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[gantz85]

PC World has posted an article about the approach to Motion controls, accuracy and clickedy buttons:

PC World Link

The tactile approach for Sony is one thing, but Microsoft can surely add on their own little wand for tactile feedback and control. Actually, the difference between Sony and Microsoft's tech aren't all that big.

Natal isn't about the camera but more about the software behind it. Eyetoy can have Natal-like software easily, but tracking multiple persons will be more difficult without stereoscope vision like Natal has. Using lighted motion controllers will alleviate that obstacle because they can use the lights to extrapolate the third Z dimension of depth that can help to ascertain the physical location of multiple persons more easily.

At the end of the day both companies can easily make adjustments to their technology so I don't think there's anything critical that'll be left out that will be each tech's undoing. Plus, motion controls for the HD platforms this generation is essentially a test.. I'm sure the iterated motion hardware launched for next generation will look different.

 

[pswii60]

PC World has posted an article about the approach to Motion controls, accuracy and clickedy buttons:

PC World Link

"E3: What's Wrong with Microsoft's Xbox 360 Motion-Control Approach?" ... in this thread?

 

[belvedere]

Yeah, so a buddy of mine from out of town paid me a visit Wed and we were talking about e3. He was asking about Natal and the new Sony tech and I eventually ended up showing him the PSEye. I showed him Trials of Topaq and a couple of the other eye mini-games. He couldn't believe that this stuff worked NOW.

I just found that funny. I'm excited to see what a controller can add to the mix.

BTW, I only have Trials of Topaq and the Japanese-themed game where you guide the wind or whatever-is there any other good Eye games I'm missing?

 

[Wollan]

A firm launch date, solid technology and a clear idea of how it will translate to alternative gaming experiences are the three crucial elements that can help the new control method establish itself on the market, said CEO and president of SCEE, Andrew House.

"We have have a lot of confidence from a Sony standpoint on the right time to introduce new technology and new interfaces, and the goal of the company has always been to do it at the right time, when we can make a difference and be best of breed," offered House, in an exclusive interview published today.

"What we had at the E3 showing was very forward facing technology, a firm date for launch which is important as it gives us a good lead time to assemble the right sorts of content to take advantage of it. And we demonstrated a very tangible sense of how this will translate into gaming experiences. Those are three critical things."

While Nintendo's Wiimote has been on the market for some time, House said that accuracy is the key to the technology, and he's confident Sony's effort will prove that motion control is more than just a gimmick.

"It's stunningly accurate in terms of the way it tracks movement. That sounds like an incremental step in terms of motion technology, but it's a huge one in terms of saying 'now it's arrived' and it's really going to change the way we think about how we play games."

Sony has bravely announced a spring 2010 launch date for the new technology, but other solid details are still under wraps.

More at link:
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/sony-time-is-right-for-ps3-motion-control

Full interview (beyond motion controller) here.

 

[Graphics Horse]

They're saying Sixaxis was a gimmick? :O

It still seems like it's coming out too soon to me, but I don't know what's being developed for it.

 

[Miburou]

I'd call you crazy. Direct aiming with a pointer is miles and miles ahead of indirectly pushing a reticle across the screen with a thumbstick. So much faster and more precise.

Faster? Sure, with more control over acceleration. But more precise? Really? More precise than a stick that stops the millisecond you let go?

 

[swerve]

More at link:
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/sony-time-is-right-for-ps3-motion-control

I'm not unduly worried

So, you're quite right to be worried, then? I jest, I jest. English is hard.

 

[lowrider007]

PlayStation Eye Scan Objects into game

:lol , pretty cool idea though.

 

[pswii60]

They're saying Sixaxis was a gimmick? :O

It still seems like it's coming out too soon to me, but I don't know what's being developed for it.

The problem is that they didn't show any more than a few crappy tech demos at E3. They didn't show any actual games using it which makes me wonder if the Spring '10 date is like PS3's infamous Spring '06 worldwide launch date. It felt more like a GDC demo then an E3 demo.

But of course, Sony has a ton of first party studios and this patent was registered a long time ago, so who knows what's in the works and for how long.

In fact, that's the area where Sony can 1-up Microsoft at the initial launch. Any motion controller is only as good as its content. On the flip-side, it sounds like MS is drumming up some decent third party support for Natal, something we've heard less about from Sony.

Time will tell, as always!

 

[Huggy]

Faster? Sure, with more control over acceleration. But more precise? Really? More precise than a stick that stops the millisecond you let go?

The question is whether the reticule stops at the place where you wanted it or not. That's kind of hard with a stick (for most people I assume). It's much easier with a mouse and should be easier with a pointer device. I believe you'd need a bit of training for that, think of when you played Super Mario 64 for the first time.

 

[Wollan]

In this GT interview Jack Tretton reconfirms they're totally committed for a spring 2010 release.
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-09-sony/51574

What will be the appropriate arena for unveiling the final product? TGS or CES in January? I'm not sure if they would want to do it at TGS as it might affect Xmas sales (even though it being sold separately). Thoughts?

 

[Graphics Horse]

Time will tell, as always!

Yeah, it looks like those games were by the motion hardware development guys, who have been locked in a room with zero game develpment budget ever since they were put on the first EyeToy.
It just depends on who else has been working with the technology, and for how long.

 

[TheGuardian]

Google ads wins again:

 

[Miburou]

The question is whether the reticule stops at the place where you wanted it or not. That's kind of hard with a stick (for most people I assume). It's much easier with a mouse and should be easier with a pointer device. I believe you'd need a bit of training for that, think of when you played Super Mario 64 for the first time.

Well, RE4 Wii compensates by making the reticule larger (so that you don't have to be extremely precise with your aim). It's true that games controlled by sticks compensate by having the game lower paced than say a light-gun shooter (which is why Umbrella Chronicles would be almost impossible to play with a standard controller), but I don't believe there's any difference between the Wii release of RE4 and the other releases in terms of speed of enemies.

 

[gofreak]

Interesting.

A SCE patent filed in May 2005 that just appeared as a granted patent today.

Basically describes what may be the 'light bulb' end of this equation, and using a light source to provide pointer functionality in conjunction with a camera.

Remote input device

The gist:

Describes determination of attributes of a target point of a light beam using a sensor (camera) in or near the target area, based on capture of some of the light being targetted at a point.

Use of 'spatial varying characteristics' of the light beam such as intensity patterns, concentric rings, speckle patterns, gradients to help identify direction and magnitude of pattern (and thus target point) movement based on changes of the pattern as seen by the sensor.

The patent is purely concerned with determining position and motion alone based on the light beam and its patterns etc. It's fairly general, talks about implementations that can go from 1 to multiple cameras. Obviously not everything discussed is relevant to Sony's wand, but I'm sure a certain amount of that work informed the light beam/pointing end of Sony's wand.

 

[Jokeropia]

Faster? Sure, with more control over acceleration. But more precise? Really? More precise than a stick that stops the millisecond you let go?

What Huggy said. Basically, speed and accuracy aren't really two separate qualities here, it's rather a matter of how accurate you can be at a certain speed. If you make thumbstick aiming as quick as pointer aiming (with an extremely sensitive reticle) your accuracy becomes very poor, and if you make it slow enough for perfect accuracy it becomes too slow to be practical. So what I'm saying is that pointer aiming can be accurate at much higher speeds than thumbstick aiming.

 

[Dice]

About aiming, all I know is that playing RE4 an Wii, there were several times I was jumped by a zombie from the side and capped it in his head instantly. That kind of precise instinct reaction would never happen with a stick. If this stuff improves over Wii, it is going to be lightyears beyond a stick.

 

[jmd494]

Interesting.

A SCE patent filed in May 2005 that just appeared as a granted patent today.

Basically describes what may be the 'light bulb' end of this equation, and using a light source to provide pointer functionality in conjunction with a camera.

Light bulb is ok but I hope:
1. It isn't round and "bulb shaped
2. The light isn't in the visible spectrum

 

[AranhaHunter]

They're saying Sixaxis was a gimmick? :O

It still seems like it's coming out too soon to me, but I don't know what's being developed for it.

If I had to guess I would say they make Hot Shots Golf 5 compatible with the new controller through a patch or release HSG6 or Hot Shots Tennis.

In this GT interview Jack Tretton reconfirms they're totally committed for a spring 2010 release.
http://www.gametrailers.com/video/e3-09-sony/51574

What will be the appropriate arena for unveiling the final product? TGS or CES in January? I'm not sure if they would want to do it at TGS as it might affect Xmas sales (even though it being sold separately). Thoughts?

I think they'll show it at GC in August and at TGS in September, maybe even let people play some tech demos or demos of games being worked on. A final release date will be given at CES and they'll probably have different bundles, i.e. wand by itself, wand+eye, wand+eye+game, and if it's a break apart like the patent shows, it'll probably replace the DS3.

 

[-WindYoshi-]

Edit: nvm

 

[shongololo]

I'm hugely impressed by the tech displayed. TRUE 1:1 3D. We're actually there. It's real.

Two weeks later and this still makes me chuckle.

 

[Raistlin]

PC World has posted an article about the approach to Motion controls, accuracy and clickedy buttons:

PC World Link

Nice article.

Pretty much mirrors my thoughts, at least based on what's been shown thus far.

 

[Raistlin]

Light bulb is ok but I hope:
1. It isn't round and "bulb shaped
2. The light isn't in the visible spectrum

One could happen (just a guess though, we don't really know enough about the tech to tell).

Don't think two could happen though, not without a new camera.

 

[jmd494]

One could happen (just a guess though, we don't really know enough about the tech to tell).

Don't think two could happen though, not without a new camera.

touche

 

[Wollan]

I think they'll show it at GC in August and at TGS in September

I disagree in regards to GC. Usually it's showcasing the same E3 demos with conferences covering some EU specific announcements (I'm hoping for proper GT5 details). I think GC is too soon, it would mean they had the actual 'final' product pretty much ready during the E3 period. I can barely believe TGS but that's probably too soon for a potential (in my head) May date next year.

 

[Miburou]

What Huggy said. Basically, speed and accuracy aren't really two separate qualities here, it's rather a matter of how accurate you can be at a certain speed. If you make thumbstick aiming as quick as pointer aiming (with an extremely sensitive reticle) your accuracy becomes very poor, and if you make it slow enough for perfect accuracy it becomes too slow to be practical. So what I'm saying is that pointer aiming can be accurate at much higher speeds than thumbstick aiming.

I brought up RE4 because it's a game where the speed was not increased for the Wii version, and where they enlarged the reticule to make hitting the enemy easier. I also brought up UC because it is a faster paced game that would be hard to play with a stick, but the thing with UC is that it's on rails, so you don't have to worry about movement. I'd like to see a game with both (a fast paced game with full control that would be hard to play on a traditional controller compared to the Wii + nunchuk combo).

About aiming, all I know is that playing RE4 an Wii, there were several times I was jumped by a zombie from the side and capped it in his head instantly. That kind of precise instinct reaction would never happen with a stick. If this stuff improves over Wii, it is going to be lightyears beyond a stick.

That is interesting. I have to confess that I bought RE4 Wii mainly to try out the controls, not to replay, and so I have not put in more than an hour, but I definitely should. But like I mentioned, is that due to the increased precision, or to the larger reticule (as opposed to the laser sight), which is a form of assist? And believe me I'm not trying to split hairs here.

 

[Dice]

That is interesting. I have to confess that I bought RE4 Wii mainly to try out the controls, not to replay, and so I have not put in more than an hour, but I definitely should. But like I mentioned, is that due to the increased precision, or to the larger reticule (as opposed to the laser sight), which is a form of assist? And believe me I'm not trying to split hairs here.

That just isn't the nature of it, all it does is make quick tracking of the reticule more visible. I highly suggest playing through more, you'll see what I mean.

 

[cakefoo]

Two weeks later and this still makes me chuckle.

It shouldn't. While Nintendo's will get the job done for most things, it needs a periodic checkup to make sure it's where it thinks it is. Gyros and accelerometers are fine for a game like tennis, because all you do is swing forehand/backhand, and it can just listen for those gestures.

A good demo that stresses why it's important to have absolute 1:1 tracking is the sandbox demo with the colored blocks coming on the conveyor belt, where you have full 3D freedom to move your hands around in front of you. The PS Eye knows the exact location of your hand at all times, height and depth and width, so it will never drift, which makes it true 1:1, whereas MotionPlus can only be 1:1 for as long as gyros and accelerometers allow.

 

[Dice]

I think the ideal would be a stick for forward/backward movement of the character, controller tilt for turning, and then the other arm totally free for aiming and shooting. Sideways on the stick may be used for far-looking (as opposed to slight looking, which I will detail later) to the side without turning the body or something like that. My reasoning is that forward movement is done with the legs, and so to my brain it kind of feels like an automatic function. This makes it better for a stick because it is minimizing the upper-body involvement of a movement that is typically associated with the legs.

Turning, however, if you pay attention when you walk around always starts with the head and and travels down the body. Physically turning sideways to the screen would be really awkward and would only allow for one very active playing position. A simple thumb flick is also too subtle for replicating this large of a physical motion when your gun control is so big and involved. So, tilt of the controller should allow for enough feel of body involvement while allowing for freedom to choose a more physically active or relaxed playing position.

Up/down looking should be fully configurable between arm/locational movement and tilting. I personally hate controls that are tied to the vertical angle of my controller because it's never comfortable and very distracting to maintain central position. Locational arm movement would require more effort but I don't think I'll need to look up that often, and if I do, the game is probably exciting enough for me not to care. Yet, I can see this being a divisive issue and each player should be able to configure it to their liking.

Of course, the gun aiming would have a bit of panning/drift given to it in case something catches your eye to the side and you think to shoot it before you think to turn. This would enhance the sensation of peripheral vision dynamics and make everything feel more natural. However, it should always have a limit to it and not stay where you push it but rather have a stretch-and-return feel to it, so you definitely have a central viewing zone and an outer zone that can be pushed into. This replicates how you may turn your head slightly and turn your eyes in a direction to check around an area, and this would increase mental immersion into the virtual surroundings to make you feel a bit paranoid about what is just out of view. Right now, all games feature tank-like viewing, so this would be a huge enhancement.

As for a dual-gun possibility of controls. I don't think it would be too bad to use a dual stick method for movement with angular direction of gun pointing for look turning. It would require more focus for control, but I think wielding two guns does in general, and overall the sensation of blasting enemies with two independently guided weapons would override the feeling of "piloting" your character. And if the game is 3rd person, I think it is more natural to feel like a pilot anyway, that is just a trait of the genre which fans of it (as opposed to FPS fans) seem to enjoy.

 

[timetokill]

It shouldn't. While Nintendo's will get the job done for most things, it needs a periodic checkup to make sure it's where it thinks it is. Gyros and accelerometers are fine for a game like tennis, because all you do is swing forehand/backhand, and it can just listen for those gestures.

A good demo that stresses why it's important to have absolute 1:1 tracking is the sandbox demo with the colored blocks coming on the conveyor belt, where you have full 3D freedom to move your hands around in front of you. The PS Eye knows the exact location of your hand at all times, height and depth and width, so it will never drift, which makes it true 1:1, whereas MotionPlus can only be 1:1 for as long as gyros and accelerometers allow.

.. nah, it's still hilarious :lol

But it's true. We do have true 1:1 -- and you can go buy it right now, on Wii.

Ignoring the Sony PR spin (have they told us when next-gen starts, yet? I'd expect that from the industry "leader" Sony) -- we already have true 1:1. Sony's tech will be an improvement in some ways whenever it finally comes out, as well it should -- it's several years after the Wii Remote and by the time Sony's Wand comes out it will be well over a year since Wii Motion+ was revealed. It would be moronic to not have more advanced tech than the Wii Remote. But that said, it won't be drastically better. And it's going to cost significantly more, and it won't have the market penetration of the Wii Remote or even Wii Motion+. That said I'm really happy to see Sony jumping on the motion-sensing train and I hope they put together some really fantastic software to go along with the tech. It'll hopefully provide more incentive for games to use the EyeToy too, because Sony just doesn't seem to know how to push that successfully.

Overall this reminds me a lot of the typical Sony controller path, though. Nintendo has two shoulder buttons, Sony puts on 4. Nintendo introduces an analog stick into their controller, so Sony puts on two. Nintendo adds rumble, Sony adds two vibration motors. It's really a funny one-upsmanship aspect of the company, but it also made the Wand utterly predictable -- which is why I was able to so confidently predict it in the E3 predictions thread

 

[shongololo]

It shouldn't. While Nintendo's will get the job done for most things, it needs a periodic checkup to make sure it's where it thinks it is. Gyros and accelerometers are fine for a game like tennis, because all you do is swing forehand/backhand, and it can just listen for those gestures.

A good demo that stresses why it's important to have absolute 1:1 tracking is the sandbox demo with the colored blocks coming on the conveyor belt, where you have full 3D freedom to move your hands around in front of you. The PS Eye knows the exact location of your hand at all times, height and depth and width, so it will never drift, which makes it true 1:1, whereas MotionPlus can only be 1:1 for as long as gyros and accelerometers allow.

It was more the faux reverence than whatever mindless speculation you're engaged in. Lets see what Sony and MS actually do to with their motion controls, I'm sceptical as to whether either will take off in any meaningful fashion. At least not this gen.

 

[-COOLIO-]

.. nah, it's still hilarious :lol

But it's true. We do have true 1:1 -- and you can go buy it right now, on Wii.

according to the tiger woods thread there's a significant delay. you can also see it in the red steel 2 demo. it's not true 1:1

so far the only 1:1 has been seen in sony's controller.

wand 4 lyfe.

 

[XiaNaphryz]

.. nah, it's still hilarious :lol

But it's true. We do have true 1:1 -- and you can go buy it right now, on Wii.

Disc golf is awesome.

according to the tiger woods thread there's a significant delay. you can also see it in the red steel 2 demo. it's not true 1:1

so far the only 1:1 has been seen in sony's controller.

wand 4 lyfe.

Are we reading the same thread?

 

[Raistlin]

.. nah, it's still hilarious :lol

But it's true. We do have true 1:1 -- and you can go buy it right now, on Wii.

Ignoring the Sony PR spin (have they told us when next-gen starts, yet? I'd expect that from the industry "leader" Sony) -- we already have true 1:1. Sony's tech will be an improvement in some ways whenever it finally comes out, as well it should -- it's several years after the Wii Remote and by the time Sony's Wand comes out it will be well over a year since Wii Motion+ was revealed. It would be moronic to not have more advanced tech than the Wii Remote. But that said, it won't be drastically better. And it's going to cost significantly more, and it won't have the market penetration of the Wii Remote or even Wii Motion+. That said I'm really happy to see Sony jumping on the motion-sensing train and I hope they put together some really fantastic software to go along with the tech. It'll hopefully provide more incentive for games to use the EyeToy too, because Sony just doesn't seem to know how to push that successfully.

Overall this reminds me a lot of the typical Sony controller path, though. Nintendo has two shoulder buttons, Sony puts on 4. Nintendo introduces an analog stick into their controller, so Sony puts on two. Nintendo adds rumble, Sony adds two vibration motors. It's really a funny one-upsmanship aspect of the company, but it also made the Wand utterly predictable -- which is why I was able to so confidently predict it in the E3 predictions thread

Won't be drastically better? For 1:1 stuff, yeah it probably won't be drastically better (though for certain applications, it may prove to be - and some of the lag stuff I've been reading regarding MotionPlus has be concerned) ... but you seem to be forgetting that it can do several things via the camera that obviously can't be done on Wii at all. In terms of overall feature set, it is 'drastically' better.



As for pricing, I think you may be jumping the gun. I'm under the impression this won't be all that expensive. Obviously Nintendo has a one up since the root controller is the main system controller. However, I don't think the Sony solution is going to be particularly expensive as far as add-ons go.

 

[Darkpen]

Indeed, if they sell those wands for $15 a pop, I'd be amazed. Hopefully no more than $25.

 

[Anonymous Tipster]

As for pricing, I think you may be jumping the gun. I'm under the impression this won't be all that expensive. Obviously Nintendo has a one up since the root controller is the main system controller. However, I don't think the Sony solution is going to be particularly expensive as far as add-ons go.

This is Sony we're talking about. Can you honestly expect this to be reasonably priced after everything that's gone on this past generation? Especially with the recent PSPGo price?

You're setting yourself up for disappointment.

 

[-COOLIO-]

Disc golf is awesome.

Are we reading the same thread?

maybe i need to go back and check it out, but ill take your word for it. is m+ 1:1? are your motions perfectly replicated without delay? i can certaintly say there was at least a half a second delay in the RS2 demo

 

[-COOLIO-]

Indeed, if they sell those wands for $15 a pop, I'd be amazed. Hopefully no more than $25.

the wiimote is still $50, how can you expect this to be cheaper when the technology looks more sophisticated?

 

[onipex]

according to the tiger woods thread there's a significant delay. you can also see it in the red steel 2 demo. it's not true 1:1

so far the only 1:1 has been seen in sony's controller.

wand 4 lyfe.

It should be very clear by now that the controls will respond in the way that they are programed to respond. I would love to see how the Sony wand responds in a full game , because I can't judge it from a tech demo.

Also, considering that Wii Sports still has some of the best, if no the best motion controls on the Wii. I will not judge motion+ by third party efforts as I suspect that the same will be true for Wii Sports Resort.

 

[-COOLIO-]

It should be very clear by now that the controls will respond in the way that they are programed to respond. I would love to see how the Sony wand responds in a full game , because I can't judge it from a tech demo.

Also, considering that Wii Sports still has some of the best, if no the best motion controls on the Wii. I will not judge motion+ by third party efforts as I suspect that the same will be true for Wii Sports Resort.

the tech demos were fine enough for me. i dont understand why the controller would be any less responsive in a full game.

 

[Plinko]

Still unsure of where this "Motion+ lag" garbage is coming from. I own Tiger Woods '10 for Wii and the Motion+ on disc golf is absolutely 1:1.

Go read the actual thread if you want more opinions, but nobody in that thread who has actually played the game is making the non-1:1 claim.

Also, haven't read the whole thread--has Sony implied what the pricing structure may be on these controllers?

 

[-COOLIO-]

Still unsure of where this "Motion+ lag" garbage is coming from. I own Tiger Woods '10 for Wii and the Motion+ on disc golf is absolutely 1:1.

Go read the actual thread if you want more opinions, but nobody in that thread who has actually played the game is making the non-1:1 claim.

Also, haven't read the whole thread--has Sony implied what the pricing structure may be on these controllers?

honestly that's reassuring, i'll take another look.

red steel 2 at least though definitely isnt 1:1 at the moment though but that might change.

edit: im back. i got these:

I've got a question to ask of my own.

I watched a few videos, and was really disappointed to see that the swinging animation was extremely delayed from the player's swing. Is this the case? Or was it just the video?

in response:

Yeah, Wii motion + is extremely laggy.

^this one got a lot of no reactions though"

and most of the responses afterwords insist it's lagless so i guess i just read the thread at the wrong time. good to know. id love to see motion plus in a tech demo just to erase any doubts

 

[JoJo13]

What type of software do you want to see the motion controller use at launch?

There are a lot of titles releasing in the Spring time of 2010 -- MLB 10 The Show, Heavy Rain, God of War 3...

I think all three of these titles could benefit from motion control.

Obviously, I think it would be the right move to make MLB 10 The Show feature heavy use of the motion control for obvious reasons. Batting/pitching would instantly be a lot more fun with 1:1 motion controls and it would (importantly) feel a lot more engaging than the current hitting/batting mechanics. If this title doesn't have motion controls, I will be hugely surprised and disappointed.

God of War 3 won't use them, but I think it's a title that should. Perhaps God of War 4 will shake the franchise up a bit with motion controls.

Heavy Rain, I think, could still make use of motion controls and I think they should include it in there for the final release. The controls in HR are apparently very odd, where you mainly control the characters head...that would be better suited towards motion controls, IMHO.

What other software should Sony have for launch of this device? I can't think of them having a big blockbuster title out for release that uses it substantively, but perhaps it will launch with a number of different quirky games, perhaps PSN releases.

 

[Dice]

the wiimote is still $50, how can you expect this to be cheaper when the technology looks more sophisticated?

Why would it be more expensive than a Wii controller? It doesn't use any accelerometers. The EyeToy and PS3 is doing all the real work.

 

[Wollan]

Why would it be more expensive than a Wii controller? It doesn't use any accelerometers. The EyeToy and PS3 is doing all the real work.

It has 'internal motion sensors'.

 

[Mr.Green]

id love to see motion plus in a tech demo just to erase any doubts

I'm pretty sure you don't want your doubts erased, Mr. Wand 4 Lyfe.

Tiger Woods 10 with Wii Motion Fix works as advertised.

 

[krypt0nian]

It has 'internal motion sensors'.

Sexy.


I guess we'll finally see that waggle plus processing power is truly possible. I was told it was one or the other.

 

[timetokill]

Won't be drastically better? For 1:1 stuff, yeah it probably won't be drastically better (though for certain applications, it may prove to be - and some of the lag stuff I've been reading regarding MotionPlus has be concerned) ... but you seem to be forgetting that it can do several things via the camera that obviously can't be done on Wii at all. In terms of overall feature set, it is 'drastically' better.

Obviously the camera offers more features. But in terms of motion-sensing itself (thus the "1:1" discussion) I don't think it will be drastically better, no. The camera itself could be used for some interesting things, but so far we haven't seen much in that direction. The demo Sony showed would be ridiculous in a game... looking at yourself doing actions? I'll wait until I see that feature in a game before I believe it's useful. By far the most interesting use of the camera (to me) was for the Eye of Judgment stuff, and it's pretty much disappeared since. So sure, it will have more features, but that alone won't make it necessarily better for games.

As for pricing, I think you may be jumping the gun. I'm under the impression this won't be all that expensive. Obviously Nintendo has a one up since the root controller is the main system controller. However, I don't think the Sony solution is going to be particularly expensive as far as add-ons go.

Why would you be under that impression? Let's look online for comparative stuff. I'll be using Amazon's list prices to avoid temporary sale price issues.

NINTENDO

Wii Remote - $40
Wii Motion+ - $20, although in some games (like Tiger Woods) it comes as a bundled pack-in for $10 extra
Wii Nunchuk - $20, but then again every Wii owner already has at least one of these.

So, to assemble a completely new 'complete' Wii 1:1 motion system, it's going to cost $80.

However, for most consumers, they will only have to pay $20 because they will already have at least Wii Remote and Nunchuk.


SONY

Playstation Eye - $40

Sony Wand - For the sake of comparison, let's say the Sony Wand comes in at the same price at the Wii Remote, despite the Wand being technologically more advanced than the Wii Remote without the Motion+. So that's another $40, if we're being generous.

As has been discussed, Sony will probably need some analog stick attachment if they want to allow for some more complex games. Maybe they'll go wired like Nintendo's solution, or maybe they'll go wireless. At any rate, let's still be generous and say it's only $20, like the nunchuk.

Again, these are generous pricing strategies that assume that Sony has either (a) found a very cheap way to produce these components or (b) is willing to only break-even or even take a small loss on these components.

Keep in mind that no out-of-the-box Sony PS3 owner has any of the components needed for Sony's 1:1 solution. So you're looking at $100.



Now let's look at it from the viewpoint of the consumer who is maybe looking to get a 1:1 tennis or golf game, no analog attachment needed. For this comparison, let's say Sony drops the price of the PS3 by $50 by this point, and Nintendo still hasn't dropped the price of the Wii whatsoever.

For the consumer who doesn't have a console at all yet:
Nintendo Wii w/ Motion+ and Tennis game: $250 + $20 + $50 = $320
Sony PS3 w/ Sony Wand, Playstation Eye, and game: $350 + $40 + $40 + $60 = $490

For the consumer who has both consoles already:
Wii Motion+ and Tennis game: $20 + $50 = $70
Sony Wand, Playstation Eye, tennis game: $40 + $40 + $60 = $140


At any rate, I don't see how you could possibly think that this won't be expensive. It's going to be a $100 add-on to an already expensive system. This is why I don't think this will matter until either the next round of consoles or until Sony figures a way to relaunch this platform with this stuff all included.

 

[LM4sure]

Although I will probably get one of these wands if there are some great games that support it, I bought Tiger Woods 10 with Motion +, and it is pretty damn close to 1:1. If there is any delay, it's negligible. The same might be true for the wand. There might be negligible delay, but we won't know until we see actual software, and not this tech demo garbage.

 

[JoJo13]

Obviously the camera offers more features. But in terms of motion-sensing itself (thus the "1:1" discussion) I don't think it will be drastically better, no. The camera itself could be used for some interesting things, but so far we haven't seen much in that direction. The demo Sony showed would be ridiculous in a game... looking at yourself doing actions? I'll wait until I see that feature in a game before I believe it's useful. By far the most interesting use of the camera (to me) was for the Eye of Judgment stuff, and it's pretty much disappeared since. So sure, it will have more features, but that alone won't make it necessarily better for games.

Not having to recalibrate is drastically better.

Although I will probably get one of these wands if there are some great games that support it, I bought Tiger Woods 10 with Motion +, and it is pretty damn close to 1:1. If there is any delay, it's negligible. The same might be true for the wand. There might be negligible delay, but we won't know until we see actual software, and not this tech demo garbage.

Huh? Why would a tech demo that was live in front of everyone not be indicative of the product?