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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 4 - Sundays on HBO

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Iksenpets

Banned
You know, he mentioned in interviews he wasn't going to be back in S5 due to scheduling conflicts.

I wonder if that was just a polite euphemism.

Nah, if he was being fired over this, there would've been some attempted to patch the scene in editing. They decided to keep it this way.

Old Daario has seen Dany naked, new Daario hasn't...yet.

But Dany's seen new Daario's dick. I bet it was glorious.
 

Speevy

Banned
Weird aside, can someone make either a comic strip or animation that suggests Oberyn successfully seduces Tywin?

The setup is perfect. He remains on the bed for a while, asks others to leave the room, they're at a brothel.
 

Speevy

Banned


It's now canon.

Tyrion is convicted because Mace Tyrell is easily swayed and Oberyn is sleeping with Tywin.

In this version, Shae, Tyrion, and The Mountain walk in on Tywin, Oberyn, and Ellaria Sand.

I don't think I have to tell you what happens next.
 

Brashnir

Member
It's now canon.

Tyrion is convicted because Mace Tyrell is easily swayed and Oberyn is sleeping with Tywin.

In this version, Shae, Tyrion, and The Mountain walk in on Tywin, Oberyn, and Ellaria Sand.

I don't think I have to tell you what happens next.

The Mountain fucks Tyrion and uses him as a condom while he fucks everyone else?
 

suzu

Member
DZPtlHo.gif

I know we're all suppose to hate him, but you guys who prefer old Daario are crazy. New Daario is cute. That wink won me over.

I'm looking forward to more of Jorah fedora.
 

Paganmoon

Member
I know we're all suppose to hate him, but you guys who prefer old Daario are crazy. New Daario is cute. That wink won me over.

I'm looking forward to more of Jorah fedora.

New-Daario isn't punchable enough. But ohwell, I'll learn to live with it.
 
whoops, this is the Book thread! Anyway, reading this thread is interesting because I didn't know the context of the original Cersei/Jaime sex/rape scene.

It's sad because not only does it change Jaime, it changes Cersei too. The show makes it seem as if she's rejecting her incestuous relationship, rejecting the circumstances, and too grief-stricken to consider sex. While the original passage makes her seem like a FREAK, which she is. It complicates and deepens her character to have consensual sex then and there, while having her being raped doesn't really give her character a chance to grow any way at all.

The Dany/Drogo thing is interesting too. As a viewer, it happens in the pilot with characters we just met, so I chalk it up to the "forget about it" aspect of TV writing. I'm sure it doesn't come off as as bad as I watched episodes with a week break in between, but I see how bingers in the future might give pause. And thematically it still kinda works because they can't communicate and have just met.

The most interesting thing of all is the showrunners turning two instances of sex into rape.

What's worse is the two changes don't seem to have been made with story/character arch considerations foremost in mind, but simply to heighten the shock value of the scene. Annoying pattern.
 

Kadayi

Banned
Hrm, based on Martin's response - that changes my thoughts on it.

Admittedly, among things that have happened on the show / are going to happen on the show, it's not the "bridge too far" for me; the show is about awful things happening in general. Part of me is a little skeptical as to why "this" change is the "the creators are terrible / awful people" as opposed to the far darker things that happen throughout the series.

I do think they're going to try to go down the route of using this as what breaks up Jaime and Cersei, and have Jaime be far darker (for now) and Cersei be a little easier to empathize with to help set up Book 4 better.

In a weird way, the change in scene was "logical" per the timeline shift (which was necessary due to the fact that actors & actresses, well, age), as Martin explains, but HBO has best be prepared to explore the logical consequences of the change. I think trying to stick strictly to the book for those two would be a mistake. Just let the natural consequences & changes play out as they should.

As for the Dany wedding night; I am not sure modern TV audiences would take a 13 year old giving "consent" much better. Without the narration / ability to get into people's heads, I do understand that certain parts will probably need to dramatically change to make sense.

I always took this scene in the book to be far darker than Martin intended it apparently; I'm now just cautiously curious as to how this will play out throughout the series. I'm already imagining they will combine Books 4 & 5 into a single "book" and split it amongst the next two seasons.

Pretty much agreed.

Also amused at this proposition put forward by a lot here that the showrunners F'd up as if the episode were only filmed a few days before airing and no one but them saw it Vs something that was filmed months ago and undoubtedly watched by many on the production team before airing. It's not a case of 'They F'd up' it's a case that 'The scene is f'd up' and that was the intent. If they didn't think it was delivering what they wanted, they'd have reshot it.
 

Helmholtz

Member
What's worse is the two changes don't seem to have been made with story/character arch considerations foremost in mind, but simply to heighten the shock value of the scene. Annoying pattern.
Honestly almost every episode seems to have a stupid shock value scene that was not present in the books, or was only mentioned in passing. As a book reader this damages the show for me and it makes it feel cheap.
 

Kadayi

Banned
Honestly almost every episode seems to have a stupid shock value scene that was not present in the books, or was only mentioned in passing. As a book reader this damages the show for me and it makes it feel cheap.

And yet here you are 4 seasons in still watching. Clearly the bad doesn't outweigh the good.
 

Helmholtz

Member
And yet here you are 4 seasons in still watching. Clearly the bad doesn't outweigh the good.
When did I ever say it did? I said it damages the show for me, not ruins it. I am allowed to dislike things about the show but still enjoy the product as a whole.
 

Rentahamster

Rodent Whores
I liked the episode. Like most others, I thought the changes in the sex scene were a little weird. I preferred the circumstances as they were described in the book, but hey, the show is a different beast and I understand that they need to make changes.

The only thing I find questionable is how the director intended the scene to appear consensual at the tail end of it. They need to re-edit the scene, because it didn't really look that way to me.
 

Famassu

Member
I have a feeling they'll have the Drogo/fighting pit scene at the end of this season.
Sure, Mereen took fucking forever in the books, but I don't think they'll draw it out on the show.
Lol, no. They'll end it with the farmer's child being eaten by Drogon and then Dany making the hard decision to lock the dragons up. Season 5 might end with the Drogon/fighting pit scene, after a season of Dany struggling with ruling Meereen, negotiating with the slavers, fighting the Sons of the Harpy, meeting the Martell dude (forget the name), meeting the vision woman again, being proposed to and the accepting the marriage etc.
 

Famassu

Member
Pretty sure Drogo is long gone guys. :p

Who's talking about Drogo?

;)



Also, as someone pointed out & a continuation of my last post, Tyrion needs to be in Meereen by the time of the fighting pit. He's in the dungeons of King's Landing atm, it'll take at least one season from this season's end of him killing Tywin to get anywhere near Meereen and even then they'll have to somewhat rush him from his escape to being enslaved and then doing the dwarf act with Penny.
 

Trasher

Member
Who's talking about Drogo?

;)

Missed the stealth edit window!


On another subject, I am super glad they aren't doing what I thought they were gonna do as far as progressing the Sam/Gilly storyline. Maybe they just want to throw her in Molestown so Sam can get his shit done at Castle Black without people wondering where Gilly is all the time for the upcoming events there. Hopefully we still get Sam orchestrating Jon's rise to LC now. God, I was so convinced they were just going to send Sam away already. Praise the old gods.
 

Hammer24

Banned
Hey guys, is there one place in the intarwebs where I can find all the thus far released chapters of The Winds of Winter? On the GRRM site there is only the latest, Mercy.
 

hateradio

The Most Dangerous Yes Man
DZPtlHo.gif

I know we're all suppose to hate him, but you guys who prefer old Daario are crazy. New Daario is cute. That wink won me over.

I'm looking forward to more of Jorah fedora.
He's like the non-freakish looking version of Bradley Cooper.

YeVHZJe.jpg
 

Rezbit

Member
I liked old Daario better. He had just the right amount of douchiness and swagger.

5341e2001379d1442812c348_daario-skrien.gif

Yeah have to agree. Considering they were never really going to go with his appearance from the books, I thought he was pretty decent. He had that permanent douche smirk on his face which worked really well. The new guy is good looking don't get me wrong, but he is pretty generic.
 
Yeah have to agree. Considering they were never really going to go with his appearance from the books, I thought he was pretty decent. He had that permanent douche smirk on his face which worked really well. The new guy is good looking don't get me wrong, but he is pretty generic.

In the books, it was pretty much "Don't go with that douchebag, stick with dependable Jorah! Why would you fall for a pretty boy! Ugh!"

The old Daario was perfect for that. Being attracted to the new one just seems fair enough.
 
I must be the only one not thinking the scene between Jaime and Ceisie was a rape. *shrug*

As for Daairo actor change ... it would have been OK if they give him clean look but have the new guys with scruffy looks is just very jarring from the old guy with that romance novel cover model look.
 

Forkball

Member
I like how a guy killing a small boy's parents and then threatening to eat them was only the fifth most offensive thing that happened last episode.

Also Oberyn totally poisoned Tywin in that scene AMIRITE BOOKBROS
 
When did I ever say it did? I said it damages the show for me, not ruins it. I am allowed to dislike things about the show but still enjoy the product as a whole.

I feel the same as you, personally I think every series has been progressively worse (still enjoyable obviously) but some of the changes and the constant need for nakedness is getting cringe worthy.
 

bengraven

Member
I liked old Daario better. He had just the right amount of douchiness and swagger.

5341e2001379d1442812c348_daario-skrien.gif

He's supposed to be a huge douche and old Daario was just perfect. I fucking HATED that guy and I LIKE the new guy. THAT'S NOT HOW IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE.

#bringbackolddaario

EDIT: oh, apparently he's filming the Transporter series now.
 

Eidan

Member
I feel the same as you, personally I think every series has been progressively worse (still enjoyable obviously) but some of the changes and the constant need for nakedness is getting cringe worthy.
Tell me how you feel about fat pink masts and Myrish swamps?

Honestly I'm consistently shocked that anyone who is a fan of the books can be so sensitive about fucking and nudity on the show. It happens frequently in the books.
 
Tell me how you feel about fat pink masts and Myrish swamps?

Honestly I'm consistently shocked that anyone who is a fan of the books can be so sensitive about fucking and nudity on the show. It happens frequently in the books.

It's not the actual nudity (I watch porn like everyone else) , in the books it was matter of fact, in the series it feels cheap and tacky.

Edit: One of my favourite books is American Psycho, I'm definitely not prudish.
 

jett

D-Member
I loathed Book Daario. Not in a fun to hate way like Joffrey and such, just a shitty, obnoxious character that I couldn't fucking stand. I'm glad they decided to make him into someone I actually like.
 

Randdalf

Member
I enjoyed seeing all the Castle Black cast members from the first season come back together, very nice that there was no recasting and all that.
 

Jayof9s

Member
It kind of amused me that the show conveniently forgot that Daario commands all of Dany's sellswords (after they merged the companies together) when they selected him to be her champion or at least assumed everyone watching would forget that.

I don't mind that they changed her champion, I just wish they would have had better justification. As it was, it felt like they expected everyone to forget that he is important because he commands a few thousand of her soldiers and is likely the main reason they're following her.

"Grey Worm, you cannot go, you are the General of my Unsullied."

"Ser Jorah, you cannot go, you are my oldest friend, adviser and your taste in hats cannot be matched. Also, you might command part of my army or something, I'm not sure."

"Ser Barristan, you cannot go, you also might command people in my army and are a valued adviser. Also, we can't let you do anything interesting or you might make an impression on non-readers."

"Daario, uh. I don't think you do anything other than flirt with me. Any objections from my advisers? ... What's that Ser Jorah, he's not important at all? Okay, go for it Daario, make me swoon!"
 
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