Doctor Ironic
Member
Oh but Corrin is fine.
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Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS patch 1.1.6 announced
- Thread starter Hero of Legend
- Start date
NOLA_Gaffer
Banned
Of course not, but it's so crazy to see people get so bent out of shape for a party fighting game. Like goddamn.
Shamrock7r
Member
Oh here we go
GiantBreadbug
Member
ITT: I'm supposed to feel bad that Bayo has to try for a KO now
(They went a bit hard on the nerfs but jeez)
(They went a bit hard on the nerfs but jeez)
Dr. Buni
Member
Sakurai wouldn't screw with his Fire Emblem babies.
Dimitri LH
Member
Last corrin Nerf was good enough honestly.
Now about that Cee Loud......
EDIT: Welp, party fighting game has been mentioned. Time to hit the bunkers.
Now about that Cee Loud......
EDIT: Welp, party fighting game has been mentioned. Time to hit the bunkers.
Rapscallion
Member
Eh, don't care either way about Bayo. I really only play team and people rarely use Bayonetta.
Wish Corrin got some nerfs though.
Wish Corrin got some nerfs though.
Can't she still Side+B after that?
NamikazeBurst
Member
Corrin isn't even high tier! There is absolutely nothing wrong with Corrin.
BumblebeeCody
Member
Well Bayonetta made the game bearable but now it's back to shit tier. I also wasn't bashing the game in my post anyway.
Oh damn. That is...bad. It doesn't even make sense by the way she moves.
True but Corrin did have an incredibly OP counter when she first came out.
Poltergust
Member
Not likely. You'd probably be able to jump out easily before the side-B connects.
Triforce141
Member
Dr. Buni
Member
Yeah, but she is still a great character after nerfs (going by reports and videos, it has been ages since I played the game)
VERY low quality bait, at that.
Those reports are incredibly exaggerated.
But hey, if there are enough of them, maybe Corrin will get her own patch to save the poor community from the "toxicity".
Dr. Buni
Member
Was it Zero who said that? The toxicity thing, I mean.
The word toxic has been misused by the Smash community at large for a long time now. But yes, he made a video callig Bayonetta that, so people parrot it nonstop now.
Hope people are happy now that they've gotten a character overnerfed. I will be very surprised if we see Bayo win anything now; as if she even won anything before the patch.
That Up B is at 0%, too, on a heavy weight character, by the way. Good luck comboing anything off of that at higher %s whenever someone SDIs it (which will now surely be almost every time).
Kudos to anyone who makes top 8 with nerfed Bayo in the future, though.
That Up B is at 0%, too, on a heavy weight character, by the way. Good luck comboing anything off of that at higher %s whenever someone SDIs it (which will now surely be almost every time).
Kudos to anyone who makes top 8 with nerfed Bayo in the future, though.
SoulUnison
Banned
I don't even understand how she's supposed to combo anymore.
It seems like every move has been specifically tweaked to make it so nothing leads to anything.
So gross that this is what ended up happening because of prominent "community" members like Zero having a temper tantrum.
He mained Meta Knight in Brawl! He constantly wrings and guilts the Smash community for attention and sympathy! He's the absolute worst water-mark of what's "toxic" or not.
I bet he just doesn't like Bayonetta as a character and didn't want there to be any viable competition.
When your one claim to fame is playing a single video game really well, the idea of the playing field being slightly unbalanced in your favor must be panic inducing.
It seems like every move has been specifically tweaked to make it so nothing leads to anything.
So gross that this is what ended up happening because of prominent "community" members like Zero having a temper tantrum.
He mained Meta Knight in Brawl! He constantly wrings and guilts the Smash community for attention and sympathy! He's the absolute worst water-mark of what's "toxic" or not.
I bet he just doesn't like Bayonetta as a character and didn't want there to be any viable competition.
When your one claim to fame is playing a single video game really well, the idea of the playing field being slightly unbalanced in your favor must be panic inducing.
Nice Job, guys. You really fixed it up nice.
I wonder if they should've made it so that Witch Time triggers Bat Within on attacks that do less than 10% DMG. Above 10%, the move works as it normally does, but below it can only trigger Bat Within. That would help with the risk/reward for people fighting her.
Karsticles
Member
Don't forget that ZeRo tried to claim he had too much honor to use Bayonetta after camping with Sheik for a year.
Astral/H3X
Member
I think they removed her "true combos" in favor of having mix up combos. I'll have to see how she plays in the end, but even in the reveal trailer they were saying she was designed as a character who has a lot of different combo mixups, but that she would have to read. That UpB leads to either A) a regular side B if other player doesn't react well enough, B) a downward side b if they air dodge, C) a jump to Fair combo if they double jump out of it. At least that's how I see it.
I don't think she's been nerfed into oblivion, but I do think she'll play quite a bit differently, going from a ez combo character to a punish combo character. But, as with anything, we'll have to see. I trust that Sakurai took his time to make sure that the changes didn't just send her to D tier, but rather brought her more in line with what she was *supposed* to be.
I don't think she's been nerfed into oblivion, but I do think she'll play quite a bit differently, going from a ez combo character to a punish combo character. But, as with anything, we'll have to see. I trust that Sakurai took his time to make sure that the changes didn't just send her to D tier, but rather brought her more in line with what she was *supposed* to be.
SoulUnison
Banned
He's the one that's toxic.
He gets offended if people talk about Smash without talking about him.
You'd think, from his ego, that he can cure cancer with an Up+B.
Lone_Prodigy
Member
All this Bayonetta talk and I'm just waiting for her Amiibo to come out.
Dr. Buni
Member
I know, I am not new to the Smash community, I am just not following the post-DLC stuff as closely as I was before. Thanks for responding and it doesn't surprise me Zero would say somefin like that. He is the Verlisify of the Smash community.
It is exactly what Blizzard have been doing with Heroes of the Storm (messing with the game because muh community claims), so I get why you and others are annoyed.
-shadow-
Member
Please tell me this is an accidental bug and not actually something that happens always. Because this is absolutely terrible.
Poltergust
Member
Well, the game was slowed down, so you can get more inputs in for SDI, but even so that is a very large distance.
TheDinoman
Member
Call me crazy, but I just sometimes honestly think they probably shouldn't of put Bayonetta in Smash 4, ballot be damned.
She just doesn't fit the game's general design very well. Bayonetta games are generally fast paced combo centric action games, and her design in Smash replicated that pretty well...problem is, it's in a game where there aren't too many combos for most of the cast. It's like, Falco in Melee is pretty cool, but imagine if they threw him into Smash 4 with no changes whatsoever, ergo making him play exactly like how he does in Melee, frame data, combos and all. He'd just feel inherently better compared to everyone else.
Maybe if the game was more like, say, Melee or Project M, games with a much faster pace and generally more combo ability, her combos and stuff would be less jarring and we wouldn't have had to gone to such extremes to calm people down.
She just doesn't fit the game's general design very well. Bayonetta games are generally fast paced combo centric action games, and her design in Smash replicated that pretty well...problem is, it's in a game where there aren't too many combos for most of the cast. It's like, Falco in Melee is pretty cool, but imagine if they threw him into Smash 4 with no changes whatsoever, ergo making him play exactly like how he does in Melee, frame data, combos and all. He'd just feel inherently better compared to everyone else.
Maybe if the game was more like, say, Melee or Project M, games with a much faster pace and generally more combo ability, her combos and stuff would be less jarring and we wouldn't have had to gone to such extremes to calm people down.
Vermillion
Banned
Bayonetta gave a lot of mid-high level Sm4sh players a way to get on the scoreboard. Sheik only worked for the best of the best. Bayonetta was kind of dumb lol.
Vermillion
Banned
People called Bayo toxic long before ZeRo, lol. Ally wanted her banned - ZeRo didn't even go that far. His solution was to adapt.
ZeRo has literally no say in the patches. Otherwise Sheik wouldn't have been nerfed, lmao. Or hell, Diddy. Y'all are fishing to attack people.
You don't need to be the first to whine when you can just further influence people with your words...
She is hardly ruined (and she was hardly "toxic" either), but this is still a bullshit precedent being set.
fredrancour
Member
oh gosh i thought it was just up-b.
the last sheik and meta knight nerfs happened after sakurai witnessed a high-level match and saw how absurdly good their biggest kill combos were. this is most likely just another case of "oh gosh we never intended for any combos in smash 4 to be that brutal."
I swear if Sheik is once again the best character in the game I'm done
I don't give a shit if she's hard to play, she's boring as fuck and it takes 1200 years for her to get a kill.
Melee sheik is infinitely more enjoyable to watch, and that's like bottom 5 most hype character in the game.
I don't give a shit if she's hard to play, she's boring as fuck and it takes 1200 years for her to get a kill.
Melee sheik is infinitely more enjoyable to watch, and that's like bottom 5 most hype character in the game.
SoulUnison
Banned
It's quite a leap from me saying that Zero was a prominent and visible member of the Smash community who devoted himself to whining about Bayonetta while, himself, camping on the "other" top-tier/OP/"toxic" characters, and your implication that I was somehow trying to say that Zero has Nintendo's ear and dictates the contents of balance patches, in some way.
Holy strawmen, Batman.
I'm just annoyed because he was one of the loudest voices for this, but he screamed while actively being and having a long history of being a hypocrite. Zero's the kind of guy that mained Meta Knight, ZSS, Diddy King and Shiek. He's like the *poster child* for running to whatever the current OP-character-of-the-week is. Then a character he doesn't "approve" up pops up and he essentially crusades against her. Not evenjust against the character, though - he attacked the players that used her and even just her fans, saying that they were weak players allowing Bayonetta to carry them... While he almost exclusively plays whoever is at the very top of whatever the currently-in-vogue tier list is.
I'm sorry, but Zero, to me, is just a guy who got lucky enough to end up in a fairly meaningless spotlight, but it's all he has going for him so he'll do absolutely anything and jump on any possible bandwagon to keep his "status." He's like the gaming community version of a politician.
freethoughtbubble
Member
Dr. Buni
Member
After Sakurai nearly turning Smash in Super Fire Emblem Bros., I can agree with this.
Poltergust
Member
Why? Those opinions are not contradictory.
Technically this terrible precedent was set with Gekkouga, which was an even worse situation, cause he wasn't as good and they still allowed pre patch diddy, pre patch Shiek (remember that back air Jesus Christ), rosa and zss to go rampart.
One of the things that kinda annoys me most is having to bitch a whole year about how ridiculous Shiek's needles are just to get a slight range removal.
I didn't realise Zero irritated people so much. Personally I like the guy, he just says dumb things sometimes.
As for the Bayo nerfs, I never thought she was broken or too op in the 1st place but some nerfs were definitely needed. They just went a little too far with it. Hopefully people can figure out some cool new stuff with her.
As for the Bayo nerfs, I never thought she was broken or too op in the 1st place but some nerfs were definitely needed. They just went a little too far with it. Hopefully people can figure out some cool new stuff with her.
Shamrock7r
Member
5 FE characters out of 58 characters total is Super Fire Emblem Bros?
Rapscallion
Member
Especially humorous considering there are 7 Mario characters (9 if you count Wario and DK), 5 Pokemon, and 5 Zelda characters.
Fire Emblem is over represented for as small of a series as it is, but it certainly isn't dominating the roster of Smash in any way.
SoulUnison
Banned
Ike, Robin, Marth and Lucina are all base game characters.
Ike and Marth are different enough, sure, and Robin's unique, but Lucina's just a generally inferior Marth clone, so it already feels like we're 20% redundant, here.
Then you get to the DLC and you get another Marth clone, and a character that's basically just an advertisement for a game that was yet to be released.
It makes it feel like the Fire Emblem representation is mostly Marth Remixes or Commercial Characters.
That said, Fox and Falco have it way worse.
I don't even get the point of Falco except for the token ability to say "Smash has 2 Star Fox characters."
I'm honestly glad Wolf's gone because 3 characters sharing the same template and being the entire representation for their series is flat-out embarrassing.
MaverickHunterAsh
Member
Six actually, but you're right - it's hilarious how much people overstate Fire Emblem's influence on the roster, especially when Nintendo has come right out and billed it as one of their most important IPs. I'm not even a big Fire Emblem fan and it doesn't bug me (though I was just as disappointed as anyone when Corrin was revealed instead of, say, Dixie).
That said, Lucina does feel like fluff considering she's basically a worse Marth and little else. I actually feel they did a pretty good job of differentiating Roy quite a bit from how he was in Melee - he's not as much of a Marth clone as he used to be. Ike, Robin, and Corrin all stand out as individual characters with unique playstyles to me, though. Anyone who tries to call Ike or Corrin a Marth clone is really fishing for utter bullshit to complain about.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Wolf has as much in common with Fox as Ike does with Marth. If you consider one as unique, you must consider the other.
You're right haha.
Probably meant how both statements annoy me as to how extreme they are. There were actual issues with Bayo that were shrugged off as if she was an honest character. I'm also gonna complain about the other top tiers though.
DecoReturns
Member
I don't like how sales represents how many characters a series should get.
I mean FE has a long history with Nintendo but never the popularity, which tells me if it was a big seller then people would be okay with the characters inclusion.
I mean FE has a long history with Nintendo but never the popularity, which tells me if it was a big seller then people would be okay with the characters inclusion.
It's understandable, though. Mother and Xenoblade shouldn't have more characters than Mario and Pokémon -- it just wouldn't look right.
12 games, 2 remakes, and #FE is a small series?
I honestly haven't understood the complaints about the FE characters. The only one I really deem unnecessary is Lucina, and I think should have just been a Marth skin. All the other ones are unique and interesting (in Smash For, even Roy was differentiated from Marth much more than Melee and feels different).