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[Latvian Hitman]

Breaking embargos is not prophesy. Nor does it require any particular skill or insight. Ultimately he is taking or being given information and leaking it, illegally and often erroneously.

And he isn't doing it for some noble or worthy reason. He's doing it for attention.

People, including nice people with kids and families and stuff, work super hard on this stuff and wake up in the morning to find some of their effort blown up.

It's not fun, and for what? So you can have a mildly interesting surprise 8 hours early and lacking context? Or get hyped or disappointed disproportionately?

Or get someone fired or someone innocent yelled at?

Ok. But it isn't prophecy, nor ultimately even important. It's annoying.

Totally understand where you're coming from, but this coin has two sides. Leaks helped save MS from itself to a large extent last year. Details about the DRM policy and Kinect 2.0's data collection practices started leaking last spring and got everyone's attention. Then, as we headed into summer, it became clear that the leaks had been largely accurate. The fury over these details had been building for a while, and it all hit critical mass right after E3.

Had that not been the case, MS would have had very little room to maneuver with regard to changing those practices and would likely have had to choose between delaying the hardware launch or seeing the console absolutely tank.

Leakers, as you say it, can definitely be self-serving and off-base. But they also regularly disseminate information that is in the consumer's best interest to know.

 

[kingocfs]

Breaking embargos is not prophesy. Nor does it require any particular skill or insight. Ultimately he is taking or being given information and leaking it, illegally and often erroneously.

And he isn't doing it for some noble or worthy reason. He's doing it for attention.

People, including nice people with kids and families and stuff, work super hard on this stuff and wake up in the morning to find some of their effort blown up.

It's not fun, and for what? So you can have a mildly interesting surprise 8 hours early and lacking context? Or get hyped or disappointed disproportionately?

Or get someone fired or someone innocent yelled at?

Ok. But it isn't prophecy, nor ultimately even important. It's annoying.

Well said.

 

[jaypah]

I agree, its unfortunate that it swings that way as well. Both extreme's tarnish CBOAT's info.

Not really. The info will always be as interesting as it can be. It does create drama but most leaks cause drama of some sort.

 

[tfur]

It's not about what you like, it's about how they want you to see.

There's a reason why there's a curtain. Figuratively and not.



CBOAT or leaks had nothing to do with it, the DRM was well revealed when the backlash happened.

"They want"

Lets me clear here...

If Microsoft employees want to comment about breaking NDA's, they need to bring that to their own employees who are the ones leaking. "They" are the Ones leaking. Unless CBOAT manifests clairvoyance, he is being fed from the inside.

In any case, the call is coming from inside the house. Maybe CBOAT is the house.

It's not our responsibility to filter what information is allowed to be seen. I will not turn my eyes away, and I am glad CBOAT's exist.

 

[Chettlar]

Totes. They never go after people who leak set pics or scripts.

That's not marketing. Of course they do that.

I'm talking about the lying and the misrepresentation and the overt secrecy of the video game industry. The Film industry is secretive as well, but it does it a lot better. What I was saying was the negetives of the video game industry are not necessary, and the film industry being the way it is proves that.

 

[jaypah]

If someone feels Microsoft doesn't derve the respect then go ahead and leak.
It's called Karma.

I'm not sure I follow?

 

[SPDIF]

Totally understand where you're coming from, but this coin has two sides. Leaks helped save MS from itself to a large extent last year. Details about the DRM policy and Kinect 2.0's data collection practices started leaking last spring and got everyone's attention. Then, as we headed into summer, it became clear that the leaks had been largely accurate. The fury over these details had been building for a while, and it all hit critical mass right after E3.

Had that not been the case, MS would have had very little room to maneuver with regard to changing those practices and would likely have had to choose between delaying the hardware launch or seeing the console absolutely tank.

Leakers, as you say it, can definitely be self-serving and off-base. But they also regularly disseminate information that is in the consumer's best interest to know.

But nobody leaked the DRM plans though (unless you're talking about a few random articles from Kotaku etc.. but we had those for Sony too). MS themselves discussed their plans in May, leakers had nothing to do with it. And what Kinect data collection practices are you talking about?

 

[Valhelm]

I think it was a stupid joke about the name Guardians and nothing else.

 

[reson8or]

Not really. The info will always be as interesting as it can be. It does create drama but most leaks cause drama of some sort.

No it tarnishes it. The info IS the info, but the extreme ends try to twist it and discredit CBOAT and the info. Just read some comments in this thread as an example.

 

[DC1]

It has crossed my mind that the blog is a parody and the majority of comments are written by the blogger. If it's not then it's some of the strangest furiousness I've read.

It real man .....Real people, real passion for THIER MS, real conspiracy chasers, real hatred for another console maker.

 

[Uno Venova]

But nobody leaked the DRM plans though (unless you're talking about a few random articles from Kotaku etc.. but we had those for Sony too). MS themselves discussed their plans in May, leakers had nothing to do with it. And what Kinect data collection practices are you talking about?

I don't remember MS saying much in May about the full plans.

 

[udiie]

Not really. The info will always be as interesting as it can be. It does create drama but most leaks cause drama of some sort.

the drama and fanboying and championing are certainly what i tire of
the information can be pretty great

Spoiler

sorry frank

I actually appreciate the info like last year, do you remember the whole Mirrors Edge reveal info he give ? Stuff like that can be great, it doesn't turn the forum into some slanging match

precisely.

 

[Latvian Hitman]

But nobody leaked the DRM plans though (unless you're talking about a few random articles from Kotaku etc.. but we had those for Sony too). MS themselves discussed their plans in May, leakers had nothing to do with it. And what Kinect data collection practices are you talking about?

Were you not on Neogaf at all in the spring of 2013?

 

[artist]

Breaking embargos is not prophesy. Nor does it require any particular skill or insight. Ultimately he is taking or being given information and leaking it, illegally and often erroneously.

And he isn't doing it for some noble or worthy reason. He's doing it for attention.

People, including nice people with kids and families and stuff, work super hard on this stuff and wake up in the morning to find some of their effort blown up.

It's not fun, and for what? So you can have a mildly interesting surprise 8 hours early and lacking context? Or get hyped or disappointed disproportionately?

Or get someone fired or someone innocent yelled at?

Ok. But it isn't prophecy, nor ultimately even important. It's annoying.

You are wrong on so many accounts.

Also I believed CBOAT, even when he was wrong and still believe his rumors. Sorry to annoy you.

 

[digoutyoursoul]

I agree, its unfortunate that it swings that way as well. Both extreme's tarnish CBOAT's info.

I actually appreciate the info like last year, do you remember the whole Mirrors Edge reveal info he give ? Stuff like that can be great, it doesn't turn the forum into some slanging match

 

[Chettlar]

But nobody leaked the DRM plans though (unless you're talking about a few random articles from Kotaku etc.. but we had those for Sony too). MS themselves discussed their plans in May, leakers had nothing to do with it. And what Kinect data collection practices are you talking about?

Uhhhhhhh..... Uhhhhhhhhhhh.

UUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

How about, EVERY leaker did. Bro do you even Q1 and 2 of 2013?

 

[digoutyoursoul]

It real man .....Real people, real passion for THIER MS, real conspiracy chasers, real hatred for another console maker.

I've bookmarked it for when I need a laugh

 

[jaypah]

No it tarnishes it. The info IS the info, but the extreme ends try to twist it and discredit CBOAT and the info. Just read some comments in this thread as an example.

Ah, I see what you mean. And yes, folks do try to discredit him. Just like people tried to ignore when he was wrong about TF. Both for obvious reasons. It wasn't hard to see who wanted what to be true/false.

A lot of people also seem to be confused. I thought it was someone else who said the XO OS was so buggy that it would be damned near unplayable at launch? Most of his pre-reveal stuff about MS was correct.

 

[StoopKid]

It's interesting to see how fast people here will champion him and other insiders when they leak something to their liking though... heh.

.

 

[Marvel]

I really couldn't care less about the plans of these million dollar corporations and their plans to fleece me of more money. Any information is welcome. Bring on the leaks.

You understand, I approve.

 

[CambriaRising]

Uhhhhhhh..... Uhhhhhhhhhhh.

UUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

How about, EVERY leaker did. Bro do you even Q1 and 2 of 2013?

Pretty much. No one believed they would actually do it though.

 

[Xanonano]

But nobody leaked the DRM plans though (unless you're talking about a few random articles from Kotaku etc.. but we had those for Sony too). MS themselves discussed their plans in May, leakers had nothing to do with it. And what Kinect data collection practices are you talking about?

This is possibly the biggest revisionist history I've ever seen on this forum. And Microsoft only discussed their plans in response to people questioning them about it in interviews, which most likely wouldn't have happened if it weren't for the leaks.

 

[NoMoreTrolls]

I really couldn't care less about the plans of these million dollar corporations and their plans to fleece me of more money. Any information is welcome. Bring on the leaks.

This post sir.
Raiseglassandnod.gif

 

[SPDIF]

I don't remember MS saying much in May about the full plans.

They posted this on the 23rd of May I believe (even though it says 1st of May at the top). I think they may have gone into more detail just before their E3 conference as well.

Uhhhhhhh..... Uhhhhhhhhhhh.

UUUUUUUUUUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

How about, EVERY leaker did. Bro do you even Q1 and 2 of 2013?

They did? Can you point me to some posts. Like I said, there were some rumours about the plans floating around, and Kotaku and others posted articles about them, but I don't remember a full on insider blow out (from CBOAT or otherwise) popping up before MS revealed their plans in May.

This is possibly the biggest revisionist history I've ever seen on this forum. And Microsoft only discussed their plans in response to people questioning them about it in interviews, which most likely wouldn't have happened if it weren't for the leaks.

I'm sure it's not. Like I've said, if you can show me otherwise, then fair enough. I'm quite happy to be wrong.

 

[Uno Venova]

They posted this on the 23rd of May I believe (even though it says 1st of May at the top). I think they may have gone into more detail just before their E3 conference as well.
.

There aren't much details in this, they don't detail reselling or the internet connection requirement being 24 hours, things like that were leaked by EDGE and Eurogamer well in advance.

 

[GalacticaN7]

I, for one, welcome our leaking underlords.

 

[BronsonLee]

I'm sure it's not. Like I've said, if you can show me otherwise, then fair enough. I'm quite happy to be wrong.

I'm afraid I've got some bad news

 

[PairOfFilthySocks]

Volatile to who? Microsoft? Who cares. They are a company, the exist to take money from us and not let us know when shit is going wrong. The guy was warning consumers of possible shortcomings in a time when Penello was here spouting non-sense and actively lying about performance concerns.

Do you seriously not realize the impact of having a supposed insider offer rumours that are potentially destructive as all hell, then proceed to say "well maybe it'll all get fixed, dunno".

"Rumours" like this that are essentially impossible to disprove when they turn out to be inconsequential are a win-win scenario for an insider, despite the fact that cboat has fumbled more than once in the past.

 

[Alcander]

They posted this on the 23rd of May I believe (even though it says 1st of May at the top). I think they may have gone into more detail just before their E3 conference as well.



They did? Can you point me to some posts. Like I said, there were some rumours about the plans floating around, and Kotaku and others posted articles about them, but I don't remember a full on insider blow out (from CBOAT or otherwise) popping up before MS revealed their plans in May.



I'm sure it's not. Like I've said, if you can show me otherwise, then fair enough. I'm quite happy to be wrong.

Haha, there were TONS of leaks about the drm/always online stuff. Most people just thought it was fake (myself included). I'd link you but I'm on my phone.

 

[SPDIF]

There aren't much details in this, they don't detail reselling or the internet connection requirement being 24 hours, things like that were leaked by EDGE and Eurogamer well in advance.

They don't flat out say it no, but by saying this:

"No, it does not have to be always connected, but Xbox One does require a connection to the Internet. We’re designing Xbox One to be your all-in-one entertainment system that is connected to the cloud and always ready. We are also designing it so you can play games and watch Blu-ray movies and live TV if you lose your connection."

they may as well have.

And yeah, like I said, they went into more detail about game reselling a couple days before their E3 conference

 

[Justified]

Last year was awesome. He got everything right except Prince of Persia, although that Halo trailer did look like PoP at first.

And most of the Sony stuff, but it seem clear at the point he mostly specialized in MS leaks

 

[alr1ght]

The number one question going into E3 was the DRM, completely due to leaks.

 

[SargerusBR]

CBOAT IS BACK????

 

[Wolfgunblood Garopa]

I really couldn't care less about the plans of these million dollar corporations and their plans to fleece me of more money. Any information is welcome. Bring on the leaks.

Except it's the people putting in their hard work that have something taken away- the excitement of the moment when their hard work is officially unveiled. And I have no idea what you mean by their plans to fleece you. You choose to buy games with your disposable income, right?

 

[Uno Venova]

They don't flat out say it no, but by saying this:

"No, it does not have to be always connected, but Xbox One does require a connection to the Internet. We’re designing Xbox One to be your all-in-one entertainment system that is connected to the cloud and always ready. We are also designing it so you can play games and watch Blu-ray movies and live TV if you lose your connection."

they may as well have.

And yeah, like I said, they went into more detail about game reselling a couple days before their E3 conference

http://www.edge-online.com/news/the...hand-games-50gb-blu-ray-discs-and-new-kinect/ These were way before MS started talking about it though.

 

[SPDIF]

Haha, there were TONS of leaks about the drm/always online stuff. Most people just thought it was fake (myself included).

I know, I'm not saying that (although it may seem like it). I'm talking specifically about "insiders" like CBOAT and others. I know there were plenty of rumours floating around that got written about, I acknowledged that up above, but to my knowledge, we didn't get full forum post leaks about the DRM in the same way we got leaks about E3 line ups for example. That's all I'm saying.

http://www.edge-online.com/news/the...hand-games-50gb-blu-ray-discs-and-new-kinect/ These were way before MS started talking about it though.

Oh I know. I think that's where there's some confusion. I'll just refer you to my reply to Alcander.

 

[TitusGroan]

It amazes me how the gaming community will on the one hand champion the medium as the newest and most interesting development in art, yet on the other hand will treat the creation of said art as less than even the most basic production line.

If we're going to accept that games are a creative endeavour, then that also means we have to recognise that the people who make those games are entitled to make them and reveal them how and when they choose. No artist likes to work with a hundred thousand eyes staring over their shoulder. You may not like the games or decisions that a company like Microsoft makes, but it is still their choice to reveal their games and choices how and when they like. That is the artist's prerogative, so to speak. Their developers are making games in a creative capacity, they should be free to make them how they like without gamers being able to throw a hissy fit because they saw a first-draft they didn't like.

If we're going to recognise game developers as creatives, we should also recognise that it's their decision when and how to reveal their games. If artists had every first draft, sketch and doodle dragged out and shown in front of a hungry audience, I don't think anyone would ever want to do anything creative again.

It's voyeurism, pure and simple.

 

[SEGAvangelist]

CBoaT reactions are pretty easy to guess really. Sony diehards praise him for sharing the TRUTHFACTS, hardcore MS apologists hate him with a passion, and the neutral types often recognize his recent agenda (which seems to have started around the XB1 reveal) but understand that his info is good most of the time. I don't mind the leaks, but his spin on things in the last year makes him come off as some sort of disgruntled MS employee. Hopefully the latest post is a sign of things to come as I'd like the have the old CBoaT back.

 

[shacklesmcgee]

I don't get this argument about "family and kids and stuff", are you trying to claim you will get less sales because of leaks? I can't see this to be true, the games that get leaked are the bigguns : Halo, CoD, Assassins Creed. You will make your quajilion dollars, you will sell your million copies. Leaks make us feel involved, and let us feel like we are apart of something. Don't know why someone would be upset about people talking about their game before they're allowed to talk about it.

Edit: Also, he posted a picture of Guardians of the Galaxy in the Halo 4 thread. Hours before the official unveil. That's it.

 

[Chemo]

Except it's the people putting in their hard work that have something taken away- the excitement of the moment when their hard work is officially unveiled. And I have no idea what you mean by their plans to fleece you. You choose to buy games with your disposable income, right?

You act like they're putting in their hard work for free, though. They get paid. This is an entertainment industry, not an intimate fine arts project. Leaks are fine. Sometimes they cast things in a good light, sometimes they cast things in a bad light, but generally the light that gets cast is the one that should be.

 

[iceatcs]

I'm betting CBOAT will leak some E3 info soon before. Today leak was premature I suspect.

 

[Latvian Hitman]

I know, I'm not saying that (although it may seem like it). I'm talking specifically about "insiders" like CBOAT and others. I know there were plenty of rumours floating around that got written about, I acknowledged that up above, but to my knowledge, we didn't get full forum post leaks about the DRM in the same way we got leaks about E3 line ups for example. That's all I'm saying.

Leaks only come from insiders. That's what makes them leaks.

As you say- no individual leaker had a huge blowout at any point, but the leaking community as a cumulative whole had painted a pretty clear picture of what MS was up to well prior to May/June when MS finally started releasing info to the public.

 

[EvB]

Also I believed CBOAT, even when he was wrong and still believe his rumors.

That says rather a lot about you.

 

[digoutyoursoul]

I'm betting CBOAT will leak some E3 info soon before. Today leak was premature I suspect.

Yep

 

[HiddenForbiddenHolyGround]

It amazes me how the gaming community will on the one hand champion the medium as the newest and most interesting development in art, yet on the other hand will treat the creation of said art as less than even the most basic production line.

If we're going to accept that games are a creative endeavour, then that also means we have to recognise that the people who make those games are entitled to make them and reveal them how and when they choose. No artist likes to work with a hundred thousand eyes staring over their shoulder. You may not like the games or decisions that a company like Microsoft makes, but it is still their choice to reveal their games and choices how and when they like. That is the artist's prerogative, so to speak. Their developers are making games in a creative capacity, they should be free to make them how they like without gamers being able to throw a hissy fit because they saw a first-draft they didn't like.

If we're going to recognise game developers as creatives, we should also recognise that it's their decision when and how to reveal their games. If artists had every first draft, sketch and doodle dragged out and shown in front of a hungry audience, I don't think anyone would ever want to do anything creative again.

It's voyeurism, pure and simple.

It's probably not the same people who do both of the things you describe.

Anyway I do consider games art, but games are also big business. Nobody is leaking indie and enthusiast devs work in games, music or movies or in literature. But big business is different. In Hollywood, with big music labels and big bands and acts and high profile books it is a lot like this. Leaked songs and videos, scripts and casting, portions of manuscripts etc. How many of the people who looked at those leaks of the last Harry Potter book cared about it as art?

You can't indict gamers with this either/or situation, things just don't work that way. The diversity of gamers who consider it art or just some hobby and those who may or may not find leaking obtrusive is wide and intersecting.

 

[Wolfgunblood Garopa]

You act like they're putting in their hard work for free, though. They get paid. This is an entertainment industry, not an intimate fine arts project. Leaks are fine. Sometimes they cast things in a good light, sometimes they cast things in a bad light, but generally the light that gets cast is the one that should be.

I really don't know how you got that idea.

Leaks are what they are, but it's ignorant to not acknowledge that it affects people, not just a faceless corporation who will make a profit anyway. Re-read Stinkle's post.

 

[SPDIF]

Leaks only come from insiders. That's what makes them leaks.

As you say- no individual leaker had a huge blowout at any point

That may be so, but in response to your original post that I originally responded to:

Leaks helped save MS from itself to a large extent last year

I would argue that leakers didn't do anything to help MS. The huge outrage from gamers once MS confirmed the leaks/rumours, helped MS. The leakers were just creating speculation up until that point. If MS decided to pull the plug at the very last minute and pretended that the DRM never existed, then the leakers could be credited with helping MS.

 

[tfur]

It amazes me how the gaming community will on the one hand champion the medium as the newest and most interesting development in art, yet on the other hand will treat the creation of said art as less than even the most basic production line.

If we're going to accept that games are a creative endeavour, then that also means we have to recognise that the people who make those games are entitled to make them and reveal them how and when they choose. No artist likes to work with a hundred thousand eyes staring over their shoulder. You may not like the games or decisions that a company like Microsoft makes, but it is still their choice to reveal their games and choices how and when they like. That is the artist's prerogative, so to speak. Their developers are making games in a creative capacity, they should be free to make them how they like without gamers being able to throw a hissy fit because they saw a first-draft they didn't like.

If we're going to recognise game developers as creatives, we should also recognise that it's their decision when and how to reveal their games. If artists had every first draft, sketch and doodle dragged out and shown in front of a hungry audience, I don't think anyone would ever want to do anything creative again.

It's voyeurism, pure and simple.

Again, though. It is a Microsoft employee that is leaking. One of those developers or whatever personnel are the ones leaking. CBOAT is only the messenger.

 

[Doc Evils]

I'm betting CBOAT will leak some E3 info soon before. Today leak was premature I suspect.

HELL YES!

 

[TitusGroan]

Again, though. It is a Microsoft employee that is leaking. One of those developers or whatever personnel are the ones leaking. CBOAT is only the messenger.

Then that one employee is disrespecting the hard work and effort of his co-workers and colleagues. Games are a collaborative creative effort, and one disgruntled worker shouldn't be able to undermine the work of the rest of his team.