• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

The Metroid Other M Drinking Game

reggie_office-6.jpg
 
What do you mean, how can I dispute that? I don't dispute the writing at all. I dispute that the game deserves a reputation for saying "baby" constantly when it doesn't.

I didn;t say constantly. I said I'd drink every time it was said. 9-14 times in 5 minutes or so is a lot. Lot of defensive Other M fans! Looks like I'm drinking again!
 
I didn;t say constantly. I said I'd drink every time it was said. 9-14 times in 5 minutes or so is a lot. Lot of defensive Other M fans! Looks like I'm drinking again!

I never said I was a fan. I'm not pointing out anything subjective, just the facts. You added this "drink every time baby is said" thing as if it's said a lot, just based on the meme about it, without realizing it's barely even said.

Your "drink every time someone defends the game" is turning out more like "drink every time I feel like making an assholish reply to someone else in the thread."


THE BABY

Edit: God dammit I always get top of the page with my most useless posts.

Please don't hurt yourself OP.

I... hic... tr... try... to... err what am I playing again ?

See, there's plenty of other people who don't realize "baby" is only said like a dozen times.
 

shaowebb

Member
I'd have to be drunk to put that pile of swill back into a console and play it. Felt like that single game character assassinated the entire franchise so hard that Metroid just stopped getting anything for 5 years...

When you fuck up so bad you knock half a decade out of a franchise thats bad. It'll take OP at least half a decade to recover from his alcohol poisoning after this.
 
I never said I was a fan. I'm not pointing out anything subjective, just the facts. You added this "drink every time baby is said" thing as if it's said a lot, just based on the meme about it, without realizing it's barely even said.

Your "drink every time someone defends the game" is turning out more like "drink every time I feel like making an assholish reply to someone else in the thread."






See, there's plenty of other people who don't realize "baby" is only said like a dozen times.

Why are you so upset about people gently mocking a below average game? And steady on the name calling sunshine. Calling people assholes because they made fun of some 1s and 0s you're fond of is pretty lame.

In case my OP wasn't cards on the table enough for you the point of this thread is me to have a bit of fun with a game I'm fairly fond of and picked up for £2.50 while getting drunk and not thinking about the deterioration and break up of a five year relationship.

So back on topic: I'm fighting a bee hive. I have to make use of the diffusor beam I forgot, it sort of stacks on top of the dodge and shoot mechanic the game has been building. The whole thing is babby's first Ninja Gaiden, but honestly? That's pretty ok. The monster design, I'm starting to remember, is exceptional. Bio-engineered monstrosities.
 
I never said I was a fan. I'm not pointing out anything subjective, just the facts. You added this "drink every time baby is said" thing as if it's said a lot, just based on the meme about it, without realizing it's barely even said.

Your "drink every time someone defends the game" is turning out more like "drink every time I feel like making an assholish reply to someone else in the thread."






See, there's plenty of other people who don't realize "baby" is only said like a dozen times.

How is a dozen times in the first 5 minutes "barely"? If those dozen times were spread throughout the game then you might have a point, but they're all really close together and also the very first thing you experience in the game, so that kinda leaves an impact on people.
 
And steady on the name calling sunshine. Calling people assholes because they made fun of some 1s and 0s you're fond of is pretty lame.

Why are you so intent on taking offense at every little thing? I didn't call you an asshole, I said the reply was. There's no need to start acting like that to everyone who says anything in the thread other than "lol don't die."


How is a dozen times in the first 5 minutes "barely"? If those dozen times were spread throughout the game then you might have a point, but they're all really close together and also the very first thing you experience in the game, so that kinda leaves an impact on people.

A dozen times over the course of the whole game is what I said.
 
Why are you so intent on taking offense at every little thing? I didn't call you an asshole, I said the reply was. There's no need to start acting like that to everyone who says anything in the thread other than "lol don't die."




A dozen times over the course of the whole game is what I said.

Even in a thread that is very much about it you're still very much
6a0105364b9091970c019aff8ab3f3970c-pi
 
The whole thing is babby's first Ninja Gaiden, but honestly? That's pretty ok. The monster design, I'm starting to remember, is exceptional. Bio-engineered monstrosities.

Remember folks, it's ok for OP to say positive things about the game, but if anyone else mentions anything that seems to imply anything mildly positive about the game, he'll get on your case and drink about it.
 

GameBuddy

Neo Member
After it's all over, pour yourself a cup of coffee and just pretend Other M was a fever dream Samus had when they were attempting to surgically remove her suit in Fusion.
 

SeanTSC

Member
This sounds reasonable. I'm starting to wonder if some of the allegations against this game's story are overblown. Haven't played it, so I can't say.

The collective disgust felt for Other M is easily the LEAST overblown thing on Gaf. People are often quick to jump on things or exaggerate their feelings for something, but that is not at all the case with Other M. It deserves every bit of criticism it has ever gotten.
 

RagnarokX

Member
I just think a lot of the vitriol aimed at it is ridiculously overblown and/or based on ignorance. It's a mediocre game with a lot of faults, but I think the overreactions did more harm to the franchise than the game itself.
It was already mentioned but he's not her boss, sure the thing is under official investigation by the military and if "she wants to stay she has to follow the rules." That still doesn't technically make him, her boss. They should be equals, and most importantly he has to treat her at the very least as a capable soldier who knows what she's doing. Because she is not in any way, shape, or form under his direct command. Samus should be able to take things Adam says under consideration in her actions, due to military procedure and their supposed history, but this would require the game to make Samus act like a grown woman and Adam to treat her as such, neither of which happen.

I've said it multiple times, this game is the fever dream Samus has while she's being operated on in the intro of Metroid Fusion. It's a disgrace what they did to her character and how they retroactively ruined Adam.
Adam is not her boss in a traditional job sense, no. He has legal authority, though, being an official high ranking officer of the government, and he could charge her for interfering with an official investigation. Just like how a police chief isn't your boss but he can still arrest you and charge you with a crime if you try to interfere with an investigation. Plus the government Adam works for is also Samus' biggest employer. So while she's not an official employee, it wouldn't look good for future employment opportunities.

I disagree. I'd rather she get caught in an explosion or have her powers sapped by dark matter aliens or whatever than not use life-saving equipment because her superior hasn't explicitly authorised its use yet.
They're all lame excuses. The one Other M uses works really well for weapons but not for other upgrades, but in the end it's just an excuse to have an upgrade system. It's silly but they're always silly. Why didn't Samus have any of her gear in Metroid 2 and Super Metroid?

This is true. It's a shitty excuse, mind, but it's just a gameplay excuse.

This does not change the fact that Samus is consistently portrayed as a damsel in need of saving by her Super Strong Male Cohorts, to the point where the flagrant, disgusting sexism peaks with Adam literally shooting Samus in the back because he needs to assert his dominance and "save her" from the scary infant Metroid. Even worse, it works. Apparently a Federation ice pistol thing can completely shut off Samus' Varia Suit and render her unconscious for an extended period of time.

Having the gameplay excuse of "Adam needs to tell you when and where you can use your things, including the completely passive defensive upgrades" just serves to underline the whole issue.
Consistently? Samus is consistently portrayed as being more powerful than everyone else. In fact, the reasoning behind the authorization system is that Samus is so powerful that she might be a danger to everyone else on board the ship. The only strong male characters are Anthony, Adam, and the Deleter. Anthony does help Samus twice, both times because he happens to have a plasma cannon, but it has a ridiculous charge time that makes him feeble compared to Samus and ultimately results in his apparent death. At the end it's his authority as a member of Adam's team, which was working on orders directly from the government, that allows them to get Madeline away from the corrupt military officials. Adam's deus ex machina gun... yeah, it's stupid. Really really stupid. But Adam didn't do it to assert his dominance and save her from the scary infant metroid. He did it because the only way to stop her from carrying out the suicide mission or trying to prevent Adam from carrying out the suicide mission was to incapacitate her with a sucker punch. She's way too powerful for Adam to stop any other way. She was really adamant about going on the mission and not letting Adam do it. If she hadn't been incapacitated she would have gotten her way. They should have had a better way for Adam to incapacitate her. The Deleter has to pilot a giant forklift mech to stand a chance against Samus.
 

also

Banned
This is true. It's a shitty excuse, mind, but it's just a gameplay excuse.

This does not change the fact that Samus is consistently portrayed as a damsel in need of saving by her Super Strong Male Cohorts, to the point where the flagrant, disgusting sexism peaks with Adam literally shooting Samus in the back because he needs to assert his dominance and "save her" from the scary infant Metroid. Even worse, it works. Apparently a Federation ice pistol thing can completely shut off Samus' Varia Suit and render her unconscious for an extended period of time.

Having the gameplay excuse of "Adam needs to tell you when and where you can use your things, including the completely passive defensive upgrades" just serves to underline the whole issue.

The authorization system was, the Varia suit nonsense aside, a thousand times better than what the Prime games did. At least Other M Samus is not so incompetent as to be critically damaged 30 min into the game.

If you have to lie, you probably have a very weak argument. Adam shots her in the back to prevent her from going on a suicide mission and not because of the nonsense you wrote.
 
Remember folks, it's ok for OP to say positive things about the game, but if anyone else mentions anything that seems to imply anything mildly positive about the game, he'll get on your case and drink about it.

Holy shit are you trying to imply saying good things about a game while acknowledging it's faults are a bad thing? It's a pretty ok game, with some awful and inconsistent writing. What is up with the chafed anuses about this? Is this a #GamerGate thing? Is it because I said Samus's femininity was not portrayed in the best light?
 
The authorization system was, the Varia suit nonsense aside, a thousand times better than what the Prime games did. At least Other M Samus is not so incompetent as to be critically damaged 30 min into the game.

If you have to lie, you probably have a very weak argument. Adam shots her in the back to prevent her from going on a suicide mission and not because of the nonsense you wrote.

The authorization system has very large downright sexists connotations. I rather have a silly videogame logic explanation that one that destroys one of the best female figures in gaming.
 

Garlador

Member
If you have to lie, you probably have a very weak argument. Adam shots her in the back to prevent her from going on a suicide mission and not because of the nonsense you wrote.

Every mission Samus takes on is considered a suicide mission.

... And if the game had let us PLAY that section, we would have survived it and emerged the hero of the story, instead of the battered housewife she ultimately became in that scene.

Besides, I'll take "fully powered Samus surrounded by Metroids" (her element) versus "helpless Samus gasping on the floor next to life-sucking Metroid because her idiot not-really-boss shot her instead of warning her".

Because if there's one thing Samus proved in Other M, it's that she NEVER follows orders, right?
 

Ezalc

Member
After it's all over, pour yourself a cup of coffee and just pretend Other M was a fever dream Samus had when they were attempting to surgically remove her suit in Fusion.
See, this guy gets it.

Adam is not her boss in a traditional job sense, no. He has legal authority, though, being an official high ranking officer of the government, and he could charge her for interfering with an official investigation. Just like how a police chief isn't your boss but he can still arrest you and charge you with a crime if you try to interfere with an investigation. Plus the government Adam works for is also Samus' biggest employer. So while she's not an official employee, it wouldn't look good for future employment opportunities.

Sure, but the fact remains that he should still treat Samus as an equal in that situation, not as a superior unless she willingly lets that happen. Which she does, but only because the writing in this game is godawful. He was never in charge of her, the point is that she doesn't interfere with their work. She mainly went along with him out of some twisted respect for the man but repays that by treating her like worse than a child. (inb4baby)

Also, sure they are the ones who usually employ her, but as an argument that is pretty weak given that the nature of her job as a bounty hunter is to work independently from the government. It's a detail that can be easily overlooked in some other game where she just works for some rich dude who needs her to go kick ass because of whatever reason, or something else that isn't the galactic government. Plus as you said it yourself, in Metroid Fusion she outright becomes a criminal in the eyes of the government. I doubt she cares very much about their future employment if she's later willing to do something like that.
 

RagnarokX

Member
The authorization system has very large downright sexists connotations. I rather have a silly videogame logic explanation that one that destroys one of the best female figures in gaming.

It does not have inherent sexist connotations. You are injecting that. Adam has authority because of his rank, not because he is a man. And he exercises that authority on her because Samus is so powerful that she could potentially be a danger to people around her.
 

Mivey

Member
I would argue that it is more extreme incompetence then actual sexism. I'm sure Sakamoto has a rather fucked pereception of women, but it really shouldn't show in the game. How can you fuck a story for a Metroid game? Its a franchise that has giant flying dinosaur and an evil brain as reoccurring villains. And you manage to fuck it up.
Is there a video game Rezzy for bad stories?
 

Garlador

Member
It does not have inherent sexist connotations. You are injecting that. Adam has authority because of his rank, not because he is a man. And he exercises that authority on her because Samus is so powerful that she could potentially be a danger to people around her.

The two don't have to be mutual exclusive. He is both a high-ranking official AND a guy lording that power over one of the most powerful women in video games.

Secondly, he technically has NO authority over Samus. At all.

Thirdly, how many times has Adam saved the galaxy? Everyone always brings up the fact he should treat her as an equal.

Screw that. They're not equal. Adam, by this point, should be taking orders from HER. Her resume is vastly more impressive than his.

Is it sexist when Adam authorizes his men to use weaponry during his mission? Cause that happens.

Funny enough, he authorizes the Ice Beams for all his men... and NOT Samus until later.

Take that as you will.
 
The two don't have to be mutual exclusive. He is both a high-ranking official AND a guy lording that power over one of the most powerful women in video games.

Secondly, he technically has NO authority over Samus. At all.

Thirdly, how many times has Adam saved the galaxy? Everyone always brings up the fact he should treat her as an equal.

Screw that. They're not equal. Adam, by this point, should be taking orders from HER. Her resume is vastly more impressive than his.



Funny enough, he authorizes the Ice Beams for all his men... and NOT Samus until later.

Take that as you will.

tumblr_m75sp5CXKC1rb9xcho1_1280.jpg
 
It does not have inherent sexist connotations. You are injecting that. Adam has authority because of his rank, not because he is a man. And he exercises that authority on her because Samus is so powerful that she could potentially be a danger to people around her.

Samus is not actually under Adam's commands. She's not part of the federation, she willingly chooses to follow his orders, although she's way more capable than him.

The result is basically an abusive relationship, in which Adam, makes considerable efforts to hurt her psychologically and physically, only because she opposed him once.

The inherent implications of all this are quite clear, be an accident due to poor writing or just downright a mysoginistic depection of Samus.
 

Ushojax

Should probably not trust the 7-11 security cameras quite so much
I would argue that it is more extreme incompetence then actual sexism. I'm sure Sakamoto has a rather fucked pereception of women, but it really shouldn't show in the game. How can you fuck a story for a Metroid game? Its a franchise that has giant flying dinosaur and an evil brain as reoccurring villains. And you manage to fuck it up.
Is there a video game Rezzy for bad stories?

The game is just very Japanese, that's the harsh truth. The writing is painfully expository and there's a creepy lustfulness to the depiction of Samus. In a Western studio the script would have been vetoed immediately, it makes Samus a pathetic character rather than a hero.

Thankfully Nintendo is not stupid, they know Other M was a mistake and that's why the francise is on hiatus. If they thought anybody liked it we would already have got a sequel.
 

also

Banned
The authorization system has very large downright sexists connotations. I rather have a silly videogame logic explanation that one that destroys one of the best female figures in gaming.

What's sexist about a soldier having to follow orders from a superior?

Every mission Samus takes on is considered a suicide mission.

... And if the game had let us PLAY that section, we would have survived it and emerged the hero of the story, instead of the battered housewife she ultimately became in that scene.

Besides, I'll take "fully powered Samus surrounded by Metroids" (her element) versus "helpless Samus gasping on the floor next to life-sucking Metroid because her idiot not-really-boss shot her instead of warning her".

Because if there's one thing Samus proved in Other M, it's that she NEVER follows orders, right?
Yeah no. None of her missions are suicidal. they are exterminations or investigations of planets/space ships. None of them pit her against invincible enemies.

There's a huge difference between following ordinary orders (use minimum fire power to minimize collateral damage, investigate the area assigned by your superior) and saying: ''Yeah, you go on your suicide mission. It's not like I care for you or anything. I'll just calmly accept it and not overpower you and rush to my certain death. I mean I am the badass Samus Aran, the robot with no feelings whatsoever!''
 

RagnarokX

Member
Sure, but the fact remains that he should still treat Samus as an equal in that situation, not as a superior unless she willingly lets that happen. Which she does, but only because the writing in this game is godawful. He was never in charge of her, the point is that she doesn't interfere with their work. She mainly went along with him out of some twisted respect for the man but repays that by treating her like worse than a child. (inb4baby)

Also, sure they are the ones who usually employ her, but as an argument that is pretty weak given that the nature of her job as a bounty hunter is to work independently from the government. It's a detail that can be easily overlooked in some other game where she just works for some rich dude who needs her to go kick ass because of whatever reason, or something else that isn't the galactic government. Plus as you said it yourself, in Metroid Fusion she outright becomes a criminal in the eyes of the government. I doubt she cares very much about their future employment if she's later willing to do something like that.

Why should he treat her as an equal. He is an official authority figure and she is a mercenary. He has command. He didn't have to let her help at all. He could have told her to take a hike.

Samus is a good person who works to ensure the safety of the galaxy. Who is she going to work for to carry out her mission in life if she betrays the government? She's not going to become an outlaw. She only does so in Fusion after it's reveal that the government has become corrupt, and her musing on what will happen afterwards is that she will be held responsible rather than live as an outlaw. In Other M the government itself isn't corrupt yet. The incident was orchestrated by a shadow organization within the government. The upper command agreed with Adam that weaponizing metroids was too dangerous and it was they who sent Adam on his mission to the Bottle Ship. This authority is instrumental in the heroes getting away from the corrupt military officials at the end.
Samus is not actually under Adam's commands. She's not part of the federation, she willingly chooses to follow his orders, although she's way more capable than him.

The result is basically an abusive relationship, in which Adam, makes considerable efforts to hurt her psychologically and physically, only because she opposed him once.

The inherent implications of all this are quite clear, be an accident due to poor writing or just downright a mysoginistic depection of Samus.

You don't have to be an official employee to be under someone's command. I'm not employed by the police or the military but they can still arrest me if I commit a crime. Samus interfering with Adam's investigation would constitute a crime. He gave her permission to assist his investigation if she followed his command. In other words, he hired her. She IS way more capable than Adam. But she's not a mindless shooting machine. She respects the government and its law as a citizen.

Adam is not abusive. He comes across as trying to act impersonal and impartial towards Samus since he feels somewhat betrayed by her and because he has very personal feelings towards her and this is a very important official mission where he can't let feelings interfere, but he doesn't try to hurt her. His cold facade doesn't last very long and concern for Samus creeps into his voice over the course of the game. The varia suit thing was dumb but that was just lazy. They devs wanted Samus to go through a section where she takes heat damage so they had her go through a heat section without the varia suit. It's not like they had a scene where Adam was going "Mwahaha she'll pay for what she did to me!" They could have fixed the whole thing by having Adam say "Sorry, Samus, I was getting something to eat and was away from the comm. Activate your varia suit." More seriously, they could have just said comms were down and Adam couldn't reach her.
 
The two don't have to be mutual exclusive. He is both a high-ranking official AND a guy lording that power over one of the most powerful women in video games.

Secondly, he technically has NO authority over Samus. At all.

Thirdly, how many times has Adam saved the galaxy? Everyone always brings up the fact he should treat her as an equal.

Playing a bit of devil's advocate here...isn't Samus basically a gun-for-hire who more or less stumbled into an official Federation op? She really shouldn't exactly have free reign in that kind of situation.

In that respect, it makes sense that the commanding officer would expect her to fall in line if she wanted to stick around, and that she, as a professional, would comply.

The screwed up part comes into play when Adam authorizes his men to use weapons that he doesn't authorize Samus to use, the whole Varia Suit thing, and several other instances of screwed upedness.

The basic premise makes a bit of sense, but the execution is bunk.
 

Garlador

Member
Yeah no. None of her missions are suicidal. they are exterminations or investigations of planets/space ships. None of them pit her against invincible enemies.

Heading into the core of an entire planet of Metroids (which, I remind you, are the deadliest things in the known galaxy), alone, without back-up or support, to commit genocide against every last single one of them... doesn't strike you as a "suicide" mission?

Besides, you seem to forget her facing off against the "invincible" SA-X in Fusion, the "invincible" Mother Brain in Super Metroid, and other invincible enemies.

Besides, even then, the Metroids weren't invincible. They were just immune to cold. ... And I was blowing them up with missiles and Power Bombs without Ice Beams long before Other M told me it was "impossible" to freeze them (which, of course, happens only a few seconds after ADAM FREEZES ONE).

Playing a bit of devil's advocate here...isn't Samus basically a gun-for-hire who more or less stumbled into an official Federation op? She really shouldn't exactly have free reign in that kind of situation.
Allow me some fun with a witty and informative counter!

Apparently, the "Federation" op was "off-books" to begin with (they were conducting illegal experimentation), so it was, in reality, not an "official" Federation op. Still, I agree that a marginal compromise should exist so she didn't have free reign... but I draw the line at having someone else limit her own life-saving defense equipment, refusing to trust ANY of her judgement (again, galaxy savior here, boys), and the fact that the "S.O.S." actually came from the scientist division, not the military, and Adam could have easily given her free reign to locate and rescue civilians and lab workers without. It's the same reason we give doctors the freedom to save lives during police shootouts without telling them how to do their jobs. So long as you don't interfere, what would be the issue?

In that respect, it makes sense that the commanding officer would expect her to fall in line if she wanted to stick around, and that she, as a professional, would comply.
At this point, however, I would argue that Samus's legacy and "rank" is beyond Adam's. She's the one who blew up the entire Space Pirate armada, destroyed the Metroid menace, save the galaxy a half-dozen times, and, at least in the Prime games, has the respect and support of some of the Federation's highest ranking officials... folks like Admiral Dane (who, as an admiral, far outranks "Commander" Malkovich). She did what the entire Federation couldn't... on her own.

If Adam was a good Commander, he'd know whom he was dealing with and not let petty personal matters muddy his investigation... but he is petty and those matters do. Rather than let her HELP, he, in actuality, impedes their investigation, limits his assets, and restricts one of their most skilled and brilliant warriors (and detectives, going by prior games investigative puzzles). It was a terrible call.

Samus, even as a professional, would be allowed the leeway to think and act for herself in life-threatening situations. ALL soldiers are allowed the right to refuse cruel or unreasonable orders, and Samus is not a soldier. It's like telling a firefighter not to use oxygen when going into a burning building. Those are just stupid orders.

The screwed up part comes into play when Adam authorizes his men to use weapons that he doesn't authorize Samus to use, the whole Varia Suit thing, and several other instances of screwed upedness.

The basic premise makes a bit of sense, but the execution is bunk.
And, ultimately, it's all in the execution, isn't it?

A good premise can be entirely undone with shoddy execution. I won't argue Other M had some good ideas, but good ideas that don't work in execution ultimately aren't good for anyone.
 

RagnarokX

Member
Heading into the core of an entire planet of Metroids (which, I remind you, are the deadliest things in the known galaxy), alone, without back-up or support, to commit genocide against every last single one of them... doesn't strike you as a "suicide" mission?

Besides, you seem to forget her facing off against the "invincible" SA-X in Fusion, the "invincible" Mother Brain in Super Metroid, and other invincible enemies.

Besides, even then, the Metroids weren't invincible. They were just immune to cold. ... And I was blowing them up with missiles and Power Bombs without Ice Beams long before Other M told me it was "impossible" to freeze them (which, of course, happens only a few seconds after ADAM FREEZES ONE).

Samus won't refuse deadly missions but none of her missions were unwinnable. Metroids are usually killable. Samus was trained by the chozo to kill metroids. The metroids in Sector 0 were designed to be unkillable by Samus' weaponry and the only way to get rid of them, according to the game, was to literally commit suicide by triggering a self-destruct mechanism that sealed off the sector which is triggered by causing damage to the sector, which I imagine setting off power bombs would do. Adam also explains why that infant metroid was freezable.
 
Top Bottom