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[D.Lo]

Not Master System, but I recently bought a ton of random Japanese Game Gear manuals for The Video Game Art Archive for me to scan and extract, and two of them were Madou Monogatari games.

It's almost forgotten now, but Madou Monogatari is the series which birthed the Puyo Puyo series. Same characters, Puyos are basically the "slime", and it's a super hardcore dungeon crawl styled game. So weird that Puyo had a life way before the puzzle series which it's mainly known for now.

Pretty cool, I had no idea Puyo had a history. Makes sense though, given the games. Like everyone I was addicted to Super Puyo Puyo in the early 90s!

 

[D.Lo]

I have a sickness

RGB mod capable SG1000 II added to the collection. Might whip that mod up this weekend

 

[ResidentDante]

I have a sickness

RGB mod capable SG1000 II added to the collection. Might whip that mod up this weekend

Nice to see all three like that. Are they all a step up in power, or is the SG-1000 II just a new version of the SG-1000? Do they in that case have a library for each console, with gradually more advanced games?

I know the Mark III = MS, and that SG-1000 was Sega's first, but I know very little of the SG-1000 II.

 

[Khaz]

SG1000, II and SC3000/H are the same with different cases, II accepts cards and the SC3000 has a keyboard, while the SG1000 needs external peripherals for compatibility.

The Mark III has an upgraded video processor, faster with extra colour modes. it has retro-compatibility with SG1000 games. The western Master System is identical to the Mark III except for the shell and the cartridge pinout. The Japanese Master System looks like a Western Master System but with the FM and 3D boards added internally.

 

[Jonneh3003]

Just found out Sonic Blast we ported to the Master System but only in Brazil! How bizzare. I'm kind of tempted to pick it up but the whole being £200 thing is a little off putting.

 

[Morfeo]

It will be much nicer with pics of the real controllers lined up, but basically the gist of it is this:

• 1981 Nintendo completely reinvents cheap directional input with the calculator style plastic to rubber membrane design of the d-pad in the Donkey Kong Game and Watch. Equal (or close) to microswitch joysticks in speed, reliability and precision. Vastly superior to Atari joysticks and buttons which use leaf connectors (bending metal) to register button/direction presses.
• 1983 Nintendo releases the Famicom with controllers which feature the Donkey Kong dpad, and soft rubber A/B buttons (this is the square button Famicom). The rubber buttons are not the best, for this reason (combined with a chip issue) Nintendo recalls these models in early 1984 and replaces them for customers. Of note, the Famicom has spots to dock the controllers on the side of the console, so cords came out the side of controllers.
• 1983 Sega releases SG1000 with primitive old paradigm joystick that uses terrible old leaf connectors
• 1984 Nintendo updates the Famicom controller to have hard plastic over rubber membrane A/B buttons for better responsiveness
• 1984 Sega Releases the SG1000 II, with SJ-150 controller which has a variation of the Famicom dpad, but a copy of the original Famicom soft rubber A/B buttons. Console also features controller docks on the side of the console.
• 1985 Sega releases the SJ-151 controller with later SG1000 II consoles with hard plastic over rubber membrane A/B buttons. The first all round good Sega pad (I think my favourite 8-bit Sega pad too)
• 1985 Sega releases the Mark III with SJ-152 controller, basically just a redesign of the SJ-151. Continues to feature controller docks.
• 1985 Nintendo brings the Famicom west as the NES with an externally redesigned (more squared off) controller that keeps all internals of the hard button Famicom pad as-is (it even uses the same board) and due to the NES having no controller docks, it even improves the Famicom pad slightly by having the cords come out the top instead of the side of the controller.
• 1986 Sega brings the Mark III west as the Master System, like the NES no controller docks, with an externally redesigned (more squared off controller) that still has the cords out the side, and a much worse less responsive larger square dpad than the SJ-151 or SJ-152. It is also made with cheaper plastic as the console is produced outside Japan in various places like Taiwan (Mark III and earlier, and all Nintendo consoles until the Wii, were made in Japan)
• 1987 Sega revises the Master System pad to have the cord come out the top like the NES, but the revision has an even worse, cheaper dpad than the first MS one that breaks in the corners.

Poor Sega, literally 1-3 years behind at every single step.

This is incredible!

 

[IrishNinja]

fantastic write-up D Lo, thanks for that man

hey, so i intend to get a master everdrive one day to dive into the SG-1000's library, what are the best titles to start with there?

 

[Fatnick]

fantastic write-up D Lo, thanks for that man

hey, so i intend to get a master everdrive one day to dive into the SG-1000's library, what are the best titles to start with there?

There are quite a few arcade ports on there that never really made it onto any other Sega hardware, like Star Jacker and Monaco GP.

My personal hat-tip goes to GP World: The original was a laser-disk coin-up, the port is basically proto Super Monaco...WITH A TRACK EDITOR!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cekbAQrL9s

 

[D.Lo]

For SG1000 I think my favourites are:

Girl's Garden
Star Jacker
Golgo 13
Orguss
Ninja Princess
Dragon Wang

Congo Bongo is also fun
Exerion is very impressive for the hardware.

 

[Khaz]

Of the ones I have, I really enjoy

The Castle
Choplifter
Girl's Garden
Ninja Princess

And also Lode Runner and Space Invaders, but you can find those everywhere.

I know Star Jacker will get on that list as soon as I get it.

 

[IrishNinja]

There are quite a few arcade ports on there that never really made it onto any other Sega hardware, like Star Jacker and Monaco GP.

My personal hat-tip goes to GP World: The original was a laser-disk coin-up, the port is basically proto Super Monaco...WITH A TRACK EDITOR!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cekbAQrL9s

For SG1000 I think my favourites are:

Girl's Garden
Star Jacker
Golgo 13
Orguss
Ninja Princess
Dragon Wang

Congo Bongo is also fun
Exerion is very impressive for the hardware.

thanks for these, guys! it's gonna be a while before i can get a master everdrive (again, need to buy back an SMS first) but as a classic sega fan i really can't wait to dive into this library. i had a lotta fun with the saturn Memorial 1/2 discs that had lots of older arcade stuff that i don't even believe left japan, in some instances

also: i had congo bongo on Atari 400, is that about the same you think?

 

[MikeMyers]

Was the Street Fighter 2 port any good?

 

[Morfeo]

I spent yesterday evening trying to get anywhere in Wonder Boy in Monster Land. Boy is this game both good - and cryptic! The controls are great, and I really like the upgrade-system where especially the boots make a huge difference in the controls. The hit-detection is not perfect, which is apparent when you fight the enemies that descend on you - seems completely random if you hit them or they hit you first. Graphics is excellent for an 8-bit title, and while I love the rpg-mechanics, the random money-jumping does get old. Anyways, I think I came to level 10 or something once, dont know how many there are, but will hopefully find out during the weekend.

 

[MikeMyers]

I wonder what the best selling Master System games are. I imagine Alex Kidd and Zillion?

 

[D.Lo]

I wonder what the best selling Master System games are. I imagine Alex Kidd and Zillion?

Highest selling in Japan by far is Fantasy Zone.

Interestingly Konami's higher selling Famicom game was Twinbee.

Japanese love their cute-em-ups!

 

[DarkSniper]

I loved the Master System. I used to play the sh*t out of Rocky back when I was a kid.

 

[MikeMyers]

Huh. Would have thought Phantasy Star for Japan.

 

[D.Lo]

Huh. Would have thought Phantasy Star for Japan.

It was covered in one of the M2 3D classics interviews. That's why there was a console exclusive Fantasy Zone 2, because the first was the best selling game on the Mark III.

 

[crpav]

I loved the Master System. I used to play the sh*t out of Rocky back when I was a kid.

I was an NES guy but had a friend who was all SEGA. I have a soft spot in my heart for all systems. I enjoyed my NES but also have fond memories of playing SEGA at his house and Rocky was one of them. Could never beat Drago.

I finally jumped into the SEGA scene with the Genesis late in it's life though as I had a SNES first. Same friend had the Genesis from launch and played plenty of that at his house until I got mine. He of course also got the SEGA CD when it came out. I got mine later but never any games because it was at the end of it's life. Don't even bring up the 32x. Biggest waste of money I have ever spent.

 

[Morfeo]

Been playing some more Wonder Boy in Monster Land and finally managed to get to the castle, which I assume is the last level. But that level is a true fuck-you, as it has diverging pathways as in the last castle in SMB, always sending you back to the beginning when you take the wrong turn. And as your health decreases with time - I ended up dying from time, not enemies - which felt really cheap and a sign of the games arcade origins. Still, after two evenings of play, I am now pretty close to the end, so I guess I just need to try a bit more. Love the light rpg-mechanics, Ive had a ton of fun trying to figure out the best way to spend my money to get as good a gear as possible for as little money as possible, but still progressing decently so I dont waste my potion (your only extra life) to early. Managed to keep hold on my potion until the boss in level 10 on this run, which I think is pretty good. Have anybody else tried to legitimately beat this game?

Edit: That final level is Monster Land is some serious bullshit. I can now get to it every time, but this level is just made by some serious sadists. First of all, the level has several ways to go, and always sends you back to the start if you take a wrong turn. Second, it has that terrible system from the original Wonder Boy where your health is drained as the time progress, meaning you can absolutely not waste time on going wrong, but third - there is seriously no way to know which way is correct untill you have tried, meaning you will go wrong a ton of times, thus dying of the time limit. This wouldnt be so wrong if it was possible to replenish your health, from instance from defeating enemies, but the fourth flaw is that all the enemies here only gives money - while there are no shops to spend the money in (at least that I have found). So yeah, this level really is from hell.

 

[IrishNinja]

Highest selling in Japan by far is Fantasy Zone.

huh, did not know this - explains why Opa-Opa was sort of tried as their mascot for a bit before Alex Kidd.

 

[D.Lo]

Been playing some more Wonder Boy in Monster Land and finally managed to get to the castle, which I assume is the last level. But that level is a true fuck-you, as it has diverging pathways as in the last castle in SMB, always sending you back to the beginning when you take the wrong turn. And as your health decreases with time - I ended up dying from time, not enemies - which felt really cheap and a sign of the games arcade origins. Still, after two evenings of play, I am now pretty close to the end, so I guess I just need to try a bit more. Love the light rpg-mechanics, Ive had a ton of fun trying to figure out the best way to spend my money to get as good a gear as possible for as little money as possible, but still progressing decently so I dont waste my potion (your only extra life) to early. Managed to keep hold on my potion until the boss in level 10 on this run, which I think is pretty good. Have anybody else tried to legitimately beat this game?

Edit: That final level is Monster Land is some serious bullshit. I can now get to it every time, but this level is just made by some serious sadists. First of all, the level has several ways to go, and always sends you back to the start if you take a wrong turn. Second, it has that terrible system from the original Wonder Boy where your health is drained as the time progress, meaning you can absolutely not waste time on going wrong, but third - there is seriously no way to know which way is correct untill you have tried, meaning you will go wrong a ton of times, thus dying of the time limit. This wouldnt be so wrong if it was possible to replenish your health, from instance from defeating enemies, but the fourth flaw is that all the enemies here only gives money - while there are no shops to spend the money in (at least that I have found). So yeah, this level really is from hell.

Haha yea, it was a cool game and hooked my imagination as a kid, it's a nice balance of level based and adventure gameplay. But it is totally busted, a leftover of its arcade heritage.

I recommend the patch for infinite energy:
http://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=971.0

The PCE version (Bikkuriman World) is actually the most solid, and near arcade perfect.

 

[D.Lo]

Question - does anyone have a Master System controller with the cord out the side - that they would sell? Ideally one with the screw-in centre knob thing, but I don't need the knob I have many of them already from Mark III controllers.

I realised I sold mine, and I want one for my 8-bit controller article.

 

[MikeMyers]

Well, on popular Master System games, here is what TecToy had to say:

Sports games were very popular, football (soccer) games in particular, with FIFA being a great franchise that we strongly promoted on TV. Also, games like Sonic and Disney titles sold very, very well. Racing games and fighting games were a must. Virtua Fighter, Mortal Kombat, and Street Fighter were huge successes in Brazil. Even RPGs sold well. We localized RPG games for many different platforms, starting with Phantasy Star for Master System.

Granted that is just Brazil, but that was the Master System's biggest market. Good job Brazil on embracing the greatness of Virtua Fighter.

 

[D.Lo]

Granted that is just Brazil, but that was the Master System's biggest market. Good job Brazil on embracing the greatness of Virtua Fighter.

I don't think so, unless you break Europe into individual countries. It apparently sold 5 million there which is less than Europe. Brazil is a huge country, and the MS did better there than other consoles, but it's even today still a country with massive income inequality and poverty, let alone how bad it was in the 90s. So a low percentage of the population could buy video games.

Also I'm pretty iffy on counting non-Sega manufactured consoles, especially ones sold after Sega as a company actually ceased to exist (2004). Sega (or Sammy) wouldn't make much money. They didn't develop any of the software for the market (all those Monica games were nasty amateur rom hacks by tecoy), and they largely sold after it was officially a dead product by Sega themselves. Those 'built in games' Mega Drives for sale right now are exactly the same thing, and apparently sold 500k in the UK this year, but we don't count those as UK sales. Is there a single worthwhile Brazil-only MS game (that isn't a rom hack of a rom hacked game gear game)?

Similarly, there were likely 20-50 million (or maybe more) Famiclones sold in Asia and Eastern Europe too throughout the 90s and 2000s, which are basically the same thing except Nintendo didn't get a cut.

Interestingly, the reason the MS sold well in Brazil is because of massive import taxes, so local company manufactured machines would be the only ones that were affordable. Master System is a pretty basic off-the-shelf design (very few custom parts, due to its SG1000/Colecovision heritage) so is easy and cheap to manufacture an accurate clone of too. So a company licensed Sega's tech manufactured and released locally. Same thing happened in Korea.

 

[MikeMyers]

You're right, Europe sales were higher. I stand corrected.

Actually, TecToy did develop one game for the Master System & Mega Drive: A Woody Woodpecker game. They did some ports, such as an exclusive 8-bit port of Street Fighter 2. It could also be mentioned that Sega did develop Ayrton Senna's Super Monaco GP II with the Brazilian market in mind, if I remember correctly.

And yeah, there were plenty of NES clones, but those weren't officially licensed by Nintendo. While all those Sega-clones are actually licensed from Sega. It's generally why people count the later sales and not the former.

Where did you read that the Mega Drive sold 500k in the UK this year? Actually those, the US/UK Mega Drive clones do come with a cartridge slot. Doesn't work with Street Fighter 2 though...

EDIT: Also, I'm sure SEGA-Sammy would still get hardware royalties even if it wasn't the actual Sega anymore. Like how they own all the IP's the Sega of old created.

 

[D.Lo]

Actually, TecToy did develop one game for the Master System & Mega Drive: A Woody Woodpecker game. They did some ports, such as an exclusive 8-bit port of Street Fighter 2. It could also be mentioned that Sega did develop Ayrton Senna's Super Monaco GP II with the Brazilian market in mind, if I remember correctly.

Oh they did make games, but that's why I said worthwhile games. Woody and Street Fighter Look like pure garbage. they look, play and sound worse than games from 1985.

And yeah, there were plenty of NES clones, but those weren't officially licensed by Nintendo. While all those Sega-clones are actually licensed from Sega. It's generally why people count the later sales and not the former.

Well, they don't really count either. They're not Sega sales, just licencing fees Sega or Sammy collect. Just like how Sony can't and don't say they sold 10 million copies of Call of Duty 4 or whatever, even though they got fees for it. They're Activision's sales, not Sony's, Sony just gets a small fee. Sony can talk about having X software titles sold for their platform, but not that they sold those games themselves, and those sales are reported as fees in Sony earnings, not software titles sold. Same goes for licened accessories etc, fees, not sales.

There are arrangements when other companies sold for Sega/Nintendo - like Mattel for Nintendo in Italy or Ozisoft for Sega in Australia - but the consoles and games were still made by Sega/Nintendo, and just either distributed (Mattel) or packaged and distributed (Ozisoft) by the local distributor.

Where did you read that the Mega Drive sold 500k in the UK this year? Actually those, the US/UK Mega Drive clones do come with a cartridge slot. Doesn't work with Street Fighter 2 though...

I read it on some mainstream news site, don't remember which, may have just been a guess by some retailer.

EDIT: Also, I'm sure SEGA-Sammy would still get hardware royalties even if it wasn't the actual Sega anymore. Like how they own all the IP's the Sega of old created.

Yeah SegaSammy probably still get fees, unless the contract let the fees drop at some point. I mean the system is out of copyright now in Japan and the US, you can make Famicom and Mark III clones for free if you want with noting illegal about it.

 

[MikeMyers]

h they did make games, but that's why I said worthwhile games. Woody and Street Fighter Look like pure garbage. they look, play and sound worse than games from 1985.

B-but, it's like, the best port of Street Fighter 2 on a 8-bit console man!

Well, they don't really count either. They're not Sega sales, just licencing fees Sega or Sammy collect. Just like how Sony can't and don't say they sold 10 million copies of Call of Duty 4 or whatever, even though they got fees for it. They're Activision's sales, not Sony's, Sony just gets a small fee. Sony can talk about having X software titles sold for their platform, but not that they sold those games themselves, and those sales are reported as fees in Sony earnings, not software titles sold. Same goes for licened accessories etc, fees, not sales.

Well I would count them as sales but would agree on not counting them as Sega sales. For example, the Genesis wikipedia page puts the total sales as "Sega: 30 million, Tectoy: 3 million, etc." which I think is a fair perspective. The Nintendo clones aren't licensed by Nintendo, so they don't really qualify even if it just semantics really.

Though I would count the Nomad for Genesis Sega sales since Sega of America actually released that themselves.

I read it on some mainstream news site, don't remember which, may have just been a guess by some retailer.

The only article I can find is this one which doesn't give a number.

Yeah SegaSammy probably still get fees, unless the contract let the fees drop at some point. I mean the system is out of copyright now in Japan and the US, you can make Famicom and Mark III clones for free if you want with noting illegal about it.

I kinda wish Sega of old did copy TecToy's concept of keeping the old systems around. Sega was kinda notorious for killing their systems early. :/

 

[D.Lo]

B-but, it's like, the best port of Street Fighter 2 on a 8-bit console man!

Game Boy is much better. The sound in particular is like 1000 times better. The Game Boy is a more powerful system though.

Though I would count the Nomad for Genesis Sega sales since Sega of America actually released that themselves.

Nomad should definitely 100% count, it is literally a Genesis with a screen.

I kinda wish Sega of old did copy TecToy's concept of keeping the old systems around. Sega was kinda notorious for killing their systems early. :/

Not really possible. Systems can keep selling with legacy games, and do if they're profitable (the Famicom was in production and support for 20 years! But supporting and developing for the Mark III was likely never very profitable for Sega, the returns were not worth it.

TecToy's entire business model was viable only because there was 10 years of software developed for other markets (Japan, then Europe) that they could re-release adapted to a country who would be accepting of what was at that point ancient technology.

 

[MikeMyers]

Gameboy isn't a console.

Sorry, didn't make myself clear on the last part. What I mean is that Sega should have kept supporting their old systems. For example, Sega of Japan pretty much stopped supporting the Mega Drive once the Saturn came out worldwide, despite being an extremely profitable system. Later well known releases like Vectorman and Sonic 3D Blast were produced by Sega of America. Likewise, they dropped the Saturn early, even in Japan where it was actually pretty popular.

Granted TecToy's published games aren't anything to write home about but considering Sega is one the biggest software companies I'd imagine they could have kept console support going. Instead they just kept releasing hardware. :/

 

[Khaz]

I got a bunch of new SG-1000 games today, that I tested on the Master System. I got them directly from Japan, but customs noticed and I had to pay a hefty import tax. I'm not sure I would recommend their services, I'm not even sure they're cheaper than buyee with additional fees everywhere.

Pitfall II was one of my white whale, and it seems to hold up to my expectations. It is said to be quite different from 2600 Pitfall II: I don't know about that, but I liked what I played. My tower of power kept freezing so I couldn't go very far. Bonus points, it's entirely playable with the SMS colour palette, there is no black enemies on dark green background like in Ninja Princess.

H.E.R.O is the second Activision game I received, and quite a quality port too! I would argue that it's the best looking port, and also the most badass as the protagonist is now a rocket-man instead of a wimpy helicopter-man. Like Pitfall II, the game is completely playable on the Master System.

Bombjack is a bonus, and while the graphics ar quite crude compared to the arcade and some later computer ports, it plays nicely. I still think the Amstrad CPC port is the better of the 8bits systems, but this SG-1000 version has nothing to be ashamed of (ok, maybe the bomb sprite). The Master System palette clashes with the gameplay sometimes, but it's still playable. I am of the opinion that Bombjack could be made arcade-perfect on the Master System, but no one has tried yet.

Dragon Wang is the last game of the bundle, and I don't like it. Terrible controls, terrible design, not really pretty. I could have forgiven the controls and visuals if it was actually playable and enjoyable, but I don't think there is much to redeem in this game. Sorry Wang.

They are all card games, which means you can play them on a western Master System if you mod it to bypass the BIOS. Or with an Everdrive, whatever.

 

[entremet]

I was watching a Sega Master system stream and one of the hosts mentioned that he couldn't do the FM mod because he grew up with the original sound.

He mentioned he listed to the FM sound version of some of his faves and it felt off.

Interesting reasoning and actually very valid especially since game collecting is so nostalgia driven.

 

[Peagles]

I was watching a Sega Master system stream and one of the hosts mentioned that he couldn't do the FM mod because he grew up with the original sound.

He mentioned he listed to the FM sound version of some of his faves and it felt off.

Interesting reasoning and actually very valid especially since game collecting is so nostalgia driven.

I haven't listened to a lot of it but I feel this way about Wonder Boy III. The tracks are higher quality but because of that they sound softer and it just isn't the same for me.

 

[Khaz]

I don't know, I grew up playing a lot of Shinobi, but once I finally heard its FM soundtrack (not that long ago) I never went back.

 

[D.Lo]

I don't know, I grew up playing a lot of Shinobi, but once I finally heard its FM soundtrack (not that long ago) I never went back.

Me too, in almost every case.

The version that you grew up with or initially played through will always be the one you prefer when comparing ports or versions of specific games. But FM though a good amplifier dominates for me.

Try this sucka through some killer speakers and when the bass kicks in you think you're playing a Mega Drive.

 

[D.Lo]

I finished the article about the Nintendo/Sega controller rivalry, check it out here:

http://nintendosegajapan.com/2015/12/06/nintendo-and-segas-8-bit-controller-rivalry/

 

[lazygecko]

I still remember the day I accidentally hit the reset button on the console well into Wonder Boy 3 because Sega didn't have the courtesy of including a start button on the controller.

 

[Morfeo]

Haha yea, it was a cool game and hooked my imagination as a kid, it's a nice balance of level based and adventure gameplay. But it is totally busted, a leftover of its arcade heritage.

I recommend the patch for infinite energy:
http://krikzz.com/forum/index.php?topic=971.0

The PCE version (Bikkuriman World) is actually the most solid, and near arcade perfect.

It is a very good game imo, but yeah, that final level is bullshit.

Anyways, I just completed it after four days:

The game itself actually feels a lot like a game like FTL or other rogue-likes, were you try to get a perfect run to prepare yourself for the final challenge. In the end I was able to get to the castle every time, were I would usually die after wandering around aimlessly forever. I yesterday managed to get to a part that is a bit like an elevator where you have to jump upwards from plattform to plattform, and this area was by far the hardest part of the game:

So I spent like 4 runs just trying to complete this part, of course if you failed and fell down, you had to start the castle over, meaning you would eventually die thanks to the bullshit time killing you. It doesnt really look that hard if you watch it, for instance, on youtube, but what makes it hard is the iffy controls in this game, which means a jump would sometimes not register if you at the same time held in the direction-pad - which you wanted to do since you are going back and forth. This means you would often fall to your death (or rather, castle-start) even though you did press the jump-button - irritating me to no end (seriously, this would be a perfect part for all the "angre gamers" out there).

Anyways, after finally getting this down, there was still a labyrinth to find the right way in, but I was so happy after this, that I just guided the correct way, ending up at the final boss with half life, and a potion, so basically 3/4 life. I then managed to beat the final boss, a dragon which transforms into a mecha dragon, on my first try, still having about 1/4 life yet which felt amazing.

All in all, this first Monster Land-game is cool, and well worth owning and playing. Just not really worth completing if you are not a masochist. Probably about a 5 or 6 of 10. Now time to finally complete Wonder Boy 3: The Dragons Trap!

Edit: Just started Wonder Boy 3 - and boy is it cool that the game starts out in that caslte, with the character fully upgraded from Monster Land, and the fact that there is now NO FREAKING TIME LIMIT!

 

[Mzo]

The rewards from the hidden chain quest really help at the end. You get either a bell that rings when you go the right way in the castle or a weapon that automatically damages the final boss past it's first form.

Monster Land is the weakest of the adventure-y Wonder Boys but it's still a fun secrets game. You gotta know where to get those hidden coins and what order to buy the armor in to maximize your character.

 

[@MUWANdo]

EDIT: way too late, dude beat the game. Congrats!

Monster Land is the weakest of the adventure-y Wonder Boys

No way, it's just a different style of game.

Truth be told, I don't think MW2 holds up nearly as well as the other MW games.

 

[D.Lo]

I agree, Monster Land is my favourite I think.

 

[ResidentDante]

I finished the article about the Nintendo/Sega controller rivalry, check it out here:

http://nintendosegajapan.com/2015/12/06/nintendo-and-segas-8-bit-controller-rivalry/

Thanks for this! Gonna enjoy a read through it!

Edit: Just read it, great stuff!

I must ask, what the hell is this Sega controller: https://www.segaretro.org/SG_Commander

And how did it rip off the NES look so much without consequences of copyright infringements?

Double edit: Seems it was made by Hori in Japan, but branded as a Sega controller in Europe.

 

[D.Lo]

Yep it's a Hori pad.

They released exactly the same one for Famicom

And PC Engine

I guess they got around the copyright infringement by it being third party? Hard to say.

 

[ResidentDante]

Yep it's a Hori pad.

They released exactly the same one for Famicom

And PC Engine

I guess they got around the copyright infringement by it being third party? Hard to say.

Tried them? I guess they are worse than the Famicom/NES pads, but maybe better than Sega's own?

 

[D.Lo]

Tried them? I guess they are worse than the Famicom/NES pads, but maybe better than Sega's own?

Pretty much identical to Nintendo pads in feel. So yeah generally better than Sega pads.

Really though, only the SJ-200 and mid/late Chinese/Taiwanese Master System pads are outright bad. The rest are okay (Japanese made first MS, SJ-150) to decent (SJ-151 and SJ-152).

 

[ResidentDante]

Pretty much identical to Nintendo pads in feel. So yeah generally better than Sega pads.

Really though, only the SJ-200 and mid/late Chinese/Taiwanese Master System pads are outright bad. The least are okay (Japanese made first MS, SJ-150) to decent (SJ-151 and SJ-152).

Yeah, I've grown up on the standard MSII pad that followed along my console. I also had this "control stick" that somehow was mirrored compared to other sticks. I guess left handed people loved it. Never really liked it much and the top handle of the control stick is loose so it rotates while playing. This thing: https://www.segaretro.org/Control_Stick

 

[Khaz]

It's actually not mirrored, or inverted. The convention at the time was to control the directions, the main inputs, with the dominant (right) hand. Cf the Atari controllers and PC joysticks. Nintendo inverted it with its gamepad as the more important inputs became the action / jump buttons on platformers and games with multiple button use in general.

 

[D.Lo]

It's actually not mirrored, or inverted. The convention at the time was to control the directions, the main inputs, with the dominant (right) hand. Cf the Atari controllers and PC joysticks. Nintendo inverted it with its gamepad as the more important inputs became the action / jump buttons on platformers.

Yep, joystick was for the right hand on the Atari VCS.

Arcades had started trending toward having the joystick on the left for a few years (eg Space Invaders, Donkey Kong) as they started to realise the action buttons were the ones that require quicker reflexes and faster input (and most people are right handed).

Sega was just behind the curve with the SG1000 controller and that one.

 

[ResidentDante]

It's actually not mirrored, or inverted. The convention at the time was to control the directions, the main inputs, with the dominant (right) hand. Cf the Atari controllers and PC joysticks. Nintendo inverted it with its gamepad as the more important inputs became the action / jump buttons on platformers and games with multiple button use in general.

Interesting! I ended up being fairly good with it as a friend and me used to play the awesome Secret Command, I'd let him have the standard pad and I would use the control stick.

Edit: Quick question D.Lo: Will you be doing a 16-bit Nintendo and Sega controller write up or are you strictly a 8-bitter?

 

[Morfeo]

The rewards from the hidden chain quest really help at the end. You get either a bell that rings when you go the right way in the castle or a weapon that automatically damages the final boss past it's first form.

Monster Land is the weakest of the adventure-y Wonder Boys but it's still a fun secrets game. You gotta know where to get those hidden coins and what order to buy the armor in to maximize your character.

Yeah, I was eventually able to complete this. That guy in the shop near the end kept eluding me - and went with the bell until I had figured out my way to the elevator - and after that went with the ruby (and cheating with a guide to go the right way for the rest of the dungeon). I did manage to get all the best stuff pretty easily after a some runs, and then doing it consisently. Pretty fun figuring that stuff out!

EDIT: way too late, dude beat the game. Congrats!

No way, it's just a different style of game.

Truth be told, I don't think MW2 holds up nearly as well as the other MW games.

Thanks!

I agree, Monster Land is my favourite I think.

Not regarding that final level, I think it might be my favorite as well, but as a total package, I actually find it the weakest. Still had an absolute blast playing it up until then, which of course should count for something.