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[caliph95]

The Problem of Lady Robots: Feminist Theory Part 1 | The Whole Plate Episode 5

Lindsay Ellis a film critic has been doing an analysis and commentary of the Bay Transformer's movies as part of her Whole Plate series. This is the fifth episode but i don't think you need to watch the other videos even if you feel you have to those videos are each around 10-12 minutes.

This particular video is more on the female robotic and transformers in the Bay series while touching of feminist theory particularly in film criticism.

 

[Mimosa97]

I love lindsay but I don't think I could make it through a video about Transformers.

 

[Htown]

watched it earlier

that quote about Arcee is the dumbest thing in the world

 

[caliph95]

watched it earlier

that quote about Arcee is the dumbest thing in the world

Somehow i doubt the average movie goer (especially with them knowing that they are getting into) really cares if they are female robots

 

[spiderman123]

Somehow i doubt the average movie goer really cares if they are female robots

But let's be real Micheal Bay is sexist though.

 

[marzlapin]

Her name is actually Lindsay Ellis

 

[Pluto]

Lindsay chez a film critic ...

Her name is Lindsay Ellis, her channel used to be called Chez Lindsay (french for at Lindsay's).

 

[caliph95]

Her name is Lindsay Ellis, her channel used to be called Chez Lindsay (french for at Lindsay's).

I know, was just using her YT name but will edit it because i just got two posts

 

[MMarston]

Bob Orci pulling the film equivalent of the Ubisoft card.

 

[Zeyphersan]

Lindsey does great work, I’ve pretty much loved everything she’s done for... god like 8 years now

 

[Pop-O-Matic]

Somehow i doubt the average movie goer (especially with them knowing that they are getting into) really cares if they are female robots

You'd be shocked at how many fans get hung up over the whole Female Transformers issue. Hell, even a couple of the writers for the franchise fucking aren't too keen on them, considering how at one point Arcee's origin was "human feminists get pissed about there being no female Autobots, so they make one to appease them, only for them to start complaining about how stereotypically girly she is."

 

[caliph95]

You'd be shocked at how many fans get hung up over the whole Female Transformers issue. Hell, even a couple of the writers for the franchise fucking aren't too keen on them, considering how at one point Arcee's origin was "human feminists get pissed about there being no female Autobots, so they make one to appease them, only for them to start complaining about how stereotypically girly she is."

Yeah true i heard of it and i'm bit ignorant of the fandom though i doubt for the general audience and such (including me to be honest) is going to make or break it for them. Just basing it on how Beast Wars, Beast Machines ,Animated and Prime (from the shows i watch) and the more recent IDW comics have them and i know the MTME comic is top seller on cmx in the uk. Though from what i know of originally Arcee it's not like she was the most "feminist-friendly" of transformers

 

[Herr Schwarz]

Hoping for lots of femmbot imagery.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

I love lindsay but I don't think I could make it through a video about Transformers.

She's made 3 (4?) now about Bayformers and they're all brilliant.

Plus, why enter the thread with this declaration? Just fuckin watch it or don't.

 

[Zelenogorsk]

Great video. I can't wait for the video about the human women (or should I say objects) in the series.

 

[excelsiorlef]

You'd be shocked at how many fans get hung up over the whole Female Transformers issue. Hell, even a couple of the writers for the franchise fucking aren't too keen on them, considering how at one point Arcee's origin was "human feminists get pissed about there being no female Autobots, so they make one to appease them, only for them to start complaining about how stereotypically girly she is."

I totally thought that was satire at first... yikes

 

[John Kowalski]

Oh shit I'll have to wait until the end of the day to watch this...

 

[mrklaw]

Why would people expect there to be male/female robots and not just - robots? There is no mummy and daddy robot involved when making a new one so wouldn't they be entirely non sexual?

 

[excelsiorlef]

Why would people expect there to be male/female robots and not just - robots? There is no mummy and daddy robot involved when making a new one so wouldn't they be entirely non sexual?

So why are they all basically voiced by male actors?

I'd imagine they use pronouns in the movie.

I mean shit Bay managed to make black stereotype robots.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

Why would people expect there to be male/female robots and not just - robots? There is no mummy and daddy robot involved when making a new one so wouldn't they be entirely non sexual?

Because escapist fiction thrives when it gives the audience someone to identify with, and in this case, the producers of the Transformers series, unconsciously or not, have defaulted to a bunch of grizzled dude-o-bots who pee while standing up on John Turturro, have big old mechanical beards, giant pectoral...metal plates, wrecking balls between their legs and deep husky voices. They have gender because the creator wants us to see ourselves in the heroes and villains of the film.

 

[Garrett Hawke]

Lindsey does great work, I’ve pretty much loved everything she’s done for... god like 8 years now

I only discovered her thanks to that mel brooks vid someone posted on here a while ago but she's great and I'm glad

 

[MisterHero]

Why would people expect there to be male/female robots and not just - robots? There is no mummy and daddy robot involved when making a new one so wouldn't they be entirely non sexual?

Would you make a Barbie convertible into a male Transformer?

I guess you could, but...

 

[Deleted member 10571]

Well now I want a Transformers reboot with Optimus and Megatron being pseudo-female robots.

 

[caliph95]

Well now I want a Transformers reboot with Optimus and Megatron being pseudo-female robots.

now you reminded me about that shitty TRANSformer video

 

[RedHoodedOwl]

So, a decepticon dry humping Megan Fox's leg is more credible than the concept of Arcee.

 

[EdibleKnife]

Would you make a Barbie convertible into a male Transformer?

I guess you could, but...

From the perspective of the writers of this series: Instead of making her female, they'd probably keep the convertible as male and use it as an opportunity for a pathetic, low-hanging joke about how the Transformer was gay because it was pink.

 

[G-Fex]

seeing how many gaffers were confused and erratic over the announcement of female droids in the han solo movie. No I think a lot of nerds/movie goers really can't handle the concept of female robots or female anything else in their movies.

 

[Tye The Czar]

now you reminded me about that shitty TRANSformer video

It reminded me of the far superior Panty & Stocking with Garterbelt parody.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Please also remember that somehow Bay managed to perpetuate the whole "black guy always dies" by killing the robot, voiced by a black man, named Jazz.

It'd be impressive if it wasn't so pathetic.

 

[Mimosa97]

She's made 3 (4?) now about Bayformers and they're all brilliant.

Plus, why enter the thread with this declaration? Just fuckin watch it or don't.

I fucking told myself the same shit but I still posted because I was bored and it was the first thing that came to my mind and also shitting on a reviled franchise like Transformers is a super easy jab that makes me feel good because I'm empty inside

 

[caliph95]

Please also remember that somehow Bay managed to perpetuate the whole black guy always dies by killing the robot ,voiced by a black man, named Jazz.

It'd be impressive if it wasn't so pathetic.

Personally it would be a decent argument about them being alien robots (not like even the best transformers makes sense to begin with) if they actually act like it but then you have the "black", "french", and a samurai robots that is goes to a point to of who gives a shit a really and why not. especially when they already did in the second movie and that pretender, it just an excuse.

 

[MisterHero]

From the perspective of the writers of this series: Instead of making her female, they'd probably keep the convertible as male and use it as an opportunity for a pathetic, low-hanging joke about how the Transformer was gay because it was pink.

And all I was thinking of was making a Transformers toy for girls. Shit. The pink might be a bit much these days though.

Oh... she's only going in on Bayformers [writers] and not the franchise itself. Carry on I guess.

 

[Cheerilee]

watched it earlier

that quote about Arcee is the dumbest thing in the world

IIRC, it was said that Kurtzman and Orci were pushing for motorcycle-Arcee in the first Bayformers movie, but Michael Bay shot them down because he felt she would be too small, too weak for his testosterone festival.

Kurtzman and Orci responded by reimagining her for the second movie as a combiner, made of three component motorcycles, that way her robot mode would be bigger. Michael Bay apparently agreed and then had her killed off out of spite.


Away from Michael Bay, and in charge of their own cartoon (Transformers Prime, which somehow happens to be one of the best Transformers cartoons ever) Kurtzman and Orci very-deliberately put their version of Arcee in as a main character, and she's great, and they didn't have to explain shit about robot gender, even though they had 26 episodes to work with in the first season, with several episodes delving into Arcee's backstory.

IMO, Orci was probably just making up a story to cover for the terrible decisions made by his terrible boss.

 

[SiegfriedFM]

The IDW comics have subtly begun exploring regular Transformers "male" relationships, to great effect. Most notably

Spoiler

Chromedome and Rewind, with both of them having previous relationships too

.

That's definitely something we're never ever ever ever ever ever going to see in a Bay film though, unless it was played for laughs complete with every caricature you can think of.

I'm not up to Windblade yet though, so it will be interesting to see how the comic deals with more female characters than just Arcee.

 

[SchrodingerC]

Oh yeah, I forgot there was a human transformer in TF2. How was that even a thing.

Oh Bob Orci, you fucking hack, I'd wished Hollywood would throw you out, but they keep you up the ladder.

 

[caliph95]

Oh yeah, I forgot there was a human transformer in TF2. How was that even a thing.

Oh Bob Orci, you fucking hack, I'd wished Hollywood would throw you out, but they keep you up the ladder.

From interviews it seems to be a bay thing not an orci and kurtzman thing. While i'm not the biggest fans they did have two prominent transformers in Prime which is their show so it points to it being Bay not wanting to add.

 

[Crocodile]

Good video, pretty much all on point

I'd never heard of Lindsay Ellis before, I'll going to take a stroll through some of her past videos. It seems she's done a lot of videos on Transformers? I wonder why this series caught her interest (or is it just because it provides a lot of fodder for this sort of analysis?).

 

[Kinyou]

IIRC, it was said that Kurtzman and Orci were pushing for motorcycle-Arcee in the first Bayformers movie, but Michael Bay shot them down because he felt she would be too small, too weak for his testosterone festival.

Kurtzman and Orci responded by reimagining her for the second movie as a combiner, made of three component motorcycles, that way her robot mode would be bigger. Michael Bay apparently agreed and then had her killed off out of spite.


Away from Michael Bay, and in charge of their own cartoon (Transformers Prime, which somehow happens to be one of the best Transformers cartoons ever) Kurtzman and Orci very-deliberately put their version of Arcee in as a main character, and she's great, and they didn't have to explain shit about robot gender, even though they had 26 episodes to work with in the first season, with several episodes delving into Arcee's backstory.

IMO, Orci was probably just making up a story to cover for the terrible decisions made by his terrible boss.

Ah, always wondered why they introduced those cool motorcycle bots and then barely featured them. Really and idiotic move by Bay. Even if you look at it without regarding gender, it's only positive to bring in more variation into the action and to have a character you can so clearly identify compared to all the other throwaway autobots.

 

[HStallion]

I'm not sure Michael Bay is the one to look for positive female role models and that isn't saying her criticisms are wrong or pointless but the dude is known for making racial stereotypes into Transformers and giving robots giant wrecking ball testicles. These movies have been questionable since minute 1 of the first film.

 

[Infinite]

Good video, pretty much all on point

I'd never heard of Lindsay Ellis before, I'll going to take a stroll through some of her past videos. It seems she's done a lot of videos on Transformers? I wonder why this series caught her interest (or is it just because it provides a lot of fodder for this sort of analysis?).

You should watch the first episode of this series. She answers your question

 

[JonnyDBrit]

Honestly, that whole spiel about female transformers being too confusing to introduce in the first film just makes the inclusion of Alice all the more baffling. The only reason I understood what the hell she was - a Pretender - was because even at 14 I was a weeb who'd watched an anime that never left Japan.

Still, the topic of gendering robots is certainly an interesting one, and it does feel... telling, how the movies are currently the exception to the rule og the franchise.

 

[muteki]

I'm kinda surprised they haven't put Windblade and Nautica in the movies considering their popularity elsewhere.

 

[Cheerilee]

Ah, always wondered why they introduced those cool motorcycle bots and then barely featured them. Really and idiotic move by Bay. Even if you look at it without regarding gender, it's only positive to bring in more variation into the action and to have a character you can so clearly identify compared to all the other throwaway autobots.

Arcee vs Soundwave

Two of the bots Kurtzman & Orci were told "weren't badass enough" to be included in Bayformers 1.

 

[Sunster]

awwww i wanted her to get to the Megan Fox part but it ended. great video, i knew transformers was dumb but i didn't think of all the stuff at play when making a movie franchise like this.

 

[Toxi]

Why would people expect there to be male/female robots and not just - robots? There is no mummy and daddy robot involved when making a new one so wouldn't they be entirely non sexual?

Because there are already male robots. Optimus Prime is a dude. He is not genderless and never has been.

Also, because there have been female Transformers since fucking G1.

 

[Htown]

Good video, pretty much all on point

I'd never heard of Lindsay Ellis before, I'll going to take a stroll through some of her past videos. It seems she's done a lot of videos on Transformers? I wonder why this series caught her interest (or is it just because it provides a lot of fodder for this sort of analysis?).

She used to go by Nostalgia Chick. She used to do reviews that were a more like Nostalgia Critic's and were hosted on his site. Over time she's transitioned into more in-depth commentary on movies and mostly dropped the surface level nostalgia review format

I'm not sure Michael Bay is the one to look for positive female role models and that isn't saying her criticisms are wrong or pointless but the dude is known for making racial stereotypes into Transformers and giving robots giant wrecking ball testicles. These movies have been questionable since minute 1 of the first film.

Yeah, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be talked about.

She's doing a whole series on Transformers. This is just part of it.

 

[MUnited83]

Why would people expect there to be male/female robots and not just - robots? There is no mummy and daddy robot involved when making a new one so wouldn't they be entirely non sexual?

Yes, that's literally a robot with a beard.

 

[sphagnum]

Oh yeah, I forgot there was a human transformer in TF2. How was that even a thing.

Pretenders have been a thing since G1. There was a whole show about them (Masterforce).

Also for people confused about Transformers having genders, they've always had them. It's just part of the franchise.

 

[Freeza Under The Shower]

watched it earlier

that quote about Arcee is the dumbest thing in the world

It's as Orci ( and Kurtzman) as you would expect.

 

[Einchy]

Yes, that's literally robot with a beard.

I also like this one.