ratchet & Clank games there are, I think its a bit rich to say MS are the ones that churn games out "over and over", all publishers do it with their main franchises.

I don't get what people don't understand here. I'm not saying Sony doesn't do sequels, of course do they do, the difference is they also let their devs make new IPs (ND's Last of Us, SSM, GG, MM, Bend, London, Japan, etc all doing new IPs) ,and fund new IPs. MS is doing a good job with QB and SO this year, but that's about it, they always start strong and then devolve into the usual cycle. Sure, it's just the start of the gen, but I'll believe otherwise when I see, For now, MS has given me every reason to be skeptical
 
What exact are MS' studios doing? Another Halo, more Forza, another Fable, and now Black Tusk is on Gears. Rare is pretty much Kinect bound. The only thing that comes to mind is Project Spark team, and the smaller devs like Press Play. Every major MS first party is pretty much a dedicated factory for a specific franchise.

Lionhead say they're working on a new IP, but I'll believe it when I see it (Black Tusk were also working on a new IP, yet here we are).

It's unfair to focus solely on first party. They have Swery working on D4, Undead Labs on a follow up to State of Decay as well as Press Play working on their next game and Grounding are likely working on something too.

My point is it's not accurate to say MS are churning out the same over and over or not taking risks.
 
It's unfair to focus solely on first party. They have Swery working on D4, Undead Labs on a follow up to State of Decay as well as Press Play working on their next game and Grounding are likely working on something too.

My point is it's not accurate to say MS are churning out the same over and over or not taking risks.

It is when you choose to ignore the bolded :p
 
It's unfair to focus solely on first party. They have Swery working on D4, Undead Labs on a follow up to State of Decay as well as Press Play working on their next game and Grounding are likely working on something too.

My point is it's not accurate to say MS are churning out the same over and over or not taking risks.

No it's not, because Sony also has second party devs working on games which I'm not mentioning (RaD, I believe QD is also second party, Tequila Works, Arrowhead).

My point is, the gulf between Sony and MS is quite significant when it comes down to their studios and games and it shows the different focuses of each company.
 

Chobel

Member
Rime is a tower defense game, you can bet there will be killing.

Also, that "dudebro space marine" point you bring up is old and simply not true.
Let me refer you to Sunset Overdrive and Quantum Break.

Oh there! When did they announce it's tower defence?

You're probably mistaking it with Helldivers.
 
Not really surprised. The original DRM box probably had some strict rules. DLC, Microtransactions, 2nd screen, etc. Hell wouldn't be surprised if some of those rules still exist. They're probably just a little more open minded due to PS4 success.
 
It is when you choose to ignore the bolded :p

I'll never understand why people ignore certain types of games...

No it's not, because Sony also has second party devs working on games which I'm not mentioning (RaD, I believe QD is also second party, Tequila Works, Arrowhead).

My point is, the gulf between Sony and MS is quite significant when it comes down to their studios and games.

No one would dispute that Sony are ahead of MS in terms of studios or exclusive output. That wasn't really the point though, it was that MS passed on this to churn out more of the same when that's not really true.
 

Chobel

Member
I don't get what people don't understand here. I'm not saying Sony doesn't do sequels, of course do they do, the difference is they also let their devs make new IPs and fund new IPs. MS is doing a good job with QB and SO this year, but that's about it, they always start strong and then devolve into the usual cycle. Sure, it's just the start of the gen, but I'll believe otherwise when I see, For now, MS has given me every reason to be skeptical

About it?

They just released Ryse, Powerstar Golf, Crimson Dragon (I'll let Lococycle go), they have D4, Sunset Overdrive, Quantum Break, Project Spark coming.

They focused their efforts on Kinect for 360 and made new IPs for that platform, just because they didn't make new IPs you want to play (or I to be fair) doesn't mean they didn't make them and invest. In this time they also seemingly turned their attention towards Xbox One which is where we are seeing the investment come off.

You've also said "the usual cycle", but what does that actually mean? At the end of the Xbox lifecycle (focusing just on 2004 and 2005), they released Fable, Forza, Jade Empire, Phantom Dust, Sudeki as new IPs - 2 of which are still very relevant, one is rotting in EAs vault of unused IPs, Sudeki presumably the same in Phil Spencer's office and Phantom Dust which seems like it be brought back. These games as well as the sequels they made: Halo 2, Blinx 2, Rallisport Challenge 2, Conker BFD.

I dont deny that MS have a lot to prove long term with regards to new IP but I don't think its as bad as people make it out to be.
 
I'll never understand why people ignore certain types of games...



No one would dispute that Sony are ahead of MS in terms of studios or exclusive output. That wasn't really the point though, it was that MS passed on this to churn out more of the same when that's not really true.

MS has had 4 years of barely doing anything on the 360 to build up their games studios and get a good thing going for the X1. Instead of doing that, they just sat around, doing absolutely nothing to improve the situation, instead they just churned out more Gears, more Halo, more Forzas. That's my issue with them. Yea, they have a game or two every now and then that they throw, but that's not nearly enough. They need to really get their head in the game. They don't have the benefit of having almost every multiplat better on their system, they don't have the benefit of a better online network, and they don't have the benefit of a strong first party to back up on. That's what happens when they rely on third party exclusives over building their own catalog.

I'm almost certain that after this year it'll just be the 360 all over again, but again, I hope I'm proven wrong. And heck, even this year isn't that great, QB looks amazing, SO looks promising but two games isn't enough.

About it?

They just released Ryse, Powerstar Golf, Crimson Dragon (I'll let Lococycle go), they have D4, Sunset Overdrive, Quantum Break, Project Spark coming.

They focused their efforts on Kinect for 360 and made new IPs for that platform, just because they didn't make new IPs you want to play (or I to be fair) doesn't mean they didn't make them and invest. In this time they also seemingly turned their attention towards Xbox One which is where we are seeing the investment come off.

You've also said "the usual cycle", but what does that actually mean? At the end of the Xbox lifecycle (focusing just on 2004 and 2005), they released Fable, Forza, Jade Empire, Phantom Dust, Sudeki as new IPs - 2 of which are still very relevant, one is rotting in EAs vault of unused IPs, Sudeki presumably the same in Phil Spencer's office and Phantom Dust which seems like it be brought back. These games as well as the sequels they made: Halo 2, Blinx 2, Rallisport Challenge 2, Conker BFD.

I dont deny that MS have a lot to prove long term with regards to new IP but I don't think its as bad as people make it out to be.

I've agreed before that MS had a stronger launch lineup, the issue is going forward. I'm just very skeptical of them after what they did on the 360. The 360 had a great first couple of years and then... look at what happened.

Most of those games you mentioned were also not from first party studios. I want MS to focus on that, and beef them up. Get them up and have them actually compete with Nintendo and Sony. What I mean by usual cycle, the yearly Forza/Halo/Gears/Fable games. It's either a Halo/Forza year, or a Gears/Forza year with Fable sprinkled around. I think MS should give their first party more independence and let them really evolve instead of just tying them down with the same games over and over. Black Tusk, a promising concept, is now a Gears factory (and yes, MS can say that they're working on other games, but again, I'll believe it when I see it).

Now, that's all my personal opinion, I realize that for some people more Forza/Halo/Gears is plenty. But it just doesn't cut it for me. I really want to play QB, but I'm not buying a console for one game, especially not for $499 and weaker than the competition. Make it $349 and then I'll bite. Again, at least that's my opinion. MS hasn't earned themselves the benefit of the doubt.
 
They probably wanted to fund it, but had already run out of their allowance for games funding due to shoveling it all down EA's gaping maw.
 
The Xbox One is truly the dudebro console. If it were a person, it'd be one of those guys you want to punch in the face.

Things like this literally make no sense.

Xbox One launch window games published, or set to publish by Microsoft Studios:
(Bold = possible "dude bro" I guess?)

Below
Crimson Dragon
D4
Dead Rising 3
Forza 5
Halo: SA
Killer Instinct & Killer Instinct Classic
Kinect Sports Rivals
Lococycle
Max: Curse of Brotherhood
Powerstar Golf
Project Spark
Ryse
Super Time Force
Xbox Fitness
Zoo Tycoon


Yep. Super "dude bro" line-up there.
 
That's what I thought too.

People have really high expectations about Rime but as some guys here have said Deadlight was mediocre (even though I kinda enjoyed it) so keep your expectations in check people, it's never a bad thing.

I kind of imagine that given the response to the game when it was announced and the ICO comparisons they are probably getting quite a bit of help from Sony now and for a while now they seem to help these small devs quite a bit when they make an exclusive game (like SSM seems to always be doing).

I just hope it's good since I loved that reveal trailer.

And Sony cares about what? Puppies? Global warming?

They all care about the same exact thing: our money. The difference at this moment is their approach. Sony didn't approve the game because they thought it looked nice, it was because they believe it can be profitable.

That's kind of ignoring how much more Sony has been willing to create/back riskier games or even just games that they expect will be moderate successes and not necessarily blockbusters (Puppeteer etc.).
 

hawk2025

Member
Things like this literally make no sense.

Xbox One launch window games published, or set to publish by Microsoft Studios:
(Bold = possible "dude bro" I guess?)

Below
Crimson Dragon
D4
Dead Rising 3
Forza 5
Halo: SA
Killer Instinct & Killer Instinct Classic
Kinect Sports Rivals
Lococycle
Max: Curse of Brotherhood
Powerstar Golf
Project Spark
Ryse
Super Time Force
Xbox Fitness
Zoo Tycoon


Yep. Super "dude bro" line-up there.

Below will be self-published, as will Super Time Force.
 
I thought Remember Me was really interesting and needed more polish. I wonder what would have happened, if Sony funded it instead of EA.

It actually was Capcom it ended up with not EA, but I agree.

Same here, I really liked that game even with it's rough spots that could have been improved with more polish. The character was pretty cool and also, the setting and visual style was awesome.
 

Sydle

Member
What exact are MS' studios doing? Another Halo, more Forza, another Fable, and now Black Tusk is on Gears. Rare is pretty much Kinect bound. The only thing that comes to mind is Project Spark team, and the smaller devs like Press Play. Every major MS first party is pretty much a dedicated factory for a specific franchise.

Lionhead say they're working on a new IP, but I'll believe it when I see it (Black Tusk were also working on a new IP, yet here we are).



I don't get what people don't understand here. I'm not saying Sony doesn't do sequels, of course do they do, the difference is they also let their devs make new IPs and fund new IPs. MS is doing a good job with QB and SO this year, but that's about it, they always start strong and then devolve into the usual cycle. Sure, it's just the start of the gen, but I'll believe otherwise when I see, For now, MS has given me every reason to be skeptical

Doesn't Sony have 2-3x as many first party studios as MS, with a handful of them at capacity to take on multiple games? Don't they also make sequels for their most successful franchises in addition to working on other games?

In addition to QB and SO, do you think recent and upcoming games like Forza Horizon, Alan Wake, Killer Instinct, LocoCycle, Ryse, Crimson Dragon, Max:CoB, State of Decay, Project Spark, and D4 are not risks? They may not own all the studios making those games, but they are bankrolling them.

I think Lionhead and Rare are both staffed up now to take on multiple projects. Rare's studio head even suggested that post-KSR they will likely start multiple projects. I also have my doubts about the Lionhead non-Fable IP, but we'll see. Pretty sure Lift London has 4 cross-device games they are going to reveal soon. Second party, but I think Ruffian is also working on a Xbox One game that is not Crackdown and the original Phantom Dust creator is going to return to Phantom Dust (because he wants to). They should have bought DH!

I think they are taking risks. And I would agree with you in thinking MS needs more first-party devs to broaden the portfolio, and I also agree with Spencer's approach of working with or buying studios that want to do business with MS.

I also think they are starting to look at things a bit different, because Press Play said they agreed to be acquired if they could retain creative control and feel like an independent developer. Perhaps the post-Mattrick era will see things develop a little differently than the 2008-2013 years of 360 when he was leading (and shutting down studios, prioritizing Kinect, etc.).
 
Below will be self-published, as will Super Time Force.

No, Below is not self published. MS Studios is publishing it as the deal was in place well before ID@Xbox. Unless Capy worked something out with MS since then. I believe you are right about STT though. Still, if that's the only issue with that list, then it seems my point has been delivered quite nicely.

edit: Capy's website still has Below as published by MS Studios. http://www.capybaragames.com/below/
 
I can just imagine the amount of games both have rejected, shit happens you never know what will become something great..it's sort of like a massive gamble

when I think of rejections though I think of nintendo..how much games they must of turned away because it might of not fit the nintendo image lol
 

hawk2025

Member
No, Below is not self published. MS Studios is publishing it as the deal was in place well before ID@Xbox. Unless Capy worked something out with MS since then. I believe you are right about STT though. Still, if that's the only issue with that list, then it seems my point has been delivered quite nicely.

edit: Capy's website still has Below as published by MS Studios. http://www.capybaragames.com/below/



Oh yes, I never denied your main point -- you are right.

And thanks for the correction :) I confused the ID@Xbox list that included Below with the announcement of the actual self-published title.
 
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