Goldrusher
Member
Just ban GameStop & co from selling used games and leave the consumer alone.
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Sony has researched new tech for suppressing second-hand game sales
- Thread starter gofreak
- Start date
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Not with the bandwidth caps in the United States.
Version 3.0
Member
I seriously doubt that, especially if you don't understand First Sale Doctrine. There is no "loss" for the developer. It's not a "loss" if multiple people use your product, whether that product is a vacuum cleaner, a movie, or a game. You get paid once - and not even by the consumer in most cases. It's none of the developer's or publisher's business what happens to the game after that. If someone plays it - whether borrowed, shared or re-sold - that may otherwise have bought it themselves, that's not a "loss".
If you disagree with any of that, then you are ignorant.
There are many reasons, but I think the primary one is historical: I don't think there ever really was a big used game market on PC in the first place, so PC gamers don't miss it.
I H8 Memes
Member
Am I really going to complain about a game that I got for $5 that never scratches. wont break, and has a near 100% chance of always being backwards compatible?
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
LOL...if only. If only.
We don't care, it's no big deal ..... to me personally.
Omegasquash
Member
Normally I don't buy used, but if there's something that I've been after for a bit on the shelf and, if the moment is right, I'll pick it up. That part isn't any sweat off my back. The part that I'm not keen on is how it would affect Gamefly.
I've bought LOTS of games via Gamefly, and I've saved my skin on not buying them, too. Granted most of those games are used, but there's been the oddball here and there.
I don't think that all platforms would implement such a restrictive policy, though I can say for sure that if Sony implements it, PS4 isn't an option anymore, period.
I've bought LOTS of games via Gamefly, and I've saved my skin on not buying them, too. Granted most of those games are used, but there's been the oddball here and there.
I don't think that all platforms would implement such a restrictive policy, though I can say for sure that if Sony implements it, PS4 isn't an option anymore, period.
Alex
Member
We reap enough benefits to not really miss it. Good prices, good support, games as more of a format rather than stuck to a single, closed machine.
If I lost the ability to resell my console and handheld games without gaining a lot of the same benefits, I'd be pretty annoyed.
That's true, but somone could simply go rent it from a video rental store now and beat a game in 5 days. This way PSN at least sees some of those profits. And if they wanna be really cool, if you decide to buy it before your 5 days are up you get the rental price deducted from the price of the full version. But this stuff makes sense and we are talking about Sony here so I guess this is just wishful thinking.
faceless007
Member
I do. I think one-time use keys are anti-consumer and companies should allow for account transferral. But for the most part, the games have become cheap enough with Steam/Amazon sales that it's not as big a deal. Spending $5 on something you can't sell isn't the same as spending $60 on something you can't sell.
That said, I do still buy and sell used PC games, though they're mostly years old and obscure titles.
Zoe
Member
Unless publishers decide to turn their backs on the rental market, they'll press different versions to sell to rental companies. That's how other industries handle it.
LizardKing
Member
because you can buy them for 5-20 bucks. That's more money saved than you ever would by trading in your game, or buying used.
Alias Greed
Neo Member
If sony does implement this, I can say that I'm out it was a pleasure playing videogames for 29 years.
I'll stick to the other companies unless they implement such a system as well.
I'll stick to the other companies unless they implement such a system as well.
DangerousDave
Member
And then you have people complaining because they're implementing a online mode in Last of Us.
Because even if the game is a wonderful experience that brings you the nirvana of videogames, most people will resell the game after they completed it. Unless there is a good multiplayer mode.
At launch, games are nearly the same price as in console. The problem is the long-term price, in consoles there aren't so many DD deals. But you can still find a lot of old console games in the 5-20 range in sale buckets at stores.
This can be overcome by letting ISPs host content locally. Valve allows this with Steam and as a result the more popular ISPs here in Australia offer unmetered access to at least their own content servers. (One ISP in particular, iiNet, also offers unmetered access to Xbox Live and [some aspects of] iTunes because it has its own Akamai farm.)
"Not really. The ability to resell or return a product if you aren't satisfied with it is a part of the purchasing decisions for the majority of people on the planet"
You obviously see the purchase of video games to be somehow different than the purchase of other entertainment. Not sure why.
I H8 Memes
Member
There has been talk about how the money from sold games is recycled back into buying more new games. But your post raises a different issue as well. The residual effect of people buying less games leading to less IP mindshare circulating. If you and all your friends are buying less games then there is less of a chance of the average gamer even being exposed to most games to know if they like it, or want to buy it, or even want to buy that games sequel when it comes out. The average gamer has no idea which games a re which and when they are coming out beyond just a few of the most popular games.
I'm cooler with this than I am with a large number of used games being purchased and not helping developers in any way. The fact that I work for a game company and my salary is paid by the selling of those games, and would be ruined by X% more used game sales, probably helps sway me a bit.
Still wish there were a middle ground.
I avoid buying used games and re-buy games I've already played and loved (but don't have a copy of) to try and support developers.
Still wish there were a middle ground.
I avoid buying used games and re-buy games I've already played and loved (but don't have a copy of) to try and support developers.
Let's Kickstart this bitch. You know they'll see it too.
Punishing the consumer IS NOT going to get you more money. It hasn't help Sony's broke ass, at least. Developers, why not reward the people that buy your games new(like extra content, or a free season pass or some shit), and give the people who buy used jack shit except for the game. These are easy alternatives to pressuring Sony to do this type of shit.
Or, you can continue acting moronic and we can just not buy this shit.
Or, you can continue acting moronic and we can just not buy this shit.
cpp_is_king
Member
but any game that is released on both console and pc will be roughly the same price on pc as console. the $5-$20 games are much smaller and more similar imo to psn / xbla games. but for premium games, not sure this argument still works
i do agree that SOME console titles are overpriced though
DenogginizerOS
BenjaminBirdie's Thomas Jefferson
Used books, music, and movies survive in this world, but somehow, video games (that have the highest prices per single unit) need anti-used technology in the hardware?
You are wrong about used game sales not helping developers.
It's because the author makes money every time the used book is lent to a friend, sold on Craigslist or given for free to the book sale at your office. Wait that's not what happens at all.
Supermanisdead
Member
How are people ok and even trying to justify/praise this bone headed idea. It's complete bullshit.
Physical books degrade in quality. Digital music on the most popular services is using DRM.
Movies are re-packaged for every new format.
The unstated assumption that this is only an issue in the video game industry is false and quite silly.
it's a matter of perspective: buy our game new and we gift you the catwoman DLC!
Buy our game used an you won't get the catwoman DLC.
same with all other online passes.
MagiusNecros
Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
They should put video games in libraries. Makes sense to me.
I don't understand the need to crack down on people buying used games, it's like punishing you for being intelligent in money management.
I don't understand the need to crack down on people buying used games, it's like punishing you for being intelligent in money management.
EdwardTivrusky
Member
I have to disagree. I buy most of my new games on PC as they are usually £15 cheaper than the console version. £25 versus £40 at launch is the usual price which means i go PC every time unless it's an exclusive to console.
The PC has lots of competition for retail which means many sales which is why we don't mind not reselling games as much as those with consoles.
If i had to pay console prices and couldn't resell i would be a lot more demanding of the quality of the product and buy fewer games as well.
sublimit
Banned
I really have no idea and i'm someone who buys almost all of my games new.This is really off putting to me.
There are things that increase in value and are sold used. Like paintings. But you don't see painters trying to stop people from trading paintings.
The fact that games don't degrade much is a good thing for publishers. It increases the value of what they sell.
scytheavatar
Member
Didn't the EU rule that the reselling of digital delivered software must be allowed?
I don't think many rich authors are against used sales of books. It's the publishers of such works, or in the case of a painter (if he is still alive): the agent.
They only think about the money and not about how many people consume a particular work of art.
It's the same with lower level roles in video game studios I think. They just want the game to be played and make enough that they can continue to make them. But the publishers want to make a big ROI.
But you're benefiting from listing games except for very few exceptions that were very popular in the first month of the game's release on consoles where the price is $60.
Do you think those games would be made with that budget to get 70% of 5$ at Christmas 7 months down the road of release?
You're making a wise money making decision by waiting and then buying it at very big sales, but that doesn't mean you (the kind of purchaser you represent) could be the symbiotic host for such a relationship with the game creator.
I H8 Memes
Member
Not so. Nearly all of the games in my library were bought for $5. Dead Space 1 & 2, Bioshock 1 & 2, Crysis 1 & Warhead, Just Cause 2, both Batman games, Deus Ex, GTA 4, Episodes from Liberty City, both Fallout 3 & New Vegas, Mass Effect 2, Mirrors Edge, Portal 2, Saints Row the 3rd, Battlefield Bad Company 2, all the Half-Life games. All of those games cost me at most $7.50. Most were $5. Almost all within a year of release. And that's just going through my installed games list. If a game comes out in March and you can wait until christmas sale you can get most games for $7.50 or less. You think people go nuts over the Steam sales because of games like Toki Tori?
Nothing says there isn't an opt-out for this system. Online-main games and evergreen titles certainly don't need it, and indeed may benefit from used sales (esp the former). Single player experiences do suffer from it though, and we've seen that devs like Naughty Dog are forced to spend time on a game mode that not everyone cares about as a prevention measure. Done right this will allow devs to create definitive single player experiences w/o the danger of losing sales to used because they didn't want to waste the time creating a MP portion.
I never liked used games to begin with as I always regret trading games in, buying used I always feel slightly guilty as the money dosnt get to the developers specially when said developer ends up tanking.
PC though I can get great deals without cutting the developers out of at least some profit. Much easier to find bargains as well.. Green man gaming has pretty much made sure I have not paid over 45 dollars for day one releases in 2012..
Plus lets be honest its my preferred platform.
LizardKing
Member
You can find them, but after/if they go under $20 they become scarce. Usually $20 is bargain basement for quality retail console games. Even online. Of course, full price it's the same even for DD pc games. But it's the DD sales/deals that are happening all the time that make up the difference.
Same price when first released, sure. But the DD PC games drop lower over time because of the DD sales. $5-$20 for full, major, AAA releases. (See I H8 Memes 3 posts above)
Because there are also benefits of "no used games" for us. Namely, cheaper games. They lack resale value so they're cheaper.
Sentenza
Member
Used software market for PC was never big in the first place, prices are low and sales agrressive enough to make it hardly matter and on a completely personal note I would add that I don't like to sell my software.
I may be quite cautious before I make a purchase, but when I buy a game it's always because I plan to keep it.
Sometimes people fall for the most obvious logical fallacies.
For example, this guy...
Well, except in the end you didn't spend less money than him, and you have just your last... what? Four or five games you purchased selling the previous ones, while he still holds all 17 of them.
So yeah, that's why used market hardly matters on PC.
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
The big problem the industry has to deal with if they want to combat used game sales and justify measures that prevent used sales, is the addiction to 5 hour production value set piece games.
Too many of the big game this gen had 30 million dollars worth of graphics and audio to support an experience that ultimately is disposable. Not games that have lasting value and most people would want to replay ten years from now. And they charged 60 a pop for the privilege of the experience.
In point of fact, I noticed game design degrading / being perverted towards the desired end product - a noticeable number of games designed to be "completed" in a kind of permanent manner, everything seen or accomplished one time. Without any actual way to reset the game, start a new save, or campaign - without going into the system and manually deleting files, often erasing things you would want to keep, like play statistics.
Publishers can't eat their cake (get 60 bucks from gamers) and have it too (get rid of used sales, so that gamers can't get money back on their 3 hour tour).
Obviously publishers are reprinting and repackaging books every year but I don't see any other industry actively attacking consumers and retailers.
yankeehater
Member
I have bought a PS1, PS2, PS3, PSP, and PSV all at launch. If the PS4 wont play used games it will be the first Sony console that I skip.
Omegasquash
Member
Alternative to that: Wait 6 months for a collectors edition and avoid paying full price anyway. Works for lots of titles.
I H8 Memes
Member
A few titles are the same price. the traditional price for PC games should always be $10 less than console games due to the licensing fee for selling a game on a console. Some publishers lately have forgotten that though. And with the exception of Skyrim (which should be the last game to sell for $60 with as much as their sales benefit from community mods) most games that try a $60 price point on PC dont do so well.