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[hey_it's_that_dog]

Intuition is a very broad term, but what I think you're getting at is internalizing execution into your muscle memory so that you don't have to think about doing something, but rather simply do it on reaction when necessary. That is an entry level skill when it comes to fighting games, and doesn't even begin to touch the actual "game."

That's a fair point, but I meant intuition more broadly. Of course internalizing the game's moves is step one to mastery, but through practice more complex cognitive activities can also become automatic and intuitive. Things like recognizing specific situations instantly and being able to react appropriately get easier as they become more automatic. So you have to learn the knowledge, but until it's heavily practiced, you still have to think about it, putting you at a disadvantage against players with the same knowledge but more practice.

I'm semi talking out of my ass because I know nothing about high level fighting game stuff, but I know a lot about psychology so I'm trying to apply that as best I can.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

It's basically the concept of drunken master.

 

[FuuRe]

A wins a win, if you lose your nerve and lose because of it, you deserve to lose. Happens in any sport

 

[Lost Fragment]

Reminds me of a saying about fencing and chess. The worst opponent a master can go against is an absolute newbie because he has not idea what the new guy is going to do.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUYylZ59BBQ&feature=youtu.be&t=1m19s

 

[Aesthet1c]

Man, those commentators and FSP were really kind of assholes.

I get that Ghandi was inexperienced, but they were slagging him and making fun of him left and right. Then FSP just unplugging his stick and walking away was a dick move.

 

[Duxxy3]

A true top player knows how to deal with randomness.

 

[OceanBlue]

OP please look for jyobin in Youtube

There's a "The best of jyobin" video by YogaFlame24 too, also on Youtube

I cannot provide the links since i'm at work now and YT is blocked

Granted jyobin sure knows his stuff but his random shenanigans make him a real pain in the ass to play against

Reading about people talk about how to deal with "incorrect plays" and unpredictable playing reminds me of when Justin played against Jyobin.

 

[Fersis]

The Ryu player wasnt random at all!
He had a pattern like:
Jump back, Fire ball, Jump forward,SRK,SRK on wake up, Jump back fireball

Anyway, kudos to our FSP buddy. Mad respect for showing up at tournaments.

 

[Sickbean]

This is so wrong it hurts. All this video proves is that the best competitive players are the ones who keep their composure and learn to adapt to their opponents. FSP sadly could not do this and paid the price. As for not having skill to play SSF4 competitively, lets are Gandhi try that against Infiltration or even Mike Ross #kappa

The point of my post is that it's either one or the other. Point 1 obviously isn't true so it must be point 2.

 

[Willy Wanka]

He stole my best moves at 3:31.

 

[BronsonLee]

Man, those commentators and FSP were really kind of assholes.

I get that Ghandi was inexperienced, but they were slagging him and making fun of him left and right. Then FSP just unplugging his stick and walking away was a dick move.

Getting frauded will do that to a man

 

[BearPawB]

Fighting game commentators are the worst part about watching fighting game tournaments. Too many oohs and ahhs, and not enough actual commentary

 

[Degen]

Huh

Looks like how I play every fighting game

that's odd

 

[sixteen-bit]

Also, don't sleep on Timedog
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5JK_g1Gpbw

If it works every time it's not scrubby.

 

[Huw_Dawson]

I should put up a note here too - I'm the FSP guy in the video. And yes, I screwed up royally.

Some part of that is the fact that I slept on a hard hall floor for the two nights prior and got about three and a half hour sleep, max, before walking to the tournament. The rest is down to getting totally mindfucked and forgetting my fundamentals.

I am entirely aware that, yes, I can just go d.mp vs an anti-air, for example. But vs a random opponent, live on stream, with little sleep? That's a lot harder to do than it is when you're nice and comfy on some sofa playing some online matches.

So yeah, I'm going to spend the next few months rinsing the game so I can secure a more solid foundation for the next major I head to. Just because I choked hard at this event doesn't mean I'm going to stop trying.

 

[Wynnebeck]

If you can't deal with pressure to the point that you lose some of your most basic functionality, then you're probably not very good.

In most cases, but I wouldn't say that about everyone.

 

[Yoshichan]

I should put up a note here too - I'm the FSP guy in the video. And yes, I screwed up royally.

Some part of that is the fact that I slept on a hard hall floor for the two nights prior and got about three and a half hour sleep, max, before walking to the tournament. The rest is down to getting totally mindfucked and forgetting my fundamentals.

I am entirely aware that, yes, I can just go d.mp vs an anti-air, for example. But vs a random opponent, live on stream, with little sleep? That's a lot harder to do than it is when you're nice and comfy on some sofa playing some online matches.

GG

 

[Deleted member 47027]

I should put up a note here too - I'm the FSP guy in the video. And yes, I screwed up royally.

Some part of that is the fact that I slept on a hard hall floor for the two nights prior and got about three and a half hour sleep, max, before walking to the tournament. The rest is down to getting totally mindfucked and forgetting my fundamentals.

I am entirely aware that, yes, I can just go d.mp vs an anti-air, for example. But vs a random opponent, live on stream, with little sleep? That's a lot harder to do than it is when you're nice and comfy on some sofa playing some online matches.

So yeah, I'm going to spend the next few months rinsing the game so I can secure a more solid foundation for the next major I head to. Just because I choked hard at this event doesn't mean I'm going to stop trying.

Right on brah, go get that glory

 

[onken]

Ah got a great laugh out this. Watching that guy stress and flip out was hilarious.

 

[FindMyFarms]

That's a fair point, but I meant intuition more broadly. Of course internalizing the game's moves is step one to mastery, but through practice more complex cognitive activities can also become automatic and intuitive. Things like recognizing specific situations instantly and being able to react appropriately get easier as they become more automatic. So you have to learn the knowledge, but until it's heavily practiced, you still have to think about it, putting you at a disadvantage against players with the same knowledge but more practice.

I'm semi talking out of my ass because I know nothing about high level fighting game stuff, but I know a lot about psychology so I'm trying to apply that as best I can.

Nah you're not talking out your ass lol, I know what you're getting at. Situational awareness in fighting games is just like anything else, and not native to the genre. You run a pick and roll a million times in basketball (ala stockton/malone) and you know all the in's and outs to that play, the variances that could happen, and how to deal with it accordingly in your sleep without breaking a sweat.

Street fighter is the same way. When you're comfortable with playing footsies at a certain range, you know the jump in angles the other character can approach with, their options on the ground, and how to deal with it appropriately without having to mentally cycle through each one while saying ok if they do this...then i do....oh yeah..this!

But I don't see how that's helping out this players case lol, he's not good at anything we've brought up.

 

[Wynnebeck]

I should put up a note here too - I'm the FSP guy in the video. And yes, I screwed up royally.

Some part of that is the fact that I slept on a hard hall floor for the two nights prior and got about three and a half hour sleep, max, before walking to the tournament. The rest is down to getting totally mindfucked and forgetting my fundamentals.

I am entirely aware that, yes, I can just go d.mp vs an anti-air, for example. But vs a random opponent, live on stream, with little sleep? That's a lot harder to do than it is when you're nice and comfy on some sofa playing some online matches.

So yeah, I'm going to spend the next few months rinsing the game so I can secure a more solid foundation for the next major I head to. Just because I choked hard at this event doesn't mean I'm going to stop trying.

I know the feeling. I remember back at Civil War 3, I faced Zerp on stream in KoF. I'm a noob in every sense of the word, but I can hold my own somewhat. Went on stream in front of people and got mindfucked. It happens.

 

[Alucrid]

I should put up a note here too - I'm the FSP guy in the video. And yes, I screwed up royally.

Some part of that is the fact that I slept on a hard hall floor for the two nights prior and got about three and a half hour sleep, max, before walking to the tournament. The rest is down to getting totally mindfucked and forgetting my fundamentals.

I am entirely aware that, yes, I can just go d.mp vs an anti-air, for example. But vs a random opponent, live on stream, with little sleep? That's a lot harder to do than it is when you're nice and comfy on some sofa playing some online matches.

So yeah, I'm going to spend the next few months rinsing the game so I can secure a more solid foundation for the next major I head to. Just because I choked hard at this event doesn't mean I'm going to stop trying.

I'm sure the Nintendo apparel didn't help

 

[Tarsul]

i once saw a german starcraft 2 tournament where the player who won it just started playing a few weeks ago and didnt really want to go to the next tournament or continue playing since he got bored with the game and wanted to go into vacations and stuff... he did some funny things in his game like playing with his troops because he didnt care to micromanage all the stuff or so

I dont know much (or anything) about sc2 but he was clearly an underdog

Sorry, I dont know where to find a source... was some german tournament (with some of ex-giga moderators)....

 

[BearPawB]

I should put up a note here too - I'm the FSP guy in the video. And yes, I screwed up royally.

Some part of that is the fact that I slept on a hard hall floor for the two nights prior and got about three and a half hour sleep, max, before walking to the tournament. The rest is down to getting totally mindfucked and forgetting my fundamentals.

I am entirely aware that, yes, I can just go d.mp vs an anti-air, for example. But vs a random opponent, live on stream, with little sleep? That's a lot harder to do than it is when you're nice and comfy on some sofa playing some online matches.

So yeah, I'm going to spend the next few months rinsing the game so I can secure a more solid foundation for the next major I head to. Just because I choked hard at this event doesn't mean I'm going to stop trying.

I wish I was confident enough to even try. So good on you man. Keep at it.

 

[kazebyaka]

what am i looking at? Looks like a decent fight to me

 

[FindMyFarms]

I should put up a note here too - I'm the FSP guy in the video. And yes, I screwed up royally.

Some part of that is the fact that I slept on a hard hall floor for the two nights prior and got about three and a half hour sleep, max, before walking to the tournament. The rest is down to getting totally mindfucked and forgetting my fundamentals.

I am entirely aware that, yes, I can just go d.mp vs an anti-air, for example. But vs a random opponent, live on stream, with little sleep? That's a lot harder to do than it is when you're nice and comfy on some sofa playing some online matches.

So yeah, I'm going to spend the next few months rinsing the game so I can secure a more solid foundation for the next major I head to. Just because I choked hard at this event doesn't mean I'm going to stop trying.

Just keep on man. It's a tough road. Get those tourney jitters outta the way, get your sleep in,and show us what you're really about! I may come off like hardass, but that's just because you're getting a lot of people being apologists for you. Honesty is the best policy. Just put in the time, and you'll get your return.

 

[Sixfortyfive]

Knowing when to apply low-level tactics is, in itself, a high-level skill.

Better luck next time, FSP.

Meaning the person experienced in the game and is well known.

"Professionals" get paid for what they do.

 

[CrazyJuan77]

I disagree with this notion there is a wrong way to play this game. There may be an unorthodox way, but winning with it is still winning. So what if its not frame perfect if it gets the job done. Nice ragequit though.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

The reason that the better player (FSP) loses in this matchup is because he's simply not used to playing against someone so... random, for lack of a better term.

FSP played like shit as well, missing basic combos, not anti-airing, using poor punishes, not recognizing the simple jump in pattern, etc. You're not automatically guaranteed to win on stream just because you win a lot online. Welcome to the FGC.

 

[skybald]

So what happened to the scrub in the next match up?

 

[FindMyFarms]

Knowing when to apply low-level tactics is, in itself, a high-level skill.

I'd say at "high-level" there are no high or low level tactics, just options.

So what happened to the scrub in the next match up?

He probably got destroyed

 

[Schadenfreude]

Ninty Sweater didn't even shake his hand. Where's the sportsmanship? Did Gandhi lose to Shades McGee afterwards?

 

[Sesha]

The problem was rightly that FSP tried to play "properly" against Gandhi who didn't know the game, which psyched him out. Watch the followup with Ukrainian player Feimitsu Danwa's Dan, who has no problem dealing with Gandhi's shenanigans.

Huu_Dawson, good that you're not letting it get to down.

what am i looking at? Looks like a decent fight to me

Guy who doesn't know how to play the game (Ryu) wins against someone (Rufus) unprepared to match up against someone who doesn't know how to play.

 

[Haunted]

nvm

 

[LakeEarth]

It happens. Sometimes you run into guys with awful fundamentals, but their wildness opens you up and leaves you frustrated.

Anyone who's played SF4 online will know this. You've lost to the Blanka who just slide/balled everywhere and did electricity on every wakeup. You've lost to the Balrog that just did charge moves at a distance, and spammed jab whenever the pressure was on. You've lost to an awful Zangief because they empty jumped into ultra and you whiffed your anti-air. It happens.

 

[Damaniel]

IMO, you're not a 'bad' player if you can manage to beat a 'good' player, regardless of (legal) technique. You might be offended by his play style, and upset that 'random' play is good enough to pull off a win, but all this talk of 'scrub tier' players mostly sounds like saltiness about the fact that thousands of hours of practice and training can be rendered moot by somebody whose skill supposedly isn't up to the lofty standards of top tier players.

 

[RS4-]

That Ryu was gdlk.



SFIV.

 

[BassForever]

The old saying still holds

If you're opponent is doing something weird and un meta how do you beat him? Well just go fucking kill him. Don't over think a situation like this or else you'll lose.

 

[ido]

I can't get the original SFIV theme out of my head after watching that match.

 

[Mzo]

what am i looking at? Looks like a decent fight to me

Not even close. Seriously? It's funny that people can look at that and see a normal match. It was hilarious.

That Ryu was pretty terrible, but the Rufus guy could have handled his shit way, way better. Watching every point-blank Ryu sweep go uncontested, what the hell? Rufus could probably Ultra punish it, it's the slowest sweep of all time. He got scared, that's it. No spacing, no anti-air even though Rufus has amazing AA options, not punishing enough, dropping combos left and right... it sucks.

We've all lost to a scrubby Ryu before, just not in front of the cameras.

 

[MrGlass]

what am i looking at? Looks like a decent fight to me

I was thinking the same thing regards to a decent fight. It was a lot more entertaining to watch than those where you have two people just blocking and waiting for the other to make the move.

I say this as someone who plays SF for fun and doesn't even think about tactics.

 

[Brannon]

Ninty Sweater didn't even shake his hand. Where's the sportsmanship? Did Gandhi lose to Shades McGee afterwards?

Yeah seriously. Talk about pulling off a random ultra (dick) move. So you got caught slippin'; show some class when taking the L broheim.

 

[ScOULaris]

IMO, you're not a 'bad' player if you can manage to beat a 'good' player, regardless of (legal) technique. You might be offended by his play style, and upset that 'random' play is good enough to pull off a win, but all this talk of 'scrub tier' players mostly sounds like saltiness about the fact that thousands of hours of practice and training can be rendered moot by somebody whose skill supposedly isn't up to the lofty standards of top tier players.

I was only using the term "scrub" to indicate that the Ryu player lacks the skill and technical knowledge of the average tournament player. I wasn't trying to demean him or anything. FSP absolutely deserved to lose that match. It has happened to everyone at one point or another, but you rarely see it like this in a tournament setting.

 

[PandaPedinte]

Looks like me playing any Fighting game. :/

 

[Tashi]

I'd say at "high-level" there are no high or low level tactics, just options.



He probably got destroyed

What about wake up Ultras? I'd consider that a low level tactic. I have seen it in high level play though and it seems to always get a "wtf?". Super rare though.

 

[Sesha]

IMO, you're not a 'bad' player if you can manage to beat a 'good' player, regardless of (legal) technique. You might be offended by his play style, and upset that 'random' play is good enough to pull off a win, but all this talk of 'scrub tier' players mostly sounds like saltiness about the fact that thousands of hours of practice and training can be rendered moot by somebody whose skill supposedly isn't up to the lofty standards of top tier players.

Even if the win made Gandhi a good player, he was soon enough booted down to bad player when he lost to Feimitsu Danwa's Dan in the next match.

"Scrubs" are people who don't want to acknowledge how bad they are, and/or steadfastly refuse to improve their game. It's confused with "noob" which is just an unskilled beginner.

 

[Venfayth]

There are some things that can beat smartness and foresight? Awkwardness and stupidity can. The best swordsman in the world doesn't need to fear the second best swordsman in the world; no, the person for him to be afraid of is some ignorant antagonist who has never had a sword in his hand before; he doesn't do the thing he ought to do, and so the expert isn't prepared for him; he does the thing he ought not to do; and often it catches the expert out and ends him on the spot.

Mark Twain understands SF4

 

[OceanBlue]

What about wake up Ultras? I'd consider that a low level tactic. I have seen it in high level play though and it seems to always get a "wtf?". Super rare though.

Haitani hits people with it lol.

 

[crazygambit]

The right way to play is the way you want to play.

You know why i don't conform to the bullshit "rules" of holdem? Because that's no fun. It's too predictable. You have to take risk. I will always stand by my "there is no wrong way to play" when it comes to video games or stuff like poker.

You're very wrong about this. I'm not talking about bluffing or aggressive play, that indeed comes down to style.

But calling when you're chasing an inside draw when the pot just isn't there to pay off the risk will always be a bad move. It's a move that when it hits after you fold you might want to bash your head against a wall, but in the long term folding when the odds relative to the pot are against you will save you money.

 

[Mihos]

I will stick to coop games. I get beat by the tutorial dummies.