Support NeoGAF

[J@hranimo]

Panic Button is doing the same with Rocket League. Makes sense.

I wonder if after release they put out a patch that changes the resolution like Minecraft? Doubt it but you know.

 

[Cutebrute]

It most likely is. Seeing many of Nintendo's titles on Switch are, at least Zelda and Splatoon are. Not sure about ARMS.

Granted I haven't followed Mario lately as I'm on a self imposed media blackout.

That's really good, since any slightly updated Switch revision will have the extra power to ensure these games hit their resolution much more consistently. And that kind of "future-proofing" is the only reason I'm a bit bummed about the 720p resolution cap on DOOM in docked mode. But I'm still thrilled to double dip on this port. What I've seen has exceeded my expectations.

 

[chronic_archaic]

Anyone doubting drops to sub HD - look at a lot of Vita games. It wasn't uncommon for AAA ports early on to be non native resolution.

 

[Rayis]

Has anyone noticed how Zelda runs worse when docked (on a 1080p TV) than in heandheld? That's because the GPU is running at the same exact speed either way.


I think you haven't read anything since that article about the dev kits. While the switch is still CAPABLE of throttling down undocked and some games do, it's software controlled now and varies from title to title, rather than being automatic like in the dev kits. This is why when Nintendo unveiled the Switch they gave this huge range for battery life and said it "depends on the game."

The Switch has two GPU clock speeds available while undocked 307.2MHz is the default plus a higher 384MHz "boost mode" for more demanding games.

When docked it runs at its full speed of 768MHz

The system is not designed to run at its full speed while undocked cuz it'd have a battery life of like 20 mins.

That is how the Switch works.

 

[shiyrley]

The Switch has two GPU clock speeds available while undocked 307.2MHz is the default plus a higher 384MHz "boost mode" for more demanding games.

When docked it runs at its full speed of 768MHz

The system is not designed to run at its full speed while undocked cuz it'd have a battery life of like 20 mins.

That is how the Switch works.

Thanks, I was just about to write this.

Not sure why that user keeps spreading lies. There are 2 handheld GPU clocks and 1 docked clocks. Handheld clocks can be used on the dock but not vice-versa. Also Zelda runs at 900p when docked and 720p undocked because of changing clock speeds.

HyGogg, please stop spreading lies and try to do at least the slightest research on the topic before stating dumb shit as fact. We have enough missinformed people as it is.

 

[Delusibeta]

Panic Button is doing the same with Rocket League. Makes sense.

I wonder if after release they put out a patch that changes the resolution like Minecraft? Doubt it but you know.

I'd like for it to be an option. Personally, I'm not too fussed, since I've already got the PS4 version and most of my interest would be for the "it's on a handheld" aspect, but I can understand why people who haven't played this would be disappointed by the cutbacks. There's also the aspect of this illustrating how (not at all) easy it is to port a game that's targeted the PS4 & Xbone to the Switch.

 

[Naked Snake]

The Switch has two GPU clock speeds available while undocked 307.2MHz is the default plus a higher 384MHz "boost mode" for more demanding games.

When docked it runs at its full speed of 768MHz

The system is not designed to run at its full speed while undocked cuz it'd have a battery life of like 20 mins.

That is how the Switch works.

Was waiting for someone to correct that overconfident junior.

 

[dfi]

So what this essentially means is that in docked mode doom should be able to sustain 720p and 30fps much more consistently than undocked mode where it will down res and go under 30 fps more often due to the difference in gpu clock speeds between docked and undocked modes.

 

[Seik]

Isn't it supposed to be dynamic resolution?

I assume handheld must drop below 720p way more often than docked.

Somewhere I kinda was hoping for 900p, though, but I'll be playing this portable more than docked anyways.

 

[Cerium]

So what this essentially means is that in docked mode doom should be able to sustain 720p and 30fps much more consistently than undocked mode where it will down res and go under 30 fps more often due to the difference in gpu clock speeds between docked and undocked modes.

It'll likely drop resolution rather than framerate. The framerate bottleneck is the CPU.

 

[pokeystaples]

I've never docked my Switch, but this is unfortunate for those who do.

 

[Si2k78]

Ughhhh. Whatever. After 20 minutes of gameplay, you'd probably forget about resolution anyways.

 

[SirMossyBloke]

This reminds me back when they tried to get original Doom working on the consoles of the time. Some resorted to shrinking down the borders of the game to a tiny window so it'd run fast enough.

Kinda the current tech version of that really. How fitting.

 

[Weils]

I'm not buying DOOM on the Switch to play it on the TV, I have the PS4 version for that. I'm buying the Switch version to play DOOM on the go. 720p isn't a deal breaker.

Yeah, I already have the PC version but I'm still interested in getting the Switch version as it will be nice to bring portable DOOM with me anywhere in the house or outside.

 

[Doctre81]

This reminds me back when they tried to get original Doom working on the consoles of the time. Some resorted to shrinking down the borders of the game to a tiny window so it'd run fast enough.

Kinda the current tech version of that really. How fitting.

TBH they technically did the same thing for RE4. Those black cars weren't there too look more cinematic.

 

[EDarkness]

They claim this information comes directly from Bethesda.



This explains why they insist on showing it in handheld mode.

Note that the Switch version of Rocket League, also handled by Panic Button, also renders at 720p both handheld and docked.

Off-screen footage we've seen looks rather sharp.

Honestly, I hate this kind of stuff. I guess Panic Button doesn't like to deal with switching in their games. I say get someone else to do if they don't want to. Why would someone who's playing docked want the game to be the same as handheld mode? It sucks.

 

[Revolutionary]

Yeesh. I've been playing Doom all day and the imps are hard enough to see as it is at 1080. Nimble bastards...

 

[xxbrothawizxx63]

Honestly, I hate this kind of stuff. I guess Panic Button doesn't like to deal with switching in their games. I say get someone else to do if they don't want to. Why would someone who's playing docked want the game to be the same as handheld mode? It sucks.

Maybe we should wait until we get closer to the release of both games and get a better idea of what docked looks like in comparison before damning them.

In Doom's case, if the game is really dropping as low as DF suggested in handheld mode then holding steady at 720p more often in docked mode makes complete sense.

We don't really know how Rocket League compares in handheld vs docked modes just yet. The cell phone shots we saw seemed to suggest no shadows at all in handheld mode (the only way I think it has been demoed so far), but the Direct footage definitely looked a lot more reminiscent of RL on other consoles in terms of shadowing and lighting. There's a chance these visual upgrades are only available in docked mode and account for the lack of an increase in resolution.

 

[bobbychalkers]

I'm not buying DOOM on the Switch to play it on the TV, I have the PS4 version for that. I'm buying the Switch version to play DOOM on the go. 720p isn't a deal breaker.

Same for me.

 

[Cerium]

I would remind everyone that the Switch screen itself is 720p. The fact that this is running at native resolution on handheld is an incredible achievement, 30fps or no.

GAFer Auron_Kale played it and confirms it looks crisp in person.

A bit late but my impressions on playing DOOM was beyond my expectations to be honest.

Upon the setup, we were given the pro controllers to play with as the joycons themselves were charging with the system. That said, rather than play through the story mode, I actually opted to play Arcade mode. Chose Beginner as I'd not played this version of DOOM before and jumped right in.

Using the Pro Controller was pretty much second nature, I never had to glance at the cheat sheet for the controls while melee was extremely satisfying due to the HD rumble funny enough. Despite the game running at 720p undocked, everything was pretty crisp and vibrant on the screen and the only time I noticed any FPS dips was when there was a lot of stuff onscreen - but even then, it was really minor and I knew the build wasn't fully optimized. I was able to pull of headshots with my pistol despite the enemies being 3 floors below me in the canyon and got to play around with all the other weapons offered in Arcade mode.

Only got to play for like 20-25 minutes (as we were pulled to wait for our turn to play Evil Within 2) but after playing the demo, I was pretty much sold on buying the game whenever it came out.

 

[family_guy]

I would remind everyone that the Switch screen itself is 720p. The fact that this is running at native resolution on handheld is an incredible achievement, 30fps or no.

GAFer Auron_Kale played it and confirms it looks crisp in person.

It doesn't even do 720p all the time.

 

[JershJopstin]

It'll likely drop resolution rather than framerate. The framerate bottleneck is the CPU.

How do we know this?

 

[FearlessBelgian]

30 fps handled
60 fps docked .

 

[Cerium]

It doesn't even do 720p all the time.

I have a serious question.

You walk into every Switch thread and without fail you shit on the graphics, including for Mario fucking Odyssey. Sometimes you stick around to drag it out, but most of the time you simply drive by.

Why? It seems exhausting and you clearly have no interest in the platform.

 

[PowerThroughLov]

I wonder what the main bottleneck for the engine is. Would have to be either memory bandwidth or CPU to make this make sense.

 

[JershJopstin]

I wonder what the main bottleneck for the engine is. Would have to be either memory bandwidth or CPU to make this make sense.

People are claiming CPU but I haven't seen a source yet.

 

[EDarkness]

Maybe we should wait until we get closer to the release of both games and get a better idea of what docked looks like in comparison before damning them.

In Doom's case, if the game is really dropping as low as DF suggested in handheld mode then holding steady at 720p more often in docked mode makes complete sense.

We don't really know how Rocket League compares in handheld vs docked modes just yet. The cell phone shots we saw seemed to suggest no shadows at all in handheld mode (the only way I think it has been demoed so far), but the Direct footage definitely looked a lot more reminiscent of RL on other consoles in terms of shadowing and lighting. There's a chance these visual upgrades are only available in docked mode and account for the lack of an increase in resolution.

I think it's just funny that both of the games they're working on have the same issue....

 

[SinCityAssassin]

I think it's just funny that both of the games they're working on have the same issue....

Just send both of them to Shin'en and we'll get 60 fps 900p high quality textures in 4 hours.

 

[EDarkness]

Just send both of them to Shin'en and we'll get 60 fps 900p high quality textures in 4 hours.

I know they don't really do ports and such, but it would be cool to see them tackle something like this.

 

[foxuzamaki]

shinen'll probably compress the game down to 4gb cartridges and still somehow keep audio and visals at the same level

 

[spannicus]

Can play this at over 100fps but i choose to play it on Switch. Fuck fps!

 

[MrCunningham]

It doesn't even do 720p all the time.

Nah, it probably is running at a dynamic resolution and I have a feeling that the game does not run at a constant 720p resolution.

shinen'll probably compress the game down to 4gb cartridges and still somehow keep audio and visals at the same level

Shin'en uses procedural generated algorithms to create things like textures, shadows and environmental objects to reduce file sizes. Their version of Doom 2016 would be pretty interesting, but they would more than likely have to rebuild the game to take advantage of those features.

 

[Cnoodles]

Sucks for people that only own a Switch, but doesn't make a difference for double dippers who only care about the handheld aspect.

I would like to know why this sucks for people with only a switch? Are you telling me that the graphics and sharp image is what makes this game good? If a game sucks because of a graphical downgrade then it probably isn't a good game to begin with.

 

[foxuzamaki]

Get a new TV mang, it's 2017.

Spoiler

I don't even have a TV

haha it is a new TV , but I couldnt get one bigger, my room is much too small

 

[Fularu]

I'm not double dipping for portability

I'm double dipping for pointer controls!

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

I'm not double dipping for portability

I'm double dipping for pointer controls!

 

[The Thnikkaman]

People are claiming CPU but I haven't seen a source yet.

Nothing confirmed but the speculation is that because the post process effects (GPU dependent) are all there.

The fact that they're sticking to 720p30 with post process DoF/AA/Motion Blur could be telling as to where resources are tight. DOOM has lots of enemies on screen with AI going after the player. The CPU is capped out, so turn the GPU effects up as there's headroom there and they can do so without loading the CPU down.

This is of course all speculation AFAIK though based on what we know about how the game looks and the impressions DF and others have had.

 

[Herb Alpert]

I'm totally fine with that. 720p is good enough for me and the framerate seems to be stable overall.

That seems to be a incredibly ambitious game for a portable device and saying otherwise is dishonest at best.

People who played it were all impressed, so fuck the numbers if the gameplay is good.

 

[EDarkness]

I'm not double dipping for portability

I'm double dipping for pointer controls!

Well, you probably aren't gonna buy this if you're looking for that....

 

[Schnozberry]

Hopefully some of the GPU effects get a bump in quality when docked. They looked fairly pared back in portable mode in some of the footage. It'd be a lot easier to spot on a TV than the handheld screen.

 

[Same ol G]

I don't believe this how do they get this information so far ahead of a releases date and nobody else got this bit of important information.
The embargo for the preview just went up nobody knows this but they get this information just like that?
Well see closer to launch i could be wrong but for now i don't believe it.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Maybe docked will be 60 fps

Spoiler

 

[Boy Wander]

I have a serious question.

You walk into every Switch thread and without fail you shit on the graphics, including for Mario fucking Odyssey. Sometimes you stick around to drag it out, but most of the time you simply drive by.

Why? It seems exhausting and you clearly have no interest in the platform.

Just ignore this user. Much easier than responding to someone who either is a troll or simply has a weird agenda.

 

[Bucket-o-roadkill]

All this just makes me wonder what shape wolfenstein 2 is going to arrive in. It's turning more and more into just some weird tech experiment/achievement then anything else at this rate.

 

[xochipiltontli]

...Were you expecting 1080p?

I was personally expecting 900p at most with drops to 720p during intense scenes when docked, which is fine as that's what Zelda did. Kind of disappointed to hear that they're targeting the same res in both modes, it either means undocked will probably reach very low resolutions dynamically or it means that they're not taking advantage of the extra GPU power at all when docked.

Makes sense. The Switch isn't a huge powerhouse the moment it gets docked.

Its GPU scales by a factor of 2x to 2.5x when docked. In theory that's supposed to get a 720p game to 1080p (best case, seen notably in Mario Kart, ARMS, and Minecraft), though many high profile Switch games seem to wind up being a ~610p to a ~900p conversion most of the time. The fact that they're targeting the same resolution in both docked and undocked mode suggests that either undocked will run at ~520p most of the time in reality (and 720p max) or that they're not making use of the docked speeds at all. A third possibility is that they're making the docked version prettier somehow by adding more detail and effects, or increasing draw distance/texture filtering/pop in, though I doubt that'll be the case.

 

[EDarkness]

I was personally expecting 900p at most with drops to 720p during intense scenes, which is fine as that's what Zelda did. Kind of disappointed to hear that they're targeting the same res in both modes, it either means undocked will probably reach very low resolutions dynamically or it means that they're not taking advantage of the extra GPU power at all when docked.

Based on what's going on with Rocket League, I wouldn't be surprised at all if they aren't doing anything special when docked and building the game for one spec and that's handheld. I hope that isn't the case, and I hope that if it is, it doesn't become a trend. I only play docked and I want the best looking/playing version of the game when docked.

Another thought is I wonder if they're charging more to build for two specs, so companies are opting to go with portable mode instead of docked.

 

[peanutbutterlatte]

Flawless.

 

[xochipiltontli]

Based on what's going on with Rocket League, I wouldn't be surprised at all if they aren't doing anything special when docked and building the game for one spec and that's handheld. I hope that isn't the case, and I hope that if it is, it doesn't become a trend. I only play docked and I want the best looking/playing version of the game when docked.

Another thought is I wonder if they're charging more to build for two specs, so companies are opting to go with portable mode instead of docked.

I really hope that it isn't a trend either, I was a bit annoyed when Rocket League was announced to be running at only 720p in either mode. One of the few games that I remember running at the same res in both modes was Minecraft at release, and even then it still had a better draw distance than when undocked and it was updated for 1080p shortly after.

 

[JershJopstin]

Nothing confirmed but the speculation is that because the post process effects (GPU dependent) are all there.

The fact that they're sticking to 720p30 with post process DoF/AA/Motion Blur could be telling as to where resources are tight. DOOM has lots of enemies on screen with AI going after the player. The CPU is capped out, so turn the GPU effects up as there's headroom there and they can do so without loading the CPU down.

This is of course all speculation AFAIK though based on what we know about how the game looks and the impressions DF and others have had.

I mean, that makes sense, yes... but the cynic in me is wondering if it's just poor decision making on Panic Button's part. Especially since I thought the gap between the PS4 and Switch CPU's was much smaller than their GPUs.

Though, on second thought: doesn't DOOM scale well with lots of cores? I could see that being the reason the Jaguar has few issues hitting 60 while the Tegra can't.

 

[Ninja Dom]

Panic Button is doing the same with Rocket League. Makes sense.

I wonder if after release they put out a patch that changes the resolution like Minecraft? Doubt it but you know.

Yup Minecraft was 720p both docked & undocked, single player. It later got patched to 1080p docked.