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Ryse crunching team served 11,500 dinners by ship date #rysefacts
- Thread starter Wario64
- Start date
endlessflood
Member
Managing tone is a big part of written communications. The tone of the tweet was that it was being posted as an interesting factoid, and that seemingly flippant tone about something which should be taken a bit more seriously by employers is what caused the unrest. Crunching might be the status quo in game development but responsible employers are trying to limit it or manage it. Instead the tweet suggested that they might have been glorifying it.
dragonelite
Member
I can vaguely remember a thread last year about an naugthy dog designer leaving game biz to become a teacher. And something about 100 hour work week crunch.
Played Ryse earlier tonight and I have the following to mention about it.
Graphics ain't too bad but is kinda blurry. Especially on the detail at a distance.
Framerate drops to mid 20s in heavy action
Input latancy. Genuinely affects gameplay
Button mashing ahoy.
Gets old very quickly.
This is my honest opinion on it. It really isn't all that much fun a few a few rounds. No idea what SP is like though.
Graphics ain't too bad but is kinda blurry. Especially on the detail at a distance.
Framerate drops to mid 20s in heavy action
Input latancy. Genuinely affects gameplay
Button mashing ahoy.
Gets old very quickly.
This is my honest opinion on it. It really isn't all that much fun a few a few rounds. No idea what SP is like though.
SenjutsuSage
Banned
Bull fucking shit. That's the truth of the matter.
Shitty practises are shitty practises regardless of where you go, complacency about how theres 'nothing wrong with it' and its 'normal for industry' will only make it more widespread and not fix the problem.
bragging about how much over time your workers have to put in to get the product out the door is not something that should happen.
Imperfected
Member
I won't boycott Ryse, because that would be a hollow gesture; after playing it at PAX I have absolutely no intention of buying it to begin with. I will, however, gladly boycott Crytek until they show meaningful improvement in their employee management.
I freely admit it's still a pretty middling sacrifice as far as protest actions go.
soxinthebox
Member
I disagree. Any gaming company that tweeted that would've been given the same treatment.
Oh come on now.
Accusations of GAF console bias generally lead to good things.
There is no level of that tweet that you could expose as being flippant. Whatever your motivation is, if that offends you, and that is a relevant remark in your world, then you are the one wasting dinners. You are wasting oxygen as well. I wonder if we have enough trees to make up for that level of dumb.
HovaHovito
Banned
I dont get it
Quadraphonic
Member
You're not a part of the industry, then.
HovaHovito
Banned
What does the tweet mean? I dont really get it
Is crunch like a reference to the shitty candy bar?
Is crunch like a reference to the shitty candy bar?
It means the Ryse team had to eat 11,500 dinners at work instead of at home with their families.
Quadraphonic
Member
Late, mandatory, unpaid overtime, but they buy you pizza, and the twitter account is boasting about how proud they are of how many nights they missed seeing their daughter grow up.
The argument isn't whether overtime is mandatory, or expected, rather how this account, being run by a PAID EMPLOYEE of the same company, is reminding their employees how much of their life they're missing out to hit a ship date in a way that pretends it's a good thing.
KillerTravis
Banned
My mom would've cooked me 5,456,323,520.23 meals by the time I graduate college and leave the house. #crunchy #mompower
I am sorry to put it to you this way.... But you were abused... 40 hours a week, that is what the best of McDonalds employees put in. Schindler's List, that Jew sucking fucker expected 16 hour work days at times. I remember working on the Michael Bay film Pearl Harbor, and if it was not for my union rep, I would have stayed two more hours and taught Affelack how to act.
HovaHovito
Banned
Seems like people are overreacting imo
Its part of their job to get a game done isnt it? I always thought developers were paid to do their specific job and they werent done until they finished. Not like theyre getting paid hourly
HovaHovito
Banned
Out
endlessflood
Member
Wow. Maybe you should consider joining the Crytek social media team, I think you have the necessary communication skills
AlphaTwo00
Member
The issue is what's reasonable, and whether crunch is systematically designed. If a project takes 2.5 years to make, but management budgeted for 2 and had planned it into the schedule so that everyone needs to crunch in the last 6 months, is it wrong?
Why not go further? Just don't schedule home/sleep/vacation time! Mandatory 12 hour work days right from day 1! Things will get done so much faster too!
Phat Michael
Banned
What the hell are you talking about? If you stayed back a few more hours maybe you could have learned how to spell?
MrGame&Watch
Member
This is why I love the mobile game company I work at: catered lunch and dinner everyday and max 2 week crunch time.
CrunchinJelly
formerly cjelly
Do they charge you 69p to go to the toilet?
Nightengale
Member
I have nothing against that tweet or even the overall content of his tweet, but I will say that I hate the use of the term 'crunching team.'
Perhaps in your own little "console warz" world... look at the foxconn thread - lot's of people state that they think worker exploitation is a shitty practice.
BasketCasket
Member
My thoughts exactly.
If your project estimates are so far off, that you require weeks/months of crunch; that is the telltale sign of a bad production team.
As someone who went through a 5 month period of 80 hour work weeks; you can be damn well sure it was not something I'd be glad to see trumpeted as a proud moment. I've since been at a new studio that doesn't crunch; which releases better quality products. This should not be "the norm" and it doesn't have to be tolerated.
That's a completely stupid tweet.
Come on, kid. Didn't people call out Rockstar over the claims that Red Dead Redemption was under a lot of crunch time? Any company that puts people under intense crunches is frequently lambasted when it comes out. To assume it is a Microsoft only thing makes the industry-wide issue at hand seem minor, when it's not. It's one of the worst things about making video games, and is an issue wherever else it arises.
BasketCasket
Member
I'm glad you placed quotes around the word "voluntary"; but I doubt someone on the outside looking in would still understand the pressure involved.
When there is a company culture that presses their employees to work unpaid overtime; which the majority of employees commit to fulfilling. If you're the guy who doesn't budge and keeps leaving on time; you will quickly be labeled as the guy who isn't pulling his weight. This is despite the fact that you worked the hours established in the contract you signed and regardless of the job you put into your paid hours.
This is also highly illegal. Where I'm from; anything above 44 hours worked in the week should be paid (even in a contract). I was making below the minimum wage on average; during my previous crunch periods at my last studio. I was away from the office only to sleep (sometimes sleeping at the office). There were days I didn't sleep; working for 40 hour stretches. There was no outside world; friends; or family who were not a co-worker that I could spend time alongside. Heck, I worked through Christmas. Broke up with my girlfriend over it... that is the "price" of it.
I've witnessed 4-5 individuals get fired; as they had kids and could not pull the extra hours. Fired due to their "production"; despite how they were top end programmers (one was a freaking lead).
I'm not buying Ryse; I hope they don't make a single extra dime off the backs of their employees.
Tidus_Great
Banned
is it just me or will posting anything literally offend/ piss off at least one other person? Hopefully the extra work payed off.
That may be the saddest part of this. Watch Ryse get slaughtered in the reviews anyway.
Depends on where you're talking about. In places like the UK there are employment contracts. In California, an hourly employee gets OT after 8, double after 12, double when working 7 straight days in the same pay cycle, and 30 minute meals are mandatory. Also the employee cannot sit at their desk while they eat, otherwise it's considered work.
In places like Texas (id, Retro, Gearbox, etc) it's just national FLSA rules and nothing else.
As an exempt employee in an at-will state (most states), they can make you put in as many hours as they want, and are not required by law to give you a meal period unless state laws have been written regarding exempt overtime and/or meals.
BladeoftheImmortal
Member
You just got unbanned bro, you should probably chill with the generalizing.
nokterian said:
Could be worse.
They could be overseen by Sony and sacked like the entire Studio Liverpool staff (Psygnosis) who made Wipeout for them.
actualproblems.gif
Pretty sure MS has done that to a few studios for that reason. At least one.
velociraptor
Junior Member
This is pretty sad, and a poor reflection of the industry itself.
Mahadev
Member
Well that sucks. Why don't they hire more people instead?
And you wonder why some people refuse to take you seriously. Posts like this just make your biases blindingly apparent.
Dinners are cheaper.
Did we ever get confirmation how many people were fired? The studio was closed, most people weren't fired. Sony Computer Entertainment still has amongst others FQA, GFPQA, XDev, CSG-Video, Localisation services and WWSE Finance at that location. They moved Studio Liverpool people to those studio's.
