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[Rembrandt]

One of the worst ones is this one by Destructoid, which has a misleading, sensationalistic headline:

$6M isn't enough to make Shenmue 3 'gorgeous visually'

What Yu Suzuki said:



If it isn't clear: he didn't say that 6 million isn't enough to make the game "gorgeous visually", he said that they're prioritizing story over graphics.

The headlines of articles about the interview are sensationalistic in general, focussing on that Yu said that "he could do with a bit more money". Cause, you know, it's such shocking news that a game with a low budget could probably be better if they had some more money to spend.

that headline isn't the only thing that's misleading. that quote is weird and very open to interpretation.

 

[miku]

I'm going to write using proper punctuation for once, to show you that I mean it.

What Shenmue 3 has shown me, is that the dividing line between message board poster and video game journalist is a lot narrower than anybody ever thought.

Eurogamer's recent article is really great. It is. It tells the story of a game developer icon emerging from a decade in the background. Revitalised by his fans, a creative given back his medium to work in. Someone who has recovered their purpose in life.

But the headline is of course "I could do with a bit more money!"

A single quote, from a very small part of the article. There's a great story in the article as a whole, there truly is. Sadly, that story has been sacrificed for clicks.

They don't want you to read about a man who is enriched by the support of fans and looking to pay them back with something they've wanted for so long. They want you to read about this imaginary greedy man rubbing his hands to get your money.

Because outrage gets page views. Even if there's nothing there to be outraged about. And so the headline gets passed around, and people think that's the whole story. Then you get awful opinion pieces like Ben Kuchera's. His baffling, weird, confusing opinion piece where you can't figure out what the point is, besides a character assassination on Yu Suzuki for purposes unknown.

Some information about Shenmue 3 has been confusing. Some quotes taken out of context, some information that wasn't immediately clarified. The campaign wasn't perfect, the fans know that better than anybody.

What's awful is that the misinformation continues to spread, even after issues have been clarified. Despite best efforts of fans who have been following Shenmue 3's development closer than pretty much anybody in the games media. When we get annoyed or angry that a journalist has cited their own opinions about it as fact, or just disappointed us with a poor title choice like Eurogamer did, suddenly we're 'outraged fanboys' and Twitter post fodder for some game journalists to sneer at.

I've seen Shenmue called a sacred cow. It's anything but. Shenmue has been openly ridiculed for years and years. Sometimes for valid reasons, and sometimes just because. It's only in the last couple of years we've seen articles like the great Guardian piece where the writer looked past the meme-bait voice acting and reputation for being 'boring walking simulator' to find a game they really liked, even without any nostalgic factor on their part.

People like Colin Moriarty writing the game off three months into development is just dumb. Nobody doubts making Shenmue 3 is a monumental task, but Yu Suzuki is a video game icon that this industry owes huge amounts to. Just as much as Miyamoto and others.

Yu Suzuki seems revitalised, energised, and creatively refreshed. That's something to be excited about. An industry great, stripped of his old superstar status, but given new purpose by his fans. It's a lot of pressure, but I definitely think he can handle it.

But nobody wants to read about that, right?

 

[Replicant]

Is that actually true? I recall the media generally criticizing that move, with only Ben Kutchera really standing out as one in favor of it.

Ha ha fuck no. Kuchera was the worst but everyone else was bee-lining against consumer's interest. Shocked me but there it was.

 

[Rembrandt]

Ugh, so true. :/ People just love to hate on Shenmue.

Gaming journalists and concern trolls, get fucked:

acting like gaming journalists haven't kept the series somewhat relevant by constantly including it in "top 10 most wanted sequels" and those assorted lists throughout the years.

 

[SilentRob]

Ugh, so true. :/ People just love to hate on Shenmue.

Gaming journalists and concern trolls, get fucked:

acting like gaming journalists haven't kept the series somewhat relevant by constantly including it in "top 10 most wanted sequels" and those assorted lists throughout the years.

I think he is busy imaging himself violently beating up members of the press and sceptic, eh, sorry, concern trolls right now. Let's not distract him from that.

Seriously, posting Gifs like that in reference to people not liking the games you like. What in the world is happening here? Perspective, people. No one is out to destroy Shenmue. No one is out to take something away from you. Calm down. It's such a weird narrative you are building up for yourselves. The only reason I ever came into contact with Shenmue was because I kept reading about it. It has the biggest videogame kickstarter campaign of all time. And yet you seem to see yourself not only as some kind of "group", but even as some kind of marginalized group other "groups" willfully hate on? Did I somehow missinterpret the huge explosion of happines in pretty much every gaming forum there is when Shenmue 3 was announced?

You have got to accept that journalists and gamers and even some fans aren't driving some hate campaign because hey hate Shenmue or Yuzuki or you, but that they are simply reacting to a bad Kickstarter campaign and confusing messaging. If Suzuki and Sony and whoever else is responsible would have clearly sketched out on Day 1 what exactly it is they are building, what exactly they need to develop an actual shenmue game, who provides money for which purposes etc. etc. this hole PR debacle would never have happened. They fucked up. It's as easy as that.

"

Yet when searching "No Mans Sky and Sony relationship" you get basically nothing. (The articles are all positive, or neutral)

"

There is the small detail that No Man's Sky isn't crowdfounded and budget was never part of the discussion. Why would it be?

 

[Windom Earle]

acting like gaming journalists haven't kept the series somewhat relevant by constantly including it in "top 10 most wanted sequels" and those assorted lists throughout the years.

I haven't seen those lists, but fans have kept the series "relevant". And I am not trying to condemn all journalists, mostly the people in the OP and especially Polygon.

I think he is busy imaging himself violently beating up members of the press and screptic, eh, concern trolls right now. Let's not distract him from that.

Seriously, posting Gifs like that in reference to people not liking the games you like. What in the world is happening here? Perspective, people. No one is out to destroy Shenmue. No one is out to take something away from you. Calm down.

Get off your high horse. But I'll remove the gif because people like you will read too much into it.

 

[Rembrandt]

I think he is busy imaging himself violently beating up members of the press and screptic, eh, concern trolls right now. Let's not distract him from that.

Seriously, posting Gifs like that in reference to people not liking the games you like. What in the world is happening here? Perspective, people. No one is out to destroy Shenmue. No one is out to take something away from you. Calm down.

This series has very devoted fans.

I haven't seen those lists, but fans have kept the series "relevant". And I am not trying to condemn all journalists, mostly the people in the OP and especially Polygon.

which gaming journalists have acknowledged by keeping the name in the general public sphere. the game would have only been remembered/known by fans if only the fans were the ones keeping the series relevant.

 

[Windom Earle]

This series has very devoted fans.



which gaming journalists have acknowledged by keeping the name in the general public sphere. the game would have only been remembered/known by fans if only the fans were the ones keeping the series relevant.

I don't remember much coverage concerning Shenmue besides people spreading wild rumors in the past. But yes, Shenmue has fans among journalists, see Gametrailers.

 

[kewlbot]

these are really cynical
do they want to report bad news on it because it was so successful?

 

[RomanticHeroX]

It's amazing after all these years of people losing their shit over Kickstarter that so many people are completely ignorant of how much games actually cost to make. The money needed to make Shenmue III could never be raised over Kickstarter alone. Literally impossible. As for the reporting on it, I just see the same dismissal and lack of interest for Japanese games that has existed in gaming press for a decade.

 

[BudokaiMR2]

It's going to get worse before it gets better.

I know that a lot of Neogaf users have enough hate for comcept (disclaimer: I work there) and Inafune to qualify them as a full-on Darth Lord, but most KS projects get similar treatment. Especially if there is a big name attached or it is already controversial for whatever reason.

For example, when the recent MN9 demo was delayed every single large outlet wrote a piece about it.

When the demo makes it out a week later? I doubt there is a single article from one of those outlets detailing their impressions of the actual content there.

Most of the large outlets out there are always going to focus on knee-jerk negativity over any sort of worthwhile or positive content.

As a Shenmue 3 backer, the only thing I actually had a problem with was the fact that they didn't actually mention Sony at all on their page originally. It just doesn't seem like the sort of detail you could actually overlook. They did their best to clear it up though, especially with the media constantly throwing FUD out there.

 

[Spyder_Monkey]

I think he is busy imaging himself violently beating up members of the press and sceptic, eh, sorry, concern trolls right now. Let's not distract him from that.

Seriously, posting Gifs like that in reference to people not liking the games you like. What in the world is happening here? Perspective, people. No one is out to destroy Shenmue. No one is out to take something away from you. Calm down. It's such a weird narrative you are building up for yourselves. The only reason I ever came into contact with Shenmue was because I kept reading about it. It has the biggest videogame kickstarter campaign of all time. And yet you seem to see yourself not only as some kind of "group", but even as some kind of marginalized group other "groups" willfully hate on? Did I somehow missinterpret the huge explosion of happines in pretty much every gaming forum there is when Shenmue 3 was announced?

You have got to accept that journalists and gamers and even some fans aren't driving some hate campaign because hey hate Shenmue or Yuzuki or you, but that they are simply reacting to a bad Kickstarter campaign and confusing messaging. If Suzuki and Sony and whoever else is responsible would have clearly sketched out on Day 1 what exactly it is they are building, what exactly they need to develop an actual shenmue game, who provides money for which purposes etc. etc. this hole PR debacle would never have happened. They fucked up. It's as easy as that.

You're being awfully condescending coming from a junior SMH. But seriously, have you read stuff like the Gizmodo article or the recent Polygon article they're just outright bad. Yeah we get it, people like you think that games journalist should always be skeptical and question everything 100% of the time until game developers can admit they're Satan only existing to scam the consumers. And I get it, some people can be scumbags. Still though that's not journalism. In theory, good journalism should present the facts honestly but they don't. Most of the articles linked in the OP are just people being are just trying to feed off the negativity and spin a couple of quotes from Suzuki for clicks. No different from the tabloids.

I'm pretty sick of this "all games journalism has to be negative in order to be honest" attitude in some circles of the internet. Anything positive and one idiot will scream "PR Piece" like being bribed for reviews is some sort of fact in gaming journalism. Not to mention this kind of attitude also spawned that dumb twitter movement from last year. If anything negative press coverage is not only scummier but it can be outright harmful if not slanderous and only feeds on the ignorant.

We get it, you don't like Shenmue or this campaign. But saying it's the disaster and shameful is not true. Yeah $10 million is unrealistic, that's why they didn't have it as the goal. It still crossed more than any other game on Kickstarter and I'm sure the creators are happy they finally get to make their game after a decade and a half. It's pretty cool for people to shed tears over a series that was so often ignored. There's nothing inherently wrong with Shenmue III being crowdfunded and I don't think I'm in the minority in that one. If the game never comes out that's the different story but it will. Almost guaranteed. If anything, we should be grateful that the game is being made instead of insisting that it's wrong and anybody who supports it is a blind-fanboy.

 

[IrishNinja]

wow, surprised at eurogamer but happy i don't patronize the sources of those click-baity pieces. and while i can understand those wanting to blame the piss-poor effort of Awesome Japan, that wasn't what caused the weird witchhunt about funding clarity - you don't see that on really any other KS or sony project. as a fan finally seeing the game happen (much less done right, with most of the original crew!) it's easy to take that negativity/vitrol pile-on and form a narrative of concern-trolling from either those backlashing against the hype (uh, okay), port-beggars and those simply unwilling to let go of the tired narrative that this wouldn't happen/fans dont care etc etc

but what it was (and apparently still is, in thankfully small doses?) is, especially in the most recent case, simply poor journalism looking for any topic to get clicks, and this clearly has been doing that.
and its why complete tripe pieces from tripe people like kuchera are on the top for the moment: when the actual work is there to show, they'll have moved on to the next sensationalized piece, and no one will remember or care about this embarrassing window when fans got about the biggest longshot in gaming and a vocal minority decided to be upset about it.

Spoiler

the irony of using the term "vocal minority" in a shenmoo discussion is not lost one me, mind

 

[Castef]

Sounds like the die hard fans are the only ones hurt by this "shameful" news. Others who aren't die hard can see how this can be a huge disaster. Rose tinted glasses can be fashionable.

Mmmh... You nailed my very same opinion pretty well.

 

[Panajev2001a]

It would be bizarre pacing - hell, I think the series already has weird pacing with Shenmue I being an entire game (honestly, in terms of story, it should have been a 30-minute chapter in what became Shenmue II, despite me loving the gameplay).

But ending things in Shenmue III would be really, really bizarre. The series goes into hyper intricate detail and has a very slow build up, but so much is going to happen going forward.

Like another comparison - imagine if Star Wars: The Phantom Menace was one movie, then all the other movies were combined into one 2-hour long movie. That would fuck with pacing in all sorts of ways.

You described a much better version of the Staf Wars prequel, the amount of cringeworthy content in the other two movies would be severely reduced or it would be a so bad it's good kind of deal .

Still, I really liked Shenmue I as it was. The Japan locations were insanely detailed and full of life for the time and for that HW. The China based levels were wider and bigger, but a tad less detailed in a way.

 

[Mooreberg]

Part of it is heightened skepticism after some notable KS duds and the perpetual weirdness of Star Citizen. But it is also humorous how enthusiastic the press can be about less notable projects from people without even a fraction of the track record.

 

[aizen59]

Hi guys,

I've contacted the Kickstarter Team in order to get some information. Here's what they had to say about the rewards system/upgrade :

"Ys Net says:

Hello David,

Thank you very much for your message

We are currently working with the designated parties to make add-ons / upgrades available for Kickstarter backers.

It will indeed be possible to back a higher tier by backing the difference between it and your current tier.

Further details as to how the system will work will be explained in a later update when the add-on / upgrade system launches.

Thanks again for your support and for saving Shenmue !

Best regards,

Oscar &

The Shenmue 3 Kickstarter Team"

So whoever was worried about it, you don't have to anymore : upgrade system is coming.

Have a nice day !

David

 

[AntiFacebook]

I just don't think this game is as popular as people in GAF believe it to be.

 

[Triggerhappytel]

I'm going to write using proper punctuation for once, to show you that I mean it.

What Shenmue 3 has shown me, is that the dividing line between message board poster and video game journalist is a lot narrower than anybody ever thought.

Eurogamer's recent article is really great. It is. It tells the story of a game developer icon emerging from a decade in the background. Revitalised by his fans, a creative given back his medium to work in. Someone who has recovered their purpose in life.

But the headline is of course "I could do with a bit more money!"

A single quote, from a very small part of the article. There's a great story in the article as a whole, there truly is. Sadly, that story has been sacrificed for clicks.

They don't want you to read about a man who is enriched by the support of fans and looking to pay them back with something they've wanted for so long. They want you to read about this imaginary greedy man rubbing his hands to get your money.

Because outrage gets page views. Even if there's nothing there to be outraged about. And so the headline gets passed around, and people think that's the whole story. Then you get awful opinion pieces like Ben Kuchera's. His baffling, weird, confusing opinion piece where you can't figure out what the point is, besides a character assassination on Yu Suzuki for purposes unknown.

Some information about Shenmue 3 has been confusing. Some quotes taken out of context, some information that wasn't immediately clarified. The campaign wasn't perfect, the fans know that better than anybody.

What's awful is that the misinformation continues to spread, even after issues have been clarified. Despite best efforts of fans who have been following Shenmue 3's development closer than pretty much anybody in the games media. When we get annoyed or angry that a journalist has cited their own opinions about it as fact, or just disappointed us with a poor title choice like Eurogamer did, suddenly we're 'outraged fanboys' and Twitter post fodder for some game journalists to sneer at.

I've seen Shenmue called a sacred cow. It's anything but. Shenmue has been openly ridiculed for years and years. Sometimes for valid reasons, and sometimes just because. It's only in the last couple of years we've seen articles like the great Guardian piece where the writer looked past the meme-bait voice acting and reputation for being 'boring walking simulator' to find a game they really liked, even without any nostalgic factor on their part.

People like Colin Moriarty writing the game off three months into development is just dumb. Nobody doubts making Shenmue 3 is a monumental task, but Yu Suzuki is a video game icon that this industry owes huge amounts to. Just as much as Miyamoto and others.

Yu Suzuki seems revitalised, energised, and creatively refreshed. That's something to be excited about. An industry great, stripped of his old superstar status, but given new purpose by his fans. It's a lot of pressure, but I definitely think he can handle it.

But nobody wants to read about that, right?

Great post. You deserve a tag for that.

 

[Shenmue]

I just don't think this game is as popular as people in GAF believe it to be.

What does this have to do with anything in this thread?

Part of it is heightened skepticism after some notable KS duds and the perpetual weirdness of Star Citizen. But it is also humorous how enthusiastic the press can be about less notable projects from people without even a fraction of the track record.

See I'd expect this heightened skepticism knee-jerk reaction from joe schmoe gamer, but not someone who purports to call themselves a journalist. 1000 KS projects on the scale of Star Citizen could fail in a single month and that would still have no bearing on whether Shenmue 3 succeeds or fails. Star Citizen, Project Phoenix, or whatever other fan-funded game that ran into trouble are not managed by the people managing Shenmue 3, they aren't the same type of games, on the same scale, with the same or similar circumstances.

 

[BONKERS]

Kickstarter has burned backers in the past + Shenmue's notoriously inflated production budget = people being skeptical.

Nothing shameful about the press being incredulous about a project. Only thing shameful I see is the blind faith some people are putting into this project. :-/

I wouldn't call it blind faith rather than benefit of the doubt. Instead of crucifying the man for their own insecurities.

SO many people are getting ridiculous amounts of butthurt about all kinds of KSs. Wake up to reality folks.

What do you think happens behind closed doors during development in a traditional environment?
(The MN9 butthurt and fake outrage is just insulting to be honest. And I hope those idiots with some kind of faux moral vendetta for mistakes being made , having the wrong expectations from what they were presented, not understanding how development works don't affect the sales of the game.) Based on my time with the Demo , aside from some weird technical quirks, I am LOVING MN9. I couldn't have hoped for better other than the graphics. (Given their budget and porting the game to ~10 platforms. That's completely fine for me)

 

[ZombAid82]

Kickstarter has burned backers in the past + Shenmue's notoriously inflated production budget = people being skeptical.

Nothing shameful about the press being incredulous about a project. Only thing shameful I see is the blind faith some people are putting into this project. :-/

^This!

It's just to much Money to ask in advance from his fans.

Because they came in with a $2mil goal, but then said "Well, we have some nebulous 3rd party backing, oh and also need $10mil on the Kickstarter to do it right."

^Also, this

Be straightforward from the beginning and you have your positive Feedback( See IGa's Bloodstained)

 

[Krejlooc]

You described a much better version of the Staf Wars prequel, the amount of cringeworthy content in the other two movies would be severely reduced or it would be a so bad it's good kind of deal .

I meant if episodes 2-6 were one 2-hour movie.

 

[VibratingDonkey]

I think he is busy imaging himself violently beating up members of the press and sceptic, eh, sorry, concern trolls right now. Let's not distract him from that.

Seriously, posting Gifs like that in reference to people not liking the games you like. What in the world is happening here? Perspective, people. No one is out to destroy Shenmue. No one is out to take something away from you. Calm down. It's such a weird narrative you are building up for yourselves. The only reason I ever came into contact with Shenmue was because I kept reading about it. It has the biggest videogame kickstarter campaign of all time. And yet you seem to see yourself not only as some kind of "group", but even as some kind of marginalized group other "groups" willfully hate on? Did I somehow missinterpret the huge explosion of happines in pretty much every gaming forum there is when Shenmue 3 was announced?

You have got to accept that journalists and gamers and even some fans aren't driving some hate campaign because hey hate Shenmue or Yuzuki or you, but that they are simply reacting to a bad Kickstarter campaign and confusing messaging. If Suzuki and Sony and whoever else is responsible would have clearly sketched out on Day 1 what exactly it is they are building, what exactly they need to develop an actual shenmue game, who provides money for which purposes etc. etc. this hole PR debacle would never have happened. They fucked up. It's as easy as that.

""

There is the small detail that No Man's Sky isn't crowdfounded and budget was never part of the discussion. Why would it be?

That was arguably fair enough back in July. But taking the "I could use a bit more money" quote out of context and portraying it as if it's some greedy, nefarious thing to say, and making it out to be a bad thing that YS Net launched the Paypal campaign that fans were asking for, just comes across as unwarranted cynicism to me. Like, what is there to criticize here? I don't get it. It's good that people are vigilant about crowdfunding practices, but when you're seeing shade where there is none, I suggest you take off those sunglasses

Spoiler

or start eating that trash can.

 

[lolosgolos]

Sony involvement is what made this whole thing rub ppl the wrong way. They have funded less deserving games but with this one its hey we got this guy to agree to make shame you but guess what? you funding it cause we don't want to take the risk if it bombs

 

[openrob]

There is the small detail that No Man's Sky isn't crowdfounded and budget was never part of the discussion. Why would it be?

My point is that for ANY game it is not unusual to have some sort of partnership with a platform and will not disclose details. Yet when Shenmue 3 does, people somehow think it is a strage thing to do.

Sony involvement is what made this whole thing rub ppl the wrong way. They have funded less deserving games but with this one its hey we got this guy to agree to make shame you but guess what? you funding it cause we don't want to take the risk if it bombs

This is what I am on about. Tell me what games you are on about that are 'less deserving'. I bet you any example you provide is not 3rd party.

No one here thinks that Sony is funding Street Fighter 5, right?
Sony aren't funding Shenmue. Not in the way you think, it is not Sony who are Kickstarting the game, they don't have a say in development, or anything like that. This is a YsNet game from an indy developer. YsNet made a deal with Sony, that in exchange for console exclusivity Sony would provide marketing and PS4 publishing cost. This means more of the kickstarter funds actually go into development.

e.g. look at this graphic for Yooka Laylee and see how much of the funds could end up not being used for development
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/playtonic/yooka-laylee-a-3d-platformer-rare-vival/description

 

[LelouchViBritannia]

 

[Sakujou]

1) Is Sony behind Hotline Miami? No. All they did was do the PS4 port and published it. Same deal with Shenmue 3. This has been known since Day 1. But "Journalists" keep thinking there is some conspiracy.

2) DAFUQ ? ... This game is coming for PC , that is the primary platform for the KS. Are you even attempting to know anything about the topic and just posting randomly.? Sony is only handling the PS4 port. Like they do for tons of other indie games.

3) Well its not our fault , fking peter moore screwed us over by signing off Shenmue 2 to the Xbox ( which had 0 install base in Japan ). If Shenmue 2 went to PS2 , it would have fared much better.
The first game sold 1.2m despite Dreamcast barely being 4m units or something.

The reason you are confused? You are just making assumptions based on clickbait headlines these gaming "journalists" are posting. Instead of what Yu Suzuki and the Shenmue team have said.

1. this was not clear from the e3 reveal as well as during the kickstarter.
this has nothing to do with conspiracies, stick to the topic, bruh.

2. again, this was not clear at the beginning. they said vague stuff at the e3 which made it super confusing at the time to figure out if this game will come to other platforms or not.
remember the ff7R reveal: "first on ps4"
so is ff7R coming:
for pc?
for x1?
for wii u?
for tablets?
nothing sure, from the reveal.

3. if shenmue 2 was a screw-over by peter moore, why wasnt shenmue 2 released in the US? it was a nice attempt of SEGA to bring over shenmue 2 to the xbox, since the xbox was marketed heavily in the US+sega fans had high hopes back then since sega signed up for a couple of games exclusively for xbox. i dont think that shenmue 2 would have fared better on other systems. segas IPs were already declining with the dreamcast(sadly).

you seem to be confused about some facts.

its normal to have assumptions if there arent enough informations out there.

talking badly about something is another talk.

 

[wanderingprostheyltite]

Now you can Fulton some sailors!

 

[Shadoken]

1. this was not clear from the e3 reveal as well as during the kickstarter.
this has nothing to do with conspiracies, stick to the topic, bruh.

2. again, this was not clear at the beginning. they said vague stuff at the e3 which made it super confusing at the time to figure out if this game will come to other platforms or not.
remember the ff7R reveal: "first on ps4"
so is ff7R coming:
for pc?
for x1?
for wii u?
for tablets?
nothing sure, from the reveal.

3. if shenmue 2 was a screw-over by peter moore, why wasnt shenmue 2 released in the US? it was a nice attempt of SEGA to bring over shenmue 2 to the xbox, since the xbox was marketed heavily in the US+sega fans had high hopes back then since sega signed up for a couple of games exclusively for xbox. i dont think that shenmue 2 would have fared better on other systems. segas IPs were already declining with the dreamcast(sadly).
.

1 & 2) You cant expect every bit of info in an E3 reveal , games are literally given only a few minutes. MK X was revealed at Sony E3? Does that mean you expected it to be an exclusive? COD gets revealed at Xbox presser. Same deal.

Also the very first words Adam Boyes said was that "This is not Sony's title"

Sony said their stance on Shenmue the very same day that they are only publishing and developing the PS4 port. The primary platform is PC.


3) What are you saying? Every Dreamcast/Sega hit that went to other platforms did well. Virtua Fighter sold millions on PS2, So did Crazy Taxi, Phantasy Star did well because it also came on GCN and then sold a million when Universe/Portable came to PS2/PSP. Crazy Taxi,Super Monkey Ball,Sonic.... So many IPs lived on because they had strong Japanese presence , which the Xbox did not have and pretty much nailed Shenmue. Even a small title like Headhunter sold better than Shenmue 2 , just because it was on PS2.

Shenmue was the 2nd biggest IP on the Dreamcast after Sonic , yet it sold the least after Dreamcast died. You dont think Platform choice had nothing to do with it? You are underestimating just how much bigger PS2 was compared to Xbox. Especially for Japanese centric titles.

 

[Mugen08]

I'm thinking that while Shenmue III is a 15 year long dream come true, and while I have donated tenfolds more to Shenmue III compared to any other Kickstarter, the campaign is still possibly the very worst run one that I have funded (out of the 19 Kickstarters I've donated to). Sure some media coverage could be better but the vast majority are just doing their job. On the other end of the spectrum, PC Gamer really did not have to write about the slacker backer campaign since PC is weirdly absent now. Still they have written two pieces as positive as they can be about it. Most, if not all, bad reporting could have been avoided had the campaign been more professional. I mean compare the websites of Shenmue III and Stasis. If you did not know of any of the games, which one would be more likely to catch your eyes? Which one would you guess have collected almost 50 times the funds of the other?

Oh well, at least there is a slacker backer campaign and add-ons are incoming. But boy is it not going as smoothly as fans were expecting. I hope we will get the monthly updates. Unfortunately they just seem to be incapable of being informative enough (yes, I know there might be some contractual obligations) and this does not rhyme well with crowdfunding anno 2015.

 

[ShenmueNextGen]

Journalism: "Start worrying, now!"

Yu Suzuki said he could do better graphics with a bigger budget, which is true. Because, you could do better things with a better budget. That is an honest fact.
However!
The interpretation of "Yu Suzuki wants more money" or "Yu Suzuki asks for more money" comes from the click-bait "journalism" which wants to make hot headlines to hit traffic and profits from ads.

Also, notice the mockery below the image, trying to make the creators look like evil to the backers:

Shenmue 3's creators released this image, that looked like it was made in Microsoft Paint, to thank backers for their support.

Additionally. As a shield for the clickbait efforts, they use the term "opinion". But, opinion or not, if you use an article to attract clicks, then it still is a clickbait article.

 

[DannyDanger]

I'm going to write using proper punctuation for once, to show you that I mean it.

What Shenmue 3 has shown me, is that the dividing line between message board poster and video game journalist is a lot narrower than anybody ever thought.

Eurogamer's recent article is really great. It is. It tells the story of a game developer icon emerging from a decade in the background. Revitalised by his fans, a creative given back his medium to work in. Someone who has recovered their purpose in life.

But the headline is of course "I could do with a bit more money!"

A single quote, from a very small part of the article. There's a great story in the article as a whole, there truly is. Sadly, that story has been sacrificed for clicks.

They don't want you to read about a man who is enriched by the support of fans and looking to pay them back with something they've wanted for so long. They want you to read about this imaginary greedy man rubbing his hands to get your money.

Because outrage gets page views. Even if there's nothing there to be outraged about. And so the headline gets passed around, and people think that's the whole story. Then you get awful opinion pieces like Ben Kuchera's. His baffling, weird, confusing opinion piece where you can't figure out what the point is, besides a character assassination on Yu Suzuki for purposes unknown.

Some information about Shenmue 3 has been confusing. Some quotes taken out of context, some information that wasn't immediately clarified. The campaign wasn't perfect, the fans know that better than anybody.

What's awful is that the misinformation continues to spread, even after issues have been clarified. Despite best efforts of fans who have been following Shenmue 3's development closer than pretty much anybody in the games media. When we get annoyed or angry that a journalist has cited their own opinions about it as fact, or just disappointed us with a poor title choice like Eurogamer did, suddenly we're 'outraged fanboys' and Twitter post fodder for some game journalists to sneer at.

I've seen Shenmue called a sacred cow. It's anything but. Shenmue has been openly ridiculed for years and years. Sometimes for valid reasons, and sometimes just because. It's only in the last couple of years we've seen articles like the great Guardian piece where the writer looked past the meme-bait voice acting and reputation for being 'boring walking simulator' to find a game they really liked, even without any nostalgic factor on their part.

People like Colin Moriarty writing the game off three months into development is just dumb. Nobody doubts making Shenmue 3 is a monumental task, but Yu Suzuki is a video game icon that this industry owes huge amounts to. Just as much as Miyamoto and others.

Yu Suzuki seems revitalised, energised, and creatively refreshed. That's something to be excited about. An industry great, stripped of his old superstar status, but given new purpose by his fans. It's a lot of pressure, but I definitely think he can handle it.

But nobody wants to read about that, right?

These words... They're immortal

 

[bishopcruz]

1. this was not clear from the e3 reveal as well as during the kickstarter.
this has nothing to do with conspiracies, stick to the topic, bruh.

That was pretty much cleared up within days of the announcement. More than enough time for anyone who thought it was shady to back out of their pledge if they felt it was shady, which, FWIW, it wasn't.

2. again, this was not clear at the beginning. they said vague stuff at the e3 which made it super confusing at the time to figure out if this game will come to other platforms or not.
remember the ff7R reveal: "first on ps4"
so is ff7R coming:
for pc?
for x1?
for wii u?
for tablets?
nothing sure, from the reveal.

No, you are flat out wrong here. At the Sony conference it was announced for PS4, because well, Sony conference. On their kickstarter page, where you would have to do anything, it was said to be on PC as well. Those are the only platforms. Others COULD theoretically be announced in the future, but are unlikely. There was no misinformation for ANYONE who was willing to do ten seconds of research.

3. if shenmue 2 was a screw-over by peter moore, why wasnt shenmue 2 released in the US? it was a nice attempt of SEGA to bring over shenmue 2 to the xbox, since the xbox was marketed heavily in the US+sega fans had high hopes back then since sega signed up for a couple of games exclusively for xbox. i dont think that shenmue 2 would have fared better on other systems. segas IPs were already declining with the dreamcast(sadly).

you seem to be confused about some facts.

its normal to have assumptions if there arent enough informations out there.

talking badly about something is another talk.

Well, to be clear, Shenmue 2 did get a dreamcast release in both Europe and Japan. The screw over came about from cancelling that version in the US. As hard as MS tried, most Sega fans went to the PS2, and to a lesser extent, the GCN. At the very least they should have done a Shenmue 1 and 2 pack, so both games could be played, but even then that might not have changed much. Xbox had some of the best Sega releases that gen, but it wasn't where most Sega fans went.

Somehow, adding Paypal, which fans were BEGGING for during the KS is beyond the pale.

But hey, let's be all concerned, because, reasons.

YS is just out to take our money!

 

[Acquiescence]

Journalism: "Start worrying, now!"

Yu Suzuki said he could do better graphics with a bigger budget, which is true. Because, you could do better things with a better budget. That is an honest fact.
However!
The interpretation of "Yu Suzuki wants more money" or "Yu Suzuki asks for more money" comes from the click-bait "journalism" which wants to make hot headlines to hit traffic and profits from ads.

Also, notice the mockery below the image, trying to make the creators look like evil to the backers:


Additionally. As a shield for the clickbait efforts, they use the term "opinion". But, opinion or not, if you use an article to attract clicks, then it still is a clickbait article.

Adding a PayPal campaign as an additional source of revenue is common practice with these Kickstarter projects, no? They're handy to have considering there are people out there who weren't able to donate during the month that the campaign was up or, for whatever reason, just didn't want to pay via Kickstarter's site. Anyone who's played the first two Shenmue games knows that a third game developed for a current-gen audience is going to require a decent-sized budget. It's absolutely no surprise that Shenmue III would still benefit largely from more than the 6.3 million that was overall raised. I don't understand why we're supposed to be up in arms because Yu Suzuki has asked for more money. The fans have waited 14 years to get this sequel, so let's hope it's the best damn follow-up it can possibly be, or otherwise it's all in vain.

Is this 'journalist' only able to communicate his thoughts sensationalism and petulance? I'm embarrassed for him.

 

[Trojan X]

Jesus people, they are journalists. They don't give a fuck about how well they present a game to the public, they are looking for news. Sorry that the most recent news hasn't been entirely unicorns and rainbows, but that's the way it goes sometimes. Every journalist on a stream collectively jizzed in their pants the second the KS was revealed, and there were tons of positive media attention thrown at Shenmue 3 during the life of the kickstarter. Just because journos aren't sucking off Yu Suzuki every chance they get doesn't mean they are being shameful (or at the very least, it doesn't mean that Shenmue is the sole target of the bad reporting).

Come on. You should know more than anyone that what is going on with ill-journalist should not be accepted. I don't expect journalist to agree with everything but I expect for them to do their damn jobs, and quite a few of them are not and it brings their company's credibility down. Heck, i remember even having an argument here with a kotaku staff member, we said that we don't care who they hire under contractor or freelance, kotaku must realize that what goes up on kotaku showcase the opinion and affect the credibility of kotaku. If a journalist don't like something then there should be good rationales to why they don't like it, but they must be realistic, mindful, not judge a game that doesn't exist or call something a collosal failure when they don't have all the facts to gauge and evaluate it to be a failure or highlight concern. Yes, journalist shouldn't be sucking a dev's dick, none of them should do that, but they shouldn't be twisting statements, making news that doesn't exist or make articles without researching either regardless of how long they may have done it.

You know what, maybe your main point is journalist aren't going to change, not for Yu Suzuki or anyone else. However, they should change. Not for Yu Suzuki but for us, their audience that is hopefully getting smaller every each passing day due to their ill articles. We don't want a gaming media version of Fox News, no thank you.

 

[jett]

Gaming journalism is on the whole, trash. There may be a few decent people here and there, but that's just the sad truth.

 

[Krabboss]

The people in this thread sure are embarrassing.

He asked for a third of what he got and now he is saying he won't be able to deliver very good graphics. Well, what was his original plan then? I know that $2M isn't a lot to develop a Shenmue game. I know that $6M isn't much to develop a Shenmue game.

This is a guy who infamously blew out the budget when making the original games and fans are way too eager to be trusting about this game's finances.

It isn't a journalist's job to swaddle Yu Suzuki. You shouldn't fly into a rage when people are keeping a watchful eye over a small budget game being headed by a big budget director.

 

[Danlord]

"Now this is very much their project, but we wanted to celebrate their announcement on our stage. ..." - on stage at E3.
Sony on-stage at E3 saying it's their [Ys Net] project. 1 day later, Sony clarified their involvement. That was it, in the OP I referenced a Polygon post with Gio Corsi explaining how Sony are helping. In the same article they mention how they're also helping Street Fighter V in the same way.


EDITED
As for Krabboss, it's clear you've not even read the Eurogamer article and fell for the click-bait headline and that's the one of the reasons we're upset with the coverage. Bear in mind also, that Shenmue famously explores quality character and story development as well as gameplay direction with visuals as considered a secondary consideration. Unreal Engine 4 by design, from Day 1 can deliver high-quality graphical capabilities.

Developing Shenmue 3 is completely different to the likes of what happened with Shenmue 1 & 2, there is so much difference in the industry and development side of things that make it a different undertaking in comparison, Unreal Engine 4 being perhaps the biggest highlight. Please look some of this up, I'm sure someone from the Shenmue Dojo can forward you a link that has already collated this information up, but they're friendly people they can probably just tell you straight here.

 

[Krejlooc]

The people in this thread sure are embarrassing.

He asked for a third of what he got and now he is saying he won't be able to deliver very good graphics. Well, what was his original plan then? I know that $2M isn't a lot to develop a Shenmue game. I know that $6M isn't much to develop a Shenmue game.

This is a guy who infamously blew out the budget when making the original games and fans are way too eager to be trusting about this game's finances.

It isn't a journalist's job to swaddle Yu Suzuki. You shouldn't fly into a rage when people are keeping a watchful eye over a small budget game being headed by a big budget director.

you seem like the kind of person who can't be bothered with details and nuance to sway your opinion.

 

[DannyDanger]

The people in this thread sure are embarrassing.

He asked for a third of what he got and now he is saying he won't be able to deliver very good graphics. Well, what was his original plan then? I know that $2M isn't a lot to develop a Shenmue game. I know that $6M isn't much to develop a Shenmue game.

This is a guy who infamously blew out the budget when making the original games and fans are way too eager to be trusting about this game's finances.

It isn't a journalist's job to swaddle Yu Suzuki. You shouldn't fly into a rage when people are keeping a watchful eye over a small budget game being headed by a big budget director.

You're talking like you only read the clickbait titles. He didn't say he "wont be able to deliver very good graphics". He said he's prioritizing gameplay over visuals.

The budget of the first Shenmue included the engine development. Early development on Sega Saturn, the move to dreamcast. And more. Which has been clarified numerous times.

Nobody's asking journalist's to worship y suzuki, yet ppl keep coming into this thread pretending thats the case.

Alot of the story's posted about this game and campaign have been straight lies. With all the correct info readily available, there's no reason for journalists to be doing that

 

[Neuromancer]

It was news to me today, reading the thread, that Sony is only publishing the game and helping with the PS4 port. Going by stories that were out around the time of the Kickstarter I really thought they were helping to fund the development of the game.

I don't expect much from gaming journalists and pundits and yet somehow I find myself getting let down again and again.

 

[PumpkinSpice]

The Shameful Fans of Shenmue 3

 

[prwxv3]

You're talking like you only read the clickbait titles. He didn't say he "wont be able to deliver very good graphics". He said he's prioritizing gameplay over visuals.

The budget of the first Shenmue included the engine development. Early development on Sega Saturn, the move to dreamcast. And more. Which has been clarified numerous times.

Nobody's asking journalist's to worship y suzuki, yet ppl keep coming into this thread pretending thats the case.

Alot of the story's posted about this game and campaign have been straight lies. With all the correct info readily available, there's no reason for journalists to be doing that

The trips to china for research were also very costly.

 

[Spaghetti]

The bizarre flip-flopping from the media continues it seems.

"Shenmue 3 got $6.3 million? It isn't enough!"

"Yu Suzuki mentioned he could do with some more money? OMG YOU GREEDY FUCK"

 

[Pie and Beans]

Some people REALLY didn't like Sony straight winning E3, and sadly Shenmue 3 was the target of that line-up that had the most chinks in its armour. Concern trolls pour in, the rest is history.

 

[Spaghetti]

Journalism: "Start worrying, now!"

Yu Suzuki said he could do better graphics with a bigger budget, which is true. Because, you could do better things with a better budget. That is an honest fact.
However!
The interpretation of "Yu Suzuki wants more money" or "Yu Suzuki asks for more money" comes from the click-bait "journalism" which wants to make hot headlines to hit traffic and profits from ads.

Also, notice the mockery below the image, trying to make the creators look like evil to the backers:


Additionally. As a shield for the clickbait efforts, they use the term "opinion". But, opinion or not, if you use an article to attract clicks, then it still is a clickbait article.

This is such an odd article. It includes the full quote, but doesn't seem to actually acknowledge the content of it.

The Twitter comments are also so confusing. Do people think they're going against the grain to court controversy like this? A misinformed dogpile isn't ground-breaking journalism, it's the type of content you'd expect to see in the comment sections that writer seems to despise so much. It's a very 'safe' controversy too. Working on an established narrative set by other opinion pieces, against a fanbase of a niche series.

Makes you wonder about the qualifications involved in actually getting hiring for games writing publications. What's the dividing line between someone who can call themselves a journalist, and a sub-par blogger?

I try not to have a negative image of games journalism as a whole, but goodness me.

I don't get the idea that being properly informed and using quotations correctly is 'coddling' Yu Suzuki either. I think that's a flimsy excuse for people with an agenda to continue doing what they're doing with no consequence.

"I could do with a bit more money! The game itself doesn't have to be gorgeous visually - a lot of the money these days goes into the graphics. If we perhaps compromise on the graphics and put more into the story, we can make a good game. The most important thing, to me, is that the game's interesting, and that it's something people want to play."

What part of this quote says the most about Yu Suzuki's approach to the game?

"I could do with a bit more money!"

or

"If we perhaps compromise on the graphics and put more into the story, we can make a good game. The most important thing, to me, is that the game's interesting, and that it's something people want to play."

 

[Trojan X]

The trips to china for research were also very costly.

Not to mention that his team R&D and created TWO game engines, one for the Sega Saturn and the other for the Dreamcast. It's nuts, his team done a lot but nope... journalist and TONS of people here STILL say that Shenmue ONE cost either 47 million or 70 million. The ignorancy is insane.

 

[Danlord]

The trips to china for research were also very costly.

In comparison to the costs of designing multiple open-world engine's with multiple redesigns in the 90's, I think it's hardly a blemish on the travel expenses. That's why Unreal Engine 4 is such big news for this project, from Day 1 they have an established and well documentation as well as all the necessary components needed for such a project.

 

[Trojan X]

In comparison to the costs of designing multiple open-world engine's with multiple redesigns in the 90's, I think it's hardly a blemish on the travel expenses. That's why Unreal Engine 4 is such big news for this project, from Day 1 they have an established and well documentation as well as all the necessary components needed for such a project.

That's why this is even more stupid. Don't get me wrong, with $6mm+ we cannot expect a game with amazing CG level graphics but we should expect a damn good game. Why? Because it's Yu Suzuki. Ignoring or dismissing this man's accolades is senseless and the people he selected to be part of his team should give us more than enough confidence to receive a Shenmue game.